GammaGlobulin Posted February 4 Author Share Posted February 4 1 hour ago, degrub said: Fanless gpu cards https://video.matrox.com/en/products/graphics-cards/m-series/m9148-lp-pcie-x16 matrox is well respected. None of the gaming stuff. Up to 8 displayport displays. As I mentioned several times, the more powerful GPUs require fans. I do not like fans. Too much noise. Fans break. Passive cooling is not easy..... So, again, this is why the integrated graphics solution is always best..... Yeah, Man! Go for it, Grub! You just need a large radiator if you choose to do away with your GPU fan.... No Problemo! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GammaGlobulin Posted February 4 Author Share Posted February 4 Anyway...back to the original Topic by, yours truly, the OP....... a. The only way to go is to use integrated graphics, and not a separate discrete GPU. b. This way, there is just one less thing to fail on your computer, which is important if you wish to avoid needless servicing of your comp, as the years tick by. c. In addition, if you prefer a quieter computer, then you will choose to not use a discrete graphics solution. d. Also, using integrated graphics will mean that you will need only one fan, just one CPU cooler fan. (which will minimize noise) e. The tradeoff is that if you use an Intel CPU, then you are limited by the GPU "power" offered by onboard Intel graphics. Still, Intel onboard graphics is enough for most needs, unless one is doing engineering work, for example. e2. In the near future, Intel may offer it's improved onboard graphics for the desktop computer. BUT, and however, this solution will NOT be available for those who wish to build their own computers, it seems. e3. Therefore, as of now, maybe this is still the best and only option from Intel for integrated graphics? e4. e5. Discrete graphics solutions are complete IDIOCY, and very old and stupid solutions. The only way forward to have BOTH CPU and GPU integrated on one single chip. More reliable. Quieter. Lower cost...for example. f. Someday, I will run Intel Corp, and then Intel will leave AMD in the dust. g. And, NVIDIA? fU..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pouatchee Posted February 5 Share Posted February 5 On 1/31/2024 at 1:05 AM, GammaGlobulin said: Never buy a discrete GPU! This is just one more thing to go wrong. If you can use integrated graphics, then you will save a lot of money. Discrete GPU sucks the Big One! As Torvalds told us.... NVIDIA: fU! hey man, every time i read your op's or comments you seem like an easy going guy who can take a punch, turn the other cheek smile and politely laugh about it. I been following this thread cos... well I thought I knew something about computers... most guys here seems can dance circles around me... point is where is the easy going guy? you seem very angry... is it that bad? cheers dude and relax... you'll find the answer you are looking for, eventually Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GammaGlobulin Posted February 5 Author Share Posted February 5 6 minutes ago, Pouatchee said: hey man, every time i read your op's or comments you seem like an easy going guy who can take a punch, turn the other cheek smile and politely laugh about it. I been following this thread cos... well I thought I knew something about computers... most guys here seems can dance circles around me... point is where is the easy going guy? you seem very angry... is it that bad? cheers dude and relax... you'll find the answer you are looking for, eventually I'm totally chill, Dude. I just have a rabid hatred for fans, is all. Please forgive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pouatchee Posted February 5 Share Posted February 5 27 minutes ago, GammaGlobulin said: I'm totally chill, Dude. I just have a rabid hatred for fans, is all. Please forgive. 555 lol But you have so many fans here on AN 😄 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GammaGlobulin Posted February 5 Author Share Posted February 5 3 minutes ago, Pouatchee said: 555 lol But you have so many fans here on AN 😄 As I say.... I just have a rabid hatred for fans, is all.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GammaGlobulin Posted February 14 Author Share Posted February 14 (edited) Important Update: This morning, I just purchased the Intel i5-13600K CPU. What a COUP, my friends! This is just about the best CPU for the money...... Next: Maybe in a few weeks, I will inform you all about which MainBoard I have chosen. Such a cliffhanger.....! Note: When I was young, buying such POWER was UNTINKABLE.... Note2: I am tinking....maybe...after I get my box running.... I just might run an IBM 360/370 emulator....just for fun... But....UBUNTU is sheeet! OPENSUSE....all the way, Baby! Edited February 14 by GammaGlobulin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GammaGlobulin Posted February 22 Author Share Posted February 22 So, anyway.... I purchased the Intel i5-13600K from JIB for about Bt.11800.00 And, I chose the Thermaltake cooler which is compatible, just as long as I do not overclock the CPU, which I never need to do: The CPU was released about 18 months ago. The performance is more than I will need, most likely. https://www.pcmag.com/reviews/intel-core-i5-13600k#:~:text=The Core i5-13600K does,count this is not surprising. Can I run 4 monitors off this integrated GPU onboard the CPU? Maybe. Maybe not. Time will tell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
howto Posted February 24 Share Posted February 24 The Core i5-13600K has a base TDP (PL1) of 125 watts and a max turbo TDP (PL2) of 181 watts. That means the CPU will consume a minimum of 125 watts of power (PL1) at its E-core base frequency of 2.60 GHz and a maximum of 181 watts of power (PL1) at its P-core base frequency of 3.50 GHz. That's a lot of heat. I advise 2 case fans to exhaust that internal case heat. Given the Intel internal graphics poor performance I don't expect 4 monitor support to be adequate for your needs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GammaGlobulin Posted February 25 Author Share Posted February 25 11 hours ago, howto said: The Core i5-13600K has a base TDP (PL1) of 125 watts and a max turbo TDP (PL2) of 181 watts. That means the CPU will consume a minimum of 125 watts of power (PL1) at its E-core base frequency of 2.60 GHz and a maximum of 181 watts of power (PL1) at its P-core base frequency of 3.50 GHz. That's a lot of heat. I advise 2 case fans to exhaust that internal case heat. Given the Intel internal graphics poor performance I don't expect 4 monitor support to be adequate for your needs. OK 2 fans, but I will choose quiet ones. I have no idea about how the CPU will work with 4 monitors.....YET. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
degrub Posted February 25 Share Posted February 25 Noctua fans or equal. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JGon Posted February 25 Share Posted February 25 Since you are hell bent on not using a discrete graphics card... and with 4 monitors you are in need of graphics... Why not get the biggest i-GPU in the market? That's the AMD Ryzen 7 8700G It has the best iGPU performance on the market, it's TDP is only 65 Watts meaning is so much more efficient and easier to cool than Intel. For the past half a decade AMD has surpass Intel is a lot of areas. While this chip in particular has 8 big core (compared to 6 big cores and 8 little cores on the 13600K)... it's way more efficient because it uses TSMC N5 node (5nm vs 10nm Intel). For Thailand, heat is the enemy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GammaGlobulin Posted February 25 Author Share Posted February 25 1 hour ago, JGon said: Since you are hell bent on not using a discrete graphics card... and with 4 monitors you are in need of graphics... Why not get the biggest i-GPU in the market? That's the AMD Ryzen 7 8700G It has the best iGPU performance on the market, it's TDP is only 65 Watts meaning is so much more efficient and easier to cool than Intel. For the past half a decade AMD has surpass Intel is a lot of areas. While this chip in particular has 8 big core (compared to 6 big cores and 8 little cores on the 13600K)... it's way more efficient because it uses TSMC N5 node (5nm vs 10nm Intel). For Thailand, heat is the enemy. The die is cast. I already purchased the Intel CPU. And, I believe, it will be my best choice available for the price and performance, which is considered to be a moderate-performance CPU. I am happy with the CPU I purchased. Many years ago, I purchased an AMD, at a time when the technology was 65nm, and when AMD leapt ahead of Intel for a short time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
howto Posted February 26 Share Posted February 26 I should also mention the Intel Thread Director and these Intel Hybrid CPU's. Around the time of Intel 10th gen CPU's is when they introduced the hybrid "E'" and "P" design. To utilize them requires the Intel Thread Director. Both in hardware and the OS. Windows 10 has a very poor implementation of it, and will/can never be fixed (just can't be). Windows 11 has the full implementation. So does Linux. It's in the v20.? kernel. What this means is one will have piss poor performance in these hybrid Intel CPU's of gen 10, 11, 12, 13, 14. Please research this yourself. I've only ever used Intel CPU's, since the 8086. I'll not go into my background. My next build will very likely be the AMD Ryzen 7 8700G. It tick's all the boxes at 65 watts. Hoping Intel gets their act together and has an alternative to their high-wattage toaster oven CPU's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GammaGlobulin Posted February 26 Author Share Posted February 26 15 minutes ago, howto said: I should also mention the Intel Thread Director and these Intel Hybrid CPU's. Around the time of Intel 10th gen CPU's is when they introduced the hybrid "E'" and "P" design. To utilize them requires the Intel Thread Director. Both in hardware and the OS. Windows 10 has a very poor implementation of it, and will/can never be fixed (just can't be). Windows 11 has the full implementation. So does Linux. It's in the v20.? kernel. What this means is one will have piss poor performance in these hybrid Intel CPU's of gen 10, 11, 12, 13, 14. Please research this yourself. I've only ever used Intel CPU's, since the 8086. I'll not go into my background. My next build will very likely be the AMD Ryzen 7 8700G. It tick's all the boxes at 65 watts. Hoping Intel gets their act together and has an alternative to their high-wattage toaster oven CPU's. Re Intel, some like it hot. Question then: a. If you had to choose an ASUS mainboard for the Intel i5-13600K, what would it be IF... b. You had no intention to overclock c. You were trying to save money, where reasonable to do so d. You had no intention to play computer games The reason I ask is that I have yet to purchase a motherboard for the CPU. But, I must do so w/in the next week, or so. Therefore, Which ASUS board to buy? (Size of the mainboard is not a constraint in the choice.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GammaGlobulin Posted February 26 Author Share Posted February 26 (edited) Why is this ASUS mainboard so expensive at JIB (Thailand)??? I really want this MoBo for my Intel i5, BUT, I will NOT pay almost double in Thailand, or at JIB, to get it. What to do? This is the MoBo for me. But, why is the price so crazy high in Thailand, anyway? Any thoughts? (Also, the JIB board is not even the DDR5 version. What is going on with JIB, these days? How could import duty be so high as to cause this huge price difference??? I wonder.....) But, no worries...because.... I have Old Friends in China who can help me get the newest boards from China, at the lowest cost, and hand-carry them to me here in CM. I am so lucky to have Old Friends in China who appreciate this Old Ham...... Edited February 26 by GammaGlobulin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GammaGlobulin Posted February 26 Author Share Posted February 26 On 2/25/2024 at 12:47 PM, JGon said: For Thailand, heat is the enemy. I do not care about the heat of Thailand. I have ACs running 24/7/365. I keep my rooms at about 20 degrees C. Why? Because, I spent a few years in HK. If you have ever been to HK, then you will know that guys in HK like their living spaces super cold during the hottest times of the year. I have a 24,000 BTU AC in my bedroom. I like to sleep at 18 degrees C during the months of March, April and May. When not asleep, I just have the temps set at 22. I am not worried about heat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GammaGlobulin Posted February 26 Author Share Posted February 26 (edited) By the way, earlier today, a member on the forum mentioned ADVICE for finding deals. But, look at this from Advice..... Way too high in Thailand! Price in Thailand vs Price on Amazon in USA. Like, almost double here. Why? What a ripoff! Edited February 26 by GammaGlobulin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GammaGlobulin Posted February 26 Author Share Posted February 26 So here is the price for this board in Taiwan, at ShunFa.... ShunFa, as you know if you have lived in Taiwan, is a good place to buy computer components. I used to shop there many years ago. The prices are OK. But, in this case, Amazon USA beats ShunFa by a bit. Still, this is a good price, at NTD8490. So then, why is the price quoted on Advice... Bt.11,900 ????? Is there a reason for this huge price difference? Now, I wish I were in Taipei, for a day...... (Maybe mainboards are just more expensive in Thailand? But why?) Taipei is a good place to shop for computer components. But, parking is very difficult. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
degrub Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 The words “gaming” and “TUF” raise the tariff anywhere. maybe the -P or B motherboards have enough video out support ? or look at the workstation motherboard. Usually as or more reliable / higher quality components, particularly on power. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KannikaP Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 (edited) 8 hours ago, GammaGlobulin said: I have ACs running 24/7/365. And yet you do not want to put, or hear, the sound of another fan in your PC tower. GG, you are talking BS, as usual. A bit off topic, but how many other members of AN have the initials GG, Gamma, Georgia.............then there are Mr Glitter the perv, Mr Garden the Goodie, Mr Green, the writer, Miss Gaynor the singer, .....555 Edited February 27 by KannikaP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GammaGlobulin Posted February 27 Author Share Posted February 27 5 hours ago, degrub said: The words “gaming” and “TUF” raise the tariff anywhere. maybe the -P or B motherboards have enough video out support ? or look at the workstation motherboard. Usually as or more reliable / higher quality components, particularly on power. OK. Workstation MB, then..... Or, I will get it carried in from China. But, SUPER CRAZY PRICE in Thailand! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GammaGlobulin Posted February 28 Author Share Posted February 28 OK, Guys. I just wanted to provide my justification for using a more powerful, though still mid-range CPU, such as the i5-13600K. Basically, in the past, I tried to run some HUGE software programs with some HUMONGOUS datasets, in order to do Corpus Analysis. This is sort of my hobby, to keep me out of those Pattaya bars, when one can lose more money in one night than it costs to buy a Super Computer. Well, THANK YOU to the guy who told me to buy an ASUS workstation mainboard, rather than the TUF board, due to tariff issues here. BUT, anyway, I just wanted to explain a bit more: I would like to run some HUMONGOUS computer jobs using HUMONGOUS software programs. This is what makes life for me still worth living, if only just barely. HERE are some opensource Corpus Analysis software programs that I intend to play around with, just as soon as I assemble my new i5 computer: ALSO, guys: The i5-13600K is just about the most expensive CPU that I am willing to buy, at this point in my career. Still, compared to what I am now using, an 15 purchased 9 years ago, the new i5 will be magnificent. Also, I may need to use around 64GB of Main Memory. I realize that this might be overkill for most of you...but.... When one is playing around with Corpus Analysis software, then one just CANNOT have too much Main Memory in one's slots! Thank you, again, to the guy who told me about using TWO Fans for the computer case. Even though I keep my workroom at about 22 degrees C, still, it can get quite hot inside the box, when one is using a CPU that maxes out at about 230 Watts, when overclocking, which I think I may need to do, come to think of it. ======================= Later this evening, after a further review of the ASUS offerings, I will post a photo of the WORKSTATION mainboard that I will choose, if I choose to buy in Thailand. Otherwise, I will just ask one of my Old Friends from China to hand carry a TUF mainboard into Thailand, for me. I am a good friend, and an OLD Friend, to people in China. They are always willing to help me, when help is needed. =============== Additionally, the import tariff on Power Supplies for PCs is also sky high. Therefore, I might have them bring in a 500 Watt power supply, at the same time. ============ The beauty of building a PC, by oneself, is that it keeps one on the "straight and narrow", and out of the bars, and STD-free! Very best to you all, you guys, who love computers even more than slumming in Pattaya bars. Stay healthy. Stay smart. Stay sane! Stay with IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GammaGlobulin Posted February 28 Author Share Posted February 28 (edited) Here is just one more price comparison between the same mainboard offered by Amazon USA, and JIB: So then, just comparing these two prices for the same board, one can easily see that..... Buying a motherboard in Thailand is a losing preposition. In fact, one always loses! And, one loses a significant amount. This board is a true workstation board. This is a bit too rich for my blood. But, I would definitely splurge and buy it, if only I could get it in Thailand for the same price as is being offered by Amazon. What to do, what to do? Still, I think, since I am in no really hurry, I will rely on my Old China Friends, to help me. Lord, do I wish I were back in Taiwan, even if just for a day, at this moment! The guys in Taiwan are super smart, and much smarter than I, which is totally unsurprising to me, after living in Taiwan for so many years. PS: As long as I stay out of the local Thailand bars, then I can easily save, in just one night, enough money to cover the total cost of this motherboard. This is the way I look at it, and this is the way I can easily justify paying for this beautiful motherboard!!!!!!!!!!! Edited February 28 by GammaGlobulin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GammaGlobulin Posted February 28 Author Share Posted February 28 (edited) Also... What is CIS? From my perspective, CIS has always meant THIS: I remain thankful to the University of Pennsylvania for helping to foster in me an ever-abiding love of ...... Computer and Information Science. I love motherboards almost as much as I love my mother. Hope you feel the same as I. Best regards, Gamma ============= Shout Out to the Moore School of Electrical Engineering!!!!! (after all these many years) ================== Also, just yesterday, I bought some high-performance thermal grease.... I am ready to go, now!!!!!!!! Edited February 28 by GammaGlobulin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GammaGlobulin Posted February 28 Author Share Posted February 28 (edited) Regarding the Power Supply for my new build: What about this? Any naysayers? Overpriced here in Thailand, of course! Nice One! Too expensive here. Maybe buy in China? Note: No matter what you do.... You should NEVER Shirk on spending enough money to purchase a very stable power supply. This is quite crucial, actually. Keep your power stable, Folks! Note2: If your PC power supply is stable, then you, yourself, will remain emotionally stable, too! Edited February 28 by GammaGlobulin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GammaGlobulin Posted February 28 Author Share Posted February 28 (edited) Being the American Patriot that I am, then I must have this module: Never, again, will I run out of RAM! Note: JIB is SUPER Overpriced on this kind of thing. Why do I live in Thailand, anyway, ....AT THESE Prices!!!!!!!!!!!????? Note2: Back in 2013, I added 16GB of main memory to two of my PCs. That was enough 10 years ago. Now, I will use 64 GB of RAM to carry me through to the year 2034. Edited February 28 by GammaGlobulin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GammaGlobulin Posted February 28 Author Share Posted February 28 (edited) Samsung SSDs have been my choice for many years. During the past 10 years, prices have DROPPED precipitously. And, from what I have read, during the next coming months, prices might begin to rise, for awhile. Therefore, now is the time to buy this one! Not sure how much more expensive it might be here, at JIB...but...then.... What a FING RIPOFF!!!!!!!!!!!!! This is why I NEED my Chinese Friends to Help me bring in the components I need, at a reasonable price. CRAZY Price for this at JIB!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (I was NOT born yesterday, Folks!) Edited February 28 by GammaGlobulin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GammaGlobulin Posted February 28 Author Share Posted February 28 (edited) You know...Folks..... One thing I quickly learned, about a decade ago, is this: If you wish to buy a decent computer at a reasonable price....then.... NEVER buy it in Thailand. The personal computers, be they laptops or desktops, can NEVER be had at a competitive price in Thailand. This is a real shame....! In my lousy opinion, computers in Thailand should be sold without import duty/tariffs in Thailand. The reason for this is that we wish to encourage all people here to buy and use computers at the lowest possible cost. Import-duty barriers to personal computing does nothing but HARM to the general populace. Totally counterproductive to where we are trying to go.....! Sorry that I am such a NUTCASE, presumably, in my humble opinion. DOUBLE THE PRICE, and you halve the fun, and the learning, potentially available, from using computers....just like the... Chinese do. Haha.... What a JOKE! (The personal computing tariffs here are a true travesty!) =============== Note: The Thermaltake power supply price that I listed above is actually....CHEAPER in Thailand than it is on Amazon in the USA. So, at least, this is good news for some of us!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Edited February 28 by GammaGlobulin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GammaGlobulin Posted February 28 Author Share Posted February 28 Just a note, please: For you OLD GUYS.... Does anyone recall the DEC-10? When I was in school, one of the smaller computers we relied upon for teaching purposes was the Dec10. That was way back in the 1970s. That was a beautiful thing. And, the only reason I mention the Dec10 is because, it seems quite fantastic to me that I can build a personal computer for about USD1000, these days, which is more capable than that! Personally, this amazes me, to no end. Also, I am happy I have lived this long, as long as I have lived, if for no other reason than the fact that I will soon have a computer in my house which is FAR faster, and having more main memory, than the computers we once used at my university, for hundreds of students to share. So then, in this respect..... LIFE IS GOOD! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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