Overcharged, Even With A Menu

[Furbie]

The problem is, you need to decide how important that restaurant it to you. If the principle is more important, here is what I do – I don’t argue, I don’t ask to speak to the owner, I don’t give them what they asked for - I don’t do anything more than ask for the menu, add the bill up, and leave the correct amount and go. Four times in five years I have taken this exact course of action (note, always have lots of small bills – cuts down on taxi and food stall issues), but no one has ever said anything to me. What are they going to say? Stop, you paid the correct amount – get back here and pay more!

Thailand is full of double pricing, most is trying to take advantage of ignorance, or the farrang willingness to let it happen – stand up to it, change venues, find a new place to eat. I am yet to find a local Thai place to eat that is so fantastic the place down the street isn’t as good.

Funny example – sitting in a Thai bar, they had promotion signs all over the place – bottles of Heineken for (I think it was 60 baht). My friends and I ordered about six bottles in total. The bill arrives, they charged us 70 Baht a bottle. Me – hey, they are 60 Baht, you have signs everywhere. Waiter – no they are 70 Baht. Me – then why are their signs saying 60 Baht special? Waiter - that was for yesterday. Me - oh, I am an American, so it is still yesterday for me – here is 360 Baht, have a nice day. Waiter – takes the money and leaves. What is he going to say?

[uptou]

i feel that there is generally so many food places around,especially for som tam ,& moo yang,that if i'm not happy with the service,whats the point of going back.

i'm always abit wary if the food place owners ask,aroi mai as i feel it might lead to an inflated price.

after youve been here awile it becomes more of principle to get the right price,

as opposed to the tourist whos only been to thailand for a week-40 baht,is nuffing is it.

[Prakanong]

we aint done yet.............lol.

now i know why thais will take advantage of farangs. the farangs are just like rocky balboa. they lead with their chin just asking to be smacked, and when the thai smacks em they go back for more.

yea........40 baht......that's a real ass-whoomping!

glad a newbie is such a Thai expert.

LOL - he once walked past a Thai restaurant in his home town though!!!!

[Rinrada]

JR Texas: This sort of petty theft bugs me.......it seems to be a well-established game in Thailand.

A Thai just came into my office and told me, "Thais think all farangs are rich."

Maybe it is a cultural thing.....they think we are all rich so cheating us is OK. Of course, to them it is not cheating and probably has something to do with perceived "fairness."

So farangs and Thais are on opposite sides of a cultural (ethical/moral) fence with regard to this issue.

For the record, I think the worst cheats are the tuk tuk and taxi drivers.

Fairly good assessment of their thoughts and even more so when for some reason or other so many (farangs) also seem to deluded and want to appear to be RICH....

They think that since they are in a TWC that they automatically become re incarnated versions of John P Getty or Andrew Carnegie....

wots the score..?....leaving Tips in cheap restaurants ....paying double on 5 bt buses in Patti......

Can you really blame the locals for trying to rip them off... they probably think you enjoy it ..

When in Rome..etc...

[LoveDaBlues]

The problem is, you need to decide how important that restaurant it to you. If the principle is more important, here is what I do – I don’t argue, I don’t ask to speak to the owner, I don’t give them what they asked for - I don’t do anything more than ask for the menu, add the bill up, and leave the correct amount and go. Four times in five years I have taken this exact course of action (note, always have lots of small bills – cuts down on taxi and food stall issues), but no one has ever said anything to me. What are they going to say? Stop, you paid the correct amount – get back here and pay more!

Thailand is full of double pricing, most is trying to take advantage of ignorance, or the farrang willingness to let it happen – stand up to it, change venues, find a new place to eat. I am yet to find a local Thai place to eat that is so fantastic the place down the street isn’t as good.

Funny example – sitting in a Thai bar, they had promotion signs all over the place – bottles of Heineken for (I think it was 60 baht). My friends and I ordered about six bottles in total. The bill arrives, they charged us 70 Baht a bottle. Me – hey, they are 60 Baht, you have signs everywhere. Waiter – no they are 70 Baht. Me – then why are their signs saying 60 Baht special? Waiter - that was for yesterday. Me - oh, I am an American, so it is still yesterday for me – here is 360 Baht, have a nice day. Waiter – takes the money and leaves. What is he going to say?

Wonder how many times THAT works? Probably a lot with tourists as they don't want a hassel over 10 baht.

[Jingthing]

Be careful or they might call the police on you.

I think the "old sign" scam would be harder to fight than a menu issue. Also not such a rare game.

Edited May 3, 2007 by Jingthing

[Mighty Mouse]

The problem is, you need to decide how important that restaurant it to you. If the principle is more important, here is what I do – I don’t argue, I don’t ask to speak to the owner, I don’t give them what they asked for - I don’t do anything more than ask for the menu, add the bill up, and leave the correct amount and go.

Take note everybody, this is how to do it but do it with a smile. That way nobody loses face and maybe the scammer will think twice before pulling the same stunt on some other farang customer.

[Morty]

Typical TV thread on this issue, you have two camps - One that you're keeneow and shouldn't mind, just bend over and take your medicine! Then theres the other that, rightly so, you should argue the toss out of it and get a fair deal.

Whenever I go to a place like that I try to ascertain the price first! But of course its not always possible as, you may come across as a keeneow in front of all the thais and, in this case, the thai gf.

The two camps, I think, are people coming from countries where a tip is customary, and the ones coming from places where tips is not common (i.e. Thailand, and certain parts of Europe). when it comes to being kee ne ow I found the easy solution. I let my wife handle the waiters when we eat at Thai restaurants. I have never experienced any bill padding at all, and we live in Pattaya. When it comes to tip, my wife tells me that we don't tip for normal service, if we get something extra, a tip is in order. According to my wife, there is no need for more than 20 baht tip on a Thai restaurant. I can assure all of you that my wife and I have never experienced rude behavior because of a 20 baht tip, and rest assured my wife would have reacted very badly toward anyone in charge, if that was ever to happen. I would dare saying that it is the big tippers that are most likely to have their bills padded (Thai ppl look at them as stupid, and they have words for it ) When we go to International restaurants I take care of the bill, with service charges, tip and all. My wife still thinks I'm giving away money regarding the tip , and she has lived and worked for eight years in Europe with me .

As a side note, we normally bring our kids along as well, and they are also Thai citizens (luk krungs) so that might have something to do with it.

When I go out alone I have found that making my order in Thai, I'm less likely to be scammed. So my suggestion is learn the Thai language or let your GF/wife do the orders or at least settle the bill, if you are in a Thai establishment.

When it comes to tips, notice that no one expects a tip from a Thai person, and are pleasantly surprised and happy when it happens, and IMHO just the way it should be.

As the saying goes: when in Rome.......

[scousemouse]

Recently, I found a new restaurant on a quiet soi not far from my apartment. It's an Isaan restaurant, serving such tasty treats as som tam, kao moo yang and nom took moo. The tables are spread out in a banana grove, providing a relaxing, private atmosphere with the sounds of birds chirping instead of engines revving.

Today I went there for lunch with my girlfriend. When we received the bill, we were surprised to see a different total than what we'd expected. It wasn't much higher, but enough to catch our attention.

My girlfriend asked why the prices on the bill weren't the same as the prices on the menu. The waiter clearly was caught off guard, and spewed out some bs story about how it was an old menu from an old restaurant, and the prices were different now. We knew that was crap for many reasons, and my girlfriend politely told him that he shouldn't charge a different price than what was on the menu. And in fact, on our previous visit they hadn't. But this time they smelled farang money and got greedy, and tried to overcharge us in spite of having prices clearly written on the menu.

Now, it's not the money that bothers me. The difference was only about 40 baht. But it's the principle of being ripped off. I just can't understand people who have such a petty mentality. By attempting to steal 40 baht, they've now lost my future business. I probably would have gone there a few times a week, and I always tip . But now I'll never go back.

This is not a unique experience. This happens more often than I'd like to admit, and it's beginning to drive me crazy! Anyone else have similar experiences?

Either get used to it or from now on when you order food tell the waiter how much your order costs , works everytime .

[Firefan]

Annoys me too - whether only 40 Baht or not. A smile and request for the menu to check have always sorted it out for me. Cheers!

[blizzard]

just to add to the mod comment.

the thais think you enjoy it should be changed to they know you enjoy it.

we all having a ball over this principle. though i still thinks its the money for him, it always is.

if i were the owners next time this guy eats i would charge more than the last time. he paid last time and he came back. and more the next time he came in.

[draggons]

Agree with Morty here, let the missus order in Thai eateries. Mines the same as Morty's in that she never leaves more than 20baht

[nick2k]

just to add to the mod comment.

the thais think you enjoy it should be changed to they know you enjoy it.

we all having a ball over this principle. though i still thinks its the money for him, it always is.

if i were the owners next time this guy eats i would charge more than the last time. he paid last time and he came back. and more the next time he came in.

I get this feeling you are anti-american?

[blizzard]

im an american all the way. love it , think its the greatest country ever.

what i make fun of is how usually farangs handle themselves in thailand.

these people want to teach a middle age couple who own a business how to run it. they thai they run it how they want to. and yet so many say go back give em a chance. if you want to patronize a busness with ethical problems , go ahead.

i say vote with your foots. go give your busness to someone who DOESNT try to jerk you off.

they cant be the only place selling tom sum

Edited May 3, 2007 by blizzard

[markg]

A problem i often find is that the staff cant add up. My missus ALWAYS checks the bill - no matter how long it is - and makes the waiter stand there whilst she does it. If its wrong in any way, back it goes. She smiles and is polite of course, as we all should be. The bill is OFTEN wrong though. She says this is nothing to do with me being foreign - it even happens back home in Nakon Si Nowhere. They just aint that bright.

Like the OP says - it aint about the money - its the principle. And i agree.

If you live in a tourist zone - just keep paying the money and see how much the prices go up.

Look, for example, at tourist places with lots of scandinavians who will just pay anything if you want evidence. They tried it on with me once in ko Lanta. Songthaw full of scandinavians paid the extra 20 baht each. I said call the cops and paid the agreed and advertised rate.

I dont like getting ripped off ANYWHERE.

[blizzard]

sir, you anti scandinavian?

[Maigo6]

This is not a unique experience. This happens more often than I'd like to admit, and it's beginning to drive me crazy! Anyone else have similar experiences?

No.

[Maigo6]

For the record, I think the worst cheats are the tuk tuk and taxi drivers.

JR, are you counting all the cheating Farangs that would rip you off at the drop of a hat in that statement ?

[Morty]

Look, for example, at tourist places with lots of scandinavians who will just pay anything if you want evidence. They tried it on with me once in ko Lanta. Songthaw full of scandinavians paid the extra 20 baht each. I said call the cops and paid the agreed and advertised rate.

I dont like getting ripped off ANYWHERE.

Thanks for painting all of us with that broad brush!!

For your information, I'm scandinavian, Norwegian as a matter of fact, and rest assured I don't pay "anything they want"

But then again I don't act like a tourist, I live here.

My experience is that if you get ripped of, it's because your behavior indicate you are not familiar with the "Thai" way of doing things.

BTW I have never threatened anyone with the police to get my way, and I can assure you that's not the "Thai" way of doing things .

[qwertz]

Jeebusjones has a point when he says this happens a lot so don't bash the newbie. He said the food was good but he doubts if he'll go back. And why should he: it's not the amount of money but the principle and the fact that the crooked help thinks farangs are too dumb or so obsessed with "face" that they'll sit still for it. Thai restaurants and bars lose regular business through these petty scams and bad service because any help with such low regard for customers is hardly likely to concern itself with customer satisfaction in the interests of repeat business. The fact is - they just don't care. I say blacklist them Jeebus and make sure you tell your friends too.

[LinkPopularity]

She's also pretty concerned about "face," and she thought she could keep the higher ground by paying the extra bit.

this is the part I don't understand, no offence to your girlfriend, mine is the same, point being ... to me ... if you get other people ripping you off, then you're the one loosing face ... yep, the other way around ...

[blizzard]

im concerned about your girlfriends face. you want her face to be devalued more by thais wiling to rip off a fellow thai. like the guy said kick some butt or leave it alone.

i personally think the face thing is overrated, just treat others like how you want them to treat you.

Edited May 3, 2007 by blizzard

[larvidchr]

A problem i often find is that the staff cant add up. My missus ALWAYS checks the bill - no matter how long it is - and makes the waiter stand there whilst she does it. If its wrong in any way, back it goes. She smiles and is polite of course, as we all should be. The bill is OFTEN wrong though. She says this is nothing to do with me being foreign - it even happens back home in Nakon Si Nowhere. They just aint that bright.

Like the OP says - it aint about the money - its the principle. And i agree.

If you live in a tourist zone - just keep paying the money and see how much the prices go up.

Look, for example, at tourist places with lots of scandinavians who will just pay anything if you want evidence. They tried it on with me once in ko Lanta. Songthaw full of scandinavians paid the extra 20 baht each. I said call the cops and paid the agreed and advertised rate.

I dont like getting ripped off ANYWHERE.

You will have to excuse us scandinavians, in our countries a price is a price and rarely will anybody ask a higher price than the real cost, haggeling over prices in shops and public transport is almost unheard of, so when turists from scandinavia come here it is quite a culture chock having to expect that sombody will try to rip you of, especially for amounts so small that it wouldent even cover the cost of half a cigaret back home.

And even though I am an expat living here, nobody is going to make me stand in the street arguing about 5 bath, it is not me as a single individual that has to stop the Bathbus scheeme, it must be up to the authorities, and if I am not happy with their result I am free to leave anytime, I dont think it is right what they do, but it is not enough to take the joy of living here away, if I get cheated for small amounts in a resturant, I just walk away and never come back, as some suggests the Thai might think he won, but I dont care, you see I think I won, I dident get upset, I dont have an ulcer and my day is still okay.

Kind regards

[qwertz]

Larvidchr has it right. Why let them spoil your day? Just don't go back to rip off merchants.

[SiamSquare123]

wait... you got over charged for 40 baht, got home, logged onto thaivisa and created a thread about it?

hahahahahahaahahahahahhahaha

[sriracha john]

It's happened any number of times with us and have never ended up paying anything other than the menu price.

There's far too many restaurant-choices here to ever return to the ones who have done this.

*edit. That is, for those that have attributed it to "old menu" or "bigger size" or other lame reason. If it's attributed to bad math skills and they seem genuinely apologetic, we'll return if we like the place.

Edited May 3, 2007 by sriracha john

[The Skipper]

The small bar at the top of my street ripped me off on my very first visit, my very first beer.

I walk past everyday now, instead of stopping in and buying some rounds.

How stupid of them....and they still call out "hello, welcome". Not very sincere and certainly not getting a single bt from me or my friends.

Repeat.

Avoid 'THE FIRST BAR", Sukhumvit Soi 8.

[0Mix1up]

Its one of the Few things I'm happy about when "Returning Home" a price is a price is a price.

But TIT like it or lump it, find a method to deal with it and move on.

And yet I've received extra food to try, "you try this one, aroi? you like?" for no charge.

[Naam]

i read repeatedly "principle" but i also detect the usual thai-bashing. from my experience "cheating" somebody who, in the eyes of the "cheater", can afford to shell out more money happens in a lot of countries and is not limited to Thailand.

my opinion is that one has to weigh the pros and cons based on the amount in question. riding the "principle horse" does not pay in each and every case.

[OneeyedJohn]

You have to make a judgment from the overall look of the place i.e. is the waiter just trying it on or is the whole attitude of the place rip off.

If you lower yourself to the level of arguing with the waiter ( or calling the boss ) then you've lost the battle, you win the war by not returning.

I can buy a pack of fags for 60B, proffer a 100B note and the cashier will use a calculator to work out my change...happens often.....go figure.

I live in the sticks and this happens occasionally and really isn't worth the stress.

Drink 3 bottles of beer and get charged for 4 is a different matter