Assimilation with Thai Culture

[Lacessit]

3 minutes ago, steven100 said:

If you think all Thais are honest you are insane.       imo

Thanks for the confirmation you've lost the plot. Do you have someone to "take care" of you?

[roo860]

3 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

I am making no assumptions, just applying a reductio ad absurdum to a somewhat fatuous post.

 

There are more ways to be polite with Thais than a wai, and I don't see why I should adopt the practice just because you say so.

A polite nod of the head suffices, covers all situations, IMO.

[Lacessit]

2 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

Thanks for the confirmation you've lost the plot. Do you have someone to "take care" of you?

Apology accepted, a misunderstanding of my post. I apologize too.

[steven100]

4 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

Thanks for the confirmation you've lost the plot. Do you have someone to "take care" of you?

[Hummin]

37 minutes ago, Andre0720 said:

Send me a postcard....

As long Bangkok Hospital is clean and up to date, Im ok. No need to go to Singapore

[steven100]

All the Thai people I have met couldn't care less whether you assimilate into their culture or not.

They don't care and I think the topic is stupid to ask.   Thai's care if their vegetables will sell at the market tomorrow or if Noi can take Ton out and get banged or if the cow has a calf.  

They have absolutely zero interest whether you like Thailand or not.  And that's the truth.    

[Sparktrader]

1 hour ago, Andre0720 said:

Well, just go visit Bangkok hospital here in Phuket.

You enter into a different world, that you never thought existed here.

Then you will understand why foreigners will not want to assimilate here, at least I would think so.

 

At Bangkok hospital:

Everything is clean, inside and outside.

No plastic, no papers, no garbage on the ground.

There are no ash trays, and no cigarette butts on the ground, none.

The people working there behave like people who went to school, college and Universities.

People greet you, people acknowledge your presence.

 

If Thailand was like that, if the plebeians in Thailand were like that, well then perhaps...

 

You want dirty unhygenic hospitals with rubbish on ground?

 

All hospitals are clean unless its some super poor nation.

[hotandsticky]

1 minute ago, steven100 said:

All the Thai people I have met couldn't care less whether you assimilate into their culture or not.

They don't care and I think the topic is stupid to ask.   Thai's care if their vegetables will sell at the market tomorrow or if Noi can take Ton out and get banged or if the cow has a calf.  

They have absolutely zero interest whether you like Thailand or not.  And that's the truth.    

 

I would agree with that, albeit a bit of a generalisation.

 

Anything outside a Thais line of vision is of no interest.

[Neeranam]

42 minutes ago, Andre0720 said:

Not even a way to determine the true feelings of the person initiating the Wai, as there is no sound, no intonation, which carries more meaning than two hands lifted towards someone's face.

It is mechanical, devoid of true feelings.

But it is part of the culture here.

There is a way, but in my experience takes many years to know. Basically, Thais practice indirect communication, whereas Farang countries practice direct. Practising indirect style actually has many benefits. However, you must learn to recognize the 13 different smiles, be more aware of the eyes and body language/posture. If a wai is done with awareness, it is a beautiful gesture. 

You are making a common mistake, thinking one culture is somehow 'better' than another. They are... different. 

[Neeranam]

2 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

I think it is also good for my son to see me being respectful of others, not just in Thailand, but elsewhere too...   Thats with handshakes, Wai’s and of course verbal manners. 

I have a friend that refuses to wai and assimilate, calling Thais *********s. 

Hos children are going to have mental issues, thinking hald of their being is not perfect. 

[London Lowf]

I don't feel assimilated to any part of the human race, let alone an alien (to me) culture with unfathomable (to me) beliefs and values.

[Hummin]

2 minutes ago, Sparktrader said:

You want dirty unhygenic hospitals with rubbish on ground?

 

All hospitals are clean unless its some super poor nation.

Im not especially happy with the local village hospital. Their rutines is not up to date same as most private hospitals is. Even the Petchabun private hospital have lack of routines when it comes to hygiene 

[Neeranam]

2 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

This brings my comments back full circle to assimilation...  Does a Child of mixed Thai / Foreign parentage fully assimilated ? does society consider them Thai or mixed ? and is it even important ?

 

Society considers them Thai, as they have Thai blood. 

Sometimes when Thais are confused when I show them my Thai ID(6'4" Scotsman) I tell them I am 'look kreung' and their attitude shifts immediately. 

[hotandsticky]

1 minute ago, Neeranam said:

I have a friend that refuses to wai and assimilate, calling Thais *********s. 

Hos children are going to have mental issues, thinking hald of their being is not perfect. 

 

We are getting to the extremes of actions - the above is clearly the wrong attitude, but - IMO - so is waiing 7-11 staff and bar girls. It is something that has huge significance in Thai culture and something that few Farangs can successfully accomplish.

[London Lowf]

1 minute ago, Neeranam said:

I have a friend that refuses to wai

I see Westerners wai'ng bargirls and restaurant staff and it makes me cringe - do you bow and shake hands with bar staff at home.

 

The only person I've ever wai'd was an immigration official who jumped me to the head of the queue - respect and gratitude.

[Hummin]

2 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

I think thats a good point - obviously situational. 

 

I have met some very senior (important) Thai’s, but didn’t worry too much about the Wai but knew its not as intricate as some make out...  just as you mentioned, thumbs to mouth, nose, bridge of nose or forehead...  unless it was a monk I’d always follow up with a hand-shake and eye contact. 

 

As Lacessit wrote: 'I am true to myself’... and I agree. If I am gong to make effort to do it the Thai way, I expect effort in return to greet my way... This is the facet of the mutual respect I expect.

 

 

I think it is also good for my son to see me being respectful of others, not just in Thailand, but elsewhere too...   Thats with handshakes, Wai’s and of course verbal manners. 

 

Part of this ‘assimilation discussion’ must also consider children of shared nationality. 

My Son is Thai and British - its astonishing how he switches, as do many of his peers. 

My Son attends well known international school in Bangkok with many children of various nationalities a lot of whom are mixed Thai and another nationality...  Its quite astonishing to see how they adapt to ‘cultural and social’ norms depending on the ‘audience’...

For example... The Thai Children or Thai / Another children will go up to my Wife and I and give us both a Wai... whereas if I am on my own (walking into school and to collect my son) they’ll just come up to me say high, have a quick conversation etc just like any (confident) Western child would. 

I do not like handshakes and never did. It have nothing to with covid just people do not clean their hands after toilet, picking their nose, scratching their bum, and more. 
 

If I was foing to choose, I would choose a gentle nod or wai. 
 

Indeed handshake with a thai, is like shaking a hand full of warm spagetti. 

[Hummin]

1 minute ago, London Lowf said:

I see Westerners wai'ng bargirls and restaurant staff and it makes me cringe - do you bow and shake hands with bar staff at home.

 

The only person I've ever wai'd was an immigration official who jumped me to the head of the queue - respect and gratitude.

Nothing wrong to wai people you have known for long time no regard what they are or what they do. I also do that with Thai friends, but regards people I see every day, I do not. 

[Non Immigrant]

1 minute ago, London Lowf said:

I see Westerners wai'ng bargirls and restaurant staff and it makes me cringe - do you bow and shake hands with bar staff at home.

 

The only person I've ever wai'd was an immigration official who jumped me to the head of the queue - respect and gratitude.

Agreed, I treat the bar girls as informally as they should be treated.

[Non Immigrant]

Just now, Hummin said:

Nothing wrong to wai people you have known for long time no regard what they are or what they do. I also do that with Thai friends, but regards people I see every day, I do not. 

It's a somewhat formal etiquette thing though, not for when you are down the boozer or bordello.

 

[richard_smith237]

37 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

I am making no assumptions, just applying a reductio ad absurdum to a somewhat fatuous post.

 

There are more ways to be polite with Thais than a wai, and I don't see why I should adopt the practice just because you say so.

I haven’t said you ‘should’...  I also agree that we can easily play the ‘farang card’ and get away with our social misgivings.

 

Speaking Thai is welcomed, although Thai’s understands and don’t mind if you don’t - the same can be said of the Wai... it is welcomed but not a unconditional requirement for foreigners as it is for Thai’s. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Lacessit]

14 minutes ago, Sparktrader said:

You want dirty unhygenic hospitals with rubbish on ground?

 

All hospitals are clean unless its some super poor nation.

Having spent 14 days in COVID quarantine in a provincial hospital, your second comment is blatantly wrong.

The ward had no cleaning staff. Test equipment was not sterilized between patients, who had to provide their own soap and bedding. No insect screening, mosquitoes and flies had free reign.

I am starting to wonder if you only open your mouth to change feet.

[Sparktrader]

Just now, Lacessit said:

Having spent 14 days in COVID quarantine in a provincial hospital, your second comment is blatantly wrong.

The ward had no cleaning staff. Test equipment was not sterilized between patients, who had to provide their own soap and bedding. No insect screening, mosquitoes and flies had free reign.

I am starting to wonder if you only open your mouth to change feet.

Where is this? Ive never seen a dirty hospital.

 

Unlike yourself I dont spend much time in hospitals. Tell me which ones are dirty.

[London Lowf]

Sparktrader is an occasionally amusing troll, nothing more - most on here surely know that and do not take his nonsense or opinions seriously.

 

[Sparktrader]

30 minutes ago, steven100 said:

All the Thai people I have met couldn't care less whether you assimilate into their culture or not.

They don't care and I think the topic is stupid to ask.   Thai's care if their vegetables will sell at the market tomorrow or if Noi can take Ton out and get banged or if the cow has a calf.  

They have absolutely zero interest whether you like Thailand or not.  And that's the truth.    

Human nature. People want money or fun. 

[Sparktrader]

1 minute ago, London Lowf said:

Sparktrader is an occasionally amusing troll, nothing more - most on here surely know that and do not take his nonsense or opinions seriously.

 

For posting my experiences? Ive never seen a dirty hospital.

[London Lowf]

Just now, Sparktrader said:

For posting my experiences? Ive never seen a dirty hospital.

I'm talking about the majority of your 9,700+ posts - see, trolling!

[Andre0720]

27 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

There is a way, but in my experience takes many years to know. Basically, Thais practice indirect communication, whereas Farang countries practice direct. Practising indirect style actually has many benefits. However, you must learn to recognize the 13 different smiles, be more aware of the eyes and body language/posture. If a wai is done with awareness, it is a beautiful gesture. 

You are making a common mistake, thinking one culture is somehow 'better' than another. They are... different. 

Well, I have seen what you refer to as a beautiful Wai gesture.

Visiting my doctor. The phone rang.

The doctor's voice changed, his voice tone changed, his movements changed.

When his conversation was finished, I told him: "You must have a lot of respect for that person that you were talking to. He replied yes, she is an woman doctor, much older, that he holds in high esteem".

So yes, one can see it, as I saw it one time in my 20 years here. One time.

 

Now regarding a common mistake, regarding cultures, as if they were equivalent.

Well, no, it is not so.

Afghanistan, Pakistan, Syria, Irak, Saudi Arabia, Somalia, Haiti, Nigeria, Cameroun, to name a few.

Oh yes that they are very different....

 

I still see a wai as a way to diminish the psyche of children, preventing them to deal equally with adults. Keeping their minds in a state of juvenile.

When I would talk to my son when he was an infant, I would kneel down so we we could talk on equal terms. Not so here...

[Lacessit]

2 minutes ago, Sparktrader said:

Where is this? Ive never seen a dirty hospital.

 

Unlike yourself I dont spend much time in hospitals. Tell me which ones are dirty.

You've never seen a dirty hospital, and you don't spend much time in hospitals. Perhaps you are incapable of perceiving how the two statements are contradictory.

 

Naming the hospital would be defamatory.

 

Of course you won't see dirt in the private hospitals. Affluent patients would desert them if there was.

When patients are paying 30 baht for treatment at a government hospital, it's not surprising standards are lower.

 

For someone who purports to know everything about Thailand, there does seem to be quite a few gaps in your knowledge base.

[Sparktrader]

1 minute ago, Lacessit said:

You've never seen a dirty hospital, and you don't spend much time in hospitals. Perhaps you are incapable of perceiving how the two statements are contradictory.

 

Naming the hospital would be defamatory.

 

Of course you won't see dirt in the private hospitals. Affluent patients would desert them if there was.

When patients are paying 30 baht for treatment at a government hospital, it's not surprising standards are lower.

 

For someone who purports to know everything about Thailand, there does seem to be quite a few gaps in your knowledge base.

Yeah Im not sick often so I dont go to many hospitals.

 

The hospitals I have been were good.

 

Everything? No. 

 

 

[Sparktrader]

15 minutes ago, London Lowf said:

I'm talking about the majority of your 9,700+ posts - see, trolling!

Posting experiences isnt trolling. You are the troll.