Explainer: Pandemic behaviour - Why some people don't play by the rules

[snoop1130]

Explainer: Pandemic behaviour - Why some people don't play by the rules

By Kate Kelland and Megan Revell

 

FILE PHOTO: People wear face masks as they use the beach boardwalk during the outbreak of the coronavirus disease (COVID-19), in Huntington Beach, California, U.S., July 1, 2020. REUTERS/Mike Blake

 

LONDON (Reuters) - Lockdowns and social distancing measures introduced around the world to try and curb the COVID-19 pandemic are reshaping lives, legislating activities that were once everyday freedoms and creating new social norms.

 

But there are always some people who don't play by the rules.

 

Rule-breaking is not a new phenomenon, but behavioural scientists say it is being exacerbated in the coronavirus pandemic by cultural, demographic and psychological factors that can make the flouters seem more selfish and dangerous.

 

Here are some questions and answers on the science of human behaviour during the COVID-19 pandemic:

 

WHAT MAKES SOME PEOPLE FLOUT AND OTHERS OBEY THE RULES?

 

A key factor is individualism versus collectivism.

 

"Some countries...tend to be higher on individualism, which is about expressing your sense of identity and who you are as an individual," said Jay Van Bavel, an associate professor of psychology at New York University.

 

People in individualist cultures tend to reject rules and ignore attempts by public health authorities to "nudge" behaviour change with risk messages or appeals for altruism.

 

"If you say, for example, that wearing a mask will help protect others, people in individualistic cultures just care less," said Michael Sanders, a expert at the Policy Institute at King's College London.

 

In collectivist cultures, people are more likely to do what's best for the group.

 

ARE TRUST AND FEAR IMPORTANT?

 

Yes. These and other instincts are significant influences on human behaviour.

 

In societies with more political division, for example, people are less likely to trust advice from one side or the other, and also tend to form pro- and anti-camps.

 

Optimism and fear are also crucial. A little of both can be positive, but too much of either can be damaging.

 

"In a situation like a pandemic, (optimism) can lead you to take risks that are incredibly dangerous," said Van Bavel.

 

WHY IS SOCIAL DISTANCING DIFFICULT?

 

"We are truly social animals," said Van Bavel. "Our bodies and brains are designed for connection and the pandemic in many ways goes against our instincts to connect."

 

That's partly why local outbreaks can crop up in bars and nightclubs, or religious ceremonies, weddings and parties.

 

"People have a hard time resisting that tendency for social and group connection."

 

IF RULE-BREAKERS ARE A MINORITY, WHY DOES IT MATTER?

 

"The problem is that, in a massive collective problem like the one we're facing now, if everybody breaks the rules a little bit, then it's not dissimilar to lots of people not following the rules at all," said Sanders.

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2020-08-13

 

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[richard_smith237]

This makes a lot of sense... 

 

It seems to me that the Brits and Americans have some sort of subconscious anarchistic impulse to at first question anything official and then fight the consensus. 

 

 

[baansgr]

Simply they are too thick to understand the severity

[Brunolem]

9 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

It seems to me that the Brits and Americans have some sort of subconscious anarchistic impulse to at first question anything official and then fight the consensus. 

 

 

This is also why they are the ones who have been making discoveries and collecting Nobel prizes for decades, if not centuries, while populations more inclined to follow the rules are also often better at copying than at creating. 

 

Thinking for oneself and questioning everything is much better than blindly following rules just because they come from some authority. 

 

Countless atrocities have been comitted by people just able to obey orders. 

[BritManToo]

1 hour ago, snoop1130 said:

WHAT MAKES SOME PEOPLE FLOUT AND OTHERS OBEY THE RULES?

A key factor is individualism versus collectivism

A major factor with me is not believing COVID is significant.

If the bodies were piling up in the streets I'd probably be a be more careful.

But the chances of it hurting me is less likely than getting run over walking across the road.

 

After a while you get used to ignoring nutters shouting 'the sky is falling'.

(BSE, SARs, Swine Flu, HIV, global warming, seas rising, peak oil, etc.)

Edited August 13, 2020 by BritManToo

[richard_smith237]

54 minutes ago, Brunolem said:

1 hour ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

It seems to me that the Brits and Americans have some sort of subconscious anarchistic impulse to at first question anything official and then fight the consensus. 

 

 

This is also why they are the ones who have been making discoveries and collecting Nobel prizes for decades, if not centuries, while populations more inclined to follow the rules are also often better at copying than at creating. 

 

Thinking for oneself and questioning everything is much better than blindly following rules just because they come from some authority. 

 

Countless atrocities have been comitted by people just able to obey orders. 

 

Quite a hyperbolae that !!!!.... 

 

I don’t think the average anarchist or uneducated layman attempting to prove the individuality of his thought is up for discovering very much... these guys just like conspiracies and blowing hot air. 

 

I do agree - questioning everything, or being conscious of everything is much better than blindly following the rules because they come from authority. BUT, it does appear that there is a somewhat anarchistic nature of Brits and Americans who chose to question blindly before anything else. 

[geriatrickid]

3 hours ago, Brunolem said:

This is also why they are the ones who have been making discoveries and collecting Nobel prizes for decades, if not centuries, while populations more inclined to follow the rules are also often better at copying than at creating. 

 

Thinking for oneself and questioning everything is much better than blindly following rules just because they come from some authority. 

 

Countless atrocities have been comitted by people just able to obey orders. 

If only it was that simple.  Your treatise ignores population size,  access to resources and prejudice. Keep in mind that for much of its history, the Nobel prize and other academic awards were subject to bias. The bias discriminated against  women, and multiple ethnic groups.  If your premise was true, then  small countries like Denmark, Israel, Canada, Australia and the Netherlands should not have  the relatively large number of Nobel laureates that they have.

 

There is indeed a cultural component to the spread of the  infection and the willingness to comply with common sense prevention procedures. Another factor is education. The better educated people are, the more likely they are to understand what needs to be done  and the benefit of compliance.

 

Some US states like New York and New Jersey  undertook public education programs, and had governors who were transparent and honest with the public.  There was a consistent message. The non compliant states do not have public education programs or a state government that consistently supports the  common prevention methods. A small group in the US forces their non compliance on the majority and they often do it through bullying; swarming events with their firearms and attacking people with a barrage of insults like lib-tard, snow-flake, pussy, etc. Foreign agents push misinformation, bombarding  social media with  rumors and false information with the intent to destabilize and sow animosity.

 

In the UK, we see non compliance specific to certain ethnic groups  and we see a government that is disorganized and incapable of  providing a clear, consistent and coherent national policy. The UK population  gets conflicting messages. One day they are told all is well, go back to work, then the next day, oooops, a city must be locked down,travel corridors suspended etc.  The non compliant people are same ones we see vomiting on Bangla Rd., or pee-ing on the street in Koh Samui or shoplifting in Pattaya. They don't care about anyone but themselves and would have done well on the  old Jeremy Kyle show.  No one ever puts them in their place.

 

Denmark, Norway, Canada, Finland and even the difficult to manage , Australia have all had the same exposure to Covid19 and have a similar type of ethnic mix, yet they have been able to obtain much higher rates of compliance. The key difference is that the national government and the provincial/municipal/state  governments all worked together, putting aside political differences.  

 

[Chelseafan]

7 hours ago, BritManToo said:

A major factor with me is not believing COVID is significant.

If the bodies were piling up in the streets I'd probably be a be more careful.

But the chances of it hurting me is less likely than getting run over walking across the road.

 

After a while you get used to ignoring nutters shouting 'the sky is falling'.

(BSE, SARs, Swine Flu, HIV, global warming, seas rising, peak oil, etc.)

 

It may not be YOU who gets infected but you could be inadvertantly passing onto others.

Do you not think that the reason the "sky is not falling in" is because of the drastic action that has been taken?

 

 

[englishoak]

25 minutes ago, Chelseafan said:

 

It may not be YOU who gets infected but you could be inadvertantly passing onto others.

Do you not think that the reason the "sky is not falling in" is because of the drastic action that has been taken?

 

 

Nope. The sky was never falling in its just the hysteria pretending it is/was... 99% survival rate is pretty acceptable to me.. but im not fat or have other underlying conditions nor scared of dying so.... and no I dont wear a nosebag. 

[Chelseafan]

4 minutes ago, englishoak said:

Nope. The sky was never falling in its just the hysteria pretending it is/was... 99% survival rate is pretty acceptable to me.. but im not fat or have other underlying conditions nor scared of dying so.... and no I dont wear a nosebag. 

 

A lot of those who have underlying health problems are the elderly through no fault of their own.

Should we just euthanise them to get back to normality ?

Only three months ago hospitals were being overrun with Covid cases so YES, the sky WAS falling in. Thankfully, albeit belatedly the Governement took action.

I'm just as keen to move on as the next man, I have family in Thailand and am stuck in the UK but if everyone played the game rather than being f@@@ing know-it-alls (not a slight against you but society in general) then perhaps we'll get through this thing quicker.

 

 

 

Edited August 13, 2020 by Chelseafan

[Scott]

An inflammatory post and reply has been removed.   Please keep it civil.  

 

[torturedsole]

A load of old rot as far as I'm concerned but I play along with the mask.  Three weeks ago I didn't need a mask in my local UK barber shop, but last Saturday and almost overnight, mask to be worn for a haircut.  Fine, but still a load of nonsense.  

[car720]

4 hours ago, englishoak said:

Nope. The sky was never falling in its just the hysteria pretending it is/was... 99% survival rate is pretty acceptable to me.. but im not fat or have other underlying conditions nor scared of dying so.... and no I dont wear a nosebag. 

Lots of I's and me's in there.

[car720]

Seems to me that the selfish and self centred will always defend their thoughts and actions with the use of sophistry.  Yet I am sure that whenever they are affected that they would be the first to scream like stuck pigs.

[tracker]

The "behavioural scientists" seem to forget that a lot of people have access to more information than provided by the main stream media. There is a lot of info which is scrubbed out of the msm. That would be a major influence to "flout the rules"

Edited August 14, 2020 by tracker
spelling

[brain150]

Maybe the reason why people don't follow these stupid rules is because the rules are stupid !

 

There is no science at all that shows that social distancing or wearing a mask do

anything in avoiding the spread of a virus ... none, nada, zero !!!

 

The PCR test used to "identify" the virus is a joke and it does NOT identify the virus

or even indicate an infection. This is scientifically proven fact !

 

The so called "virus" was until now never isolated ... which means there is no basics for any Science as it would be the first step in the scientific process.

 

Maybe these people don't blindly follow people who have a track record of lying and cheating

in their greed for power like the UN, WHO or pretty much every Government.

 

Or maybe these people just think for themselves, do their research and find out that

all of the real science and information is heavily censored by all media including social media.

 

This socialist take over is nothing but a crime ! On a global scale !

Everybody who wants to see, can see !!!

 

"You will know them by their deeds"  ... a very famous guy once said !!!

His name was Jesus Christ. He was right ... it is beyond me how people can follow orders

that put little children in plastic cages like animals - that's what Thai schools do to children now.

 

The insanity of all this is hard to believe but easy to see !!!

Edited August 14, 2020 by brain150

[Emdog]

How about talking about where we are, aka Thailand?

Local Family Mart: all the staff had masks below noses. If they had plastic face shield, it's in the up position. Sign in sheet flutter in the wind, no temp checks.

In the West it may be some sort of local tribal/ individualism "anyone beyond my circle doesn't matter"

I'd say here in Thailand it's more of a time span thing: huge time gap between cause (spreading virus to each other, and not knowing who spread it) and effect (having the virus).

Along with foolish belief young folks are immune and if you get it while young, no long lasting effects.

Culture here emphasizes present time, maybe yesterday and tomorrow occasionally.

[brain150]

This is insanity !!!

 

[brain150]

For all the people who think that following the rules is a good idea:

 

This it what they do to children !!!

 

[JCauto]

Thanks to our TV British friends for providing further evidence, although not actually needed, that the observations were spot on.

Even an article specifically explaining why you are fools only spurs further behaviour of exactly the sort described. No hope for such selfish societies.

[Thailand]

If the first wave of Covid is waiting to pounce in Thailand it won't be too long as a large number of the population are now flouting the regulations that may have kept it at bay.

 

No cases for 5 weeks so no problem?

I do believe that is what Vietnam and New Zealand thought.

 

[JCauto]

10 hours ago, geriatrickid said:

If only it was that simple.  Your treatise ignores population size,  access to resources and prejudice. Keep in mind that for much of its history, the Nobel prize and other academic awards were subject to bias. The bias discriminated against  women, and multiple ethnic groups.  If your premise was true, then  small countries like Denmark, Israel, Canada, Australia and the Netherlands should not have  the relatively large number of Nobel laureates that they have.

 

There is indeed a cultural component to the spread of the  infection and the willingness to comply with common sense prevention procedures. Another factor is education. The better educated people are, the more likely they are to understand what needs to be done  and the benefit of compliance.

 

Some US states like New York and New Jersey  undertook public education programs, and had governors who were transparent and honest with the public.  There was a consistent message. The non compliant states do not have public education programs or a state government that consistently supports the  common prevention methods. A small group in the US forces their non compliance on the majority and they often do it through bullying; swarming events with their firearms and attacking people with a barrage of insults like lib-tard, snow-flake, pussy, etc. Foreign agents push misinformation, bombarding  social media with  rumors and false information with the intent to destabilize and sow animosity.

 

In the UK, we see non compliance specific to certain ethnic groups  and we see a government that is disorganized and incapable of  providing a clear, consistent and coherent national policy. The UK population  gets conflicting messages. One day they are told all is well, go back to work, then the next day, oooops, a city must be locked down,travel corridors suspended etc.  The non compliant people are same ones we see vomiting on Bangla Rd., or pee-ing on the street in Koh Samui or shoplifting in Pattaya. They don't care about anyone but themselves and would have done well on the  old Jeremy Kyle show.  No one ever puts them in their place.

 

Denmark, Norway, Canada, Finland and even the difficult to manage , Australia have all had the same exposure to Covid19 and have a similar type of ethnic mix, yet they have been able to obtain much higher rates of compliance. The key difference is that the national government and the provincial/municipal/state  governments all worked together, putting aside political differences.  

 

Excellent post and well summarized points.

I would note the first one in particular - the fellow who claimed that "more Nobel Prizes are won..." as being indicative of a deeper issue that is common to the USA, UK and Thailand. That is the fundamental "myths" they have constructed as their "origin story" and accepted as unadulterated truth rather than the obvious propaganda it always was. Thus, the rich see only that they were smart and took risks so believe they're an individual success, whereas they don't recognize that their friends and family gave them a leg up and they always had the resources to avoid the consequences of failure. It's a closed circle of ignorance that feeds upon itself. 

[Siamjim]

doesn't any1 do their own research anymore than accepting and believing everything being told?  though as tragic as it is the deaths from C19 is a whooping 2% more than seasonal flu which is also tragic towards the elderly and those with underlining health issues. yes there is also a second wave from flu

[Captain Monday]

6 hours ago, englishoak said:

Nope. The sky was never falling in its just the hysteria pretending it is/was... 99% survival rate is pretty acceptable to me.. but im not fat or have other underlying conditions nor scared of dying so.... and no I dont wear a nosebag. 

There you have it. Fearless, shameless, rejection of consensus, irrational anti-hygiene animus and complete indifference to the suffering of others.  Add politicization of science and you have why in the US we experience a virus out of control and mass death. In Japan 95 percent of the population follows all government suggestions without coercion by laws and the situation is not perfect but much better in comparison, without total lockdowns. I was there almost 4 months from April.

[micmichd]

7 hours ago, englishoak said:

Nope. The sky was never falling in its just the hysteria pretending it is/was... 99% survival rate is pretty acceptable to me.. but im not fat or have other underlying conditions nor scared of dying so.... and no I dont wear a nosebag. 

You're aware you risk a ping-pong infection if you don't wear a mask? 

[Brunolem]

31 minutes ago, JCauto said:

Excellent post and well summarized points.

I would note the first one in particular - the fellow who claimed that "more Nobel Prizes are won..." as being indicative of a deeper issue that is common to the USA, UK and Thailand. That is the fundamental "myths" they have constructed as their "origin story" and accepted as unadulterated truth rather than the obvious propaganda it always was. Thus, the rich see only that they were smart and took risks so believe they're an individual success, whereas they don't recognize that their friends and family gave them a leg up and they always had the resources to avoid the consequences of failure. It's a closed circle of ignorance that feeds upon itself. 

This was true in the times of Darwin and Einstein, much less today.

 

A Japanese or a South Korean has as much opportunity and help to perform as an American or an Italian, and yet there is still more creativity and discovery by the latter, while the former are still more inclined to imitate and copy.

 

Just one example: the smartphone...a Steve Jobs creation, then copied by South Korea (Samsung) and China (Huawei and many others).

 

Being creative is different from being smart, or smarter than the others.

 

In fact, Asians generally perform much better than Westerners in most international contests (maths, physics and so on), but they are wired differently, for cultural reasons dating back centuries.

 

These differences also explain why Asia is doing much better than the West when it comes to dealing with the pandemic.

 

One can't have it both ways...each his own victories...

[Grumpy John]

I am resisting the urge to say "the Wuhan China virus is no more harmful than the flu"  but it could possibly be.  We know for a fact the oldies with pre-existing conditions are in the high risk category but can't we deal with them separately and let the rest of us get on with life.  

 

At 67 years of age I do have some concern about the Wuhan China virus being in the community, is it?, but the risk of catching it and dying is low.  On the other hand, If I was in a nursing home with a sick body I would be extremely worried about it.

 

So despite wearing a facemask and using hand gel at Makro the lack of social distancing whilst shopping and the fact what I just touched may have been touched by someone else with an infection (name one) is of some concern to me.  But the lack of new cases in the general population is reassuring to some degree.

 

I watched a video this morning about a virus situation from long ago: 

 

[thaibreakfast]

1 hour ago, brain150 said:

For all the people who think that following the rules is a good idea:

 

This it what they do to children !!!

 

What exactly are they doing to children here? They are sitting at their desks that are equipped with the same kind of barriers you can find in restaurants. 

[englishoak]

41 minutes ago, micmichd said:

You're aware you risk a ping-pong infection if you don't wear a mask? 

 

Yup your aware a common cold or the flu can kill the infirm and have you ever locked yourself down out of concern  ? nope you havnt.. 

 

Im also aware when i get in the car i could have a ping pong accident and kill someone, but i still drive .. how many deaths on the road in Thailand annually ? do you get in a car or go on the road  ? 

[thaibreakfast]

1 minute ago, englishoak said:

 

Yup your aware a common cold or the flu can kill the infirm and have you ever locked yourself down out of concern  ? nope you havnt.. 

 

Im also aware when i get in the car i could have a ping pong accident and kill someone, but i still drive .. how many deaths on the road in Thailand annually ? do you get in a car or go on the road  ? 

Do you also think that it makes no difference whether you drive drunk or sober? These rules aren't just about protecting yourself but also about protecting others.