3 minutes ago, BigStar said:

Oh, my. They gotta stay in refugee camps and eat gov't-issued MRE? Can't check into hotels, eat & drink at restos, hit the bars, shop in the malls and the markets? No swimming & sunbathing?

 

Bring 'em on.

If they've been forced out of their country and don't intend to return they are still refugees.

55 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Not quite.

While I would accept that all Russians have some collective responsibility the military avoiders are more like refugees than tourists. Of course unless wealthy, they'll need to move on to other countries or even be forced to go home.

Also of course they vary in support of the war from gung ho Z fascists to fleeing activists. My feeling is that the majority are apolitical but surprise surprise the politics came to bite them. 

They come from a society where espousing your political views can land you in prison. I reckon very many Russians despise Putin and all that he stands for, but would never openly say so.

3 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

Perfect comments from behind the safety of a computer-screen.

 

What would you do if you were facing prison for being drafted into a war you disagreed with ???

 

You’d stand by your moralistic principles, refuse and publicly protest, right ???? 

 

You wouldn’t try and get out of the country to avoid jail and spending your ‘blood money’ elsewhere making a hypocrite of yourself, would you ??? 

When I was 19, I was called up for the Vietnam War. I was determined to go to gaol if I had to rather than go fight an unpopular and unjust war. Fortunately, the draft was cancelled before the moment came. Yes, I would stand by my "moralistic principles". Do you have any?

Just now, Andrew65 said:

They come from a society where espousing your political views can land you in prison. I reckon very many Russians despise Putin and all that he stands for, but would never openly say so.

The opposition is increasing, that's for sure. 

Funny that Iranian school girls are much more brave than Russian adults in protesting their regimes.

7 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Why?

I was living in Pattaya when they were there in large numbers and they didn't cause any problems that I was aware of.

Very true. You don't have to like them and most don't speak English or refuse to.

They often come with wife/family. Not the #1 target customers for bars/redlight.

They won't stand much in your way.

I guess the majority will still stick to Jomtien?

5 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

If they've been forced out of their country and don't intend to return they are still refugees.

Oh. Do they have special refugee visa stamps? Can their visas be like, extended, as if they're what you think of as real tourists?

 

I don't intend to return to my country either, BTW.???? Especially now. You might call me a long-term refugee.  

Edited November 22, 20223 yr by BigStar

7 minutes ago, BigStar said:

Oh. Do they have special refugee visa stamps? Can their visas be like, extended, as if they're what you think of as real tourists?

 

I don't intend to return to my country either, BTW.???? Especially now. You might call me a long-term refugee.  

You don't get it.

It's irrelevant how long they can stay in Thailand.

Unless they can buy an Elite Visa they are in transit here or they will go underground.

Mostly they're seeking ways they can financially survive out of Russia and/or searching for other countries where they can more permanently settle.

Some might bop around Asia for years hoping their country changes.

Sure they'll go to the beach and eat Pad Thai but the above concerns are not those of normal tourists.

You're right they are not official refugees like Ukrainians in Europe.

 

If you can return to your country without fear of arrest, mobilization, or being murdered, you aren't a refugee.

Edited November 22, 20223 yr by Jingthing

12 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

When I was 19, I was called up for the Vietnam War. I was determined to go to gaol if I had to rather than go fight an unpopular and unjust war. Fortunately, the draft was cancelled before the moment came. Yes, I would stand by my "moralistic principles". Do you have any?

Principled enough to know when and when not to be a hypocrite...  

 

You are pinning your example on a scenario that never came to fruition... “I would have...”    ... but you didn’t, so it doesn’t mean anything...  the comment is just ‘pie in the sky’...

 

You had the luxury of being in the US...  Russia is still very different.

 

Would YOU stand by your principles in Russia ?? protest ?? how would you avoid conscription into a war you completely disagree with in Russia ????   

 

Me ???... I’m not ashamed to say I’d get out of dodge...   I don’t blame the Russians who are coming to Thailand for doing so.

 

 

 

10 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

It's irrelevant how long they can stay in Thailand.

Oh, it's totally relevant, just as it is with you and me.

 

10 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

nless they can buy an Elite Visa they are in transit here or they will go underground.

Mostly they're seeking ways they can financially survive out of Russia and/or searching for other countries where they can more permanently settle.

Now you've merely resorted to hot air. Oh, maybe this, maybe not. Some do, some don't, yada yada. Anyone coming in on a tourist visa may or may not do the same. Finished with the "refugee" non-issue?

 

Edited November 22, 20223 yr by BigStar

2 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

Principled enough to know when and when not to be a hypocrite...  

 

You are pinning your example on a scenario that never came to fruition... “I would have...”    ... but you didn’t, so it doesn’t mean anything...  the comment is just ‘pie in the sky’...

 

You had the luxury of being in the US...  Russia is still very different.

 

Would YOU stand by your principles in Russia ?? protest ?? how would you avoid conscription into a war you completely disagree with in Russia ????   

 

Me ???... I’m not ashamed to say I’d get out of dodge...   I don’t blame the Russians who are coming to Thailand for doing so.

 

 

 

I don't blame the Russians for coming to Thailand either. Disgusting of you to claim I have no principles.

Edited November 22, 20223 yr by ozimoron

31 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Yeah but it's relevant to know what portion are refugees. Refugees aren't tourists. 

What if you turn on the logic? Why run away to Thailand when you can go to a neighboring country two or three times cheaper!

10 minutes ago, anyone said:

What if you turn on the logic? Why run away to Thailand when you can go to a neighboring country two or three times cheaper!

They might like Asia, the weather  and they can bop around.

Georgia and Turkey are not that cheap especially Tbilisi. Massive rent spikes because of Russians.

I don’t think the Stan's are cheaper than Thailand on a budget.

There are a limited number of countries Russians can fly into these days without a visa and Thailand is one of them. So Thailand is getting some Russian refugees.

Remember WW2? China and the Philippines got some Jewish refugees.

Edited November 22, 20223 yr by Jingthing

Baiiting post removed

Are Russians still challenged with credit card and ATM usage?

 

Or has that issue been sorted.

 

Is it easy to buy THB with Russian Rubbles?

 

 

39 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

I don't blame the Russians for coming to Thailand either. Disgusting of you to claim I have no principles.

Don’t play the victim... I haven’t accused you of not having principles... 

 

But, the example you used to ‘claim the moral high ground’ was not something which played out... you never did face conscription....   

 

 

1 hour ago, ozimoron said:

Yes, I would stand by my "moralistic principles". Do you have any?

And yet you get so butt hurt when your moral example is brought into question and think nothing of questioning someone else’s morals ??? [do you have any?]... hypocritical much ?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited November 22, 20223 yr by richard_smith237

7 hours ago, Lacessit said:

While I agree there are many Russians who don't want to become poorly trained cannon fodder, I am interested in how you know these young males are Russian.

We ask them in Elevator at my condo   , I said you do a runner and they smile , I’m sitting next to two 20 year olds In Starbucks at the moment they ran too 

Edited November 22, 20223 yr by TingTonger

17 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

You had no basis whatsoever for questioning my principles and it's a personal flame to do so.

Anyway...  Apologies if your feelings were hurt... 

 

I’ll make no further response to your comments in this thread as you seem to interpret everything as a personal attack and lack the emotional tools to discuss without getting upset or offended.

 

All the best.. 

1 hour ago, richard_smith237 said:

Principled enough to know when and when not to be a hypocrite...  

 

You are pinning your example on a scenario that never came to fruition... “I would have...”    ... but you didn’t, so it doesn’t mean anything...  the comment is just ‘pie in the sky’...

 

You had the luxury of being in the US...  Russia is still very different.

 

Would YOU stand by your principles in Russia ?? protest ?? how would you avoid conscription into a war you completely disagree with in Russia ????   

 

Me ???... I’m not ashamed to say I’d get out of dodge...   I don’t blame the Russians who are coming to Thailand for doing so.

 

 

 

If you are unfortunately from a country who invades another country and you disagree with it but are conscripted, you don't have to kill, murder or rape anyone,  what would stop you from shooting to miss instead of shooting to kill and keeping away from women?

Just now, NoshowJones said:

If you are unfortunately from a country who invades another country and you disagree with it but are conscripted, you don't have to kill, murder or rape anyone,  what would stop you from shooting to miss instead of shooting to kill and keeping away from women?

You might be firing artillery that isn't aimed by yourself. You might also wind up with a bullet in the back of the head.

2 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

You might be firing artillery that isn't aimed by yourself. You might also wind up with a bullet in the back of the head.

True, but that may be the chance you have to take when you are in combat.

25 minutes ago, TingTonger said:

We ask them in Elevator at my condo   , I said you do a runner and they smile

Same as Thais do when they don't understand English. Fancy that.

1 hour ago, richard_smith237 said:

Perfect comments from behind the safety of a computer-screen.

 

What would you do if you were facing prison for being drafted into a war you disagreed with ???

 

You’d stand by your moralistic principles, refuse and publicly protest, right ???? 

 

You wouldn’t try and get out of the country to avoid jail and spending your ‘blood money’ elsewhere making a hypocrite of yourself, would you ??? 

Plenty of examples of support for the war from Russians living outside and also from the comfort of their keyboards

The hypocrites are Russians who hate the west so much but love to live here rather than their <deleted>hole of a country.

Escaping a draft is not a rejection of the war.

This war is only comparable to Nazi Germany's ww2 exploits and ISIS brutality, any civilized human should be ashamed to be linked to a society capable of such evil

22 minutes ago, NoshowJones said:

If ever you have seen 4 indians with a straw each drinking from on glass of beer.

No one's ever seen any. Just one of those bigoted forum myths we love so much.

11 minutes ago, NoshowJones said:

If you are unfortunately from a country who invades another country and you disagree with it but are conscripted, you don't have to kill, murder or rape anyone,  what would stop you from shooting to miss instead of shooting to kill and keeping away from women?

I am extremely lucky that I don’t have to face that situation. 

 

What would I, could I do... I don’t know... I suspect if we are 100% honest with ourselves none of us know exactly what we’d do in many such situations until we are faced with that very situation. 

 

I would like to think I could protest against my government....  in the UK we have that luxury, in Russia such actions come with serious consequences. 

 

So... playing the ‘what if’ game....   I wonder if I’d do a runner just as some of the Russians have... or would I be conscripted and ‘shoot to miss’... another possibility...

 

But do we really know what we would do ???  I don’t think so...  and I wouldn’t want to claim any false morality with ‘what I would do’ BS from behind a keyboard...  

 

All I can say is that I understand the Russians who have escaped and come to Thailand and condemn those who still support the actions of their government. 

5 hours ago, Lacessit said:

I don't think I would want to get close enough to complete strangers with my phone, to hear and translate what they are saying.

M3 earphones - they instantly translate ( including Thai) 

4 hours ago, tomyami said:

A Russian avoiding the draft is still a supporter of the brutal war they should not be allowed fun in the sun while there country is killing, torturing and raping civilians in neighboring Ukraine.

Shame Thailand accepts this blood money.

There are many orcs around they have being packing middle eastern flights to here for months

 

 

Definitely this. Russia and Russians in general have shown their true colours. It might not be all of them who are horrid Putin supporting little nazis but it is a fair percentage

Ban ALL Russians from Thailand! They started the war and only Russians can kick out Putin. Don't allow them to escape their country; they have to stop Putin!
But as we all know, money is No 1 in Thailand and all the rest is just not important.

7 hours ago, mackayae said:

Most are Putin supporters.

Correct.

29 minutes ago, JulesMad said:

Ban ALL Russians from Thailand! They started the war and only Russians can kick out Putin. Don't allow them to escape their country; they have to stop Putin!
But as we all know, money is No 1 in Thailand and all the rest is just not important.

Fully agree!

4 hours ago, NoshowJones said:

If you are unfortunately from a country who invades another country and you disagree with it but are conscripted, you don't have to kill, murder or rape anyone,  what would stop you from shooting to miss instead of shooting to kill and keeping away from women?

maybe the Chechen mercenary officer behind you with the AK47?