Will the 400,000 Baht Marriage Option.....

[vermin on arrival]

The valid thing to speculate is whether the more recent changes are part of a pattern that continues into the foreseeable future. You cannot foresee the future in Thailand.

If they increase the limits/restrictions enough, we'd all be illegal here.

Peace Blondie(or do you prefer Peter Pan ,

The trend has been there since the beginning of TRT and Thaksin. He slowly, but surely made all of the visa requirements for work visas, and the costs for all of the visas ,and the money to show for all the non-immigrant and for retirment visas higher. He steadliy increased the fees for overstay and visa extension. Although the rational was that there had not been increases for quite some time(which was true), the implications were clear-pay us more or get out. They changed the work visa rules around 5 times I believe, and one immigration officer even came out and stated that the rules were toughened to deliberately make it harder for foreigners to work in Thailand. In addition, to increase the tax going into government coffers they increased the minimum salary requirements for foreigners working in Thailand and did it in a strange quasi-racist fashion that required people form the west to be have to earn more or they wouldn't get a visa.

At the end of the Thaksin reign, the new rules which have caused so much uproar were initiated, and many were hopeful that with the coup they would be rescinded. However, it appears that the ultranationalists who are running the show are even more gung-ho in adding rule after rule that make things more difficult and inconvenient for foreigners to stay here. Certainly, I cannot forsee the future, especially in a place like Thailand, but the trend has been there for quite some time, at least the last 6 or 7 years. It appears that worse changes will come.

[vermin on arrival]

There were a whole lot of people gloating when the visa exemption stamp rules went into effect Oct 1. Just go back and read some of those threads and nasty reponses from some people fortunate enough to have sorted visa situations. I am certain that some of these people are now getting the shaft on this marriage thing. We all need to take care before we speak as our own situations can change over night.

i joined this forum in september, scoured each and every thread for some valuable information and i do not recall a single "gloating" posting the sort you mentioned.

Dr Naam,

I think you missed some posts. I can not mention them by name or by which thread they appeared in, but I've seen a number of posts in which people who were unaffected made nasty comments about the group of people who were affected by certain rules, referring to them by terms such as vermin or riff-raff. They made it clear that they were glad that all the "bad" farang were being forced out and some even expressed a desire for even harsher rules. In one case, I recall someone voicing support for rasing the money requirement for non-immigrant visas to 2 million baht so that all of the no good farang would be driven out.

In reality, the sad truth is that the thai government seems to be willing to move many of us into the class of undesirables, legal one day and not legal the next no matter what our behavior has been like during our stay in the kingdom. If I had serious roots in the LOS, such as a wife, children or property, I would be really worried right now. As it is, with my rented apartment full of possesssions that I've brought over or have accumulated over the last 10 years, I'm feeling none too secure. Before these changes took place, I was going to upgrade my living sitaution here and really spend some dosh to improve the quality of my life, but all that is on hold until I see how things shake out. I'm not optimistic. Unfortunately, I have to start considering something which I never had thought possible-leaving the LOS.

Edited May 13, 2007 by vermin on arrival

[otherstuff1957]

A good friend of mine who has lived here since 2001 owns a home across from a Colonel of the Royal Thai Police Bangkok. My friend is having dinner with this police official as we speak. He figured he would ask about what I was just told at Pattaya Immigration and it has been confirmed.

Here is the new information - they now want the Thai spouse to prove income which would go along with what Colonel Prattaporn told me at Pattaya Immigration. She told me to start a business with my Thai Wife to show income. I wondered why she didn't say I should just show income but she did not. Now I know why, they want the Thai Spouse to show the income.

No-one has really commented on the most surreal bit in the above post... They want the Thai Spouse to show the income!!

I can't wait to see the look on my wife's face when I tell her that she's going to have to earn 40K a month next year to support me!

[dave111223]

whatever you do, do not bet your life savings on Grandfather because he has cancer and will die on Oct 1

On 6th of April this year I renewed my yearly extension based on old 400K rule. Immigration then made both my wife and myself sign a statement that if we wanted to use the same rule next year, we both understood the 400K had to be in the bank for 3 months. This statement that we signed is obviously kept in my own personal file in immigration.

Immigration may change the rules again, but at the present time the officers are under the impression that those who are eligable to use the 400K rule this year can do so again next year.

Cheers,

Soundman.

Take that paper into the shitter with you and use it appropriately. It will suffice more as toilet paper than a guarantee - the promise made to you has been rescinded.

After Oct 1 you will no longer be able to show 400,000 in the bank as a reason to stay while married to and supporting a Thai.

Over.

Fini.

Kaput.

You can take that to the bank.

That's where you are being a touch naieve there Mr. click.

Can't take anything to the bank with regards to laws, policy or whatever at govt. level in Thailand, especially something that might be the opinion of one person, who may be part of a much larger commitee, and is just letting it fly over finger foods & whiskey.

Cheers,

Soundman.

I also signed this paper (about same time as Soundman). They told me "Make sure you have the money in the bank atleast 3 months before you apply next time"

They did NOT say "You can't use your bank account next time"

click2delete: You seem to know just about everything for someone with only 36 posts to your name? Overnight expert on Thai immigration are we?

[click2delete]

That's where you are being a touch naieve there Mr. click.

Can't take anything to the bank with regards to laws, policy or whatever at govt. level in Thailand, especially something that might be the opinion of one person, who may be part of a much larger commitee, and is just letting it fly over finger foods & whiskey.

Cheers,

Soundman.

My information came from the Captain at Pattaya Immigration. It was confirmed by a high ranking police Colonel having dinner with my friend on the same day. The colonel called his counterpart at Immigration in Bangkok - the question was asked and the answer was given.

After Oct 1, there will no longer be an option for a foriegner married to a Thai to use 400,000 baht in the bank for the application. The only thing accepted with be proof of 40,000 baht income from eithe the spouse, the foreigner or combined.

[chuchok]

click2delete: You seem to know just about everything for someone with only 36 posts to your name? Overnight expert on Thai immigration are we?

Are you serious?Since when does having lots of posts mean anything?I have a few posts,but know bugger all about immigration.What about the people that have been here many years,but have just signed up????

[jumnien]

It's amazing. The Thai govt lowers the financial requirements from 400,000 baht in a Thai account to zero and some farang interpret that as an attempt to get them to leave. Well, there are many elderly farang here who will find it far easier now to live on their fixed incomes without keeping large sums in the bank here.

[Naam]

Dr Naam,

I think you missed some posts. I can not mention them by name or by which thread they appeared in, but I've seen a number of posts in which people who were unaffected made nasty comments about the group of people who were affected by certain rules, referring to them by terms such as vermin or riff-raff. They made it clear that they were glad that all the "bad" farang were being forced out and some even expressed a desire for even harsher rules. In one case, I recall someone voicing support for rasing the money requirement for non-immigrant visas to 2 million baht so that all of the no good farang would be driven out.

if that is truly the case, i stand corrected. however, i am sure that nobody in his right mind has voiced objections that a foreigner -who has sufficient funds and wants to take care of his thai family- should be deported. concerning "vermin and riff-raff", we all know that these categories of farangs do exist in Thailand and tarnish with their behaviour the image of other honest foreigners.

[phutoie2]

click2delete: You seem to know just about everything for someone with only 36 posts to your name? Overnight expert on Thai immigration are we?

Are you serious?Since when does having lots of posts mean anything?I have a few posts,but know bugger all about immigration.What about the people that have been here many years,but have just signed up????

Agreed, its taken years for me to save up for a computer!! & no internet cafe's around here

[Fred Sanford]

Dr Naam,

I think you missed some posts. I can not mention them by name or by which thread they appeared in, but I've seen a number of posts in which people who were unaffected made nasty comments about the group of people who were affected by certain rules, referring to them by terms such as vermin or riff-raff. They made it clear that they were glad that all the "bad" farang were being forced out and some even expressed a desire for even harsher rules. In one case, I recall someone voicing support for rasing the money requirement for non-immigrant visas to 2 million baht so that all of the no good farang would be driven out.

if that is truly the case, i stand corrected. however, i am sure that nobody in his right mind has voiced objections that a foreigner -who has sufficient funds and wants to take care of his thai family- should be deported. concerning "vermin and riff-raff", we all know that these categories of farangs do exist in Thailand and tarnish with their behaviour the image of other honest foreigners.

so what you are saying is that all persons who post in this forum are in their right mind. LOL, wake up and smell the coffee dude

[dave111223]

click2delete: You seem to know just about everything for someone with only 36 posts to your name? Overnight expert on Thai immigration are we?

Are you serious?Since when does having lots of posts mean anything?I have a few posts,but know bugger all about immigration.What about the people that have been here many years,but have just signed up????

When you combine low post count with someone making absolute statements about the Thai law (when anyone who's been here any time knows the law seems to vary depending on the officer enforcing it).

And then top that off with his "My Mate knows this high ranking Colonel, and he told him..."

Leads me to believe that most of what he is saying is ****

[jackr]

A good friend of mine who has lived here since 2001 owns a home across from a Colonel of the Royal Thai Police Bangkok. My friend is having dinner with this police official as we speak. He figured he would ask about what I was just told at Pattaya Immigration and it has been confirmed.

Here is the new information - they now want the Thai spouse to prove income which would go along with what Colonel Prattaporn told me at Pattaya Immigration. She told me to start a business with my Thai Wife to show income. I wondered why she didn't say I should just show income but she did not. Now I know why, they want the Thai Spouse to show the income.

No-one has really commented on the most surreal bit in the above post... They want the Thai Spouse to show the income!!

I can't wait to see the look on my wife's face when I tell her that she's going to have to earn 40K a month next year to support me!

Yeah, same here. I shall go and let her know right now.

So if the 400k option is out, how about simply SWIFTing over 40k a month or am I missing something?

[JR Texas]

The valid thing to speculate is whether the more recent changes are part of a pattern that continues into the foreseeable future. You cannot foresee the future in Thailand.

If they increase the limits/restrictions enough, we'd all be illegal here.

Peace Blondie(or do you prefer Peter Pan ,

The trend has been there since the beginning of TRT and Thaksin. He slowly, but surely made all of the visa requirements for work visas, and the costs for all of the visas ,and the money to show for all the non-immigrant and for retirment visas higher. He steadliy increased the fees for overstay and visa extension. Although the rational was that there had not been increases for quite some time(which was true), the implications were clear-pay us more or get out. They changed the work visa rules around 5 times I believe, and one immigration officer even came out and stated that the rules were toughened to deliberately make it harder for foreigners to work in Thailand. In addition, to increase the tax going into government coffers they increased the minimum salary requirements for foreigners working in Thailand and did it in a strange quasi-racist fashion that required people form the west to be have to earn more or they wouldn't get a visa.

At the end of the Thaksin reign, the new rules which have caused so much uproar were initiated, and many were hopeful that with the coup they would be rescinded. However, it appears that the ultranationalists who are running the show are even more gung-ho in adding rule after rule that make things more difficult and inconvenient for foreigners to stay here. Certainly, I cannot forsee the future, especially in a place like Thailand, but the trend has been there for quite some time, at least the last 6 or 7 years. It appears that worse changes will come.

JR Texas to Vermin on Arrival: Excellent summary........thanks! It helps put all of these changes in proper perspective.

[jackr]

A good friend of mine who has lived here since 2001 owns a home across from a Colonel of the Royal Thai Police Bangkok. My friend is having dinner with this police official as we speak. He figured he would ask about what I was just told at Pattaya Immigration and it has been confirmed.

Here is the new information - they now want the Thai spouse to prove income which would go along with what Colonel Prattaporn told me at Pattaya Immigration. She told me to start a business with my Thai Wife to show income. I wondered why she didn't say I should just show income but she did not. Now I know why, they want the Thai Spouse to show the income.

No-one has really commented on the most surreal bit in the above post... They want the Thai Spouse to show the income!!

I can't wait to see the look on my wife's face when I tell her that she's going to have to earn 40K a month next year to support me!

Yeah, same here. I shall go and let her know right now.

So if the 400k option is out, how about simply SWIFTing over 40k a month or am I missing something?

I guess this wouldn't impress immigration though...

[JR Texas]

A good friend of mine who has lived here since 2001 owns a home across from a Colonel of the Royal Thai Police Bangkok. My friend is having dinner with this police official as we speak. He figured he would ask about what I was just told at Pattaya Immigration and it has been confirmed.

Here is the new information - they now want the Thai spouse to prove income which would go along with what Colonel Prattaporn told me at Pattaya Immigration. She told me to start a business with my Thai Wife to show income. I wondered why she didn't say I should just show income but she did not. Now I know why, they want the Thai Spouse to show the income.

No-one has really commented on the most surreal bit in the above post... They want the Thai Spouse to show the income!!

I can't wait to see the look on my wife's face when I tell her that she's going to have to earn 40K a month next year to support me!

Yeah, same here. I shall go and let her know right now.

So if the 400k option is out, how about simply SWIFTing over 40k a month or am I missing something?

I guess this wouldn't impress immigration though...

JR Texas: The 400K was dropped because it did not break up enough Thai-Farang families. Now you and/or your Thai wife must show income per month. The income per month figure was set too high for a reason: to ensure the destruction of many Thai-Farang families.

Of course, you can set up a business for your Thai wife. But she must show proof of meeting the monthly income requirement in official tax receipts. Since that is almost impossible in Thailand, you will probably be inclined to "doctor the books." The govt. knows that already...........they are hoping and waiting for you to do it. And after you do it will be the end of your stay in Thailand.

The other option is for you to start a business in Thailand independent of your wife. But the govt. has made that almost impossible with the crazy rules and regulations. Have you seen the new list of jobs you can't do in Thailand?

They removed the 400K in the bank rule because they knew that most expats could not or would not start a business or set their wives up in a business that meets the excessively high monthly income requirement.

It is a no win situation and that is what they are trying to create: stopping visa runners and then putting nutty restrictions on tourist visas; stopping the investment visa; establishing rules that make it almost impossible to start a small business; setting the monthly income bar so high that your wife's business will never meet it without you having to break the law; and now abrogating the "marriage visa" grandfathered law..........with more to come.

From where I sit, it looks like the people in charge want us out.

"Beware of what you wish for...........you just might get it."

--unknown

[mijan24]

Income requirements are totally unfair to the poor. What if a Thai farmer had married a woman from laos? He will not make 40,ooo a month. So according to them he has no right to get married! Its just wrong.

Bernie66 not correct he has by birthright the right to live in his native country the same as we do but in our countries of birth.

[Naam]

After Oct 1, there will no longer be an option for a foriegner married to a Thai to use 400,000 baht in the bank for the application. The only thing accepted with be proof of 40,000 baht income from eithe the spouse, the foreigner or combined.

so where is your problem Click? i refer to your quote "money is not the problem". if the latter is the case and you don't feel like working, why not show THB 40k monthly income from abroad?

all 400k / 800k requirements were never meant to show only but to spend although it wasn't really enforced. but i'll bet my (not so) sweet butt that this will be enforced in future.

[Naam]

Now I know why, they want the Thai Spouse to show the income.

After Oct 1, there will no longer be an option for a foriegner married to a Thai to use 400,000 baht in the bank for the application. The only thing accepted with be proof of 40,000 baht income from either the spouse, the foreigner or combined.

please make up your mind Click. which one is it now?

[vermin on arrival]

Income requirements are totally unfair to the poor. What if a Thai farmer had married a woman from laos? He will not make 40,ooo a month. So according to them he has no right to get married! Its just wrong.

Bernie66 not correct he has by birthright the right to live in his native country the same as we do but in our countries of birth.

Mijan 24,

In many countries, if you marry a citizen of the nation while legally in that country, or have children of that nationality, you have the right to live there. You are put on a track to get resident or permanent resident status or some other special kind of visa, or even citizenship. While people constantly harp about how the US has such harsh visa regulations, they don't mention that once you are in country(and I realize the problems US citizens have when they marry someone out of country and then bring them in) and marry a citizen and it is a legit marriage, you are put on track for a green card and then citzenship, property rights, work, etc..

I don't know of any other state that makes it so hard for you to even get a visa to stay in the country once you do that. I've never heard of financial requirements to stay in a nation when you fit this case, except in Thailand. Of course, it is Thailand's right to do this, but it doesn't make it a fair policy. This could just be my ignorance and my indolence because I'm too lazy to google it now. Would anyone care to enlighten me on this subject? Do many other nations have such policies? Japan? Korea?

I also realize that women marry out into the family of the husband in Thailand as in many other Asian societies, and that the rules are different for when men and women marry foreigners here and potentially elsewhere in Asia,etc.

[vermin on arrival]

A good friend of mine who has lived here since 2001 owns a home across from a Colonel of the Royal Thai Police Bangkok. My friend is having dinner with this police official as we speak. He figured he would ask about what I was just told at Pattaya Immigration and it has been confirmed.

Here is the new information - they now want the Thai spouse to prove income which would go along with what Colonel Prattaporn told me at Pattaya Immigration. She told me to start a business with my Thai Wife to show income. I wondered why she didn't say I should just show income but she did not. Now I know why, they want the Thai Spouse to show the income.

No-one has really commented on the most surreal bit in the above post... They want the Thai Spouse to show the income!!

I can't wait to see the look on my wife's face when I tell her that she's going to have to earn 40K a month next year to support me!

Yeah, same here. I shall go and let her know right now.

So if the 400k option is out, how about simply SWIFTing over 40k a month or am I missing something?

My understanding is that they require your embassy to verify that this is actually part of a steady monthly income which you are paid, be it pension or whatever, and that you can't just be sending the money to yourself every month from outside or have a friend do it. Or am I wrong?

[Morty]

Regarding the embassy letter, I can report that it is not enough to satisfy immigration. ATM they want to see you transferring the same amount that is mentioned in your embassy letter, read my post regarding this earlier. To me it's obvious that they are increasing the requirements, but they are doing it step by step. My extension was rejected even though I'd transferred 1.5 mill. baht last year, and the reason: my embassy letter stated that I made more money then I actually had transferred. The officer in charge was the lady mentioned in an earlier post here at Pattaya immigration. So my conclusion is that we should all be concerned, since the immigration officers seems to be trying their very best to misinterpret their orders, or generally place hurdles in our way. And believe me, it has nothing to do with excluding the so called undesirables. My guess is that we, as foreigners with our foreign income, are capable of taking better care of our "poor" families and educating our kids to a better degree than the establishment in Thailand, and it pi$$es them off.

I hope I'm wrong but the signs are there.

Morty

[edwinchester]

I like some people have enough money in the UK to live comfortably in Thailand until my pesion kicks in when I am 60.

And like some people find it a pain to prove the 40k Bht per month.

I will be 48 in December, married to a Thai and am now here on a multi entry.

Age 50 I intend to go the retirement option.

Until then I guess that I can continue with the multi entries.

Or howabout this cunning plan?

Wifey says that she is housekeeper, cook, foodseller whatever.

I pay 40k into her bank every month to show the earnings.

Here's the hard part....she actually pays tax on the 40k. Hard for a Thai to pay any tax I know but an essential part if the plan is to succeed.

Comments are welcome.

Ed.

[phutoie2]

Regarding the embassy letter, I can report that it is not enough to satisfy immigration. ATM they want to see you transferring the same amount that is mentioned in your embassy letter, read my post regarding this earlier. To me it's obvious that they are increasing the requirements, but they are doing it step by step. My extension was rejected even though I'd transferred 1.5 mill. baht last year, and the reason: my embassy letter stated that I made more money then I

I hope I'm wrong but the signs are there.

Look I may be wrong here, but I am sure "Lopburi" mentioned that if your income is earned abroad and it meets the 40,000 baht per month criteria, and you have the embassy letter, plus evidence to back that up if the immigration ask for it, then that should be sufficient. I do not know of any requirement to monthly transfer 40k to a Thai bank account. That is not my reading of Police order 606/7.17 anyway.

On 22 May I am going to Soi Suanplu for annual extension armed with my recent embassy letter, so will let all know. Thanks

[Morty]

Look I may be wrong here, but I am sure "Lopburi" mentioned that if your income is earned abroad and it meets the 40,000 baht per month criteria, and you have the embassy letter, plus evidence to back that up if the immigration ask for it, then that should be sufficient. I do not know of any requirement to monthly transfer 40k to a Thai bank account. That is not my reading of Police order 606/7.17 anyway.

On 22 May I am going to Soi Suanplu for annual extension armed with my recent embassy letter, so will let all know. Thanks

I can assure you that you are correct, but the immigration officers might see it differently, and they're the ones stamping your PP. so be prepared for some extra hoops to jump trough. For me it turned out OK in the end, but there seems to be all sorts of misinterpretations at the local immigration offices around the kingdom. Since you're going to Suan Plu I think you will get what you want, Pattaya, on the other hand, seems to enjoy making problems even though all the papers are in order

Good luck

Morty

[astral]

My information came from the Captain at Pattaya Immigration. It was confirmed by a high ranking police Colonel having dinner with my friend on the same day. The colonel called his counterpart at Immigration in Bangkok - the question was asked and the answer was given.

After Oct 1, there will no longer be an option for a foreigner married to a Thai to use 400,000 baht in the bank for the application. The only thing accepted with be proof of 40,000 baht income from eithe the spouse, the foreigner or combined.

All hearsay. A friend of a friend...................... etc who may not have understood the question properly.

Please write to Suan Plu and lets get this in writing.

Better still, as you are in real jam here, go up there and submit the papers, get the answer from the horses mouth.

Mind you, with friends on this level, I am very surprised you cannot find a solution.

[Naam]

I like some people have enough money in the UK to live comfortably in Thailand until my pesion kicks in when I am 60.

And like some people find it a pain to prove the 40k Bht per month.

I will be 48 in December, married to a Thai and am now here on a multi entry.

Age 50 I intend to go the retirement option.

Until then I guess that I can continue with the multi entries.

Or howabout this cunning plan?

Wifey says that she is housekeeper, cook, foodseller whatever.

I pay 40k into her bank every month to show the earnings.

Here's the hard part....she actually pays tax on the 40k. Hard for a Thai to pay any tax I know but an essential part if the plan is to succeed.

Comments are welcome.

Ed.

what's so bloody hard? have you figured out HOW MUCH tax is to be paid locally and HOW MUCH tax you are NOT paying in U.K.?

[Thaising]

My information came from the Captain at Pattaya Immigration. It was confirmed by a high ranking police Colonel having dinner with my friend on the same day. The colonel called his counterpart at Immigration in Bangkok - the question was asked and the answer was given.

After Oct 1, there will no longer be an option for a foreigner married to a Thai to use 400,000 baht in the bank for the application. The only thing accepted with be proof of 40,000 baht income from eithe the spouse, the foreigner or combined.

All hearsay. A friend of a friend...................... etc who may not have understood the question properly.

Please write to Suan Plu and lets get this in writing.

Better still, as you are in real jam here, go up there and submit the papers, get the answer from the horses mouth.

Mind you, with friends on this level, I am very surprised you cannot find a solution.

This is what I would like to hear and say mate. What's hear say.

[click2delete]

My information came from the Captain at Pattaya Immigration. It was confirmed by a high ranking police Colonel having dinner with my friend on the same day. The colonel called his counterpart at Immigration in Bangkok - the question was asked and the answer was given.

After Oct 1, there will no longer be an option for a foreigner married to a Thai to use 400,000 baht in the bank for the application. The only thing accepted with be proof of 40,000 baht income from eithe the spouse, the foreigner or combined.

All hearsay. A friend of a friend...................... etc who may not have understood the question properly.

Please write to Suan Plu and lets get this in writing.

Better still, as you are in real jam here, go up there and submit the papers, get the answer from the horses mouth.

Mind you, with friends on this level, I am very surprised you cannot find a solution.

Do you read what I write? Carefully? I don't think you do. You're in good company, many people here read what they want to read, ignore the salient parts and then open their mouths and shoot from the hip.

I sat in front of Captain Pattraporn of the Pattaya Immigration office and spoke to her. We had a very pleasant conversation - we shared information with each other.

That is not hearsay - that is first person to first person contact.

What about that discussion did you not understand.

Right - I'll wait for you to read the original first post.

tick tock tick tock .....

[jumnien]

Yes, I'm sure the conversation was very, very pleasant and I'm sure the lovely lady had no reason not to give you the visa you deserve.

[click2delete]

Yes, I'm sure the conversation was very, very pleasant and I'm sure the lovely lady had no reason not to give you the visa you deserve.

I'm starting to question your being a pilot. You don't pay attention to detail.

I have to ask, are you autistic? Why don't you follow Astral back to the original post I made and you'll see that I went to Immigration for my 90 day report. I'm not due to renew my Marriage Visa Extension until next month.

I asked in advance - I don't like surprises.

Got it?

Maybe not:

1. I went for 90 day report.

2. I did not go for extension renewal.

When you understand let me know -

You are soon approaching my favorite saying:

Never try to teach a pig to sing, it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

Stop oinking and start reading.