How do you start a Coding Programme for Anuban and Prathom students?

Covedian21 · April 22, 2021

How do you start a Coding Programme for Anuban and young Prathom students?

It all started with a meeting where the director had a fantastic idea! Adding coding into the existing curriculum starting with Anuban up to Prathom.

Does anybody work at a primary school where coding is part of the curriculum? I'm aware that coding is not part of the Thai Curriculum, but well, some people seem to believe that all is possible, but I have my doubts.

You can’t teach coding to students who have no basic knowledge about keyboards, mice, certain commands, and more. I'm quite familiar with almost all Windows products, I fix my computer alone, no matter if it's a soft,- or hardware problem, but coding?

And how useful would it be if little kids understand Raspberry for example, but can’t deal with any MS products?

I'd be thankful if anybody who teaches coding could come up with some useful input. Thanks a lot in advance.

OneMoreFarang · April 22, 2021

Coding = programming?

I am no teacher but a programmer so here is my 2 cents:

I think a program like Excel is a good start. Many things can already be done with Excel functions which are available for the users. Like i.e. something like this: =IF(A1=B1, "same", "not same")

And if that is not powerful enough then students can start with VBA (included in Excel and other Office programs). They can learn programming with just one or a few lines of code at a time.

ozimoron · April 22, 2021

https://codewizardshq.com/coding-for-kids-free/

Google "coding for kids" There are many websites like this.

ChristianBlessing · April 22, 2021

Less important than any particular coding language are the concepts of coding. Possibly the easiest entry to coding and coding concepts for young learners is the use of Scratch, a programming application developed by the Massachusetts Institute of Technology (MIT). In use by schools around the world since 2007 Scratch has a vast and vibrant online community of users and resources.

You can't miss with Scratch. Kids love it as they can see the results of their work throughout the process of coding. Further, for what it's worth, kids learn best the "basic knowledge about keyboards, mice, certain commands" in the context of real and engaging work.

expatjustice · April 22, 2021

6 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

Coding = programming?

I am no teacher but a programmer so here is my 2 cents:

I think a program like Excel is a good start. Many things can already be done with Excel functions which are available for the users. Like i.e. something like this: =IF(A1=B1, "same", "not same")

And if that is not powerful enough then students can start with VBA (included in Excel and other Office programs). They can learn programming with just one or a few lines of code at a time.

Yes that is a perfect way to get started into programming.... for I would say at least 16+ year olds. If they are smart enough maybe 12,13 works too.

But primary students are kids, as in 6 to 12 at most.... Do you think any kid will be interested or even be able to understand Excel let alone VBA???

You need something much more graphic, cartoonish games. I think Swift Playgrounds (from Apple) does a perfect job at this.

(Now don't judge me by my words; Swift is a terrible terrible language which no serious programmer should use. But Swift Playgrounds has some very big potential of being used for getting little kids started into this.)

Covedian21 · April 22, 2021

37 minutes ago, expatjustice said:

Yes that is a perfect way to get started into programming.... for I would say at least 16+ year olds. If they are smart enough maybe 12,13 works too.

But primary students are kids, as in 6 to 12 at most.... Do you think any kid will be interested or even be able to understand Excel let alone VBA???

You need something much more graphic, cartoonish games. I think Swift Playgrounds (from Apple) does a perfect job at this.

(Now don't judge me by my words; Swift is a terrible terrible language which no serious programmer should use. But Swift Playgrounds has some very big potential of being used for getting little kids started into this.)

Thanks, a lot. I should have been more precise. It's about Anuban kids and Prathom kids.
Now we're talking about four to nine year old's.

Teaching a four-year-old how to use Paint is already pretty difficult when you take it seriously and you want to see results.

None of them would be interested in Excel, all must be fun and based on games.

Otherwise, you won't get such a group of kids to do anything other than watching YouTube and using simple drawing programs such as Paint.

Even the oldest kids who are around nine are more interested in anything else than writing a program.

What the school might not get is, that you need a piece of basic computer knowledge to start with.

I'd like to thank all of you for your answers, I'm only sampling ideas to finally come up with something.

Future learn currently offers a course and there's a university and educational Institution in the UK involved who made some superb materials.

Who knows? I still hope that the guy in charge will soon forget about his "great idea" that doesn't help anybody. neither the students nor the involved teachers.

Stay safe and enjoy life. It can be shorter than expected. Thanks for all your input. :wai:

Covedian21 · April 22, 2021

6 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

Coding = programming?

I am no teacher but a programmer so here is my 2 cents:

I think a program like Excel is a good start. Many things can already be done with Excel functions which are available for the users. Like i.e. something like this: =IF(A1=B1, "same", "not same")

And if that is not powerful enough then students can start with VBA (included in Excel and other Office programs). They can learn programming with just one or a few lines of code at a time.

Thank you very much, but Excel wouldn't be a good start. The kids are way too young and would easily be bored if they don't understand you. It's not that they speak a good English. Lol

Covedian21 · April 22, 2021

6 hours ago, ozimoron said:

https://codewizardshq.com/coding-for-kids-free/

Google "coding for kids" There are many websites like this.

Thanks, mate. This website looks great. Have a nice week.

OneMoreFarang · April 22, 2021

2 hours ago, expatjustice said:

Yes that is a perfect way to get started into programming.... for I would say at least 16+ year olds. If they are smart enough maybe 12,13 works too.

But primary students are kids, as in 6 to 12 at most.... Do you think any kid will be interested or even be able to understand Excel let alone VBA???

You need something much more graphic, cartoonish games. I think Swift Playgrounds (from Apple) does a perfect job at this.

(Now don't judge me by my words; Swift is a terrible terrible language which no serious programmer should use. But Swift Playgrounds has some very big potential of being used for getting little kids started into this.)

Ok, I understand that these kids are too young for Excel.

But then I ask myself, what kind of coding would they learn if they won't even use Excel?

Maybe I misunderstand the word here but I though coding is about doing something like IF THEN ELSE.

What kind of code would a child want to "write"?

ozimoron · April 23, 2021

6 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

But then I ask myself, what kind of coding would they learn if they won't even use Excel?

Maybe I misunderstand the word here but I though coding is about doing something like IF THEN ELSE.

What kind of code would a child want to "write"?

What they need to be taught is how to understand algorithms and logic, not any specific computer language. I've spent decades coding and never written an Excel formula. That's end user stuff, not coding. I think if then else is a great way to start, it's really the basis of coding.

varun · April 23, 2021

Look into:

https://www.scratchjr.org/about/info

It's available for free on Android & IOS.

OneMoreFarang · April 23, 2021

40 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

What they need to be taught is how to understand algorithms and logic, not any specific computer language. I've spent decades coding and never written an Excel formula. That's end user stuff, not coding. I think if then else is a great way to start, it's really the basis of coding.

You might be surprised how many functions in Excel are available for end users. That is definitely a good start into programming.

After programming my programmable calculator (Casio FX-602) in school my next step to programming was the macro language in AmiPro. That was enough to learn the basics of programming. VBA was the next step.

JulianLuus · April 24, 2021

Try Scratch - https://scratch.mit.edu/

gwynt · April 24, 2021

I teach my son at home through two online programs (purchased)therefore he is adept with computer language he has been coding with Scratch, for one year,lovrs it.

Poet · April 24, 2021

On 4/22/2021 at 11:16 AM, Covedian21 said:

You can’t teach coding to students who have no basic knowledge about keyboards, mice, certain commands, and more.

Forget about the specific hardware. You want them to learn the fundamental concepts of code. The language absolutely does not matter. In fact, a simple game is the best way to get kids of any age into this stuff.

In the Apple eco-system (Macs and iPads), the best choice would be Swift Playgrounds, mainly because they have poured a lot of effort into building out a comprehensive curriculum, with plenty of supporting material, and localized it into 15 languages including Thai:

Of course, iPads are expensive, the education price is 10K baht. I presume that similar apps are available for cheaper Chromebooks, Android tablets, and Windows machines. I suspect, however, that iPads are better overall when you consider the value added by the many creative tools that Apple includes for free. For kids who don't immediately take to coding, editing video (iMovie or Clips) or sequencing music (Garageband) can be alternative paths to grab their interest and build their confidence until they are ready to dip their toes into coding.

Be very careful about taking advice from very old, retired coders. Most forget how they originally got hooked and would be unaware of how much is now available for kids. You can spot the particularly out-of-touch ones: they refer to coding as programming.

Edited April 24, 2021 by Poet

recom273 · April 24, 2021

Start with scratch fro MIT - this is where every kid in China starts, using the code blocks to make animations or simple games.

i think it’s more about catching their attention, rather than looking at a screen, so you could try robots, like OTTO - the parts can be 3D printed, customized, painted, etc - the (arduino) components are all available on AliExpress - they just push together, so you could reuse sensors from one project to another.

OTTO is cool because it uses something similar to scratch - and the kids program a routine, upload via USB and then press go.

There is also educational resources, good community support - if you are interested I have a 3D printer that sits doing nothing, and a bit of filament that needs using up, PM me.

Edited April 24, 2021 by recom273

OneMoreFarang · April 24, 2021

57 minutes ago, recom273 said:

Start with scratch fro MIT - this is where every kid in China starts, using the code blocks to make animations or simple games.

i think it’s more about catching their attention, rather than looking at a screen, so you could try robots, like OTTO - the parts can be 3D printed, customized, painted, etc - the (arduino) components are all available on AliExpress - they just push together, so you could reuse sensors from one project to another.

OTTO is cool because it uses something similar to scratch - and the kids program a routine, upload via USB and then press go.

There is also educational resources, good community support - if you are interested I have a 3D printer that sits doing nothing, and a bit of filament that needs using up, PM me.

I watched the video. Wow!

I am pretty sure I could put that thing together and after many hours of programming could let it do what it does.

But I am used to programming, RC hobby and Arduinos.

How much of that can kids do and at what age?

Grusa · April 24, 2021

The bases of coding, or programming, are analysis and logic. It requires a questioning mind, and lateral thought.

The teaching of such things to the plebs is anathema to the ruling classes, and totally contrary to the objectives of the Thai educational establishment as presently constituted.

Good Luck with trying to change things, except perhaps for a privileged few.

OneMoreFarang · April 24, 2021

45 minutes ago, Grusa said:

The bases of coding, or programming, are analysis and logic. It requires a questioning mind, and lateral thought.

The teaching of such things to the plebs is anathema to the ruling classes, and totally contrary to the objectives of the Thai educational establishment as presently constituted.

Good Luck with trying to change things, except perhaps for a privileged few.

That might be correct but let's look at reality worldwide.

With all those smart mobile devices one would think there should be many millions of people out there who are interested in programming. But it seems in reality that is not the case. Billions play with social media for hours a day and the same billions have no idea and no interest in programming. (Sorry I forgot where I read that, but it was a reliable source.)

recom273 · April 24, 2021

1 hour ago, OneMoreFarang said:

I watched the video. Wow!

I am pretty sure I could put that thing together and after many hours of programming could let it do what it does.

But I am used to programming, RC hobby and Arduinos.

How much of that can kids do and at what age?

It”s based around the scratch engine - so you just drag and drop the blocks (it’s quite easy but each block has properties which can be adjusted - a bit like node-red - I doubt anuban kids could do it, but i think 7-8 year olds don’t seem to have issues with it.

There is a pretty comprehensive kid friendly website - https://www.ottodiy.com

They have a Bluetooth module, so you could use an (android) mobile phone, to control and then program directions. Little kids can begin there.

As the kids progress, you can use arduino code, then you can automate it using the sensors, light, sound, from there the sky is the limit.

To make it, it’s just 4x sg plastic servo (35B each) an uno (150B) a bit of screwdriver work and plugging in the little connects.

I started playing when I got a 3D printer, there is the SMARS too - this is a nice modular toy, after you got the basic going, you can break it down and use the parts to build a quadrupled. This is arduino or python.

https://www.smarsfan.com

and also a spider too - but these are more robotic projects than programming.

I don’t teach in schools anymore, but I wish I had access to these projects and 3D printer 10 years ago, would have been much more interesting than my weekly spelling club.

Edited April 24, 2021 by recom273

AgMech Cowboy · April 24, 2021

If you can teach a 50 yr old coal miner to code, as Joe suggest, kids should be a snap.

On 4/22/2021 at 5:43 PM, ozimoron said:

https://codewizardshq.com/coding-for-kids-free/

Google "coding for kids" There are many websites like this.

On 4/23/2021 at 9:43 AM, varun said:

Look into:

https://www.scratchjr.org/about/info It's available for free on Android & IOS.

4 hours ago, JulianLuus said:

Try Scratch - https://scratch.mit.edu/

Thank goodness for social security. ????

micmichd · April 24, 2021

On 4/22/2021 at 5:39 PM, OneMoreFarang said:

Coding = programming?

I am no teacher but a programmer so here is my 2 cents:

I think a program like Excel is a good start. Many things can already be done with Excel functions which are available for the users. Like i.e. something like this: =IF(A1=B1, "same", "not same")

And if that is not powerful enough then students can start with VBA (included in Excel and other Office programs). They can learn programming with just one or a few lines of code at a time.

I learned coding with a pseudo-programming language called dBASE, spreadsheet calculations (Lotus 1-2-3) on PC (long time ago)

Yes, both are similar to Excel.

VBA contains object-oriented elements, so that might be a bit confusing for beginners.

retsdon · April 24, 2021

My kids are enrolled in Code.org.

They have complete schools packages for all levels.

https://code.org/

Edited April 24, 2021 by retsdon

OneMoreFarang · April 24, 2021

1 hour ago, micmichd said:

I learned coding with a pseudo-programming language called dBASE, spreadsheet calculations (Lotus 1-2-3) on PC (long time ago)

Yes, both are similar to Excel.

VBA contains object-oriented elements, so that might be a bit confusing for beginners.

Lotus 1-2-3 was an amazing program at that time. The mouse was not yet invented...