True Gigatex Fibre Modem restricts LAN-side router ? symptom : no internet

[ETatBKK]

hi there

a week ago I put a Linksys wifi router and a switch (LAN-side) behind the True Gigatex Fibre Modem/Router (WAN-side), it runs fine but then in some evening it has no internet (symptom : no default gateway). 

 

I suspected that True Gigatex Fibre modem restricts connection to additional LAN-side router. anyone experience this ? 

 

some technical info :

WAN-LAN connection : 192.168.1.1, DHCP is ON, wifi is OFF, internet is fine

LAN-side : 10.77.10.1, DHCP is ON for all connections, NO INTERNET neither via wifi nor via LAN, 4 computers 2 smartphones all no default gateway (ipconfig /all)

 

please help, cheers !

Edited August 14, 2021 by ETatBKK

[wprime]

You mean the clients don't get a default gateway or your True device doesn't get a default gateway?

[MrJ2U]

I'm using the Lynksys Velop TRI band routers (Mesh Network) connected to the true Gigi- byte router.

 

I ended up calling True and they sent someone out to configure it.  Very helpful!

He ended up doing the configuration.

 

Its working beautifully now.  12 of these lynksys mesh router nodes all over the property inside and out, amazing technology.

 

My advice is to have a guy who speaks relatively good english or have a translation with you go over it with the True IT guy who comes over.

 

This way you can get an idea in case it fails to work later.  Get the guys personal number and leave a good tip.  

 

Same guy comestibles to my place now if I run into problems.

 

1242 contact

Edited August 15, 2021 by MrJ2U

[mtls2005]

IP address conflicts arise over time. I just had to trouble-shoot this very problem this past Monday.

 

The switch is fine, but the secondary router (Linksys) needs to be properly configured. DHCP turned off, IP pool arranged, root IP of secondary router changed, and an assigned a static IP on the primary router.

 

What is the exact model of the Linksys router?

 

For this application I always recommend (for non hobbyists) a newer multi-mode router, which can be configured in "Access Point" mode. Plug and play. We've used this one - obviously not for flashing custom firmware -  https://www.tp-link.com/th/home-networking/wifi-router/archer-c6/ in a number of installs. Supports 5 GHz WLAN, and has GbE. I think these are under 1,500 THB. 

 

https://www.bnn.in.th/th/p/network/router-1/wi-fi-router/tp-link-archer-c6-ac1200-wireless-mu-mimo-gigabit-router-6935364084110_d45m4z

 

They offer same day delivery. 

 

If your Linksys router cannot be configured in Access Point mode the there are plenty of Youtube videos on how to arrange this, search "add secondary router".

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited August 15, 2021 by mtls2005

[recom273]

17 minutes ago, mtls2005 said:

IP address conflicts arise over time. I just had to trouble-shoot this very problem this past Monday.

 

The switch is fine, but the secondary router (Linksys) needs to be properly configured. DHCP turned off, IP pool arranged, root IP of secondary router changed, and an assigned a static IP on the primary router.

 

What is the exact model of the Linksys router?

 

For this application I always recommend (for non hobbyists) a newer multi-mode router, which can be configured in "Access Point" mode. Plug and play. We've used this one - obviously not for flashing custom firmware -  https://www.tp-link.com/th/home-networking/wifi-router/archer-c6/ in a number of installs. Supports 5 GHz WLAN, and has GbE. I think these are under 1,500 THB. 

 

https://www.bnn.in.th/th/p/network/router-1/wi-fi-router/tp-link-archer-c6-ac1200-wireless-mu-mimo-gigabit-router-6935364084110_d45m4z

 

They offer same day delivery. 

 

If your Linksys router cannot be configured in Access Point mode the there are plenty of Youtube videos on how to arrange this, search "add secondary router".

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The guy has 12x node (AP) Linksys mesh system, that's around 3000THB per AP, that's enough (if a node is an AP) AP's to cover more than a few acres of land on multiple levels.

[mtls2005]

1 hour ago, recom273 said:

The guy

 

Which "guy"?

 

I was addressing the OP, ETatBKK, who appears to just have one ISP router, one of their own routers and a switch.

 

I was not addressing MrJ2U, who, it also appears has resolved their problem.

 

But carry on.

 

 

 

 

[recom273]

26 minutes ago, mtls2005 said:

 

Which "guy"?

 

I was addressing the OP, ETatBKK, who appears to just have one ISP router, one of their own routers and a switch.

 

I was not addressing MrJ2U, who, it also appears has resolved their problem.

 

But carry on.

 

 

 

 

My bad - I thought the OP was MrJ2U .. Who as you say has already sorted his issue. 

[ETatBKK]

7 hours ago, wprime said:

You mean the clients don't get a default gateway or your True device doesn't get a default gateway?

just back online via different connection. to be exact - the True Gigatex Sercom ST-244F Modem / Router has WAN IP and WAN gateway 100.101.xx.x, and it seems working alright. while I connect the Linksys EA7500 to the True Gigatex Modem / Router, the Linksys router actually CONNECTED, but no default gateway, no internet.

Edited August 15, 2021 by ETatBKK

[ETatBKK]

6 hours ago, MrJ2U said:

I'm using the Lynksys Velop TRI band routers (Mesh Network) connected to the true Gigi- byte router.

 

I ended up calling True and they sent someone out to configure it.  Very helpful!

He ended up doing the configuration.

 

Its working beautifully now.  12 of these lynksys mesh router nodes all over the property inside and out, amazing technology.

 

My advice is to have a guy who speaks relatively good english or have a translation with you go over it with the True IT guy who comes over.

 

This way you can get an idea in case it fails to work later.  Get the guys personal number and leave a good tip.  

 

Same guy comestibles to my place now if I run into problems.

 

1242 contact

YES, these days I lot of users connecting own MESH routers to the ISP modem / router. the configuration between the ISP modem / router to MESH or to non-MESH router is the same. I think I stuck here on the configuration.

 

[sometimewoodworker]

11 hours ago, ETatBKK said:

hi there

a week ago I put a Linksys wifi router and a switch (LAN-side) behind the True Gigatex Fibre Modem/Router (WAN-side), it runs fine but then in some evening it has no internet (symptom : no default gateway). 

 

I suspected that True Gigatex Fibre modem restricts connection to additional LAN-side router. anyone experience this ? 

It’s unlikely to impossible that the fibre modem is restricting lan connections.

 

it’s is virtually certain that your Linksys is misconfigured. There are a verity of possible incorrect settings the one that seems likely with the limited information you have provided is that your True modem has a LAN network on the 192.168.1.x  so your Linksys must have an incoming (internet) 192.168.1.x connection.

your Linksys has a LAN side network on 10.77.10.x (rather strange but no technical problems).
 

More data is required for diagnosis.

 

FWIW my setup is

public IP address (WAN) 182.53.194.202 ONT to modem

provided modem LAN is 192.168.1.x 

my tp-link modem has an ip at the moment of 192.168.1.17 and a lan network on 10.1.1.x

 

 

[sometimewoodworker]

6 minutes ago, ETatBKK said:

YES, these days I lot of users connecting own MESH routers to the ISP modem / router. the configuration between the ISP modem / router to MESH or to non-MESH router is the same. I think I stuck here on the configuration.

 

MESH or non MESH makes no difference at all. 
 

The problem is that simple configuration assumes settings that may not be (often are not) true.

If you want security then there are many settings that must be correct.

if you want simplicity the settings are different. 
 

at the moment I have 2 main modems and about 7 subsidy ones in bridge mode that link music. I have 3 (actually 6) LANs configured. Is it easy to miss configure? Absolutely if you don’t throughly understand the theory. But “monkey see monkey do” can avoid the need to get that education 

[ETatBKK]

5 hours ago, mtls2005 said:

IP address conflicts arise over time. I just had to trouble-shoot this very problem this past Monday.

 

The switch is fine, but the secondary router (Linksys) needs to be properly configured. DHCP turned off, IP pool arranged, root IP of secondary router changed, and an assigned a static IP on the primary router.

 

What is the exact model of the Linksys router?

 

For this application I always recommend (for non hobbyists) a newer multi-mode router, which can be configured in "Access Point" mode. Plug and play. We've used this one - obviously not for flashing custom firmware -  https://www.tp-link.com/th/home-networking/wifi-router/archer-c6/ in a number of installs. Supports 5 GHz WLAN, and has GbE. I think these are under 1,500 THB. 

 

thanks and understand your point. I have checked it is not IP conflict, I limited the DHCP on the True Gigatex Modem / Router to 192.168.1.1 to 192.168.1.16, and check all IP accordingly.

 

happened to me, the True whatever modem / routers are so bad and they died every 3 months; I don't want to rely on their router. I have computers, AP, switch, printers, NAS, smart home & IoTs around, every time True replace the modem / router, I have to re-setup everything. that's why I want to have a self contained network with its own routing table, when True modem / router sleeps again, I just call and replace a new modem / router.

 

I come back later with more details . . .

[mtls2005]

17 minutes ago, ETatBKK said:

Linksys EA7500

 

That device can act as a Wireless Repeater. 

 

https://www.linksys.com/ca/support-article?articleNum=247437

 

You could also uplink the Linksys from your ISP's router.

 

https://www.linksys.com/ca/support-article?articleNum=132275

 

I'd recommend: i. LAN to LAN

 

video: https://www.linksys.com/ca/support-article/?articleNum=155108

 

 

 

 

 

 

[ETatBKK]

8 minutes ago, sometimewoodworker said:

MESH or non MESH makes no difference at all. 
 

The problem is that simple configuration assumes settings that may not be (often are not) true.

If you want security then there are many settings that must be correct.

if you want simplicity the settings are different. 
 

at the moment I have 2 main modems and about 7 subsidy ones in bridge mode that link music. I have 3 (actually 6) LANs configured. Is it easy to miss configure? Absolutely if you don’t throughly understand the theory. But “monkey see monkey do” can avoid the need to get that education 

YES, certainly I may miss some configuration on the True Gigatex Modem / Router, AND on my Linksys router ! that why I come to here ???? let me organise the details and post here for reference !

[sometimewoodworker]

11 minutes ago, ETatBKK said:

YES, certainly I may miss some configuration on the True Gigatex Modem / Router, AND on my Linksys router ! that why I come to here ???? let me organise the details and post here for reference !

You need a minimum of

public IP address (https://www.whatsmyip.org) (WAN)

True LAN network and settings 

Linksys (WAN) network address

Linksys LAN network and settings 

 

if you want internal network security 

if you don’t care about internal network security 

 

it’s virtually certain you need change nothing on the True modem

 

IP addresses are not the only possible misconfiguration, it could be DNS that’s wrong and blocking everything.

 

EDIT also the kind of connection between True & Linksys (I hope it’s Ethernet)

 

Edited August 15, 2021 by sometimewoodworker

[MrJ2U]

38 minutes ago, ETatBKK said:

YES, these days I lot of users connecting own MESH routers to the ISP modem / router. the configuration between the ISP modem / router to MESH or to non-MESH router is the same. I think I stuck here on the configuration.

 

I know my True guy just opened his laptop and did some configuring.

 

I was up and running within an hour.

 

Maybe they can do the same for you.

 

Good luck.

[ETatBKK]

my approach - whatever True devices, the hardware and the configuration should be independent, and not affect the LAN side configurations. so, I want the True device feeding internet only, but not the routing function, nor the wifi. this is what we used to do with modem, routing, switch, and access point, all separately.

this is a home + work, LAN side internal security not an issue. most devices (computers, NAS, switch, extender, TV . . .) are connected via CAT6. only portable devices are on wifi.

 

below are the configurations I recorded on both devices. YELL if I made a silly mistake, I don't cry !

 

True Gigatex Sercom ST-244F modem / router
WAN interface ppp0_nas_0
WAN protocol PPPoE
WAN IP 100.101.xx.xx from True
WAN gateway IP 100.101.xx.x
WAN DNS 203.144.207.29

 

LAN IP 192.168.1.1 (@LAN1)
DHCP enabled, 192.168.1.2 - 192.168.1.16
subnet mask 255.255.255.0
LAN gateway 192.168.1.1
DNS relay enabled
WLAN 5.0GHz hidden SSID : emergency (for testing), AC only / auto channel / WPA2 AES
WLAN 2.4GHz disabled

 

Linksys EA7500 wifi router
WAN IP 169.168.1.x (via ethernet DHCP from Sercom ST-244F)
DHCP enabled, 10.77.10.2 - 10.77.10.25
subnet mask 255.255.255.0
LAN gateway 10.77.10.1
DNS 8.8.8.8, 8.8.4.4, 1.1.1.1
DHCP reservation 10.77.10.2 - 10.77.10.9 (5 LAN, 3 wifi)
WLAN 2.4GHz, SSID : WLAN03_2.4GHz, N only, auto channel
WLAN 5.0GHz, SSID : WLAN03_5.0GHz, AC only, auto channel
Mac address cloned - of the main desktop, via LAN

 

NAT enabled, UPnP enabled
Cut Through Forwarding enabled
Application Layer Gateway SIP disabled
LAN4 ethernet connection to a Linksys LGS108 switch
then ethernet connection to a Linksys RE6500 extender in bridge mode

[GrandPapillon]

I can see a problem with your config, you are combining 2 DHCP servers with 2 pool of IPs, which default to a non routable address for the gw

 

shutdown the DHCP server for LAN 10.77.10.1

 

put a new IP for the LAN Switch, in the same IP class as the main router, maybe 192.168.1.2

 

bridge with an ETH cable between 2 normal ports, not the "internet" port of the router or the switch if it has one

 

problem solved,

Edited August 15, 2021 by GrandPapillon

[ETatBKK]

thanks GP, that I wondered already if the network is double DHCP, double NAT ?

 

if I want to keep all the routing on the Linksys EA7500 instead of the True Gigatex device (that comes and goes every 3 months), should I switch OFF the DHCP on the True modem / router instead ? then the Linksys distributing the IP 10.77.10.1 to 10.77.10.25 on the network ?

 

[sometimewoodworker]

1 hour ago, ETatBKK said:

True Gigatex Sercom ST-244F modem / router
WAN interface ppp0_nas_0
WAN protocol PPPoE
WAN IP 100.101.xx.xx from True
WAN gateway IP 100.101.xx.x
WAN DNS 203.144.207.29

Looks no problem

 

1 hour ago, ETatBKK said:

LAN IP 192.168.1.1 (@LAN1)
DHCP enabled, 192.168.1.2 - 192.168.1.16

 Unusually restrictive DHCP but probablyOK

 

1 hour ago, ETatBKK said:

LAN gateway 192.168.1.1
DNS relay enabled
WLAN 5.0GHz hidden SSID : emergency (for testing), AC only / auto channel / WPA2 AES
WLAN 2.4GHz disabled

I would set DNS to 203.144.207.29 or the Google 8.8.8.8

1 hour ago, ETatBKK said:

Linksys EA7500 wifi router
WAN IP 169.168.1.x (via ethernet DHCP from Sercom ST-244F)

As long as x is in the range 2~16 that’s ok

1 hour ago, ETatBKK said:

DHCP enabled, 10.77.10.2 - 10.77.10.25
subnet mask 255.255.255.0
LAN gateway 10.77.10.1
DNS 8.8.8.8, 8.8.4.4, 1.1.1.1

Again a strange and restrictive selection of IP ranges but it should work though I would as a test case set DNS every to 203.144.207.29

1 hour ago, ETatBKK said:

DHCP reservation 10.77.10.2 - 10.77.10.9 (5 LAN, 3 wifi)

But you have DHCP enabled, 10.77.10.2 - 10.77.10.25 so that looks like a conflict.

 

if you want static IPs  enable DHCP from 10.77.10.10

1 hour ago, ETatBKK said:

WLAN 2.4GHz, SSID : WLAN03_2.4GHz, N only, auto channel
WLAN 5.0GHz, SSID : WLAN03_5.0GHz, AC only, auto channel
Mac address cloned - of the main desktop, via LAN

I don’t see a need to clone the MAC address but it probably won’t be a problem.

 

1 hour ago, ETatBKK said:

NAT enabled,

Essential

 

1 hour ago, ETatBKK said:

UPnP enabled

Dangerous if you don’t absolutely have to have it.

 

1 hour ago, ETatBKK said:

Cut Through Forwarding enabled

Pass,  I don’t know that but it’s unlikely to be a problem.

 

1 hour ago, ETatBKK said:

Application Layer Gateway SIP disabled
LAN4 ethernet connection to a Linksys LGS108 switch
then ethernet connection to a Linksys RE6500 extender in bridge mode

Looks OK

 

44 minutes ago, GrandPapillon said:

I can see a problem with your config, you are combining 2 DHCP servers with 2 pool of IPs, which default to a non routable address for the gw

I don’t see a problem there. I also run 2 DHCP servers with no conflict.

 

44 minutes ago, GrandPapillon said:

put a new IP for the LAN Switch, in the same IP class as the main router, maybe 192.168.1.2

I don’t see a need or benefit for that

44 minutes ago, GrandPapillon said:

bridge with an ETH cable between 2 normal ports, not the "internet" port of the router or the switch if it has one

A non standard solution that turns the Linksys into a switch.

 

_—————————————-

if no security is wanted set the Linksys into bridge mode and disable the 10.x.x.x network.

 

I don’t claim network engineering expert status but I have configured several networks with only minor problems that I fixed

Edited August 15, 2021 by sometimewoodworker

[sometimewoodworker]

24 minutes ago, ETatBKK said:

thanks GP, that I wondered already if the network is double DHCP, double NAT ?

 

if I want to keep all the routing on the Linksys EA7500 instead of the True Gigatex device (that comes and goes every 3 months), should I switch OFF the DHCP on the True modem / router instead ? then the Linksys distributing the IP 10.77.10.1 to 10.77.10.25 on the network ?

 

If you almost never connect anything new to the true router you can turn off DHCP on the True device and just use manual IP addressing, but that is not the problem as nothing on the Linksys network can see (should be able to see) the True DHCP server.

Edited August 15, 2021 by sometimewoodworker

[sometimewoodworker]

Double DHCP if correctly configured and double NAT cause no problem 

[GrandPapillon]

That seems to be overly complex network with 2 pool of IPs and 4 times the tech "resolution" for what is a home network

 

I have a similar setup with 2 switch, WIFI APs and RPs and the main router

 

overlapping 2 private pools to access a public network is just increasing "garbage" for your network

 

Keep it simple always work, one class of IPs, one DHCP server with a large range (100 hosts) and never had a problem connecting to the internet

 

everytime I see 2 pools of private IPs, with 2 DHCP servers, the client will get the wrong gw or the wrong IP class and won't connect

 

classic,

 

always looks good on paper, but a PITA to make it work if you miss one small parameter or the switch software is full of minor bugs

Edited August 15, 2021 by GrandPapillon

[ETatBKK]

42 minutes ago, GrandPapillon said:

That seems to be overly complex network with 2 pool of IPs and 4 times the tech "resolution" for what is a home network

 

Keep it simple always work, one class of IPs, one DHCP server with a large range (100 hosts) and never had a problem connecting to the internet

 

always looks good on paper, but a PITA to make it work if you miss one small parameter or the switch software is full of minor bugs

totally agree with you, keep it simple is the principle ???? I am just going through the mess and complexity, and find simplicity.

 

perhaps, my end point is clear - I want to have a network that is NOT REPLY on True's whatever modem / router (which is very faulty recently). if I put the one DHCP server back to the True's equipment, then I won't reach this goal.

 

or, would my concept totally inapplicable ? please share !

[ETatBKK]

2 hours ago, sometimewoodworker said:

If you almost never connect anything new to the true router you can turn off DHCP on the True device and just use manual IP addressing, but that is not the problem as nothing on the Linksys network can see (should be able to see) the True DHCP server.

hours ago I start power cycle the DNS on the Linksys to 203.144.207.29. STRANGE it connects for a minutes plus, then internet gone with no error message. but now even with the power cycles, no internet, no default gateway, no DHCP, no DNS on the Linksys ? 

 

[sometimewoodworker]

52 minutes ago, ETatBKK said:

hours ago I start power cycle the DNS on the Linksys to 203.144.207.29. STRANGE it connects for a minutes plus, then internet gone with no error message. but now even with the power cycles, no internet, no default gateway, no DHCP, no DNS on the Linksys ? 

 

You forgot that if you have DHCP turned off on the True device you have to manually set a 192.168.1.x on every other device that connects to it. The 169.254.x.x is another non routable address range like 192.168.x.x & 10.x.x.x

 

also unless your Linksys can substitute for the true equipment it can’t have a public address.

 

if the true modem is faulty the call them and they will change it.

Edited August 15, 2021 by sometimewoodworker

[sometimewoodworker]

1 hour ago, GrandPapillon said:

overlapping 2 private pools to access a public network is just increasing "garbage" for your network

 

Keep it simple always work, one class of IPs, one DHCP server with a large range (100 hosts) and never had a problem connecting to the internet

 

everytime I see 2 pools of private IPs, with 2 DHCP servers, the client will get the wrong gw or the wrong IP class and won't connect

 

classic,

Humm

A single private IP range is inherently insecure.
 
Correctly configured DNS should be an island, your device should only ever see a single DNS server. 
 

a simple secure network will have 3 DNS servers. 1 (A) will connect to the internet, 1 (B) will contain all the IOT devices and connect via (A) to the Net and the 3rd (C) will have all the intelligent devices like phones, tablets & computers on it. 

 

I've been running my own 2 and 3 DNS ranges behind an internet connection for many years with no problems that I didn't make then instantly correct, and vanishingly few of those.

 

I completely agree that its way too easy to mess things up.

 

Only if you enjoy  the fun of making errors and finding out why you messed up the fixing the errors should you have a go at DIY without taking a networking class. But also realise that there are several ways to achieve the same end and often they are equally correct.

[sometimewoodworker]

1 hour ago, ETatBKK said:

totally agree with you, keep it simple is the principle ???? I am just going through the mess and complexity, and find simplicity.

 

perhaps, my end point is clear - I want to have a network that is NOT REPLY on True's whatever modem / router (which is very faulty recently). if I put the one DHCP server back to the True's equipment, then I won't reach this goal.

 

or, would my concept totally inapplicable ? please share !

You almost certainly must use a True modem as it’s supported by them and configured by them, if faulty get it changed.

 

The TRUE DHCP server is not the problem (you were able to connect to the net using it).
 

You can disable the TRUE DNS but must then give static IP addresses to any device that connects to the true modem (the range is 192.168.1.x where x=2~254). Your Linksys message that states “Autoconfiguration IPv4” is the problem now. You have to set a static IP on the Linksys.

 

The only setting on the TRUE modem that it’s safe for you to change is it’s DNS server. It must still receive its DNS dynamically, just not serve DNS

 

My devices connect to my private modem/s. The private modem/s connect to my providers modem. This is what you want.

 

My advice, unless you enjoy frustration, is get someone who can visit either in person or virtually to help. 

 

[sometimewoodworker]

2 hours ago, ETatBKK said:

perhaps, my end point is clear - I want to have a network that is NOT REPLY on True's whatever modem / router (which is very faulty recently). if I put the one DHCP server back to the True's equipment, then I won't reach this goal.

Incorrect.

 

 

[ETatBKK]

53 minutes ago, sometimewoodworker said:

perhaps, my end point is clear - I want to have a network that is NOT REPLY on True's whatever modem / router (which is very faulty recently). if I put the one DHCP server back to the True's equipment, then I won't reach this goal.

Incorrect.

 

58 minutes ago, sometimewoodworker said:

My devices connect to my private modem/s. The private modem/s connect to my providers modem. This is what you want.

 

could you please explain these two points in a bit more details ! I logged a service request to True and they will show up on Tuesday afternoon. so I still have time to refresh the networking concepts.