Questions about divorce in Thailand (married abroad)

[TPDH]

Hi

 

Me (Scandinavian) and my wife (Thai) is getting a divorce. We lived in the USA for a few years and got married there but now we both live in Thailand where our marriage has been registered since a few years back. We have no kids or properties. The only assets we have is savings and stock investments but those have always been kept completely separate. Though almost all of those assets were acquired during our marriage. The plan is not to split or share any of our assets. Got a few questions about this: 

 

1. Do we need a lawyer to get divorced? Or do we just go to the amphur with one witness each? 

2. When we go to the amphur and sign the documents they give us, does that mean that we do not split any assets and we both keep what we own? I'm worried that I'll sign something that gives her right to any of my assets. 

3. I'm about to start a new business and make some new investments. After the divorce is done, I guess I'm safe that she would not be entitled to any interest in that? 

4. Anything else to think about or any other advice about this? It's my first time getting a divorce (and hopefully last :). 

 

Abroad

5. I'm not a US citizen or green card holder etc. and neither is my wife. Is there any point in somehow registering the divorce in the US? 

6. The marriage is not registered in my home country in Scandinavia and I haven't lived there for many years. I guess there's nothing I need to do there in regards to the divorce? 

7. Will this Thai divorce and its documents be recognized in most other countries as a valid divorce? 

 

Thank you. 

Edited November 9, 2023 by TPDH

[Stevemercer]

As you no doubt know, under Thai law your spouse is entitled to 50% of income and assets gained during the period of the marriage. However, unlike Western countries, you don't need a formal financial agreement to be registered detailed the agreed split before a divorce is granted.

 

So the key question is whether your spouse understands and has agreed to your proposed financial settlement? If she is 100% with you, then you can go and get the Thai divorce. If she is waivering, or doesn't understand the financial implications, you might need to consult a lawyer to avoid problems.

 

Most westerners end up keeping their key assets by waiting until the wife is desparate for a divorce (e.g. she wants to marry somebody else or is worried about her own assets (e.g. family land/house) being at risk). They might offer a modest cash settlement which the wife will grab because she wants money now, and doesn't think about the future.

 

Once you have the divorce papers, that is generally it. However, if really aggrieved, your wife could engage a lawyer to seek a just financial setlement. This would be a civil case (e.g. she is 'suing' you) and the case would drag on and on with the most likely outcome being a negotiated settlement where you would give her more money.

 

You could avoid this scenario by leaving Thailand.

 

However, I assume yo want to stay in the country. So the best course is to offer up a reasonable cash settlement to your wife and go down to the local office to finalise the divorce. 

 

I don't know how you would complete the divorce in the USA, but the first step is to divorce in Thailand. I'm assuming your wife doesn't have the knowledge, contacts or ability to try and pursue a financial settlement in the States. In any case, this would be confounded (e.g. would not go anywhere) if you are already legally divorced in Thailand.

[kingstonkid]

2 minutes ago, Stevemercer said:

As you no doubt know, under Thai law your spouse is entitled to 50% of income and assets gained during the period of the marriage. However, unlike Western countries, you don't need a formal financial agreement to be registered detailed the agreed split before a divorce is granted.

 

I don't know how you would complete the divorce in the USA, but the first step is to divorce in Thailand. I'm assuming your wife doesn't have the knowledge, contacts or ability to try and pursue a financial settlement in the States. In any case, this would be confounded (e.g. would not go anywhere) if you are already legally divorced in Thailand.

Never as u me that a Thai lady does not know the rules.  She may not but I am wiling to bet she has a freidn that does or knows where to get the info.

[Iamloki]

I am no expert, and can only comment on my own experience. When I divorced my Thai wife, I wrote the separation agreement, that then became our divorce agreement. I went room by room listing who gets what. I talked about the bank accounts and who gets what. I kept it fair, while protecting myself. I offered x amount money per month for a year, and the option to take less per month in exchange for me paying for her kid's education. (The payment parts was done verbally and not specified in the document). We both signed the document and went to the amphur with my translator/witness. I don't remember there being a second witness, but one of the office staff may have served that purpose.

 

Anyway, with a signed agreement, the process was quick and easy. True, she could have been a pain and made things hard... but it wasn't in her best interest do so so.

[TPDH]

Do we need to bring any agreement or document to the amphur? What if we just go to the amphur and sign the documents they have there about divorce? Does that mean there's no splitting of assets and we both keep what we have? 

[ignore it]

Re your query: I don't know.

But I did marry and divorce two broads.

[scorecard]

Good question. And I would wonder what legal knowledge the folks at the amphur office have and whether they are qualified / authorized to mke comments about any setlement terms.

 

Why? A buddys Thai son decided to write his will. He did some research and wrote his will which bequeathed most of his assets to his Thai wife.

 

They took the will to the Amphur office to be registered (they had been told this was required by Thai law). The Amphur officer said the will was not acceptable by Thai law because he must leave 100,000Baht to his wife's mother.

 

Young man consulted a qualified lawyer who said there is no such law and the lawyer accompanied them bck to the amphur office.

 

Lawyer asked the amphur officer to show proof that "...he must leave 100,000Baht to his wife's mother".  She just insisted "this is Thai law". Further discussion revealed that the amphur lady had no legal qualification nor training in the law.

 

Lawyer insisted it was not Thai law and insisted on speaking to the snr. officer at the amphur. Lawyer then insisted that the snr officer prove that it's Thai law.

 

Snr. officer spoke privately to the lady officer involved the said to the Thai man "But she's just trying to help you". Lawyer again insisted "it's not the law".

 

Officer then said "Yes I know it's not the law but I think it's nice idea." LAyer then directed a comment at the Snr. Officer (manager) saying "Your staff are making illegal coments to the local public". 

 

Lawyer also asked why the officer was telling people that 'Thai wills have to be registered at the amphur office'. Again "well I think it's a good idea."

 

Lawyer spoke further to the snr. officer (manager)and said he would request that the Thai law council do an 'audit' of processes etc., at that amphur office.

 

Snr amphur officer (manager) panicked and said he would investgate the subject and he apparently did, and he set rules prohibiting amphur staff from making their own rules etc.

 

Hence my comment that any comments on the divorce settlement by the amphur staff should be confirmed by a credible lawyer.  

[Paradise Pete]

If you're not filing a US tax return and have no US assets there's little point to registering the divorce unless/until you plan to marry someone else.

You may or may not find it useful in the future to explain to someone who is pressing you for marriage that you can't because you're still technically married in the US....

Edited November 10, 2023 by Paradise Pete

[4MyEgo]

On 11/9/2023 at 2:39 PM, TPDH said:

1. Do we need a lawyer to get divorced?

 

In my opinion, it's always worth a few $'s to seek out legal advice, know what it's going to cost you, (shop around), then have agreements made, signed, witnessed and sealed by the court (western way), not sure about Thailand, but when in an area your not sure of, you don't want her coming at you down the track.

 

When I separated with my X (westerner), we were on good terms, and didn't see any reason to get divorced, we sold our house, split the money 50/50 and kept our own superannuation accounts. We had a child who was 18 months old and agreed to share care, week on, week off.

 

Everything was fine until one day I was speaking to a guy who said, W-T-F- you NEED to get a lawyer asap, otherwise she can come after you a decade down the track, that said, I saw a lawyer who said I was lucky that I didn't leave it any longer, he drafted documents stating what transpired and what we agreed to, the X then sort legal advice, and then my lawyer received a letter saying that my X didn't agree to it but was forced into it and was seeking a further 20%.

 

I then approached my X and asked her, what's going on, and she said that she was listening to her lawyer, and added that everything was fine until I went to see a lawyer, and I explained to her again that before she got the letter, that I was seeing a lawyer because it was best that everything was documented and signed off by the court so that we wouldn't have any issues in the future and she said, she was ok with it, but changed her tune after she saw a lawyer. 

 

She said that her lawyer said that she was entitled to more, I then said, if you want more, I will give you more, but that is not what we agreed upon, and if it is more that you want, then be prepared to lose at least $160,000 in lawyers fees and 2 years going through the courts, if you don't believe me ask your lawyer how much it will cost you if I contest her extra 20%, and then see if the math works in her favour, because I WILL go to court just on principal and burn $160,000 and make sure she gets nothing more as I would shift my monies.

 

I received a call from her a couple of days later saying that she signed the documents to what we agreed on previously and her lawyer signed a waiver stating that she advised her client that she considered the agreement was not in her clients best interest, the court however signed off on it.

 

Get legal advice at the very least, then if you require representation, you will know what it will cost you.

 

 

Edited November 10, 2023 by 4MyEgo

[MangoKorat]

From a man who's been divorced in Thailand more times than he cares to mention

 

I have no idea of the position regarding your US marriage but regarding your Thai marriage........

 

When you go to the Amphur to register your divorce (which you can only do if you are both in agreement), you will be asked if you've agreed on the split of assetts and on access/maintenance for any children.  This can either be recorded in the divorce papers or a simple yes or no will do. I would recommend you list major assets held by either party.

 

That's it, you're divorced and your wife will find it difficult to challenge any settlement later unless she has an exceptional reasons. That's why its better to list assets - she can't claim later that she didn't know about X, Y or Z.

 

Under Thai law, anything you owned before marriage is yours and does not form part of the marital estate - the same applies to your wife.

 

If you don't both agree, the amphur cannot register your divorce and you will have to go through the courts.

Edited November 10, 2023 by MangoKorat