Divorce and runaway kids

[2008bangkok]

16 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

You're in a tough spot and there are clearly posters who enjoy 'triggering' others who are in a tough spot. 

 

If you don't agree with another poster, be a little thicker skinned and ignore their post - they'll consume your energy and build your frustrations - thats something you really do not need at the moment. 

 

 

There was mention of drink...  do you drink a lot? every day? - honest question.

Could you be getting frustrated more easily because you have been drinking the evening before ?

 

Also try to look inwards - are there any changes you can make ?... its not all about discipline, it's about being a roll model, sometimes the calm approach is the right appraach instead of allowing things to blow up. 

 

 

 

I will anwser both posts,

 

Cheers for the advice, yes visa is not an issue or shouldn't be as I'm waiting for it now while still under consideration so any day now.

Yes maybe I should hold back for a while, I just worry, if I didn't care id be like sod it I got my visa let him do what he wants and come back when he wants.

 

I like to sit on my patio,. listening to music and have a beer yes but it's not everyday, been 2 weeks now since I did that, I never go out as IV always had kids to take care of till recently.

I don't know what to change, I'm sure there are things, I'm a good dad, take care of them well, buy them what they want when they want it, take them out.

But in return I'm also old skool and expect them to clean there bedroom, clean there bathroom, do the dishes, clothes etc, none of this they have to do at them.mums as she lives in a studio not even 1 bedroom.

 

So yeah what's easier stay at Daddys and have to do chores and he moans if not or stay at Mummys where she does everything and they can just lie on there <deleted> all night on phones watching YouTube or playing games.

[OneMoreFarang]

I try to remember the time when I was 15.

My mother allowed A and my father wanted B. What did I choose? Obviously the option which I wanted.

My parents were married and not divorced, but I am sure even if they would have been divorced and I would have done what I wanted, and with what I get away with, and not just obey what one of them told me to do.

 

In my case my father never wanted to give advice to me. If I asked him something he wanted that I do what he told me to do. I would have liked advice and make my own decision, but when I did that, he asked/accused me "why did you ask me and then do it differently?"

 

Personally, I think it would be best for your son, and also your daughter, if you support them, try to influence them to be good at school, maybe go to university or learn a suitable job, etc. Also try to keep them away from drugs and other bad influences.

Will you be able to do that by dictating to your son what he should do? I have my doubts. Will he follow your advice when he sees that you try to support him? Not sure, but that is still a lot more likely than the "I tell you what you have to do" option.

 

And about you not speaking Thai after 15 years in Thailand: Why not? Didn't you think it would be a good idea that you can communicate with the Thai people around your children, their friends, teachers, other parents? Will your children bring friends home and tell them: this is my dad, he lives here since I was born, but he doesn't understand you... 

[richard_smith237]

11 minutes ago, 2008bangkok said:

I don't know what to change, I'm sure there are things, I'm a good dad, take care of them well, buy them what they want when they want it, take them out.

But in return I'm also old skool and expect them to clean there bedroom, clean there bathroom, do the dishes, clothes etc, none of this they have to do at them.mums as she lives in a studio not even 1 bedroom.

Making your kids do their own laundry is excessive. 

Doing the dishes... fair enough... instead of getting them to do the dishes, get them to help you doing the dishes. 

Keeping their bedroom clean - how clean. Food and litter free, fair enough, but getting angry about a poorly made bed, or a few clothes lying around may be excessive - they're teens remember. 

 

As I mentioned - take a step back a little.. You may be 'old skool' but we're not in an 'old skool' world anymore.

 

[2008bangkok]

23 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

I try to remember the time when I was 15.

My mother allowed A and my father wanted B. What did I choose? Obviously the option which I wanted.

My parents were married and not divorced, but I am sure even if they would have been divorced and I would have done what I wanted, and with what I get away with, and not just obey what one of them told me to do.

 

In my case my father never wanted to give advice to me. If I asked him something he wanted that I do what he told me to do. I would have liked advice and make my own decision, but when I did that, he asked/accused me "why did you ask me and then do it differently?"

 

Personally, I think it would be best for your son, and also your daughter, if you support them, try to influence them to be good at school, maybe go to university or learn a suitable job, etc. Also try to keep them away from drugs and other bad influences.

Will you be able to do that by dictating to your son what he should do? I have my doubts. Will he follow your advice when he sees that you try to support him? Not sure, but that is still a lot more likely than the "I tell you what you have to do" option.

 

And about you not speaking Thai after 15 years in Thailand: Why not? Didn't you think it would be a good idea that you can communicate with the Thai people around your children, their friends, teachers, other parents? Will your children bring friends home and tell them: this is my dad, he lives here since I was born, but he doesn't understand you... 

I hear what you saying however you seem to be missing the point.

Although he wants to live with his mum, legally it's not up to him, it's not up to his mum, it's up to me.

His mum gave up her parental responsibilities to him the day she signed the divorce papers as did I with my daughter, so she has no more rights to keep him than say you would.

I give him advice on day to day stuff but I don't force anything on this apart from where he needs to live.

After all let me as you this if your 14 year old boy decided he wanted to go and live on the farm with say his Uncle and not you, would you be OK with this?

[2008bangkok]

18 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

Making your kids do their own laundry is excessive. 

Doing the dishes... fair enough... instead of getting them to do the dishes, get them to help you doing the dishes. 

Keeping their bedroom clean - how clean. Food and litter free, fair enough, but getting angry about a poorly made bed, or a few clothes lying around may be excessive - they're teens remember. 

 

As I mentioned - take a step back a little.. You may be 'old skool' but we're not in an 'old skool' world anymore.

 

Excessive, taking your washing out the basket walking 10.meters, pressing 2 buttons then an hour later hanging them out, at 1 month short of 15 years old!!

Sorry, I appreciate and listening to your advice but I don't agree with that.

When I say tidy your room, I mean i let it slide until it literally becomes and with no exagerationa tip, I have attached example where my tolerance levels snaps.

[OneMoreFarang]

15 minutes ago, 2008bangkok said:

I hear what you saying however you seem to be missing the point.

Although he wants to live with his mum, legally it's not up to him, it's not up to his mum, it's up to me.

His mum gave up her parental responsibilities to him the day she signed the divorce papers as did I with my daughter, so she has no more rights to keep him than say you would.

I give him advice on day to day stuff but I don't force anything on this apart from where he needs to live.

After all let me as you this if your 14 year old boy decided he wanted to go and live on the farm with say his Uncle and not you, would you be OK with this?

I understand this is a difficult situation for you.

One thing I am pretty sure about: Your son won't care at all about the legal situation. He will do what he wants to do and what he gets away with.

If he would stay together with i.e. drug addicts or criminals then I understand that you would do anything to get him away from those bad influence.

If you force him to not see his mother, then I am pretty sure he won't understand that. And no argument "I only do this for your future" will convince him.

So the question is: Do you want to be legally right and alienate your son? Or do you want to try to make the best out of the situation?

I am pretty sure you won't be able to force your son to accept what you want and/or the legal situation. 

[2008bangkok]

5 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

I understand this is a difficult situation for you.

One thing I am pretty sure about: Your son won't care at all about the legal situation. He will do what he wants to do and what he gets away with.

If he would stay together with i.e. drug addicts or criminals then I understand that you would do anything to get him away from those bad influence.

If you force him to not see his mother, then I am pretty sure he won't understand that. And no argument "I only do this for your future" will convince him.

So the question is: Do you want to be legally right and alienate your son? Or do you want to try to make the best out of the situation?

I am pretty sure you won't be able to force your son to accept what you want and/or the legal situation. 

I hear ya again,

You know unfortunately I hate to say this but it also comes down to a Farang v Thai mentality.

Let's just say I go "you know what sod it, I give up, stay with your mother" then I believe I'm letting him down because he doesn't know the opportunity he has with me, mould him into a good man, decent morals, etc, at the moment he is a sheep, he is nearly 6ft 85kg yet wouldn't say boo to a goose, even my daughter bullies him for his money, only a dad can bring that confidence out of him, show him who he is, show him his potential as a man.

with his mother who is from the village (and nothing wrong with that) but she doesn't have any of that, can I eat, can I sleep that's it, I gave up trying to have any news related conversations with her years and years ago, so then that's his life then and I can see this as plain as I can see my hands.

But maybe I should stop fighting and wait until it's to late and hope that at some point when he is older he comes to me and says sorry Daddy I was wrong, which will never ever happen because by that time he will have a full blown Thai mentality

[FritsSikkink]

12 minutes ago, 2008bangkok said:

he doesn't know the opportunity he has with me, mould him into a good man, decent morals, etc, at the moment he is a sheep, he is nearly 6ft 85kg yet wouldn't say boo to a goose, even my daughter bullies him for his money, only a dad can bring that confidence out of him, show him who he is, show him his potential as a man.

 

Looks like it didn't work for the first 14 years.

Saying that woman can't do this is ridiculous.

Edited June 30, 2023 by FritsSikkink

[2008bangkok]

2 minutes ago, FritsSikkink said:

Looks like it didn't work for the first 14 years.

Your just a breath of fresh air you are

[FritsSikkink]

1 hour ago, 2008bangkok said:

Your just a breath of fresh air you are

Every child is different, there is no one shoe fits all parenting same as managing people at work. Different kids need a different approach. Some kids fair well with commands others needs another approach:

There are different types of leadership styles, including:

 

• Transformational Leadership: Inspires employees and motivates them towards achieving their collective goal.
• Autocratic Leadership: Leader makes decisions without input from others.
• Participative (Democratic) Leadership: Leader involves employees in decision-making.
• Transactional Leadership: Leader rewards or punishes employees based on their performance.
• Delegative Leadership: Leader delegates decision-making to employees.
• Bureaucratic Leadership: Leader follows rules and procedures strictly.
• Servant Leadership: Leader focuses on the needs of employees.
• Coaching Leadership: Leader helps employees develop their skills and abilities.

[richard_smith237]

45 minutes ago, 2008bangkok said:

Excessive, taking your washing out the basket walking 10.meters, pressing 2 buttons then an hour later hanging them out, at 1 month short of 15 years old!!

Sorry, I appreciate and listening to your advice but I don't agree with that.

When I say tidy your room, I mean i let it slide until it literally becomes and with no exagerationa tip, I have attached example where my tolerance levels snaps.

That is a tip....  but he's a teen.

At that age my room was probably just as bad, however, I conveniently remember I was a perfect teenager, in reality I probably pushed every button my parents had !!....   

 

You have bigger issues to fight than a tidy room - prioritise.... Do you care that his room is tidy, or do you care he's with you so you can assist with his education and personal growth?... you may not be able to force all of your adult ideals on his teenage mind. 

 

As far as washing goes...  just let that one slide.... expecting a kid to do their own washing is excessive. 

 

At that age I'm sure I'd push back too...  

 

His parents have separated...  your job at the moment is surely just to be there for him.

 

You have a choice to make....  calm down, take it easier, let a lot of stuff slide (every parent has to do that for teens)...  Or risk alienating him. 

 

It currently seems as thought its 'your-way or the highway'... at the moment he's taking the highway...  You can't control a 14 (15) year old, you can only guide them. 

 

Both your son and you have a lot of adapting to do, that takes flexibility on your part, the flexibility on his part is purely up to him.

 

IF your response is that you have already been flexible enough, that would not seem the case if he is taking the 'easy option' to just run off to Mums..... it's a very difficult situation, and one your ex isn't helping - thats out of your control. 

 

Just be there ready for when he wants to come back and take it easy.

 

 

 

 

 

[Goat]

2 hours ago, marin said:

Are you always this frazzled? What is a short temple school? And what are you on about kindergarten?  This is age 3-5 or 6 in Thailand. Then there are 6 levels of Pratom or Primary, that she should finish at 12 or 13. Then she begins Mattayom or  Secondary school until 18 or so.  You dont even seem to know how schools here work. Not much more to say other than I am glad I am not in your shoes. Try to respect your wife a bit, you once did as you chose to marry her, always remember she is the mother of your kids and they need her love as well.

Might thought exactly.

 

The OP believes he is smart but after two decades of living here he can not speak or read Thai. 

Being effectively illiterate and mute, which despite what he thinks he knows, he actually doesnt know much at all.

 

I assume that his wife must be able to speak English, despite her not living in England, but the OP constantly makes references to her being stupid. I think she might be a bit smarter than him and certainly knows what is going on around her.

 

It also occurs to me that he wants his son to get a good paying job and he will be teaching him how to obtain that. If my father could not speak English i cant see how he could have assisted me growing up.

 

Finally, the other three members of the family seem to get along well, so who is really the problem?

 

[BritManToo]

2 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

He made a semi-valid point....  Your visa is tied to your kids being 'your kids' and having legal custody rights. You still have that, so it's not a concern at the moment unless the mother decides to fight for sole custody, which is always a possibility. I imagine this lingering in the back of your mind adds a significant amount of stress. 

Not all that sure about that,

When you get a married extension the paperwork isn't enough, they want to see her at immigration and in the home (and they generally ask her if she's happy in the marriage). As far as I can see the same rules will apply to a dependents extension, dependent will need to be present in the home, and they will ask him if he's happy living with dad.

 

But I could be totally wrong, so OP should call immigration and ask if his dependent extension is still valid when his dependent son has run away from home. That would be better than immigration finding out later and ruling him as being on overstay since the boy moved out.

[2008bangkok]

6 minutes ago, Goat said:

Might thought exactly.

 

The OP believes he is smart but after two decades of living here he can not speak or read Thai. 

Being effectively illiterate and mute, which despite what he thinks he knows, he actually doesnt know much at all.

 

I assume that his wife must be able to speak English, despite her not living in England, but the OP constantly makes references to her being stupid. I think she might be a bit smarter than him and certainly knows what is going on around her.

 

It also occurs to me that he wants his son to get a good paying job and he will be teaching him how to obtain that. If my father could not speak English i cant see how he could have assisted me growing up.

 

Finally, the other three members of the family seem to get along well, so who is really the problem?

 

Let me tell you this smarty.

I didn't learn Thai because I wanted the whole family to speak English as they will get there results when it comes to work.

As a result of always speaking English to my kids since birth, if you met them and was speaking Englishyou would be gob smacked to even think that there mother tongue is Thai, not even a hint of tinglish or Thai accent in there English, just pure natural English like I speak, all while being brought up in the Thai education system not private.

So that my friend is why I decided not to learn proper Thai, just get by

[Lacessit]

IME forcing a kid to do what they don't want to do is a waste of time and effort. The father presumably sets boundaries, the mother doesn't. Not hard to guess which mode of living is preferred.

Perhaps a carrot and stick approach may work, for both child and mother.

The best any father can do is be a role model. If the son of the OP does not want to follow up, the father is not to blame if things go pear-shaped.

Bear in mind every son rebels in their teens, maybe he will grow up.

[2008bangkok]

11 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Not all that sure about that,

When you get a married extension the paperwork isn't enough, they want to see her at immigration and in the home (and they generally ask her if she's happy in the marriage). As far as I can see the same rules will apply to a dependents extension, dependent will need to be present in the home, and they will ask him if he's happy living with dad.

 

But I could be totally wrong, so OP should call immigration and ask if his dependent extension is still valid when his dependent son has run away from home. That would be better than immigration finding out later and ruling him as being on overstay since the boy moved out.

I have done all that, I'm 3 days away from getting the actual passport back after the 30 day consideration 

[marin]

You have anger issues. You have lashed out at several posters on here for simply questioning or offering advice you dont like. Its also quite clear you have some disdain for the Thai's, their language and culture. Your son sees this for sure. Remember he is half Thai. As for your not learning Thai that you would have to admit is your problem. Your wife and kids are bilingual and you are not. Think about this. We all have frustrating times here. Please remember you live in Thailand their mothers home, not back in your home country.

 

You cant force love from a child. I hope you realize this. 

[2008bangkok]

8 minutes ago, marin said:

You have anger issues. You have lashed out at several posters on here for simply questioning or offering advice you dont like. Its also quite clear you have some disdain for the Thai's, their language and culture. Your son sees this for sure. Remember he is half Thai. As for your not learning Thai that you would have to admit is your problem. Your wife and kids are bilingual and you are not. Think about this. We all have frustrating times here. Please remember you live in Thailand their mothers home, not back in your home country.

 

You cant force love from a child. I hope you realize this. 

I don't have anger issues, I take offence to people critizing my integrity as Dad  instead of just responding to the actual post I wrote.

So far the only 2 people have actually given me any advice after like 3 pages is Kingkenny and Richard, everyone else just like "leave the 14 year old to do what he wants"

No I ain't gonna leave him to do what he wants, it is my way and that's it, no other way.

And also as IV stated 2 weeks ago he was fine, so stupid comments like you cannot force love is just irrisponsible posting 

Edited June 30, 2023 by 2008bangkok

[OneMoreFarang]

52 minutes ago, FritsSikkink said:

Saying that woman can't do this is ridiculous.

No!

Mothers and females have a parental role, and fathers and males have another parental role.

That's psychology 101. Denying that fact is ridiculous. 

[onthedarkside]

Reported inflammatory post and replies to it have been removed

[DrJack54]

6 hours ago, 2008bangkok said:

I firmly believe it's in his best interests in the long term at 14 to be with his Dad.

Selected just this one sentence.

Could have selected any as you seem to have no idea.

Your son would be better off with the mother and family assuming she is a loving caring mother.

 

 

[2008bangkok]

8 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

No!

Mothers and females have a parental role, and fathers and males have another parental role.

That's psychology 101. Denying that fact is ridiculous. 

Exactly, I wouldn't expect to understand what my daughter going through lady wise at 13, not my job either

[2008bangkok]

2 minutes ago, DrJack54 said:

Selected just this one sentence.

Could have selected any as you seem to have no idea.

Your son would be better off with the mother and family assuming she is a loving caring mother.

 

 

So why is it that if it got to the point of child court as you couldn't agree, the judge would always recommend the daughter stays with the mother and son stays with the father.

That well documented

[OneMoreFarang]

12 minutes ago, 2008bangkok said:

No I ain't gonna leave him to do what he wants, it is my way and that's it, no other way.

And why do you bring this topic up here for discussion?

Did you hope that lots of members will tell you: Force your son to do what you want. 

 

I would bet that "it is my way and that's it, no other way" is a sure way to make the situation worse. And if one day, maybe in a few years, you think about what you did wrong, then maybe remember this discussion.

[Goat]

35 minutes ago, 2008bangkok said:

Let me tell you this smarty.

I didn't learn Thai because I wanted the whole family to speak English as they will get there results when it comes to work.

As a result of always speaking English to my kids since birth, if you met them and was speaking Englishyou would be gob smacked to even think that there mother tongue is Thai, not even a hint of tinglish or Thai accent in there English, just pure natural English like I speak, all while being brought up in the Thai education system not private.

So that my friend is why I decided not to learn proper Thai, just get by

Well that is an interesting excuse.

I am sure most will agree that if the father can speak the local lingo he will be more aware of education requirements, can speak with his childrens teachers, not rely on others for simple day to day tasks like telling delivery men how to get to the house, etc etc.

 

Nothing to stop you from refraining from using Thai with your children. 

 

Most jobs in Thailand dont use English anyway.

[Goat]

19 minutes ago, 2008bangkok said:

So far the only 2 people have actually given me any advice after like 3 pages is Kingkenny and Richard, everyone else just like "leave the 14 year old to do what he wants"

No i am suggesting you improve yourself so you can help your son.

 

Good luck.

[2008bangkok]

4 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

And why do you bring this topic up here for discussion?

Did you hope that lots of members will tell you: Force your son to do what you want. 

 

I would bet that "it is my way and that's it, no other way" is a sure way to make the situation worse. And if one day, maybe in a few years, you think about what you did wrong, then maybe remember this discussion.

I stupidly throughout I could get some advice off people who have been In similar situations, but that would be to easy, so I got to dust off the battle armour 

[2008bangkok]

6 minutes ago, Goat said:

Well that is an interesting excuse.

I am sure most will agree that if the father can speak the local lingo he will be more aware of education requirements, can speak with his childrens teachers, not rely on others for simple day to day tasks like telling delivery men how to get to the house, etc etc.

 

Nothing to stop you from refraining from using Thai with your children. 

 

Most jobs in Thailand dont use English anyway.

But the ones that do my kids will get 5x because it's automatic assumed they ain't thick as 

[DrJack54]

18 minutes ago, 2008bangkok said:

So why is it that if it got to the point of child court as you couldn't agree, the judge would always recommend the daughter stays with the mother and son stays with the father.

That well documented

16 years old. 

He will do his own thing soon enough and in meantime you are on fast tract to lose contact with both kids. 

 

The judge was a fool to approve/order the siblings to be separated.

Ludicrous. 

More likely a bad idea from someone else. 

Edited June 30, 2023 by DrJack54

[Bday Prang]

37 minutes ago, 2008bangkok said:

Let me tell you this smarty.

I didn't learn Thai because I wanted the whole family to speak English as they will get there results when it comes to work.

As a result of always speaking English to my kids since birth, if you met them and was speaking Englishyou would be gob smacked to even think that there mother tongue is Thai, not even a hint of tinglish or Thai accent in there English, just pure natural English like I speak, all while being brought up in the Thai education system not private.

So that my friend is why I decided not to learn proper Thai, just get by

           Poorest excuse for not learning Thai that I have heard for a long time, Good job their mother taught them Thai , and now they share a common bond that you can never be a part of. they can also bad mouth you without you knowing, and don't for a second think that they don;t

            Anyway the kid in question sounds like a typical Thai kid, a mummys boy who will never be able to cut the apron strings that bind him to his mother, and very likely that he's playing the pair of you 

              Speaking english might improve his chances of a job but its not guaranteed, a lot of jobs require some  intelligence, of which language is not an indicator, plenty of retards in the uk and every one of them can speak english