19 hours ago, DrTuner said:

If they want to make a list, make a list of CCP trolls in the internet. Then when the time comes, administer proper punishment: six weeks of non-stop Thai TV "comedy" with eyes glued open. 

For a second offence add in forced feeding of cold haggis and black-pudding.

1 hour ago, tomazbodner said:

Your picture flag surely shows that

Indeed it does, good sir. But check out my posting record not just my avatar. I have been lambasting the junta and all their evil works from day one.

If you want to take down this country's "elite", that will quite naturally include many if not most of its TV celebrities. This hardly comes as a surprise.

 

8 minutes ago, baboon said:

Indeed it does, good sir. But check out my posting record not just my avatar. I have been lambasting the junta and all their evil works from day one.

I was happy when they took over and stopped the nightly killings. At the beginning it looked like they were really going to clean up the house - uproot corruption, mainly. And there were signs they were doing it.

 

But then it all stopped and junta started behaving like politicians. Then overstayed their welcome.

 

I still believe that if a strong hand came in, and really cleaned up the mess, then leave, it would leave Thailand in much better place. With rise of populism all around the World, there won't be much of a positive change. Just do what it takes to win the votes, then go back to filling pockets.

22 minutes ago, tomazbodner said:

I was happy when they took over and stopped the nightly killings. At the beginning it looked like they were really going to clean up the house - uproot corruption, mainly. And there were signs they were doing it.

 

But then it all stopped and junta started behaving like politicians. Then overstayed their welcome.

 

I still believe that if a strong hand came in, and really cleaned up the mess, then leave, it would leave Thailand in much better place. With rise of populism all around the World, there won't be much of a positive change. Just do what it takes to win the votes, then go back to filling pockets.

Yea many were suckered into believing that and that's what they promised they would do

but you only have to look at history of previous Coups to know that was never their goal Power was.

Now they have more power than ever before it's gonna be pretty much impossible to get rid of them without a fight.
P.s the protests were Orchestrated to justify a coup.
Pps how many yellow shirt leaders were arrested for sedition?

13 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

I wonder how many protesters experienced the last two Thai coups in 2006 and 2014 and the 2010 red-shirt demonstrations as adults, or at least interested teenagers.

It was all about Thaksin and the coups happened because he was so greedy and wanted more and more power.

I am sure many Thais didn't really like the idea of a coup but for many at that time it was the smaller problem.

The big problem Thaksin was exchanged with the smaller problem military government.

Was that good? No. But for many it was a lot better than Thaksin.

Unfortunately the reporting about those events, i.e. at the BBC, was bad. And obviously Thaksin tried to bend history as much as he could.

I wonder how many of the current protesters know the history of what really happened.

Personally I don't care about celebrities. But lets be fair here. Looking back and saying something like "a coup is always bad" does not really cover the whole picture in Thailand...

Plus, from what I read the current students want to move forward to get much closer to: what a real and valuable constitution looks like / should be, democracy should/could look like, along with fair & equal justice and opportunity, a senate which is voted in / not appointed and loaded with military, stooping corruption and nepotism etc.

 

None of which connects/aligns to the aims of the various parties in the last 15-20 years.  The students tell me they don't want any of the past, they want to move forward.

 

My young uni students say they have gained a lot of knowledge of how things should be in terms of constitution, democracy, senate, accountable police force, corruption etc., etc.

 

Yes I know I will get further posts saying thanathorn is a crook, democracy is not so good etc., etc. So be it.   

20 hours ago, CGW said:

It's a start, the media is "paid" to drive the agenda and indoctrinate the masses, if you need an example start with CNN & the BBC 

But Fox New it's not for indoctrinate but for educate the masses I suppose ???? 

22 hours ago, webfact said:

Celebrities came under the spotlight after Ornapa posted a vulgar message attacking student protesters, saying: “Keep playing with your [expletive] at home. Don't go to school, you demon kids.” 

 

Angered by her comment, netizens launched a boycott campaign against Ornapa and she was forced to give up her job in two TV shows.

Students know how to play the social media game better than anyone, 500,000 dislikes on Ornapa's page doesn't look good. TV would drop her like a red-hot brick !

Bet she wished he/she kept quiet now, not quite the celeb he/she thought he/she was!

 

Edited August 27, 20205 yr by metisdead
Please do not modify someone else's post in your quoted reply, either with font or color changes or wording.

29 minutes ago, Tchooptip said:

But Fox New it's not for indoctrinate but for educate the masses I suppose ???? 

Strange reply? I have no idea about Fox news, never watched it, so will take your word for it - thanks 

1 hour ago, tomazbodner said:

I was happy when they took over and stopped the nightly killings. At the beginning it looked like they were really going to clean up the house - uproot corruption, mainly. And there were signs they were doing it.

 

But then it all stopped and junta started behaving like politicians. Then overstayed their welcome.

 

I still believe that if a strong hand came in, and really cleaned up the mess, then leave, it would leave Thailand in much better place. With rise of populism all around the World, there won't be much of a positive change. Just do what it takes to win the votes, then go back to filling pockets.

Well I hate to say I told you so, but I did, as did others. This was all obvious from the get go. And yet you STILL advocate a strong hand for Thailand? 

The triumph of hope over experience,  I suppose...

1 hour ago, tomazbodner said:

I was happy when they took over and stopped the nightly killings. At the beginning it looked like they were really going to clean up the house - uproot corruption, mainly. And there were signs they were doing it.

 

But then it all stopped and junta started behaving like politicians. Then overstayed their welcome.

That's a very naive view, ignorant of the long and inglorious history of military coups in Thailand.

 

Each new government, military and civilian alike, sees the need to purge personnel affiliated with its opposition from the public service once taking office. What better way to do that than a (selective) anti corruption crackdown? As they are all corrupt, it's like shooting sitting ducks. The gullible public sees some action, the public service gets stacked with cronies of the new government, it's the perfect smoke screen.

 

12 hours ago, baboon said:

You are either with the fascists or you aren't. No amount of revisionism changes that.

Me, I stand with the people not their tormentors.

You are with Thaksin or against him. I am against him because he divided Thailand like nobody else in the last decades. 

With Prayut we have peace. And he and his team managed Covid perfectly. Thank you!

2 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

You are with Thaksin or against him. I am against him because he divided Thailand like nobody else in the last decades. 

With Prayut we have peace. And he and his team managed Covid perfectly. Thank you!

"You are with Thaksin or against him."

No you aren't. 

"With Prayut we have peace."

No you don't. 

1 hour ago, scorecard said:

Plus, from what I read the current students want to move forward to get much closer to: what a real and valuable constitution looks like / should be, democracy should/could look like, along with fair & equal justice and opportunity, a senate which is voted in / not appointed and loaded with military, stooping corruption and nepotism etc.

 

None of which connects/aligns to the aims of the various parties in the last 15-20 years.  The students tell me they don't want any of the past, they want to move forward.

 

My young uni students say they have gained a lot of knowledge of how things should be in terms of constitution, democracy, senate, accountable police force, corruption etc., etc.

 

Yes I know I will get further posts saying thanathorn is a crook, democracy is not so good etc., etc. So be it.   

I am sure many students will have very good intentions. And I hope the students will make a lot of progress.

So let's imagine there will be a new election. Who will run? New faces? Smart and honest people who will work for Thailand and democracy? Or will there be lots of old faces and maybe their family members just like usual?

And how will the uneducated masses vote? Will they, including the old people, listen to the students? Or is it a lot more likely that they will vote like usual, with money involved, with the village elders telling them what to do, etc.?

And I am sure one infamous political party will claim they support the students and they support democracy - but in reality they don't.

 

Life, elections and democracy could be wonderful if educated informed people who care about the country would decide. But how many of the voters are informed and care?

4 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

I am sure many students will have very good intentions. And I hope the students will make a lot of progress.

So let's imagine there will be a new election. Who will run? New faces? Smart and honest people who will work for Thailand and democracy? Or will there be lots of old faces and maybe their family members just like usual?

And how will the uneducated masses vote? Will they, including the old people, listen to the students? Or is it a lot more likely that they will vote like usual, with money involved, with the village elders telling them what to do, etc.?

And I am sure one infamous political party will claim they support the students and they support democracy - but in reality they don't.

 

Life, elections and democracy could be wonderful if educated informed people who care about the country would decide. But how many of the voters are informed and care?

“No one believes more firmly than Comrade Napoleon that all animals are equal. He would be only too happy to let you make your decisions for yourselves. But sometimes you might make the wrong decisions, comrades, and then where should we be?”
― George Orwell, Animal Farm

Celebrities do sway the opinions of the ignorant, that's why they are paid to do ads. Recall Dolly Parton saying she never gives any indication of her political views, says she was just an entertainer. Pity more don't follow that lead.

Some posts have been edited to remove bold font from the quoted content:

 

Forum Netiquette
 
2. Please do not modify someone else's post in your quoted reply, either with font or color changes or wording. Such posts will be deleted and the user warned.

3 hours ago, tomazbodner said:

I was happy when they took over and stopped the nightly killings. At the beginning it looked like they were really going to clean up the house - uproot corruption, mainly. And there were signs they were doing it.

 

But then it all stopped and junta started behaving like politicians. Then overstayed their welcome.

 

I still believe that if a strong hand came in, and really cleaned up the mess, then leave, it would leave Thailand in much better place. With rise of populism all around the World, there won't be much of a positive change. Just do what it takes to win the votes, then go back to filling pockets.

Then time shows you were wrong and experience shows you were naïve, the military in Thailand are a massive part of the problem and always will be until their leadership is culled root and branch...

2 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

I am sure many students will have very good intentions. And I hope the students will make a lot of progress.

So let's imagine there will be a new election. Who will run? New faces? Smart and honest people who will work for Thailand and democracy? Or will there be lots of old faces and maybe their family members just like usual?

And how will the uneducated masses vote? Will they, including the old people, listen to the students? Or is it a lot more likely that they will vote like usual, with money involved, with the village elders telling them what to do, etc.?

And I am sure one infamous political party will claim they support the students and they support democracy - but in reality they don't.

 

Life, elections and democracy could be wonderful if educated informed people who care about the country would decide. But how many of the voters are informed and care?

 

I agree with all your points.  

 

A 'one step' transition would be wonderful but it's not going to happen, for several reasons.

 

It will take some time, with lots of interference, involving (as you mentioned) money, following the instructions of the pooyai baan etc., and the waiting in the wings and ill-intentioned immoral rogues from the past. 

 

I just hope that there will be a transition but recognizing it will take many years and will have many big bumps. And hopefully free of violence. 

 

 

On 8/26/2020 at 2:47 PM, Saint Nick said:

Can you not take your tinfoil infused- BS somewhere else?

Every thread is full of your inane comments about "them" and the "the media" and how "they" steer this or work towards that!

It gets really boring!

 

Yeah right, boring. So let's all just pretend the BBC, CNN, Fox, Reuters, News Corp etc etc don't have their own politically motivated agendas and only broadcast the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth.

 

Try not to fall off that bar stool now.

On 8/26/2020 at 9:17 PM, OneMoreFarang said:

I wonder how many protesters experienced the last two Thai coups in 2006 and 2014 and the 2010 red-shirt demonstrations as adults, or at least interested teenagers.

It was all about Thaksin and the coups happened because he was so greedy and wanted more and more power.

I am sure many Thais didn't really like the idea of a coup but for many at that time it was the smaller problem.

The big problem Thaksin was exchanged with the smaller problem military government.

Was that good? No. But for many it was a lot better than Thaksin.

Unfortunately the reporting about those events, i.e. at the BBC, was bad. And obviously Thaksin tried to bend history as much as he could.

I wonder how many of the current protesters know the history of what really happened.

Personally I don't care about celebrities. But lets be fair here. Looking back and saying something like "a coup is always bad" does not really cover the whole picture in Thailand...

The Thaksin party got 24 million votes and is still massively popular. If there were free  fair elections they would win again.

22 hours ago, baboon said:

You are either with the fascists or you aren't. No amount of revisionism changes that.

Me, I stand with the people not their tormentors.

Well said!

17 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

I am sure many students will have very good intentions. And I hope the students will make a lot of progress.

So let's imagine there will be a new election. Who will run? New faces? Smart and honest people who will work for Thailand and democracy? Or will there be lots of old faces and maybe their family members just like usual?

And how will the uneducated masses vote? Will they, including the old people, listen to the students? Or is it a lot more likely that they will vote like usual, with money involved, with the village elders telling them what to do, etc.?

And I am sure one infamous political party will claim they support the students and they support democracy - but in reality they don't.

 

Life, elections and democracy could be wonderful if educated informed people who care about the country would decide. But how many of the voters are informed and care?

 

" Life, elections and democracy could be wonderful if educated informed people who care about the country would decide."

 

This is one of the strong challenges to make real progress to move forward.

 

Thailand does have plenty of highly capable balanced people who want to contribute, but they don't.

 

Why? In the past because they can't change the world alone, they need to join a party but the bottom line is they don't want to be associated with any of the parties, all of whom are riddled with unethical folks. Some are parties with some form of vague agenda, and some say they are parties but in fact are owned by powerful ruthless people who have a personal agenda for power and money and even have their own 'army'.

 

Is it changing? It seems to me many of the old parties are still involved and are props to the PMs party. However I see thanathorn's party are trying to break the old mold and I see the new student push as focused on the 'right' factors to build proper democracy, equality and more.

 

There's a long bumpy road ahead.

 

 

Edited August 27, 20205 yr by scorecard

It depends who this blanket amnesty bill was going to benefit, this has a familiar ring to it, is this new wave of student protests Shinawattra driven, the protesters should have enough ammunition to concentrate on the present, for get the past.

Edited August 28, 20205 yr by chainarong

10 hours ago, Nout said:

The Thaksin party got 24 million votes and is still massively popular. If there were free  fair elections they would win again.

And that's one of the problems.

Why do millions or Thais vote again and again for super corrupt and criminal Thaksin and his family?

I understand that Thaksin did a few good things for Thailand but there is no doubt that his priority was to enrich himself and his cronies. Why do Thais vote for people like him?

Because as we all know being elected, even by millions and millions of people does not give anybody the right to be above the law.

When people vote for corrupt and criminal politicians then they should not be surprised when the get a corrupt and criminal government.

It's time for Thais to vote for honest people. But I am not holding my breath that that will happen anytime soon.

2 hours ago, scorecard said:

 

" Life, elections and democracy could be wonderful if educated informed people who care about the country would decide."

 

This is one of the strong challenges to make real progress to move forward.

 

Thailand does have plenty of highly capable balanced people who want to contribute, but they don't.

 

Why? In the past because they can't change the world alone, they need to join a party but the bottom line is they don't want to be associated with any of the parties, all of whom are riddled with unethical folks. Some are parties with some form of vague agenda, and some say they are parties but in fact are owned by powerful ruthless people who have a personal agenda for power and money and even have their own 'army'.

 

Is it changing? It seems to me many of the old parties are still involved and are props to the PMs party. However I see thanathorn's party are trying to break the old mold and I see the new student push as focused on the 'right' factors to build proper democracy, equality and more.

 

There's a long bumpy road ahead.

I agree with your post except I don't trust Thanathorn. He works together with Thaksin that alone is a reason to reject him.

If he wants a fair and corruption free government then he should stay away from most established parties and politicians.

13 hours ago, Baerboxer said:

 

Yeah right, boring. So let's all just pretend the BBC, CNN, Fox, Reuters, News Corp etc etc don't have their own politically motivated agendas and only broadcast the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth.

 

Try not to fall off that bar stool now.

Yaaaaaawn....

Isn't happy hour starting soon?

Edited August 28, 20205 yr by Saint Nick

On 8/27/2020 at 10:16 AM, overherebc said:

 black-pudding.

Can I have some mustard with it?

10 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

I agree with your post except I don't trust Thanathorn. He works together with Thaksin that alone is a reason to reject him.

If he wants a fair and corruption free government then he should stay away from most established parties and politicians.

Thats exactly what my wife said to me he is to much like Toxin

On 8/26/2020 at 2:46 PM, Saint Nick said:

If you consider, that many Thais see them as "superstars" (quoting Mrs Nick here), you might understand!

Yeah... never understood what dictionary the Thais got the definition of superstar out of....