Can I use 64-bit Linux dual booted with 32-bit Win 7?

[topt]

Possibly a stupid question but it would be a simple solution before I get too far in. I have finally got round to trying Linux on one of my old laptops but have hit an issue.

I have successfully (eventually) got Linux Mint 19.3 32-bit running as a dual boot with the current Win 7 32-bit installation.

 

The only reason I went with an older release was it was the last 32 bit Mint version. However when I went to look at adding the Brave browser it is only available in 64 bit distributions. My laptop is apparently 64-bit capable so wondering if it was vaguely possible to do what I asked in the title?

 

I am not expecting startling performance or anything as this is really to try out and see if I can move to Linux when I purchase a new laptop in the not too distant future. I use Brave as my browser of choice however so would ideally like to test with that.

[gamb00ler]

In a dual boot setup, the different operating systems that you boot have basically nothing to do with each other.  The two environments are completely separate.  The different OS's may be able to read or even write to each other's allocated disk storage but make sure you don't mess up the system files that belong to the other OS.

 

So, YES you will be able to install and boot both 32 and 64 bit OS's on the same computer (provided it is capable of 64 bit operation).

[Led Lolly Yellow Lolly]

59 minutes ago, topt said:

I am not expecting startling performance or anything as this is really to try out and see if I can move to Linux when I purchase a new laptop in the not too distant future. I use Brave as my browser of choice however so would ideally like to test with that.

I stopped using Windows altogether in 2008. I also don't bother with dual boot, what's the point when the vanishingly rare occasions you need to use Windows (I last needed to use Windows around 3 years ago) you can just run it in a VM container on your Linux distro.

[Eindhoven]

Why not spend a few hundred baht to buy a solid state drive and then swap it with the existing hard drive. Then you can play around to your heart's content. Install Windows 7 64 bit & Linux or Windows 10 64 bitand LInux...

You are looking at 600 - 700 baht for a 128 GB SSD.

 

With that simple upgrade, you might decide that you don't need a new laptop after all.

[Mickeymaus]

I have Win XP, Win 8.1, Win 7 32, Win 7 64 and Windows 10 on my computer. No problems. Only when I installed Windows 10 I got a desaster. I ended up with crosslinked partitions. It took me a while to fix this... Perhaps Microsoft never tested it with so many operating systems on one computer. It was a standard installation that should have worked. 

 

In respect of Linux look how to handle NTFS partitions. I don't use Linux but I remember that there are some things you should know. 

[gk10012001]

Dual boot... hmmm.  How about running a virtual machine that hosts the different software?  I know at work he had to use some old XP applications but IT department had upgraded all the PCs to Windows 7 and then 10.  The virtual machine allowed us to still run XP.

[topt]

9 hours ago, gamb00ler said:

In a dual boot setup, the different operating systems that you boot have basically nothing to do with each other.  The two environments are completely separate.  The different OS's may be able to read or even write to each other's allocated disk storage but make sure you don't mess up the system files that belong to the other OS.

 

So, YES you will be able to install and boot both 32 and 64 bit OS's on the same computer (provided it is capable of 64 bit operation).

Thanks this is what I was hoping. The Windows performance chart says it is 64 bit capable so we will see.

[topt]

6 hours ago, gk10012001 said:

Dual boot... hmmm.  How about running a virtual machine that hosts the different software?  I know at work he had to use some old XP applications but IT department had upgraded all the PCs to Windows 7 and then 10.  The virtual machine allowed us to still run XP.

yes not got my head around VMs. The dual boot works at the moment but will probably look at that for the future.

[gk10012001]

6 minutes ago, topt said:

yes not got my head around VMs. The dual boot works at the moment but will probably look at that for the future.

On a related note, if you look at some of the buys on utube that bust online scammers, most out of India, they setup a VM, let the scammers access it, and they think they are getting all sorts of good stuff.  He meanwhile grabs lots of information about them.  It is some amusing reverse work

[topt]

6 hours ago, Eindhoven said:

Why not spend a few hundred baht to buy a solid state drive and then swap it with the existing hard drive. Then you can play around to your heart's content. Install Windows 7 64 bit & Linux or Windows 10 64 bitand LInux...

You are looking at 600 - 700 baht for a 128 GB SSD.

 

With that simple upgrade, you might decide that you don't need a new laptop after all.

Have already done this on one of my old laptops with some other upgrades. There are other issues (eg screens) and both are over 13 years old. There is no specific reason for me to move to 64-bit Windows from 32-bit but there is for Linux Mint.

[topt]

8 hours ago, Led Lolly Yellow Lolly said:

I stopped using Windows altogether in 2008. I also don't bother with dual boot, what's the point when the vanishingly rare occasions you need to use Windows (I last needed to use Windows around 3 years ago) you can just run it in a VM container on your Linux distro.

Yes I understand thanks but I am not there yet with regards to Linux. That's the whole point of my question.

[gk10012001]

7 hours ago, Eindhoven said:

Why not spend a few hundred baht to buy a solid state drive and then swap it with the existing hard drive. Then you can play around to your heart's content. Install Windows 7 64 bit & Linux or Windows 10 64 bitand LInux...

You are looking at 600 - 700 baht for a 128 GB SSD.

 

With that simple upgrade, you might decide that you don't need a new laptop after all.

I am not so sure you can just removed and replace things that simply and things will work.  If it does, then great, but I think there are several interfaces and settings that will cause issues. 

[mrfill]

Yes, you can dual boot as you suggest, but its a terrible idea. Win7 is appallingly insecure whether 32 or 64 bit. If you must run it, keep it to a Virtual Machine where it has its own little sandbox (to use a familiar term). If you're OK with Mint, then use that as a host - a new version of Mint has just been launched (20.2) and then you can run any number of operating systems. One strange effect you may notice is that Windows tends to run faster in a VM than natively.

And then, when it goes horribly wrong (normal for WIndows), it can be safely deleted and reinstalled. If shared folders are used for data then nothing need ever get lost.

I've run linux as a VM host for years and am currently using 16Gb of RAM in the host and allocate 6Gb for each VM. Means I can be running the linux host and up to two other operating systems simultaneouisly - although never use more than one at a time. Dual booting would mean you can only run each system separately and each would have to have a large lump of hard drive. A VM will dynamically allocate space and  is far more space efficient.

[vinci]

created a virtual machine running on current window, no need switch back an forth, a window within a window

Edited July 15, 2021 by vinci

[Eindhoven]

4 hours ago, gk10012001 said:

I am not so sure you can just removed and replace things that simply and things will work.  If it does, then great, but I think there are several interfaces and settings that will cause issues. 

What are you talking about? Of course it will work. I think you have just confused yourself..

[Eindhoven]

3 hours ago, mrfill said:

Yes, you can dual boot as you suggest, but its a terrible idea. Win7 is appallingly insecure whether 32 or 64 bit. If you must run it, keep it to a Virtual Machine where it has its own little sandbox (to use a familiar term). If you're OK with Mint, then use that as a host - a new version of Mint has just been launched (20.2) and then you can run any number of operating systems. One strange effect you may notice is that Windows tends to run faster in a VM than natively.

And then, when it goes horribly wrong (normal for WIndows), it can be safely deleted and reinstalled. If shared folders are used for data then nothing need ever get lost.

I've run linux as a VM host for years and am currently using 16Gb of RAM in the host and allocate 6Gb for each VM. Means I can be running the linux host and up to two other operating systems simultaneouisly - although never use more than one at a time. Dual booting would mean you can only run each system separately and each would have to have a large lump of hard drive. A VM will dynamically allocate space and  is far more space efficient.

The laptop in question is thirteen years old. Dual boot on an SSD is better. You can still secure Windows 7 until 2023 with a little jiggery-pokery.

[KannikaP]

10 hours ago, Mickeymaus said:

I have Win XP, Win 8.1, Win 7 32, Win 7 64 and Windows 10 on my computer

All at the same time? Why?

[Mickeymaus]

Just now, KannikaP said:

All at the same time? Why?

Because this is how I used them and I have enough disk space. Win XP I use for some old games (I used XP for many years). Then I switched to Win 7 64 because I installed 8 GB memory. Then I switched to Win 7 32 because better for older 16 Bit software (when I was younger I programmed a lot with 16 Bit). I have a kernel batch and therefore Win 7 32 can handle 8 GB memory. So Win 7 64 got somehow useless. Out of interest I installed 8.1. When Win 10 came out you could install it for free and so I did it.

 

My main system is still Win 7 32. Security - I have been using computers for decades and was on the Internet from the beginning. Never had any problems. Of course I was always careful. Firewall is installed and every program that is started is checked if it still has the same checksum. Also antivirus is running. Some not so clean software... runs always in its own virtual environment. I also have a backup history. That means if two backups get a virus I still have one more. In respect of the OS partitions I have a very long backup history. They are on different discs that are only connected at backup times. 

[Eindhoven]

24 minutes ago, Mickeymaus said:

Because this is how I used them and I have enough disk space. Win XP I use for some old games (I used XP for many years). Then I switched to Win 7 64 because I installed 8 GB memory. Then I switched to Win 7 32 because better for older 16 Bit software (when I was younger I programmed a lot with 16 Bit). I have a kernel batch and therefore Win 7 32 can handle 8 GB memory. So Win 7 64 got somehow useless. Out of interest I installed 8.1. When Win 10 came out you could install it for free and so I did it.

 

My main system is still Win 7 32. Security - I have been using computers for decades and was on the Internet from the beginning. Never had any problems. Of course I was always careful. Firewall is installed and every program that is started is checked if it still has the same checksum. Also antivirus is running. Some not so clean software... runs always in its own virtual environment. I also have a backup history. That means if two backups get a virus I still have one more. In respect of the OS partitions I have a very long backup history. They are on different discs that are only connected at backup times. 

 

 

[Mickeymaus]

22 minutes ago, Eindhoven said:

 

 

With all my backups and security setups I am really not scared. The only thing that could really hurt me is if my condo burns down. I don't have backups at a different location.

 

But anyhow - mostly I use my Android tablet now. It is a Samsung Galaxy Tab S7 plus with a relatively big screen and an excellent performance. I am old now and somehow I don't need neither my PC nor my notebook anymore.

 

The picture below shows my monitor - has waves on the screen. I have little motivation to buy a new one because I hardly use the PC anymore. But one day... I will buy one just that I don't have to throw away the whole computer. 

Edited July 15, 2021 by Mickeymaus

[fdsa]

Quote

Can I use 64-bit Linux dual booted with 32-bit Win 7?

 

it is absolutely possible but make sure to install Windows first, because it will delete Linux boot loader if you install Linux first. And if you install Windows first then Linux installer will correctly detect Windows boot loader and will add it to the boot menu.

 

[topt]

21 hours ago, fdsa said:

 

it is absolutely possible but make sure to install Windows first, because it will delete Linux boot loader if you install Linux first. And if you install Windows first then Linux installer will correctly detect Windows boot loader and will add it to the boot menu.

 

Win 7 and 32 bit linux currently installed. I want to change the Linux install for 64 bit - I will leave Win 7 as is. Can I just load the 64 bit version over the top as a new install or do I need to delete everything Linux first?

 

I have been reading about removing linux from a dual boot so If the latter no problem to delete in disk manager but just a bit concerned about grub - I have a repair disc but it has not been tested.........

edit - not UEFI

Edited July 16, 2021 by topt

[fdsa]

45 minutes ago, topt said:

Win 7 and 32 bit linux currently installed. I want to change the Linux install for 64 bit - I will leave Win 7 as is. Can I just load the 64 bit version over the top as a new install or do I need to delete everything Linux first?

In theory - you'll never need to delete an old installation.

In practice - it depends on the Linux distribution and its package manager — some will correctly detect and update everything, changing all installed packages from 32 bit to 64 bit. And some will not, so you will have to reinstall from scratch. I never used Mint so I don't know for sure.

 

If you have a separate /home partition then you could reinstall from scratch (the installer should offer you something like "delete an old Linux installation, keeping user files").

If all your files reside on a single disk partition then it will be better to install the 64 bit version on top of the old version (the instaler should offer something like "do not delete an old Linux installation, and install over it"), and to hope that the installer will update everything correctly.

 

Try inserting an installation disk/flash and choosing "Upgrade" instead of "Install".

Edited July 16, 2021 by fdsa

[topt]

8 minutes ago, fdsa said:

Try inserting an installation disk/flash and choosing "Upgrade" instead of "Install".

Thanks.

I think it was on the Linux mint guidelines, or possibly in their forum, but definitely said cannot "upgrade" from from 32 to 64 bit and would need a new install. I was thinking more of just installing over the top, ie it just wipes what is there, as have no files in the Linux home partition to worry about. However it is the grub/mbr bit that concerns me.

I think I may just delete and use the rescue disc, which as long as it works, should be a cleaner solution. Unless there is a simple way to change the mbr to boot Win 7 first? 

[fdsa]

1 hour ago, topt said:

Thanks.

I think it was on the Linux mint guidelines, or possibly in their forum, but definitely said cannot "upgrade" from from 32 to 64 bit and would need a new install. I was thinking more of just installing over the top, ie it just wipes what is there, as have no files in the Linux home partition to worry about. However it is the grub/mbr bit that concerns me.

I think I may just delete and use the rescue disc, which as long as it works, should be a cleaner solution. Unless there is a simple way to change the mbr to boot Win 7 first? 

Install the new system over the old one, the installer should update the boot loader without any problems.

 

> but definitely said cannot "upgrade" from from 32 to 64 bit and would need a new install.

as far as I remember, it was possible to upgrade 32 bit to 64 bit system in our lizard-green world but it required providing some manual assistance to the package manager as it was not able to change all packages' architecture automatically. I don't know about Ubuntu/Mint world but I think it should be possible there too.

[topt]

27 minutes ago, fdsa said:

I don't know about Ubuntu/Mint world but I think it should be possible there too.

https://linuxmint-user-guide.readthedocs.io/en/latest/upgrade-to-mint-20.html

Quote

Requirements

64-bit architecture

Although both 32-bit and 64-bit versions of Linux Mint 19.3 are supported until April 2023, new releases of Linux Mint, including 20, are only available in 64-bit.

To upgrade to Linux Mint 20 you need to be running the 64-bit version of Linux Mint 19.3.

 

[topt]

5 hours ago, fdsa said:

the installer should offer you something like "delete an old Linux installation, keeping user files")

Thanks for your help. Turned out I needn't have been concerned.

Install page offered this which appears (so far) to have worked fine -

[fdsa]

OK then. However if I was you I'd have tried "Something else" where, I think, was a possibility to preserve user files, maybe even some "expert" mode which could update and change the architecture for all installed packages.

It is actually very strange that the installer wipes all user files, AFAIR our lizard distro only wipes system partitions such as "/", "/var", "/usr" but does not touch "/home" because it's simply makes no sense - there is no system files in users' directories.

 

 

[driver52]

are you aware of WINE? Linux software that lets you run windows progs, I use it on arch linux specifically endeavouros a very good distro

Like others have said, buy an SSD, stop using windows, don't look back lol

[topt]

8 hours ago, fdsa said:

However if I was you I'd have tried "Something else"

Used that on first install and allows you to customise the partition sizes etc. You keep forgetting I had no real user data as only just installed so was not an issue.

 

8 hours ago, driver52 said:

are you aware of WINE?

Yes thanks.

 

8 hours ago, driver52 said:

Like others have said, buy an SSD

You obviously didn't read my reply to that................