Israel is at War - General discussion (pt2)

[Morch]

Just now, ozimoron said:

 

Hoew do you get more corrupt than aiding and abetting terrorists to atatck your own country in order to pursue a religious objective?

 

You'll have to be clearer with your deflection/trolling. Don't speak the language, sorry.

[ozimoron]

1 minute ago, Morch said:

 

You'll have to be clearer with your deflection/trolling. Don't speak the language, sorry.

 

big swerve there, feigning ignorance. It's almost as if we haven't discussed this at length. Some have difficulty with inconvenient facts.

[Morch]

1 minute ago, Jingthing said:

Well I would put it this way.

While hopefully Netanyahu will be gone after this war, it's my strong impression that Israelis are very unified now as far as security. So some Palestinian ruler can say they accept Israel's existence, Israelis will be very slow to believe it. So it would need to be a very long baby steps process to build trust, like decades. 

 

Yes. Not suggesting any dramatic changes will occur. But baby steps it's how things develop.

My point was more about there being a chance the solution might be something a little different, maybe slightly better.

[Bkk Brian]

4 minutes ago, mikebike said:

We were aware of the tunnel network, literally years ago. 

Not this one. Next......

[Morch]

2 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

 

big swerve there, feigning ignorance. It's almost as if we haven't discussed this at length. Some have difficulty with inconvenient facts.

 

No, I literally didn't get what you're on about.

Maybe you'd care to phrase it it clearer terms.

[ozimoron]

Just now, Morch said:

 

No, I literally didn't get what you're on about.

Maybe you'd care to phrase it it clearer terms.

 

Netanyahu actively and secretly assisted Hamas financially over a period of at least 14 years while they conducted terrorist attacks and planned the october 7 th massacre. He did this to stop the PA from being able to form a united Palestinian state in order to prevent any 2 state solution. Netanyahu shares a religious conviction with his Minister Gallant and various other hard right religious freaks that Israel owns the lot and he's proud to have blocks a Palestinian state. That is as morally and ethically corrupt as it's possible to get.

[Morch]

2 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

 

Netanyahu actively and secretly assisted Hamas financially over a period of at least 14 years while they conducted terrorist attacks and planned the october 7 th massacre. He did this to stop the PA from being able to form a united Palestinian state in order to prevent any 2 state solution. Netanyahu shares a religious conviction with his Minister Gallant and various other hard right religious freaks that Israel owns the lot and he's proud to have blocks a Palestinian state. That is as morally and ethically corrupt as it's possible to get.

 

Oh, so you weren't actually addressing what I posted, but beating the same drum again. OK. Glad to see I wasn't wrong about the trolling.

 

Essentially you picked a single word, 'corrupt', which was posted in reference to the PA (which is, regardless of anything, corrupt) and went off tangent.

 

The point made was that Netanyahu might not have much choice in this, and that he will probably be looking for ways to spin things so that his voter base will have an easier time accepting this. If there's one thing even your own post tells about Netanyahu, is that he'll do pretty much anything to secure himself remaining in power.

 

And here we go....

 

Israel okay with reformed PA running Gaza, wants to help rebuild, top Netanyahu aide says

https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/israel-okay-with-reformed-pa-running-gaza-wants-to-help-rebuild-top-netanyahu-aide-says/

[ozimoron]

1 minute ago, Morch said:

 

Oh, so you weren't actually addressing what I posted, but beating the same drum again. OK. Glad to see I wasn't wrong about the trolling.

 

Essentially you picked a single word, 'corrupt', which was posted in reference to the PA (which is, regardless of anything, corrupt) and went off tangent.

 

The point made was that Netanyahu might not have much choice in this, and that he will probably be looking for ways to spin things so that his voter base will have an easier time accepting this. If there's one thing even your own post tells about Netanyahu, is that he'll do pretty much anything to secure himself remaining in power.

 

And here we go....

 

Israel okay with reformed PA running Gaza, wants to help rebuild, top Netanyahu aide says

https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/israel-okay-with-reformed-pa-running-gaza-wants-to-help-rebuild-top-netanyahu-aide-says/

 

You accused the PA of being corrupt. I pointed out they are nowhere near as corrupt as your dear leader.

[Morch]

1 minute ago, ozimoron said:

 

You accused the PA of being corrupt. I pointed out they are nowhere near as corrupt as your dear leader.

 

Dear leader? Did you see me posting anything positive about Netanyahu on these topics?

 

As for 'nowhere near' - that you're opinion.

 

It still a deflection, as it doesn't actually address what I posted.

[ozimoron]

2 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

Dear leader? Did you see me posting anything positive about Netanyahu on these topics?

 

As for 'nowhere near' - that you're opinion.

 

It still a deflection, as it doesn't actually address what I posted.

 

You have offered nothing but the mildest criticism, never accusing him of criminality that I saw.

[Morch]

1 minute ago, ozimoron said:

 

You have offered nothing but the mildest criticism, never accusing him of criminality that I saw.

 

More nonsense.

As said, and as admitted by yourself, you do not read posts, topics - you just hop in and decide what was posted.

And you're still deflecting, this was not what my post was about.

[ozimoron]

Just now, Morch said:

 

More nonsense.

As said, and as admitted by yourself, you do not read posts, topics - you just hop in and decide what was posted.

And you're still deflecting, this was not what my post was about.

 

Your post was about PA (Abbas) corruption, right? Mild compared to double agent Bibi.

[Morch]

1 minute ago, ozimoron said:

 

Your post was about PA (Abbas) corruption, right? Mild compared to double agent Bibi.

 

No, it wasn't about PA corruption.

That was a relatively minor point in my post.

Try reading it again.

[ozimoron]

2 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

No, it wasn't about PA corruption.

That was a relatively minor point in my post.

Try reading it again.

 

I'm getting tired of this game. You wrote "considering the PA is corrupt and incompetent".

[Neeranam]

27 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

So some Palestinian ruler can say they accept Israel's existence, Israelis will be very slow to believe it.

Herein lies the problem.

 

33 minutes ago, mikebike said:

Right. Ignore the previous 55+ years 🥺

These fundamentalist Zionists stupidly think that one terrorist attack cancels all the Israeli terrorist acts of those past years.

Here's a graph of the deaths in the last 15 years or so.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaza–Israel_conflict#/media/File:Timeline_of_Israel-Palestine_fatalities_2008-2023.png

[Neeranam]

8 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

More nonsense.

As said, and as admitted by yourself, you do not read posts, topics - you just hop in and decide what was posted.

And you're still deflecting, this was not what my post was about.

How hypocritical, you often deflect difficult questions. Well I mean difficult for you to keep denying Israel are doing no wrong.

[Neeranam]

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/dec/19/palestinian-casualties-in-gaza-near-20000-with-nearly-2m-people-displaced

[Morch]

3 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

 

I'm getting tired of this game. You wrote "considering the PA is corrupt and incompetent".

 

You're chery-picking.

[ozimoron]

4 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/dec/19/palestinian-casualties-in-gaza-near-20000-with-nearly-2m-people-displaced

 

There is mass murder being carried out in Gaza and the world is just watching. This can’t go on

Husam Zomlot

 

Millions died in concentration camps – starved, worked or gassed to death – alongside political opponents such as communists, trade unionists and socialists.

 

This unprecedented brutality, along with the enormous human and material cost of the second world war, was the motivation behind the push to create the United Nations and a global rules-based system to render war a last resort.

 

That order would set firm boundaries for behaviour in war, for military occupations, in regulating state-to-state behaviour and preventing egregious crimes – even within states – such as genocide, systematic murder, forcible population transfer, enslavement, apartheid and many others.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2023/dec/09/mass-murder-gaza-world-watching

[Morch]

1 minute ago, ozimoron said:

 

There is mass murder being carried out in Gaza and the world is just watching. This can’t go on

Husam Zomlot

 

Millions died in concentration camps – starved, worked or gassed to death – alongside political opponents such as communists, trade unionists and socialists.

 

This unprecedented brutality, along with the enormous human and material cost of the second world war, was the motivation behind the push to create the United Nations and a global rules-based system to render war a last resort.

 

That order would set firm boundaries for behaviour in war, for military occupations, in regulating state-to-state behaviour and preventing egregious crimes – even within states – such as genocide, systematic murder, forcible population transfer, enslavement, apartheid and many others.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2023/dec/09/mass-murder-gaza-world-watching

 

 

Husam Zomlot is the Palestinian ambassador to the UK.

[Neeranam]

Just now, Morch said:

 

 

Husam Zomlot is the Palestinian ambassador to the UK.

and?

[ozimoron]

Just now, Neeranam said:

Have you condidered ignoring?

All the extremists resort to personal insults. I admire that you don't lower yourself to that level.

 

I could do that but I may as well just not read the board at all. I think it does sometimes help the wider readership (or maybe not) to get a more balanced and nuanced perspective on the situation than the team players we see here would have them believe.

 

Just for fun, I will reiterate because a lot of people need constant reminding, I condemn Hamas unreservedly.

[Danny Australia]

4 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

 

Your post was about PA (Abbas) corruption, right? Mild compared to double agent Bibi.

 

List of Israeli public officials convicted of crimes or misdemeanors - Wikipedia

 

Israel has a substantial and troubled past regarding corruption, with a pervasive history that extends beyond individual leaders.

 

Benjamin Netanyahu is just one example; preceding him, various figures such as presidents, prime ministers, ministers, Knesset members, chief Rabbis, and Mayors have faced convictions for a range of crimes, including rape, sexual harassment, theft, bribery, forgery, and fraud.

 

Reviewing the comprehensive list prompts one to question whether this is a functioning state or a mafia like organized crime network.

 

Expecting such lot to seek peace with neighbors, behave ethically, not commit war crimes or lie is fanciful.

 

[ozimoron]

2 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

and?

 

Means he's educated and knows what he's talking about. Some posters have no qualms about believing IDF statements.

[Morch]

2 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

 

I could do that but I may as well just not read the board at all. I think it does sometimes help the wider readership (or maybe not) to get a more balanced and nuanced perspective on the situation than the team players we see here would have them believe.

 

Just for fun, I will reiterate because a lot of people need constant reminding, I condemn Hamas unreservedly.

 

You wouldn't know balanced if it hit you in the face.

[Bkk Brian]

7 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

 

Husam Zomlot is the Palestinian ambassador to the UK.

I'm surprised he never posted a quote from Hamas

[Morch]

3 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

 

Means he's educated and knows what he's talking about. Some posters have no qualms about believing IDF statements.

 

No, it means he's mouth piece. It's what ambassadors do.

There was nothing said about IDF in my post.

[ozimoron]

1 minute ago, Morch said:

 

No, it means he's mouth piece. It's what ambassadors do.

There was nothing said about IDF in my post.

 

I'm talking about your posts collectively.

[Morch]

Just now, ozimoron said:

 

I'm talking about your posts collectively.

 

Of course you are.

But I do not often quote the IDF words.

You're confusing me with another poster, who does.

[ozimoron]

1 minute ago, Morch said:

 

Of course you are.

But I do not often quote the IDF words.

You're confusing me with another poster, who does.

 

OK. So do you believe the IDF tale about how the hostages got shot?