Message to the Thai Authorities

[HashBrownHarry]

1 minute ago, richard_smith237 said:

I didn’t mention that - you have my post mixed up with another. 

 

Because the response would be subjective and argumentative - we don’t know that most Thai’s have a better life in the UK or elsewhere. Many travel for work, or contract positions etc which have since ended.

 

Noted about numbers, my bad.

 

Any country i've moved to has provided a better lifestyle, it's not subjective / argumentative at all, makes complete sense.

 

 

[richard_smith237]

1 minute ago, HashBrownHarry said:

It's nothing like saying that, it's common sense, when the airport opens there will ( of course ) be more flights, what's hard to understand about that?

Of course it is - you are arguing with the obvious.

 

Do you know that Passenger flight of all (many) airlines will be permitted travel into Thailand from July 31st and that the Emergency Decree will not be extended?

 

I don’t. Anyone wishing to return to Thailand will want to do at the first opportunity. The situation can change quite quickly as we have already found out.

 

 

[robblok]

21 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

The whole point of a discussion topic is to share ideas, discussions and present arguments. If done maturely they are a good source of information and help others see things from a different perspective. 

 

Another thread on which I have contributed has helped me see things from a different perspective such that I have adjusted the approach I am taking to re-entering Thailand and securing the CoE. 

 

This thread is of interest to be because it helps me understand the thought processes of others outside of my situation. 

 

I can see how ‘home quarantine’ may not work, its been explained to me in this thread. However, I do think the existing measures in place (Covid-19 checks, pre and post flight) are sufficient to minimise the risk. 

 

I also now have a better understanding from the perspective of those within Thailand of why the Government may want a 'one size fits all approach’ which is easier to police - Its clear the decision making process is one borne of fear of criticism should there be any imported cases rather than one borne of evaluating the actual risks critically. 

 

I also see how it would be unfair to allow foreigners to home quarantine, but not Thai’s - that would be incredibly unfair. Most of the Thai’s I know have a better house than I do !!!! 

 

If home quarantine is a viable option, it must be a viable option for everyone because differentiation based on nationality or socio-economics or any other reason is simply wrong. 

 

If home quarantine is a viable option its because the risks have been fully evaluated with intelligent balance. 

 

 

Richard,

 

We seen what happened when they let people home quarantine. It did not work because people just did not obey. There were no checks (really hard and expensive to do). That is why a quarantine for everyone works better. 

 

Your point about checks before and after with short stay in quarantine would be acceptable. However the government is not that flexible and might not want to spend all that money. Also the problem is that it would take a lot more work to make sure about the pre boarding checks (like what organisations are trustworthy to check and what checks). It would just open the government up to critisim that they don't want.

 

Remember its not just the UK they need to make these rules for all countries then contact all kind of organisations and have all kinds of papers. It would be really hard to organize. Just a small mistake there and again they get criticism. The government does not like to open itself up to stuff like this. 

 

If it was for instance just the Uk they they could find one standard form and one organisation to do it (perhaps) maybe that is not even possible. Then what tests should be used are all those test the same the world over ect ect..

 

Your idea's are good but the work would scare the Thai government. Besides for most people who want to come here the two weeks is not too bad. For tourist ANY delay would be too bad. So we are talking about catering to really small group with lots of risk for the government to look bad. 

 

I fully support your idea's in theory, just think the Thai government would have a hard time doing it practically.

[richard_smith237]

3 minutes ago, HashBrownHarry said:

5 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

I didn’t mention that - you have my post mixed up with another. 

 

Because the response would be subjective and argumentative - we don’t know that most Thai’s have a better life in the UK or elsewhere. Many travel for work, or contract positions etc which have since ended.

 

Noted about numbers, my bad.

 

Any country i've moved to has provided a better lifestyle, it's not subjective / argumentative at all, makes complete sense.

 

 

Then there would be no Thai’s who want to return... 

 

The argument has gone off track to an utterly pointless discussion about why Thai's would want to return. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[richard_smith237]

2 minutes ago, robblok said:

Richard,

 

We seen what happened when they let people home quarantine. It did not work because people just did not obey. There were no checks (really hard and expensive to do). That is why a quarantine for everyone works better. 

 

Your point about checks before and after with short stay in quarantine would be acceptable. However the government is not that flexible and might not want to spend all that money. Also the problem is that it would take a lot more work to make sure about the pre boarding checks (like what organisations are trustworthy to check and what checks). It would just open the government up to critisim that they don't want.

 

Remember its not just the UK they need to make these rules for all countries then contact all kind of organisations and have all kinds of papers. It would be really hard to organize. Just a small mistake there and again they get criticism. The government does not like to open itself up to stuff like this. 

 

If it was for instance just the Uk they they could find one standard form and one organisation to do it (perhaps) maybe that is not even possible. Then what tests should be used are all those test the same the world over ect ect..

 

Your idea's are good but the work would scare the Thai government. Besides for most people who want to come here the two weeks is not too bad. For tourist ANY delay would be too bad. So we are talking about catering to really small group with lots of risk for the government to look bad. 

 

I fully support your idea's in theory, just think the Thai government would have a hard time doing it practically.

Yup... agreed. 

 

There are lots of situations whereby the government could make it easier, but obviously they don’t need to - it simply comes down to that.

 

 

I’m ok with the ASQ, its the delay on securing the CoE and getting confirmed flights which is the issue. 

If there were more repatriation flights many could have completed Quarantine already.

 

 

 

[ExpatOilWorker]

10 hours ago, KhaoYai said:

With respect - you are making general assertions and know nothing of people's personal circumstances. I for example bought my house in Thailand 6 years ago, I have been a regular visitor for 18 years.  My wife has no wish (and indeed cannot) to live in another country. When we met she had every reason to believe that I saw my future as living in Thailand and that is why she agreed to marry me - we don't have an 'option'!

 

As for legal redress? I very much doubt that Thailand will have any legislation in place that can be used and would almost certainly refuse to recognise any international legislation such as Article 8 of the EU Human Rights Convention that they are not bound by.

I have sympathy for your situation. You had something good going, you planned ahead, you followed the rules and then Wham! out of the blue China unleashed the virus and all the rules were changed.

In many ways your situation is similar to a young British lad dating a German girl and having a house in Germany in the fall of 1939. What options would they have had? Not many I suppose. 

You may want to plan further than just how to get home, travel restrictions could be in place for years and maybe even tightened. 

 

[checkered flag]

11 hours ago, KhaoYai said:

If agenda means seeing your family, correct. However, if you think that those wishing to see their families whilst accepting that Thailand has its own desires is a personal agenda, you must lead a very sad life.

 

Protect the nation - but its OK if you're a businessman or in the US military.

There are priorities on who to allow in and not. Learn that all your whining only makes you look like a falong that wants special treatment. You are a minnow and not a big fish in this pond. I think you're a Brit so it fits with your self entitled attitude.  

[checkered flag]

11 hours ago, KhaoYai said:

Thanks for your comment - I already replied to his comment, he is totally wrong, I did not 'leave my family' - I went to work to support my family.

That's double talk. You left to support your family. That's still leaving. Maybe justified but still leaving.  

[checkered flag]

11 hours ago, vinny41 said:

World Health Organization guidelines for quarantine is 14 days. If  people u want to see their families on a regular basis I sure they have options, those options may not be the person / family preferred options and unlikely to include Thailand as a base but they have options

and I sure if a foreigner broke home quarantine and was banned from Thailand for 1 year would seek legal Regress to have the ban removed or overturned

Do WHO guideline still mean anything other than wasted paper? Thailand has kept Thai citizen and guests here safe from Covid19 and my guess they will continue to do the same. When the rules change the risk of renewed infections and the effect on the economy will need to be carefully weighed. Individual concerns and desires will be at the end of the list. It could be a year or longer before unfettered travel access returns.

[checkered flag]

11 hours ago, robblok said:

That is the whole point people can't be trusted we have seen that and that is why home quarantine is not an option. 

 

As Richard said maybe a test first, then one again combined with a short stay in state quarantine followed by home quarantine with heavy fines (maybe total ban from Thailand if quarantine is broken). 

 

But home quarantine alone is just not something that would work. 

Thai authorities aren't really concerned about KhoaYai missing his wife. In the 150 page book of issues to be solved it's at the bottom of page 150 (if at all). As long as you can send the wife money to live she'll be OK.

[checkered flag]

11 hours ago, robblok said:

Good that you leave because you mangled my point where i said that there should be other conditions. I don't believe that foreigners are any different from Thais everyone is irresponsible if there are no checks. Before the UK and my country drinking and driving was common just like in Thailand. Only with enforcement did it change. You seem to think that foreigners are better by virtue of being a foreigners. I find that quite racist to be honest. 

Well said. Thinking foreigners are better is obnoxious and racist. At the same time he begs to returns.  

[robblok]

35 minutes ago, checkered flag said:

There are priorities on who to allow in and not. Learn that all your whining only makes you look like a falong that wants special treatment. You are a minnow and not a big fish in this pond. I think you're a Brit so it fits with your self entitled attitude.  

True he is a minnow and so are many others.

 

As for Brits feeling more entitlement then others I think they are on par with all other foreigners who think the world revolves around them. The US folk and their I will decide what i do and what rules to follow its my freedom are not much better. Only nationality that stands out in a positive way are the Dutch of course because we are more relaxed after a few tokes of weed ????

[checkered flag]

9 minutes ago, robblok said:

True he is a minnow and so are many others.

 

As for Brits feeling more entitlement then others I think they are on par with all other foreigners who think the world revolves around them. The US folk and their I will decide what i do and what rules to follow its my freedom are not much better. Only nationality that stands out in a positive way are the Dutch of course because we are more relaxed after a few tokes of weed ????

It's becoming more available in the US so maybe we'll blend better with the Dutch. 

I'm sorry for reacting to those feeling entitled, because they come across as stuffed shirts. In general Americans are a classless (not no class) society, where anyone can achieve. Its not perfect but using social status is much less important than showing what you are all about.

I strive to treat everyone as equal and with dignity.  

[robblok]

7 minutes ago, checkered flag said:

It's becoming more available in the US so maybe we'll blend better with the Dutch. 

I'm sorry for reacting to those feeling entitled, because they come across as stuffed shirts. In general Americans are a classless (not no class) society, where anyone can achieve. Its not perfect but using social status is much less important than showing what you are all about.

I strive to treat everyone as equal and with dignity.  

I was joking about the Dutch.. hence acting like all Dutch do weed.

 

Personally I don't see much difference between nationalities. You got idiots everywhere. You thinking that the Brits are based on class is a bit old fashioned. I would say that most Brits are just as ordinary as the Americans (don't mean that in a bad way). 

 

But there are a lot of guys on here who at one hand insult all Thais and look down on them and on the other think their nationality is the best (not nationality specific but more bound to a certain kind of person)

[checkered flag]

1 hour ago, robblok said:

I was joking about the Dutch.. hence acting like all Dutch do weed.

 

Personally I don't see much difference between nationalities. You got idiots everywhere. You thinking that the Brits are based on class is a bit old fashioned. I would say that most Brits are just as ordinary as the Americans (don't mean that in a bad way). 

 

But there are a lot of guys on here who at one hand insult all Thais and look down on them and on the other think their nationality is the best (not nationality specific but more bound to a certain kind of person)

Thanks. I find most Thais very honest and honorable. In Thai society the Poo Yai is often expected to pay and look after others. Other nationalities think they are being taken advantage of. Unless you are with close Thai friends and/or coworkers Thais would never think about splitting the bill and the PooYai would simply pick it up. Years ago I had a Thai friend who was very well to do but we were colleagues. I would sometimes ask him to go to lunch. Since he knew everyplace in Bangkok he would typically chose. Since I asked, I expected to pay but he'd always insist. I told him I expected to pay next time because I invited him, so he took me to a noodle shop. It was very good but cheap, so he won out.

Now I'm the PooYai and expect to pay. Mostly my wife takes care of it.

Falongs that don't understand Thai customs offend others with no idea they were offensive. 

[robblok]

7 minutes ago, checkered flag said:

Thanks. I find most Thais very honest and honorable. In Thai society the Poo Yai is often expected to pay and look after others. Other nationalities think they are being taken advantage of. Unless you are with close Thai friends and/or coworkers Thais would never think about splitting the bill and the PooYai would simply pick it up. Years ago I had a Thai friend who was very well to do but we were colleagues. I would sometimes ask him to go to lunch. Since he knew everyplace in Bangkok he would typically chose. Since I asked, I expected to pay but he'd always insist. I told him I expected to pay next time because I invited him, so he took me to a noodle shop. It was very good but cheap, so he won out.

Now I'm the PooYai and expect to pay. Mostly my wife takes care of it.

Falongs that don't understand Thai customs offend others with no idea they were offensive. 

With most Thais I split but they are close friends. I don't agree that the PooYai has to pay everything. It might be so in Thai culture. But the person you associate with should also accept you have a different culture. Its not like one culture always has to win out. 

 

The person with you also can change a bit to adjust its IMHO not set who should adjust as your in a relation / friendship. Both should adapt. 

[from the home of CC]

21 hours ago, robblok said:

That is the whole point people can't be trusted we have seen that and that is why home quarantine is not an option. 

 

As Richard said maybe a test first, then one again combined with a short stay in state quarantine followed by home quarantine with heavy fines (maybe total ban from Thailand if quarantine is broken). 

 

But home quarantine alone is just not something that would work. 

4 working Brits in Singapore were caught breaking the rules (out drinking where they weren't supposed to), they were fined 5000 and all lost their jobs for they were deported. Some just feel their priorities are higher  anyone else.. 

[robblok]

10 minutes ago, from the home of CC said:

4 working Brits in Singapore were caught breaking the rules (out drinking where they weren't supposed to), they were fined 5000 and all lost their jobs for they were deported. Some just feel their priorities are higher  anyone else.. 

Good that there were actual checks and that they were caught. Some people do think drinking is the most important thing to do. 

[from the home of CC]

3 minutes ago, robblok said:

Good that there were actual checks and that they were caught. Some people do think drinking is the most important thing to do. 

in my country they have performed thousands of police quarantine checks and the consequences can be serious and costly ($ being the only thing some folks understand)..

https://toronto.citynews.ca/2020/07/05/2-american-visitors-to-canada-fined-1000-for-violating-quarantine-act/

 

[kingdong]

12 hours ago, checkered flag said:

There are priorities on who to allow in and not. Learn that all your whining only makes you look like a falong that wants special treatment. You are a minnow and not a big fish in this pond. I think you're a Brit so it fits with your self entitled attitude.  

whats a falong?

[ExpatOilWorker]

The Egyptians have beyond reasonable doubts proven that home quarantine does not work!