24 minutes ago, Freeduhdum said:

Point of fact... it does not matter what disease, chronic condition or trauma you have or die from... if you die and test positive for Covid19, you are listed as a covid death. 

False

 

9 hours ago, WaveHunter said:

It's not just Texas; Americans overall are probably the most most obese people in the world, which stands to reason since America is also the country with the highest consumption of junk food (i.e.: excessive carbohydrates  and heavily processed food products).

Not quite: among the OECD countries it's true, but worldwide "we are number 1!" ranks only number 12. ????

13 minutes ago, placeholder said:

False

 

So... you are seriously going to argue that when you die and you test positive for covid19... that will NOT be listed as a covid death?

I thought it was the Israeli's that were going to save us in 2021?

https://www.usnews.com/news/national-news/articles/2019-01-29/israeli-scientists-say-theyll-have-cancer-cure-in-the-next-year-report

5 minutes ago, Freeduhdum said:

So... you are seriously going to argue that when you die and you test positive for covid19... that will NOT be listed as a covid death?

Of course the question really should be  So...you are seriously going to argue that when you die and you test positive for covid19... that will NOT be listed as a covid death?

VERIFY: No, COVID-19 deaths are not being inflated by car crash deaths

https://www.abc10.com/article/news/verify/covid-deaths-car-crash-comorbidities-coronavirus-death-total-counts-john-hopkins-study/65-e3842ed2-f753-4a15-8b97-c2ae75c2b2ce

 

In fact, most public health officials believe that covid deaths are actually undercounted since there are more excess mortality deaths that there are covid deaths:

How COVID-19 Deaths Are Counted

In Colorado, for example, a Republican state legislator has accused the state’s public health department of falsely inflating COVID-19 deaths; in Florida, local media have objected to the State Department of Health’s refusal to release medical examiner data to the public, alleging that the state may be underreporting deaths.

The reality is that assigning a cause of death is not always straightforward, even pre-pandemic, and a patchwork of local rules and regulations makes getting valid national data challenging. However, data on excess deaths in the United States over the past several months suggest that COVID-19 deaths are probably being undercounted rather than overcounted.

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/how-covid-19-deaths-are-counted1/

12 hours ago, canopus1969 said:

Survival of the fittest, the fatties die off first ?

Unless a famine. 

3 minutes ago, cheapcanuck said:

Unless a famine. 

Sure cannibalism, skinnies still win

11 hours ago, placeholder said:

Deflecting much?

 

And given what researchers are learning about the ecology of the gut, it seems a lot of obesity is due to over medicating  with antibiotics and changing the healthy balance of organisms.

No, not deflecting at all. You state why the obese should be vaccinated first, I question that position.

6 hours ago, Freeduhdum said:

Point of fact... it does not matter what disease, chronic condition or trauma you have or die from... if you die and test positive for Covid19, you are listed as a covid death. 

Not true.

20 hours ago, mr mr said:

body positivity maybe not such a good thing to push after all ? who would of known.

 

 

Is the positivity a reference to an excess of body?

Lets start a GOFUND to help.

there are more then only this what they mentioned and they now start to use a blood test to make a prediction of who is having problems or even worse and will end up more death then living in the ICU and who is more lucky.

 

personally i have seen many the blood test tells more then how a person looks. the most around me who passed away where seen a healthy with no medical history and alwys seem to be healthy when had medical examination and still died within a few hours after arrival on the hospital. they walked in to the hospital en in just two hours died.

23 hours ago, webfact said:

The report, which described a "dramatic" correlation between countries' COVID-19 death and obesity rates, found that 90% or 2.2 million of the 2.5 million deaths from the pandemic disease so far were in countries with high levels of obesity. 

Seems that I may have had it right when I opined that America had a high corona death rate because so many are obese.

That was in posts long ago last year so don't expect me to quote them.

28 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Seems that I may have had it right when I opined that America had a high corona death rate because so many are obese.

That was in posts long ago last year so don't expect me to quote them.

A positive correlation has been noted repeatedly since the early days of the epidemic.

 

Obesity increases risk for COVID-19 complications, data shows
Gabrielle Masson - Thursday, March 26th, 2020 

Obesity appears to be a major risk factor for critical COVID-19 cases, according to an Intensive Care National Audit and Research Centre analysis on United Kingdom critical care admissions.

The report includes data from all COVID-19 admissions to critical care units in the U.K. up until midnight March 19. Nearly two-thirds (127) of 196 patients requiring critical care were overweight, and 71 patients had a BMI of 30 or higher.

The report also found that 37 percent of admissions were patients younger than 60, and 139 of the 196 patients were men. 

  https://www.beckershospitalreview.com/public-health/obesity-increases-risk-for-covid-19-complications-data-shows.html

On 3/5/2021 at 7:44 PM, ChristianBlessing said:

Not quite: among the OECD countries it's true, but worldwide "we are number 1!" ranks only number 12. ????

My remark that "...Americans overall are probably the most most obese people in the world..." is a valid comment since I am talking about total numbers of people not percentage of population.

You are probably referring to the following data:

The total population of the United States is far greater any of the 11 other countries listed, so I remain firm that the United States probably has more obese people with serious health issues resulting from that than any other country in the world.

Furthermore, this data is only for "adult" population, and does not even take into account the growing number of children who can be classified as obese.  There is actually an EPIDEMIC of obesity and diabetes type 2 in children today that was unheard of only a decade ago.  That is truly alarming! 

Edited March 13, 20215 yr by WaveHunter

1 hour ago, WaveHunter said:

My remark that "...Americans overall are probably the most most obese people in the world..." is a valid comment since I am talking about total numbers of people not percentage of population.

You are probably referring to the following data:

The total population of the United States is far greater any of the 11 other countries listed, so I remain firm that the United States probably has more obese people with serious health issues resulting from that than any other country in the world.

Furthermore, this data is only for "adult" population, and does not even take into account the growing number of children who can be classified as obese.  There is actually an EPIDEMIC of obesity and diabetes type 2 in children today that was unheard of only a decade ago.  That is truly alarming! 

Obesity is truly a big problem.  It causes all sorts of health issues.  I've been to almost every country on that list.  In the top 10, it's truly amazing.  They are HUGE!

When wifey and I fly back to the US, when landing, we say to each other:

"welcome to the land of the big people".

But it's not that much different in many of the other western countries.  Take a look at the BMI index.  Not much difference in most of the countries. 

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_body_mass_index

On 3/5/2021 at 6:35 PM, Yme said:

I wasn't aware that obesity was such a problem in the slums of Brazil, or Iran, or India. 
 

How about the majority of global COVID-19 deaths have been largely concentrated in two countries where people have refused to wear masks and where there hasn't been efficient lockdowns or travel restrictions. 

 

 

 

Regarding your first remark, Obesity is not limited to those with money.  Obesity is always the result of poor nutritional choices.  People living in slums generally do not have money for proper nutrition so they consume cheap and empty calories to excess, which are primarily carbohydrates...ergo, obesity.  

Regarding your second remark, If you're going to make such a definitive statement, you really should back it up with sound science-based data (i.e.: not simply politically generated  rhetoric).  What "two" countries are you referring to anyway??

There is no unbiased science-based evidence that I am aware of that convincingly correlates lockdowns and mask-wearing to lowered rates of Covid-19 spread, even though that is the prevailing public sentiment.  Such views are political-based and emotional, not science-based. 

If you look at the unbiased, science-based data, countries with severe lockdown measures have no better results that those with more relaxed measures.

Furthermore. you really have to take into account the economic repercussions of lockdowns, which are actually proving to be far worse than the health effects of the virus itself.

Edited March 13, 20215 yr by WaveHunter

40 minutes ago, Jeffr2 said:

Obesity is truly a big problem.  It causes all sorts of health issues.  I've been to almost every country on that list.  In the top 10, it's truly amazing.  They are HUGE!

When wifey and I fly back to the US, when landing, we say to each other:

"welcome to the land of the big people".

But it's not that much different in many of the other western countries.  Take a look at the BMI index.  Not much difference in most of the countries. 

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_body_mass_index

True!  Developed countries always have a giant processed food industry.  The food products they make are highly profitable because they use high-fructose corn syrup in almost everything they make since it is incredibly cheap.  It's in almost all processed foods, even many where you would not even expect it.

It's used in many so-called "healthy" low fat foods because when you remove fat, the food would be unpalatable so high fructose corn syrup is used to restore flavor.  The truth is that these so-called healthier foods are not healthier at all, they are simply much cheaper to produce!

High-Fructose corn syrup is simply a highly refined carbohydrate, and consumption of excessive amounts of carbohydrates is what leads to obesity...and eventually more serious medical conditions like Diabetes type-2.

Even more disturbing is that additives are often included in these processed foods to make you over-consume them by turning off the satiety receptors in the brain.  There used to be an advertisement on TV for some potato chip company with the tagline, "bet you can't eat just one".  I think that says it all about the true intentions of the processed food industry.

Another example of how people are encouraged towards obesity is when you go into a fast food restaurant like McDonalds.  You are always encouraged to buy  "super sized" salted fries which makes you also want a super-sized soda.

It's no wonder that obesity and type-2 diabetes has reached epidemic  levels in most developed nations of the world today.  And worse, this epidemic now includes children, where only a couple of decades ago, diabetes type 2 in children was practically unheard of! 

Thank you, Ronald McDonald and your "happy meals" ????

 

Edited March 13, 20215 yr by WaveHunter

51 minutes ago, WaveHunter said:

<snip>

There is no unbiased science-based evidence that I am aware of that convincingly correlates lockdowns and mask-wearing to lowered rates of Covid-19 spread, even though that is the prevailing public sentiment.  Such views are political-based and emotional, not science-based. 

If you look at the unbiased, science-based data, countries with severe lockdown measures have no better results that those with more relaxed measures.

Furthermore. you really have to take into account the economic repercussions of lockdowns, which are actually proving to be far worse than the health effects of the virus itself.

There is unbiased science-based evidence that shows mask-wearing reduces the spread.  Same with lockdowns.  Makes sense.  If you're locked down, you can't transmit!  Easy.

If masks don't work, how about the next time you get surgery, tell the doc not to wear a mask as it won't prevent you from getting airborne infections from the staff.  Remember, CV19 is airborne. LOL.

Thailand had severe lockdown measures.  Same with NZ.  Worked pretty good there.  Economics aside.

Edited March 13, 20215 yr by Jeffr2

7 minutes ago, Jeffr2 said:

This is unbiased science-based evidence that shows mask-wearing reduces the spread.  Same with lockdowns.  Makes sense.  If you're locked down, you can't transmit!  Easy.

If masks don't work, how about the next time you get surgery, tell the doc not to wear a mask as it won't prevent you from getting airborne infections from the staff.  Remember, CV19 is airborne. LOL.

Thailand had severe lockdown measures.  Same with NZ.  Worked pretty good there.  Economics aside.

Thanks for the clear and easy-to-understand unbiased science-based evidence you posted proving the effectiveness of mask-wearing and lockdowns to curb the spread of covid-19.   ????

4 minutes ago, Peter Denis said:

Thanks for the clear and easy-to-understand unbiased science-based evidence you posted proving the effectiveness of mask-wearing and lockdowns to curb the spread of covid-19.   ????

It's all over the internet.  Google is your friend.

21 minutes ago, Jeffr2 said:

This is unbiased science-based evidence that shows mask-wearing reduces the spread.  Same with lockdowns.  Makes sense.  If you're locked down, you can't transmit!  Easy.

If masks don't work, how about the next time you get surgery, tell the doc not to wear a mask as it won't prevent you from getting airborne infections from the staff.  Remember, CV19 is airborne. LOL.

Thailand had severe lockdown measures.  Same with NZ.  Worked pretty good there.  Economics aside.

Show me some empirical evidence of this.  I have looked and I can find no unbiased studies that prove that countries with severe lockdown measures have fared any better than those with less strict measures. 

Mask wearing is largely ineffective because the majority of people are only wearing cheap drugstore masks, not N95 respirators that a surgeon would wear in an operating room.  I'm not saying you shouldn't wear one.  I always wear one in public, but let's be honest...if you are wearing the cheap drug-store type, which most people wear, it is really not doing much at all to protect you or others.  It's only to make others around you feel better.  I think we all really know this on a gut-level.

As for lockdowns, there is no such thing as an effective lockdown unless you are in a state-controlled country like China.  In most democratic countries, lockdowns are highly selective.  Not everybody has to play by the rules.  Powerful politicians dining out at five star restaurants with their lobby partners are free to do so, while ordinary citizens are banned from family gatherings in their own homes.  How many ordinary citizens really abide by such draconian rules...not many!

When you finally throw in the economic repercussions of lockdowns, this so-called remedy is proving to be FAR more devastating than the virus itself.  Take Thailand for example, sure the entire country has been in a lockdown from foreigners for a year now.  Of course, there is minimal spread of the virus here as a result.  But what about the economic health of the country?  THAT has yet to be fully realized, but in the end it will be far more devastating than the virus could ever have been.  It will be at least a decade before Thailand recovers from the economic devastation, according to many experts.

 

Edited March 13, 20215 yr by WaveHunter

5 minutes ago, Jeffr2 said:

It's all over the internet.  Google is your friend.

Evidence of the contrary is there also in abundance (and I am not referring to 'conspiracy' sites).  But a little harder to find than what is posted on some of the mainstream-media.

19 minutes ago, Jeffr2 said:

It's all over the internet.  Google is your friend.

With all due respect, what is all over the internet is a lot of biased political based rhetoric by politicians and mainstream media talking heads, very few of which have any actual science-based facts to back up their claims. 

You must do your own research of the facts, and not simply reply on mainstream-media commentators and politicians because the truth of the matter is that recently they all have an exceedingly poor track record of telling the truth.

Let me be clear, I am not touting some sort of conspiracy theory or anything like that.  I'm just saying that these days, you just can not trust mainstream media anymore because journalism is no longer practiced by these outlets.  Instead, we have "commentators" with political biases to the left or the right telling you what you should believe instead of just reporting the news.

That means you have to work extra hard at uncovering the facts for yourself instead of merely allowing yourself to be told what to believe. 

So, yes, Google is indeed your friend...if you use it wisely to search for facts, not biased opinions and rhetoric. 

Edited March 13, 20215 yr by WaveHunter

Duh! Anything that weakens the immune system will increase the risk of any virus. And that includes the horrendous diets of most Americans and many ethnic groups (that is not an "allowed discussion") with the MSM. It is considered Not PC. And I do not care one iota. If mild truths offend, get thicker skin. 

Eat more fast food.

17 minutes ago, WaveHunter said:

Show me some empirical evidence of this.  I have looked and I can find no unbiased studies that prove that countries with severe lockdown measures have fared any better than those with less strict measures. 

Mask wearing is largely ineffective because the majority of people are only wearing cheap drugstore masks, not N95 respirators that a surgeon would wear in an operating room.  I'm not saying you shouldn't wear one.  I always wear one in public, but let's be honest...if you are wearing the cheap drug-store type, which most people wear, it is really not doing much at all to protect you or others.  It's only to make others around you feel better.  I think we all really know this on a gut-level.

As for lockdowns, there is no such thing as an effective lockdown unless you are in a state-controlled country like China.  In most democratic countries, lockdowns are highly selective.  Not everybody has to play by the rules.  Powerful politicians dining out at five star restaurants with their lobby partners are free to do so, while ordinary citizens are banned from family gatherings in their own homes.  How many ordinary citizens really abide by such draconian rules...not many!

When you finally throw in the economic repercussions of lockdowns, this so-called remedy is proving to be FAR more devastating than the virus itself.  Take Thailand for example, sure the entire country has been in a lockdown from foreigners for a year now.  Of course, there is minimal spread of the virus here as a result.  But what about the economic health of the country?  THAT has yet to be fully realized, but in the end it will be far more devastating than the virus could ever have been.  It will be at least a decade before Thailand recovers from the economic devastation, according to many experts.

 

Most mask wearing is  preventing some contamination, if for no other reason that the awareness it creates when it comes to rubbing the nose or mouth. 

8 minutes ago, WaveHunter said:

I have looked and I can find no unbiased studies that prove that countries with severe lockdown measures have fared any better than those with less strict measures

It seems the ones with strict lockdowns were the ones totally under prepared who then over reacted and were then destined to have a high death rate regardless of locking down (too late)

Taiwan, with no obvious lockdown, did lockdown through strict quarantine (both local and incoming flights from Wuhan), financial "rewards" for quarantining, extensive mask wearing.

It seems speed was the key....not belated draconian actions.....

3 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

Most mask wearing is  preventing some contamination, if for no other reason that the awareness it creates when it comes to rubbing the nose or mouth. 

That's a valid point and one reason I always wear one in public, use antiseptic gels frequently when in public, and always wash my hands once I return home, but in terms of preventing airborne spread, the cheap drug store masks do very little, if anything at all IMHO.

Edited March 13, 20215 yr by WaveHunter

5 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

that is not an "allowed discussion"

Link?