Poll- Do You Feel That Thailand Wants You Or Wants You Out?

[uptou]

are we talking about the government (a few power minded individuals),or the feeling of the thai people in general?eg the fruit seller,guest house owner,etc.

any political party that calls itself "thais love thais",has to have a certain anti foreigner feeling to it,& i wonder whether they indirectly stirred feelings up a bit nationally.

visa regs are surely only going to change if it hits the cash flow.

maybe they've just realised that we aint that great after all.pattaya could be the sex tourism capital of the world,chaing mai doesnt exactly feel thai anymore.

[Naam]

Phil Conners- So if I'm Thai I can just move to the US, Germany, France or England with twenty thousand dollars or whatever, open some kind of small business and live there indefinitely on some kind of business visa?

It would be like that in my perfect world (along with many other changes), but is that really the law in those countries?

no you cannot. in fact all these countries have put up much stricter hurdles than Thailand. the only difference is that IF you succeed your position is more secure.

[torito]

maybe they've just realised that we aint that great after all.

[Edonista]

The truth is you made your choice in shakey grounds.

Exactly. Before one sets up a family it's a good idea to have a way to take care of it beforehand. Blaming the government does nothing to provide security for them.

Sometimes you do not choose to set up a family but you have to.

Ever heard of unexpected pregnancies ?

That thing that when happens to a Thai man usually make him flee to another village ?

When such thing happens to a farang instead he usually sets up a family and takes care of his child. I guess Immigration could show its appreciation for such an astonishing behaviour by not harassing the farang with silly income requirements. Or I must assume Immigration actually wants to encourage farang husbands to quit their Thai wives and children ?

Edited May 13, 2007 by Edonista

[rychrde]

The OP needs to look at the bright side. In my villlage, it is full of relatives.... pratically everyone is related. Now my son gets to have tons of role models, and every male in the village excludeing his father is unemployed. The males lay in a hamok all day. Now they do stress a little trying to decide if they should get up and switch the channel, but usually the more imediate decission is.... "Do I swat the fly, or just let him do his thing." Now their wife's and daughters work, usually selling food or something of that nature. So life as a male Thai aint that bad at all. He will thank you latter for it.

Actually, some of the men work very hard. OK, I said some! But one thing strikes me as strange, they seemto prefer to work hard for peanuts rather than sit back and have a plan to earn more. The women seem far more entrepreneurial in gneral than the men. They seem to look up to the chinese because they make lots of money and have businesses, and yet nothing inside them seems to stir to try and emulate them.

It has taken my own wife six months to finally get enthused about a possible biz. I said to her, I'd help her and family to help themselves - not to help themselves to my wallet - I've had to work for my pennies. Feels like we're nearly there now :-)

rych

[wintermute]

Phil Conners- So if I'm Thai I can just move to the US, Germany, France or England with twenty thousand dollars or whatever, open some kind of small business and live there indefinitely on some kind of business visa?

It would be like that in my perfect world (along with many other changes), but is that really the law in those countries?

no you cannot. in fact all these countries have put up much stricter hurdles than Thailand. the only difference is that IF you succeed your position is more secure.

What's different is that western countries allow foreigners or immigrants to succed whereas in Thailand even if you are successful your business may still be seized through extrajudicial means. This means the barriers are almost completely cultural and social rather than mostly economic like they are in the west.

Edited May 13, 2007 by wintermute

[torito]

What's different is that western countries allow foreigners or immigrants to succed whereas in Thailand even if you are successful your business may still be seized through extrajudicial means. This means the barriers are almost completely cultural and social rather than mostly economic like they are in the west.

you are right, and the corruption factor increases them still more...

but once you overcome all, you are in. Many in here appears to have achieved that, and they appears to be quite happy chaps.

[Edonista]

Click- It's clear to me that Thailand doesn't want you, at least given what you're doing right now. Which apparently is living on a tight budget and not working. Thailand certainly wants other farangs, if and as long as it's in Thailand's interests.

So you are stating that forcing the OP to leave Thailand quitting wife and child is in Thailand's interest ? That is having two...oh , sorry, I meant one and a half Thai citizens starving is in Thailand's interest ?

Maybe the millions of truly impoverished Thai citizens are more on their mind....

They are ? So they should be aware that hundreds of thousands of them (or perhaps millions of them) rely on farang money each time they need medical care, replace motorbike, replace buffalo,repair roof...actually farangs are the social security Thailand does not provide to its citizens. If Thailand government gets rid of farangs is it going to replace their precious social role ?

Edited May 13, 2007 by Edonista

[Galong]

There are plenty of countries that should also be called "Land of Smiles". I've had wonderful encounters with locals in Laos, Cambodia, the Philippines, Fiji, Malaysia, Mexico and Myanmar. I even found friendly people in Canada.

Plus, I came here are open-minded and accepting but after being screwed by everyone from employees, immigration, revenue dept and so on, I decided that I'll still stay because I love the environment. So far they haven't completely plowed every over and turned it into concrete... I can take or leave thai society. I see nothing special about it.

[torito]

They are ? So they should be aware that hundreds of thousands of them (or perhaps millions of them) rely on farang money each time they need medical care, replace motorbike, replace buffalo,repair roof...

This is a big buffalo s hit.....

If all farangs leave, this country will continue been Thailand......perhaps Pattaya will become a Thai Karoeke place....

But this will not happen, and if more barriers are placed for farangs....I am sure that will be plenty of them willing to come anyway!

[jumnien]

It's amazing that some vagabond farang seem to feel like the rather simple act of impregnating girls in lands far from their homeland entitles them to live in those lands. Can't get a visa, impregnate a local girl. I don't think many countries are going to go for this thinking...

[LinkPopularity]

the Thai government is without any doubt shooting themselves in the foot, burning their own bridges, smashing their own windows ...

I invested more then 2.000.000 Baht in this country and I bring about 300.000 Baht into this country every month, still I know that the Thai government don't want me, they want to blame me for their own mistakes, it's so obvious, they did thew same in '97, it was all the IMF's fault ... but I don't care !

In fact I'm happy that they screw up so badly, that's why I'm making a lot of money here !

if they wouldn't be so childish, but be professional instead, it would be much harder for me to make money

in the land of the blinds, 1 eye is king !

I love it here !

[Jingthing]

Well, it is pretty clear they are tweaking the rules, and will probably continue to tweak the rules, with the aim of improving the "quality" of the farangs allowed to stay. I for one will continue to play the game as long as I can. There may come a day when I can't jump the latest hoop and will have to leave. I hope that doesn't happen but you'd have to be blind to think that isn't part of the "contract". Yes, they are indeed throwing the baby out with the bathwater in many cases, and many good people, good objectively and good for Thailand, are being hurt. But we have no power on these matters, so the best we can do is be awake about it.

Edited May 13, 2007 by Jingthing

[Aussietraveller]

I think that each of us should compare the immigration process for our own countries, before we slam the Thai immigration process.

I am not defending the Thai immigration and Visa situation.

It is flawed in many ways.

BUT...

When i wanted a Visa to come to LOS, i went to the embassy in Australia with minimal preparation, and twenty minutes and several hundred dollars later i had a 1 year Visa.

The staff were professional and helpful and very easy to deal with.

I have to leave every 90 days, but can then return for another 90 days.

When my GF wanted to come to Australia, i spent weeks preparing an application.

Paid the Visa fee, Lodged the application in Bangkok.

GF got a phone call grilling her on ou relationship.

Visa was granted, 12 month multi entry tourist Visa.

With her Visa she had to leave the country every 90 days. (sound familiar)

IMHO, my Thai Visa was a lot easier to get than her Australian Tourist Visa.

We see many posts on this forum about people trying to get Visa's for their loved ones to return to their home country.

I feel that this is a lot harder than getting a visa for Thailand.

I am in the process of preparing spouse Visa app. for my wife so we can return to Australia later in the year.

The level of documentation required for this Visa exceeds anyhting that the Thai's have dreamed up.

I do believe that the Thai government does want to make it more difficult for us.

They are being more selective.

This is their right.

I do not necessarily agree with it, and it does make me angry some times, but i still thing it is easier to deal with than the system in my country.

[uptou]

the Thai government is without any doubt shooting themselves in the foot, burning their own bridges, smashing their own windows ...

yes,this is what i dont understand.i can understand that they dont give a toss about us,but from their own point of veiw i think that they've just F****D up with these visa reg changes.maybe decissions were made during a night,during which enormous amounts of whiskey were consumed,& thai pride & nationalism was on a high.

i wouldnt completely rule out incompetance,tit.

after awile i think things may turn a little easier regarding regulations (albeit a gradual,face saving return to easier times)

[Edonista]

It's amazing that some vagabond farang seem to feel like the rather simple act of impregnating girls in lands far from their homeland entitles them to live in those lands. Can't get a visa, impregnate a local girl. I don't think many countries are going to go for this thinking...

How right you are !

Thai land is for Thai only.

And impregnating Thai girls leaving them to raise the child alone is a sport for Thai men only.

Farangs must not dare to make them look bad by taking care of wife and children. Let's make them pay taxes and fees until they quit their demeaning behaviour !

[Edonista]

It's amazing that some vagabond farang seem to feel like the rather simple act of impregnating girls in lands far from their homeland entitles them to live in those lands. Can't get a visa, impregnate a local girl. I don't think many countries are going to go for this thinking...

Forgot to say that the "vagabond" that opened this thread states he has no problem in showing 400,000 TBH in his account. That's 4 times average salary in Thailand. So he can for sure provide an above average lifestyle to his family.

He is complaining Immigration wants him to show a domestic income of 40,000baht/months, that he will have to create fictitiously, just to allow Income department to tax it.

[jumnien]

I'm sure all will work out for the fine fellow. As I've said, it sure helps if you have a Thai interpreter with you or take the time to learn the language. No need to start a business and get a work permit to qualify for a one year visa - marriage or retirement. Sounds like one of the many misunderstandings we all come across from our farang friends. There's been some winners over the years!

[torito]

Well, it is pretty clear they are tweaking the rules, and will probably continue to tweak the rules, with the aim of improving the "quality" of the farangs allowed to stay. I for one will continue to play the game as long as I can. There may come a day where I can't jump the latest hoop and will have to leave. I hope that doesn't happen but you'd have to be blind to think this isn't part of the "contract". Yes, they are indeed throwing the baby out with the bathwater in many cases, and many good people, good objectively and good for Thailand, are being hurt. But we have no power on these matters, so the best we can do is be awake about it.

Most farangs assume that everything for them should be granted....they hate to struggle, and beleive that they have rights and deserve all things...

Well this is Thailand, and the country struggles with many things: widespread corruption, a non-competitive educational system, lack of English, lack of skills that make companies to move away, unstable political situation, social inequality,.......and you can add more to the list.

How the country can deal with a large population of unwanted farangs, maintaining the good ones and their money (thing that all countries in the world do), with all the crap that has to deal with its own problems......not easy ah?

Farangs should be awake that the country is struggling, and this invariable will impact their social condition in here......unfortunatelly they cannot be out of it.

Edited: change luck for lack......sorry

Edited May 13, 2007 by torito

[click2delete]

I feel sorry for the OP's wife with a child of one month that the father doesn't want brought up as Thai and a totally uncertain future.

My wife not only agrees, but she wants him brought up as much as a non-Thai that is possible if we stay here.

Why do you think she married me and not Somchai down the block? Could it be that Somchai and all his available Thai friends were more interested in swigging Mekhong, riding motorcycles like idiots, and screwing any women that would look to or away from them.

She only has to look to her own father to see what she does not want her son to become.

Careful with your assumptions.

[jumnien]

luck of English?

[torito]

My wife not only agrees, but she wants him brought up as much as a non-Thai that is possible if we stay here.

Why do you think she married me and not Somchai down the block? Could it be that Somchai and all his available Thai friends were more interested in swigging Mekhong, riding motorcycles like idiots, and screwing any women that would look to or away from them.

She only has to look to her own father to see what she does not want her son to become.

Agree with 'click2delete', this is another real factor that the coutry also has to resolve....farangs are a good solution...but the good ones!!

[jumnien]

I think she could look to many farang men in Thailand and see what she does not want her son to become as well.

[Neeranam]

Do you live in Pattaya?

Is this your wife's hometown?

That's the last place on earth I'd want my kids living.

Edited May 13, 2007 by Neeranam

[click2delete]

I feel sorry for the OP's wife with a child of one month that the father doesn't want brought up as Thai and a totally uncertain future.

The OP needs to look at the bright side. In my villlage, it is full of relatives.... pratically everyone is related. Now my son gets to have tons of role models, and every male in the village excludeing his father is unemployed. The males lay in a hamok all day. Now they do stress a little trying to decide if they should get up and switch the channel, but usually the more imediate decission is.... "Do I swat the fly, or just let him do his thing." Now their wife's and daughters work, usually selling food or something of that nature. So life as a male Thai aint that bad at all. He will thank you latter for it.

So hey, when in Rome..... my wife recently offered to continue working and allow me to quit my job. We would still be over the 40K limit.... To be honest I gave it at least 20 seconds of thought.

That's right and you could start your own thread that would surely give Grandpa (PeaceBlondie) a heart attack. I didn't respond to a post he made earlier in this thread, something about posting negative things about Thailand.

How about truth? Let the chips fall where they may? The truth is that when you go out and about, it's the women who work to support some lazy piece of *##@#$& man who sits home and watches television while she works the noodle stand.

And let's not forget about Thailand's pimps (parents) who happily wait for the daughters to call them at 7am when they finish screwing your fat cousin just so they can tell her that Uncle Somkid drank all the money she sent by taking the boys out to the local belch and beer and could screw someone extra today and don't forget to put some more money in the bank.

I have utmost respect for Thai women and disdain for the men. And the men who dominate the police - well they are the pillars of society aren't they - wink wink nod nod

[endure]

3) Religious or racial slurs, rude and degrading comments towards women, or extremely negative views of Thailand will not be tolerated.

Can we stop the sweeping generalisations please.

[jumnien]

If you truly feel that Thailand wants you out, the first thing to do is ask yourself why? A little self-inquiry and honest self-appraisal and the willingness to change will go a lot farther than castigating all Thai men. To thine own self be true! Denial is not a river in Egypt.

[click2delete]

The truth is you made your choice in shakey grounds.

Exactly. Before one sets up a family it's a good idea to have a way to take care of it beforehand. Blaming the government does nothing to provide security for them.

Sometimes you do not choose to set up a family but you have to.

Ever heard of unexpected pregnancies ?

That thing that when happens to a Thai man usually make him flee to another village ?

When such thing happens to a farang instead he usually sets up a family and takes care of his child. I guess Immigration could show its appreciation for such an astonishing behaviour by not harassing the farang with silly income requirements. Or I must assume Immigration actually wants to encourage farang husbands to quit their Thai wives and children ?

You're correct, he was unplanned, but not unwanted. Ok my wife got pregnant - shift plans a bit - make way for a baby - expect to spend more money. But what I do not expect, is the government to make my life harder.

So Mr. Click, just give up your 1 year extension and go on 90 day visa runs. Yes, leave the country knowing that each time you do, the government could one day say - no we won't give you a visa even though you have a home with a family in it. I could one day find myself on the outside looking in - who allows for this in their right mind?

At least with the 1 year extensions I have breathing room, can make plans, can travel in and out without fear of being one day locked out.

What kind of people are these Thais who come up with this stuff?

[ColPyat]

That's right and you could start your own thread that would surely give Grandpa (PeaceBlondie) a heart attack. I didn't respond to a post he made earlier in this thread, something about posting negative things about Thailand.

How about truth? Let the chips fall where they may? The truth is that when you go out and about, it's the women who work to support some lazy piece of *##@#$& man who sits home and watches television while she works the noodle stand.

And let's not forget about Thailand's pimps (parents) who happily wait for the daughters to call them at 7am when they finish screwing your fat cousin just so they can tell her that Uncle Somkid drank all the money she sent by taking the boys out to the local belch and beer and could screw someone extra today and don't forget to put some more money in the bank.

I have utmost respect for Thai women and disdain for the men. And the men who dominate the police - well they are the pillars of society aren't they - wink wink nod nod

I somewhat agree that presently things seem to be poised against the average farang living here, by introducing laws that are everything else than fair.

The problem though i have with threads like this is firstly - it gives wingers an opportunity to blame every itch they have on Thailand and complain in endless tirades about it, and secondly, even worse - it gives the opportunity to spread wide sweeping and idiotic generalizations crossing the border of blatant racism such as voiced in this post.

There are rightful and constructive complaints, and there is whinging. 90% of the content of your posts are the latter. You might have a case if you'd stop that drivel.

Edited May 13, 2007 by ColPyat

[jumnien]

I really don't understand why these fathers cannot just get a job here and the work permit that comes with it, and stay. You can always teach English or French or whatever. If you don't have the qualifications, then get them. Just don't expect Thailand to accomodate every man who gets a girl pregnant on those rather ordinary abilities alone. You must be able to do something of benefit to others.