Are expats being tempted by Thailand?

[Walker88]

1 hour ago, Mike Teavee said:

Thailand's Visa Requirements are not difficult, especially for the "Rich" as they have a number of options available to them (Elite/Investment Visas being the 2 obvious ones), they're only difficult for people unable or unwilling  to invest & (rightly or wrongly) these are not the demographic that Thailand is trying to attract.  

 

 

You'd be hard put to find as easy or cheap visa requirements in the region, Philippines is probably the only one with it's SRRV (though this involve as jumping through as many if not more hoops), Malaysia has recently doubled it's financial requirements for MM2H, Cambodia has a dodgy business visa that could be clamped down on anytime & I don't think Vietnam has anything... 

 

On balance if you're able/willing to put the money into Thailand, it's relatively straight forward to live here. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Funny you say 'invest'. If you mean literal investment, as in buying a company, the visa requirements ARE difficult.

 

They would be difficult even if tributes were not demanded in a most blatant fashion, but tributes are regularly demanded. As for the official requirements---not the ones enacted merely to enhance bureaucrats' income---a typical application is more than 100 pages. It requires everything from university and grad school transcripts, lots of data re owners and directors, pages of 'action photos' of the applicant pretending to work or mulling over business ideas, lots of photos at the place of business, with the address clearly visible and staff surrounding the applicant, and other such things, all of which must be signed by the applicant.

 

In a post I made a while back, I was told or contacted about others' experiences that included such things as 'declined for not wearing a business suit in the photos' or other silly things meant to extract a payment. In my first instance, sitting with my accountant who has years of experience navigating the system, the officer thumbed through the stack of docs without even looking at them, then announced something missing, but the oversight could be ignored for a special fee.

 

For this visa, the applicant is given an initial 3 month visa, then a second one, and a third trip yields the one-year. Each application requires the same onerous document stack, despite the fact this is redundant.

 

To most people, this system would be categorized as 'difficult'. It's also quite expensive when one factors in the agent fees, 'tributes', etc. I also think the size of the tribute is a function of the amount invested, as those who put more money into the country are viewed as capable of being more 'generous' with their tributes.

 

Now if you meant 'invest' as in an Elite Visa, perhaps the system is easier, as the Elite Staff apparently handle the 90-day reporting requirements.

[Sticky Rice Balls]

15 minutes ago, HeijoshinCool said:

.

Dunno, because all the girls look like sisters...?

with kids at grandmas back in the village....

[GinBoy2]

Hmm interesting question.

I'd kinda agree with the general assertion that if money is no object Thailand would be well down the list.

 

I maybe a bit of an outlier in as much as I didn't meet my wife in Thailand, but at our work in Singapore, and I, against her better judgement wanted to retire to Thailand.

 

So the basic question are expats tempted?

 

I was tempted at the time by the thought I would lead a wholly Farang life at a fraction of the price.

 

Over the years, that didn't really pan out, and I found cost of living, for the lifestyle I wanted to live was actually costing more than in the US, without the conveniences of living in your our country.

 

So I'm not exactly sure what the marketing hook would be for expats?

 

Unless we of course delve into the pants of aging farang males mesmerized by the Maidens of Isaan 

[Will B Good]

15 minutes ago, fredscats said:

Christ  I dont fancy yours

You forget.....beer goggles!!!!

[DLock]

51 minutes ago, Will B Good said:

Are they still tempted by Thailand?....YES....though the mystery is why?

 

I'm always intrigued at how someone could find a 3/10 flat footed, splay toed farm girl, with cheap make-up and minimal language skills attractive....and marry them...but maybe that's just me.

[jazzdog32095]

2 hours ago, Mike Teavee said:

Thailand's Visa Requirements are not difficult, especially for the "Rich" as they have a number of options available to them (Elite/Investment Visas being the 2 obvious ones), they're only difficult for people unable or unwilling  to invest & (rightly or wrongly) these are not the demographic that Thailand is trying to attract.  

 

 

You'd be hard put to find as easy or cheap visa requirements in the region, Philippines is probably the only one with it's SRRV (though this involve as jumping through as many if not more hoops), Malaysia has recently doubled it's financial requirements for MM2H, Cambodia has a dodgy business visa that could be clamped down on anytime & I don't think Vietnam has anything... 

 

On balance if you're able/willing to put the money into Thailand, it's relatively straight forward to live here. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

1.00 usd per day retirement extension. Can't beat that.

[DrJack54]

2 minutes ago, DLock said:

 

I'm always intrigued at how someone could find a 3/10 flat footed, splay toed farm girl, with cheap make-up and minimal language skills attractive....and marry them...but maybe that's just me.

You have just described my dream girl.

[Misterwhisper]

2 hours ago, tonray said:

I thought they all flocked to Bath on their holiday week...????????????????

Brighton?

[ThailandRyan]

5 minutes ago, jazzdog32095 said:

1.00 usd per day retirement extension. Can't beat that.

No it's around 16 1/2 cents a day, not 1 dollar......

[Scrotobike]

1 hour ago, ezzra said:

If only the people in charge on bringing "rich" or any foreigners to retire in Thailand knew what they were doing this country would be full of them, but Thai people are inherently proud of their country and sovereignty and are fiercely opposing the move to allow foreigners to populate Thailand in big numbers hence the awkward cumbersome visa and permits regulations a foreigner has to put with to stay in this country... 

Yes Thais want Thailand for the Thais - nothing wrong with that. 

BUT this means the desired foreigners will not come or will leave shortly after as they are not welcome in such a xenophobe country.

Cannot have your somtam and eat it.

[FritsSikkink]

2 hours ago, Rookiescot said:

When you are rich you have the world at your feet.

Many places offer sun and beaches.

Often they have less difficult visa requirements than Thailand does.

If you have money, you don't have visa problems in Thailand.

[MrJ2U]

1 hour ago, ChipButty said:

They have got that much money they dont care about luxury tax, when you see the amount of BMW's Merc's around where I live, Last week a German guy rented one of my apartments he turned up a brand new Merc 250 coupe, it had Bangkok plates on it and I asked him did he drive here he said no he paid someone to drive it here for him. That Merc would be at least double the price of what it would be back in Berlin,

They do care.

 

Not much choice.

 

Extortionate taxes on cars here. 

That's why many Thais are stuck in debt or stuck riding an old Honda with no headlights.

Edited September 10, 2021 by MrJ2U

[FritsSikkink]

1 hour ago, worgeordie said:

TAT and Thailand want to forget about attracting wealthy ,tourists,  retirees,

it's never going to happen

 

 

Nonsense, know enough of them.

[LosLobo]

3 hours ago, webfact said:

When Brits think about retiring or moving abroad, more often then not, picturesque landscapes of beaches with cloudless skies are cited as features they want.

Yes cloudless skies without the PM 2.5!

 

 

Edited September 10, 2021 by LosLobo

[jazzdog32095]

38 minutes ago, Walker88 said:

Funny you say 'invest'. If you mean literal investment, as in buying a company, the visa requirements ARE difficult.

 

They would be difficult even if tributes were not demanded in a most blatant fashion, but tributes are regularly demanded. As for the official requirements---not the ones enacted merely to enhance bureaucrats' income---a typical application is more than 100 pages. It requires everything from university and grad school transcripts, lots of data re owners and directors, pages of 'action photos' of the applicant pretending to work or mulling over business ideas, lots of photos at the place of business, with the address clearly visible and staff surrounding the applicant, and other such things, all of which must be signed by the applicant.

 

In a post I made a while back, I was told or contacted about others' experiences that included such things as 'declined for not wearing a business suit in the photos' or other silly things meant to extract a payment. In my first instance, sitting with my accountant who has years of experience navigating the system, the officer thumbed through the stack of docs without even looking at them, then announced something missing, but the oversight could be ignored for a special fee.

 

For this visa, the applicant is given an initial 3 month visa, then a second one, and a third trip yields the one-year. Each application requires the same onerous document stack, despite the fact this is redundant.

 

To most people, this system would be categorized as 'difficult'. It's also quite expensive when one factors in the agent fees, 'tributes', etc. I also think the size of the tribute is a function of the amount invested, as those who put more money into the country are viewed as capable of being more 'generous' with their tributes.

 

Now if you meant 'invest' as in an Elite Visa, perhaps the system is easier, as the Elite Staff apparently handle the 90-day reporting requirements.

Pretty much all third world countries enact laws and regulations that are complex, confusing and open to interpretation that make it impossible to successfully gain approval. This approval can only be attained by entering the underworld of endless kickbacks and bribes. It's considered standard practice. I developed property in Costa Rica where one NEVER gets a project approved without a payoff of some sorts usually involving the Mayor or Registro employee. I've gain approval of subdivision buying brake shoes for a dump truck. I developed in S. Florida and been declined after spending hundreds of thousands on studies and engineering and told to come back in a year! Bribes are just part of the process in poorer countries.  

[Will B Good]

29 minutes ago, DLock said:

 

I'm always intrigued at how someone could find a 3/10 flat footed, splay toed farm girl, with cheap make-up and minimal language skills attractive....and marry them...but maybe that's just me.

Yes........you can't beat a 2/10, loud, fat and aggressive white girl in a denim miniskirt, white mottled legs with cottage cheese thighs and wearing scuffed white high heels......you got me . 

Edited September 10, 2021 by Will B Good

[DLock]

12 minutes ago, Will B Good said:

Yes........you can't beat a 2/10, loud, fat and aggressive white girl in a denim miniskirt, white mottled legs with cottage cheese thighs and wearing scuffed white high heels......you got me . 

If that's all you aspire to and can attract based on your success in life...I understand your predicament.

 

Carry on.

[fusion58]

2 hours ago, Mike Teavee said:

Thailand's Visa Requirements are not difficult, especially for the "Rich" as they have a number of options available to them (Elite/Investment Visas being the 2 obvious ones),

Trouble is, Elite Visa holders have to jump through the same ridiculous 90 Day Reporting/TM30 hoops as everyone else. "Rich" people generally don't like being treated like criminal suspects and being forced to wear a (figurative) ankle bracelet at all times. Further, to compound matters, there are few paths to permanent residence and/or citizenship for retirees/property owners - wealthy or otherwise.

[HappyExpat57]

How many Brits came here with a comfortable-ish pension, only to have the baht exchange bring them to their knees? And there is no guarantee that won't happen again. The way the baht is falsely manipulated is enough to keep ANYONE from retiring here.

[jazzdog32095]

59 minutes ago, ThailandRyan said:

No it's around 16 1/2 cents a day, not 1 dollar......

but you pay 5.48 per day in lost opportunity cost

[Will B Good]

Just now, HappyExpat57 said:

How many Brits came here with a comfortable-ish pension, only to have the baht exchange bring them to their knees? And there is no guarantee that won't happen again. The way the baht is falsely manipulated is enough to keep ANYONE from retiring here.

Yet another, very strong, argument against buying/investing here unless you are reasonably wealthy and can take the hit.

 

Renting is the only way to go if you intend to live here.

[HappyExpat57]

2 minutes ago, Will B Good said:

Yet another, very strong, argument against buying/investing here unless you are reasonably wealthy and can take the hit.

 

Renting is the only way to go if you intend to live here.

I've lived all over the world and recognized, with all its ugly warts, the US has an extremely strong rule of law regarding real estate. You keep up on your property taxes and that property stays yours. Yes, I know about imminent domain, but that's a rarity. No WAY would I ever make a land investment in a developing country.

[Mike Teavee]

25 minutes ago, fusion58 said:

Trouble is, Elite Visa holders have to jump through the same ridiculous 90 Day Reporting/TM30 hoops as everyone else. "Rich" people generally don't like being treated like criminal suspects and being forced to wear a (figurative) ankle bracelet at all times. Further, to compound matters, there are few paths to permanent residence and/or citizenship for retirees/property owners - wealthy or otherwise.

I'm on a Non-Imm O (Retirement) & am not rich but I choose to pay an Agent to do all my immigration needs for me so with the exception of having to turn up on the day to do my extension I have nothing to do with them. 

 

Costs have been:-

1. 2,000 THB to do my very 1st TM30 (This was at the time when Immigration was being very hot about people completing them), have recently moved but the real estate agent did my TM30 for me
2. Extension - 8,900 THB (Includes the 1,900 THB fee, they do all of the running around & I spend about 30 minutes at CW on the day)
3. Initial 90 Day Report - 1,500 THB this was the report after the amnesty so needed to be done in person or you could pay a "Service Fee" to have an agent do it for you
4. Subsequent 90 Day reporting - All done online, if I wanted my agent to do it for me it's 380 THB a time    

Maybe a waste of money to some but I value my time more than it costs so it's of value to me... 

 

If it wasn't for Covid I'd be travelling all of the time so would probably go for an Elite Visa (If for no other reason than fast track / lounges at the airport) & not have to do anything save update the Visa once every 5 years (Simply wouldn't bother with TM30 & no need to do 90 day reports as I wouldn't spend 90 days in-country) 

 

 

 

Edited September 10, 2021 by Mike Teavee

[ThomasThBKK]

3 hours ago, Mike Teavee said:

Thailand's Visa Requirements are not difficult, especially for the "Rich" as they have a number of options available to them (Elite/Investment Visas being the 2 obvious ones), they're only difficult for people unable or unwilling  to invest & (rightly or wrongly) these are not the demographic that Thailand is trying to attract.  

 

 

You'd be hard put to find as easy or cheap visa requirements in the region, Philippines is probably the only one with it's SRRV (though this involve as jumping through as many if not more hoops), Malaysia has recently doubled it's financial requirements for MM2H, Cambodia has a dodgy business visa that could be clamped down on anytime & I don't think Vietnam has anything... 

 

On balance if you're able/willing to put the money into Thailand, it's relatively straight forward to live here. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Quite sure the SRRV is suspended right now: https://newsinfo.inquirer.net/1351888/retirement-visas-on-hold-over-security-concerns

 

 

The board of the Philippine Retirement Authority (PRA) on Friday suspended the granting of retirement visas to foreigners after several senators raised security concerns over the presence in the country of nearly 28,000 Chinese “retirees,” some of whom were only in their 30s.

 

Destroyed by chinese abuse. Normal foreigners seem to suffer for this.

 

Currently Thailand seems the only easy to get long term visa in South East Asia...

 

 

3 hours ago, Rookiescot said:

Rich people are generally not going to buy their way into a country like Thailand when other options are available but I suspect its not rich westerners they want anyway.

Rich Chinese on the other hand might be tempted as its a way of getting money out of China.

 

 

Yeah they do, do u think all those phuket beach front villas, bangkok penthouses etc are owned by poor people.... lol.

 

 

Which other option is availble where u can just buy a 20 year visa for 30 grand and be left alone with basically no paperwork? Yeh nothing...
 

[spidermike007]

3 hours ago, ThailandRyan said:

The rules and laws here in Thailand have not been changed and foreigners gain no advantage at all here.  You still can not own the land yourself, you get no citizenship, and are not even a permanent resident like many other countries.  A major inequity is what it is, yet many of us have bought vehicle here, houses, and or Condos and live here as if it were our permanent residence.  Thailand however looks upon us as just long term visitors and nothing more.  For those friends I know who are looking at retirement in the next year or so many have decided on Portugal, Panama, and Spain, as they can buy the house, own the land and gain citizenship as well as attain residence and a passport.  Thailand, not so much, they may buy a Condo for use as a family asset when the world reopens to travel.

Many of us moved here a long time ago, when Thailand was a different place. Before it started going downhill rapidly, with no end on the horizon. At this time, there appears to be little hope for positive change, and a brighter future for the nation. Many of us have good lives here, regardless of the clowns. We enjoy good food, nice people, some of us are fortunate to have a very good Thai woman, and the quality of life is good for those of us with a limited income. And picking up and leaving requires a huge amount of time, resources and effort. So, most of us will stay and ignore the spectacularly toxic leadership and the ignorant immigration xenophobia. If I were wealthy enough, I would only be here 2 or 3 months of the year. There is just way too much nonsense here, these days.

 

But, for someone thinking of a place to retire now, there are far better options. Especially for wealthy people, which Thailand has little to no chance of attracting, no matter how much they wish upon a star. There are far too many choices, that offer more freedoms, better culture, better infrastructure, easier visa policy, more vision toward the future, more concern for the environment, law and order, actual traffic laws that are enforced, less racism, less fear of the outside world, etc., and many of the things ThailandRyan quotes above.

 

Thailand would have to be very low on the list, unless one was single and looking for action, then they might even resort to something really desperate like the PI. 

Edited September 10, 2021 by spidermike007

[ivor bigun]

If i was single ,i doubt very much i would retire here ,but as a married man with an adult son ,who is in a highly paid job and who has the mortgage on our lovely detached property ,and i have some savings and a pension ,and a lovely wife,its good for me ,but funnily enough my wife is starting to miss England where we lived for many years ,as do i sometimes ,but we would not go back to live , 

[spidermike007]

Most wealthy people tend to be smart with their money. They simply will not pay stupid money for stuff. The ultra rich are different. But, no ultra rich people would even consider Thailand as a destination, unless they had work here. The luxury taxes have been discouraging high end tourism here for decades. It is policy that is so dumb, so shortsighted, so non-visionary, and it badly hurts the economy. If wine duty was 80%, you would have a thriving wine industry here, five to ten times the size of the current industry. So the state income would be made up on volume, and hundreds of thousands of jobs would be generated. Instead the protection of a few local wineries continues, due to some politicians passing the anti import wine bill years ago, and accepting the payoffs that came with that braindead decision. Same applies to luxury taxes. Ferrari would sell 100 cars a year here, instead of 5. The designer stores in the malls might actually have some customers. 

 

Brain dead policy, by brain dead men, who think Thailand is the center of the universe. Earth to Thailand. This place is not only not the center of the universe, it is barely the center of SE Asia anymore. The tiger of SE Asia has become a whiny, sickly, anemic, hungry, disease infected alley cat. And the nation is moving backwards at a breakneck pace, towards true, poor nation 3rd world status. 

Sure, many other countries are benefitting from all of the mistakes Thailand is making. But, they are also trying much harder, and are far smarter with their policies. They deserve the gains.

Edited September 10, 2021 by spidermike007

[jazzdog32095]

27 minutes ago, Will B Good said:

Yet another, very strong, argument against buying/investing here unless you are reasonably wealthy and can take the hit.

 

Renting is the only way to go if you intend to live here.

Agreed, the huge inventory of property makes resale a fools game. The Xchange has has lost 1% over 5 years, not an issue.

[spidermike007]

2 hours ago, NanaSomchai said:

Anything equalling "beer bar girls" in either of those aforementionned three countries? Portugal, Panama, Spain?

 

If you know anything and have expertise to share privately please PM me if it's deemed too sensitive for public posting.

Quite expensive, lower quality in general, but more passionate, again in general. Yes, there is plenty of action, but nothing like here. At least before Covid. After? Who knows?

[spidermike007]

3 hours ago, HeijoshinCool said:

.

 

Sorry, are you talking about Thailand, or the UK, or France, or Germany, or the USA?

Well, you do make a reasonable point. I do not know about France, Germany or the UK. In the US, the leadership has been poor for decades now. They are not able to attract the best and the brightest to public office anymore, as the job is just too toxic, and so is the environment. Most of the people with some noble intentions, tend to stay away from it, and it tends to attract people like Trump, Bush Jr. Clinton, Pelosi, McCarthy, McConnell, and other low end, low rent, low ethics types of contenders. 

 

However there is law and order, there are some environmental safeguards, foreigners who live there do have legal rights, and in general, the place is not run by dinosaurs, completely lacking a vision of the future, and who are only in it for the sake of extracting as much illicit cash as possible.