Introduction to Personal Income Tax in Thailand

[Mike Lister]

1 hour ago, OJAS said:

What address should paper returns be sent to, and would this be worth stating in the Guide, please?

 

The filing system is mostly online but paper copies are still available. I take my spreadsheet to the revenue office and ask the staff there to enter the info the system which they are always happy to do. I've never filled out a paper copy so I don't know where they should be mailed but I'll find out.

[treetops]

On 4/23/2024 at 3:49 AM, Mike Lister said:

61) Gifts in excess of the above thresholds will be subject to PIT at the rate of 5% and will not need to be included together with other income when computing the annual PIT liability.

 

This bit makes me think that even if gifts are to be taxed then it'll be at 5% irrespective of other income taking you up the bands.  If so it'd still be a way to reduce one's income tax bill if paying any at a rate >5%.

[Mike Lister]

3 hours ago, treetops said:

 

This bit makes me think that even if gifts are to be taxed then it'll be at 5% irrespective of other income taking you up the bands.  If so it'd still be a way to reduce one's income tax bill if paying any at a rate >5%.

Don't forget that the gift must be for the use of the person it is gifted to, otherwise it is not a gift.

[OJAS]

4 hours ago, Mike Lister said:

The filing system is mostly online but paper copies are still available. I take my spreadsheet to the revenue office and ask the staff there to enter the info the system which they are always happy to do. I've never filled out a paper copy so I don't know where they should be mailed but I'll find out.

 

But will all staff in all revenue offices be necessarily happy to enter your data into the system? Or, as in the case of Immigration, could it depend on (1) your particular office, (2) the individual within that office you deal with, or (3) even the side of the bed they got out of that morning? Is it even possible for us to set up an online facility ourselves once we've (presumably) got a TIN? Could our office even do this for us at the same time as giving us the TIN?

 

On a general point, I think that it would be extremely helpful if para 77 of the Guide could be expanded as necessary so as to set out in the appropriate level of detail the specific procedures needing to be followed to enable tax returns to be filed electronically or on paper. This will, I suspect, be a major logistical consideration for those of us who, like myself, will be coming cold to the intricacies of the Thai taxation system for the very first time.

 

[Mike Lister]

 

57 minutes ago, OJAS said:

 

But will all staff in all revenue offices be necessarily happy to enter your data into the system? Or, as in the case of Immigration, could it depend on (1) your particular office, (2) the individual within that office you deal with, or (3) even the side of the bed they got out of that morning? Is it even possible for us to set up an online facility ourselves once we've (presumably) got a TIN? Could our office even do this for us at the same time as giving us the TIN?

 

On a general point, I think that it would be extremely helpful if para 77 of the Guide could be expanded as necessary so as to set out in the appropriate level of detail the specific procedures needing to be followed to enable tax returns to be filed electronically or on paper. This will, I suspect, be a major logistical consideration for those of us who, like myself, will be coming cold to the intricacies of the Thai taxation system for the very first time.

 

I am working on expanding para 77 and will post a draft in the next couple of days.

 

There will almost certainly be some variations between offices and staff at TRD around the country, all I can suggest is that everyone try it to see what success they have. Here in Chiang Mai the TRD staff have always been very helpful.

 

Once you have your TIN, I suggest you go to your local TRD office and ask them to set up an account and give you the log on credentials, that done you might ask them to provide some instructions the first time around and show you how to enter information. That is what I did and again, they were extremely helpful. Another point to add is that when I fits obtained my TIN years ago, they were only issued at the Regional Offices, not the District offices, I don't know what the situation is today. 

[Mike Lister]

7 hours ago, foreverlomsak said:

I only have income in the UK (paid into an offshore bank and transferred from there) plus Thai bank interest, which is subject to Thai tax withholding.

They consists of State Pension, Private Pension and an annuity from an old Company pension.

I do not intend to take over any monies that could make me liable for significant Thai tax annually, leaving the remainer to be handled under inheritance rules, but will still need to submit details.

Can you please advise which declaration form I should use PN90 or PN91, I'm confused on this matter.

The link below explains the difference between the two forms in detail.

 

https://www.rsm.global/thailand/insights/rsm-focus/filing-pnd90-and-pnd91

[Mike Lister]

I will update the document with the following:

 

 

80) As stated earlier, there is also a fine that is capable of being levied, for not filing a return, even when no tax is due, as long as the assessable income level is exceeded. Perhaps more importantly, TRD is empowered to audit the preceding 10 years tax returns in the event a tax resident fails to file a return after exceeding the threshold. Where returns have been made, TRD is only empowered to audit the preceding two years. It should be understood that there is no evidence presently that the TRD does undertake back audits on people who don’t file Neither are we aware that the fine is levied for not filing, when no tax is due. But it should also be noted that those facilities do exist and were only created in the last decade.

[Mike Lister]

This is a draft of the change to the tax filing process. If anyone wants to suggest changes or additions, I will be happy to incorporate them where possible.

 

TAX FORMS AND FILING

 

76) The Thai Revenue  tax filing system is on-line but only available in Thai language at present. The tax forms are however available in English and they can be downloaded from the link below.

 

https://www.rd.go.th/english/63902.html

 

76.5) Tax returns must be filed between 1 January and 31 March each year, if

you file later than that, penalties will apply. Tax filing is electronic or paper based, the address where paper based returns must be sent can be found in the link below.

  

77) Completing a tax return is a simple affair for most people, if you have difficulty, the Revenue Department staff are extremely helpful. If you want to file electronically, you should ask the TRD office to set up your on-line account and show you how to use the system. If you are not fluent in Thai it may help to take somebody with you who is. If you want to try doing this yourself at home, the TRD e-filing site is where you can apply for an e-filing account, submit forms and also practise using the system.

 

https://efiling.rd.go.th/rd-cms/

 

77.5) Whichever method you use to file, you must obtain a TIN first. After you obtain your TIN you must ask the TRD office to set up your on-line account and show you how to use the system. If you are not fluent in Thai it may help to take somebody with you who is. There have been several reports from members who have been refused a TIN. In order to obtain a TIN, You will need to bring the following documentation:

 

a) Completed LP 10.1 form, available at the tax office

b) Valid passport and visa (วีซ่า)

c) Proof of address (e.g., a rental agreement, yellow tabien baan (ทะเบียนบ้าน), or residency certificate from the immigration office)

d) Employment contract (สัญญาจ้างงาน) or proof that you have tax liability in Thailand (e.g., proof of financial transactions)

 

If you continue to have problems obtaining a TIN, the Revenue Department Help Line number is 02 272 8000 and they will be able to assist you.

 

https://www.expatica.com/th/civil/administration/tax-id-thailand-2172861/#apply

[Mike Lister]

A new para for the introduction, for comment, if any:

 

4) This document looks at the tax laws and related rules that exist but does not attempt to understand the degree to which they are always uniformly followed or enforced. Often in Thailand, laws are enacted, utilised, but then become dormant for long periods before being brought back into service again, the TM30 rule is one such example. It is virtually impossible for us to understand the degree to which any particular tax rule is enforced uniformly, nationwide, or when a particular law might next be activated once again. For example, we are aware that penalties exist for not filing a tax return where the income threshold has been exceeded but no tax is due. We think it is unlikely that this rule is enforced and that many people if any are fined but we cannot be certain. Readers must therefore assess their own willingness to accept the risk of not following a particular seemingly dormant or unenforced rule, that might suddenly one day be fully utilised once again, without notice.

[OJAS]

12 hours ago, Mike Lister said:

the address where paper based returns must be sent can be found in the link below.

 

No mention of any address in https://efiling.rd.go.th/rd-cms/ or https://www.expatica.com/th/civil/administration/tax-id-thailand-2172861/#apply as far as I can tell!

 

[OJAS]

Mike - might this be the address to which paper returns should be sent?

 

The Revenue Department
90 Soi Phaholyothin

7 Phaholyothin Road

Phayathai

Bangkok 10400

 

 

[Mike Lister]

7 hours ago, OJAS said:

Mike - might this be the address to which paper returns should be sent?

 

The Revenue Department
90 Soi Phaholyothin

7 Phaholyothin Road

Phayathai

Bangkok 10400

 

 

Firstly, my apologies about the earlier link, I knew it was not the right one but forgot to remove it before I ran off down the the TRD office to find the right answer.

 

Your quote above is the Head of Office of the TRD in Bangkok but it is not recommended that you mail returns there. The advice I have received from both TRD and from others mirrors what is written in the following link:

 

"In order to file a hard copy personal income tax return using form PND 90/91, taxpayers must do so at any Revenue Department Area Office along with any additional tax that is owed in cash, by cashier’s check, or by QR code, and that must be paid within seven days of the date the tax return was issued. The deadline is March 31; after that, late filers will be charged an additional 1.5% monthly surcharge (or fraction thereof) on top of the unpaid tax. Those who apply will have access to interest-free installment payment plans for up to three months. The penalty for submitting documents late ranges from THB 200 to 2,000". 

 

https://franklegaltax.com/2023-tax-return-filing-in-thailand/

 

Mailing returns to Bangkok is not advised because the mail system is not sufficiently robust and Bangkok is not geared up to receive them in large volumes.

[Mike Lister]

I have returned a previous point to the list of unknowns because there are too many mixed messages regarding what is the correct answer:

 

P) - Returned to the list: The issue of whether income earned in a year when tax resident but remitted to Thailand in a year when not tax resident………….is it taxable? Many contradictory reports on this, even from within TRD and tax consultants themselves.

[OJAS]

7 hours ago, Mike Lister said:

Firstly, my apologies about the earlier link, I knew it was not the right one but forgot to remove it before I ran off down the the TRD office to find the right answer.

 

Your quote above is the Head of Office of the TRD in Bangkok but it is not recommended that you mail returns there. The advice I have received from both TRD and from others mirrors what is written in the following link:

 

"In order to file a hard copy personal income tax return using form PND 90/91, taxpayers must do so at any Revenue Department Area Office along with any additional tax that is owed in cash, by cashier’s check, or by QR code, and that must be paid within seven days of the date the tax return was issued. The deadline is March 31; after that, late filers will be charged an additional 1.5% monthly surcharge (or fraction thereof) on top of the unpaid tax. Those who apply will have access to interest-free installment payment plans for up to three months. The penalty for submitting documents late ranges from THB 200 to 2,000". 

 

https://franklegaltax.com/2023-tax-return-filing-in-thailand/

 

Mailing returns to Bangkok is not advised because the mail system is not sufficiently robust and Bangkok is not geared up to receive them in large volumes.

 

Whilst I appreciate the obvious risks of using the mail service to file paper returns where tax payments in some form or other (in particular cash) need to be included, these are unlikely to apply in my case. The requirement to file returns stems purely from my admissible expenditure (solely in the form of the UK State Pension) totalling more than 120k pa - and it is clear from the various exemptions and allowances detailed in the Guide that I won't, in practice, be required to make any tax payment.

 

Indeed, according to some tentative calculations which I have undertaken based on TRD's 2023 forms, it appears likely that I shall, in due course, be reporting a negative figure for the 2024 tax year. And that is even before the zero-rating of the first 150k comes into play!

 

The issue then arises as to which Revenue Department Area Office I'll need to submit my 2-page ภ.ง.ด. 91 return + Allowances/Exemptions attachment to in due course - hopefully by EMS mail rather than physically in person. According to the TRD's organisation chart at  https://www.rd.go.th/english/6015.html there appear to be 119 such offices in existence. Unfortunately, though, the TRD, in their infinite wisdom, have chosen, for reasons best known only unto themselves. not to publicise the locations and catchment areas of these offices on their website as far as I can tell! So how else are each of us supposed to be able to identify the relevant office in our case?

 

Ditto in the case of the 12 Regional Revenue Offices from which we may need to obtain our TIN's if your previous experience in that regard still holds good.

 

[Mike Lister]

6 minutes ago, OJAS said:

 

Whilst I appreciate the obvious risks of using the mail service to file paper returns where tax payments in some form or other (in particular cash) need to be included, these are unlikely to apply in my case. The requirement to file returns stems purely from my admissible expenditure (solely in the form of the UK State Pension) totalling more than 120k pa - and it is clear from the various exemptions and allowances detailed in the Guide that I won't, in practice, be required to make any tax payment.

 

Indeed, according to some tentative calculations which I have undertaken, it appears likely that I shall, in due course, be reporting a negative figure for the 2024 tax year. And that is even before the zero-rating of the first 150k comes into play!

 

The issue then arises as to which Revenue Department Area Office I'll need to submit my 2-page ภ.ง.ด. 91 return + Allowances/Exemptions attachment to in due course - hopefully by EMS mail rather than physically in person. According to the TRD's organisation chart at  https://www.rd.go.th/english/6015.html there appear to be 119 such offices in existence. Unfortunately, though, the TRD, in their infinite wisdom, have chosen, for reasons best known only unto themselves. not to publicise the locations and catchment areas of these offices on their website as far as I can tell! So how else are each of us supposed to be able to identify the relevant office in our case?

 

Ditto in the case of the 12 Regional Revenue Offices from which we may need to obtain our TIN's if your previous experience in that regard still holds good.

 

I believe you must use the TRD office in the Region and District where you live. You might call the TRD Help Line and ask them to tell you which office that is, based on your post code.

 

 

[topt]

On 4/24/2024 at 5:54 PM, Mike Lister said:

The link below explains the difference between the two forms in detail.

 

https://www.rsm.global/thailand/insights/rsm-focus/filing-pnd90-and-pnd91

So just to be clear anyone not working here (being paid in Thailand) and if wishing to declare whatever funds they remit here should be using PND 90?

[topt]

On 4/25/2024 at 6:14 AM, Mike Lister said:

77) Completing a tax return is a simple affair for most people, if you have difficulty, the Revenue Department staff are extremely helpful.

 

I have some issues with the above statements as I think they are somewhat of a generalisation or an over simplification unless I have completely misunderstood the PND 90.

Having looked through the PND90,  I for one,have no idea where I might put potential remittances, like pensions for example?

 

In past interactions with Revenue Department staff in Jomtien for claiming simple refund of withheld interest the helpfulness was mixed at best. Not being fluent in Thai and even with a "helper" I could not imagine trying to complete this form with them at this moment. 

 

Perhaps it is just me (probably ) but as someone who has completed UK paper forms for some years now with the help of the Notes I can't see the Thai return being a "simple affair for most people". 

[Mike Lister]

10 minutes ago, topt said:

 

I have some issues with the above statements as I think they are somewhat of a generalisation or an over simplification unless I have completely misunderstood the PND 90.

Having looked through the PND90,  I for one,have no idea where I might put potential remittances, like pensions for example?

 

In past interactions with Revenue Department staff in Jomtien for claiming simple refund of withheld interest the helpfulness was mixed at best. Not being fluent in Thai and even with a "helper" I could not imagine trying to complete this form with them at this moment. 

 

Perhaps it is just me (probably ) but as someone who has completed UK paper forms for some years now with the help of the Notes I can't see the Thai return being a "simple affair for most people". 

Fair enough, that statement is based on a number of factors, some of which may not apply to everyone:

 

1) I live in Chiang Mai where the TRD office staff are super helpful, this may not be the same elsewhere.

2) Taking a spreadsheet with your numbers to the TRD office and asking them to enter the numbers into their system is, I believe, "a simple affair", this ought to be very similar for everyone else.

3) In the earlier days of the tax threads, a member posted instructions how to complete the tax form and they were pretty simple, I'll go in search of that example and repost it and I'm certain you'll agree. I have PM'd the person who posted that example and await his reply.

 

[Mike Lister]

Please see below, member Guavaman's sample form filling of the PND91 form, dated December last year. The sample was, until recently, part of the simple guide but had to be removed because the graphics character was the source of many problems in displaying the link.

 

Linked  below also is the TRD e-filing income tax forms and  instructions for 2023 where all forms and instructions can be downloaded:

 

https://www.rd.go.th/english/65308.html

 

 

[Mike Lister]

The TRD link above is already embedded in the tax guide in para 78.

[Mike Lister]

Below is the email address of the e-filing help desk.

 

 [email protected]

[Mike Lister]

7 minutes ago, Mutt Daeng said:

Hi Mike, the link in para 78 in the guide seems to be broken.

It's one of those days I guess!

 

Here, try this:

 

https://www.rd.go.th/english/65308.html

 

I think I've fixed the link in the document also.

 

 

[Mike Lister]

 

Attached is an example of how to complete a PD91.

 

500k-230366PIT91.pdf

[nong38]

Thanks for all the info and I thin there will more for us to digest as time goes by but just a few thoughts for now.

1. Many on here who live in Thailand as Thai residents ( more than 180 days pa ) will likely have submit a tax return for the year just gone and if you are a UK citizen you may well have been paying tax for the forthcoming year so I am guessing that under the double tax ruling, if it is not updated, we will have to send a copy of the Thai tax return with proof of payment to HMRC and claim a rebate?

2. When the Thai tax return is completed and taken to the local office is it up to the person ( me ) to work out what I owe and pay it to the cashier along with the return or do I wait for confirmation that that the return is correct and then pay?

[Mike Lister]

2 minutes ago, nong38 said:

Thanks for all the info and I thin there will more for us to digest as time goes by but just a few thoughts for now.

1. Many on here who live in Thailand as Thai residents ( more than 180 days pa ) will likely have submit a tax return for the year just gone and if you are a UK citizen you may well have been paying tax for the forthcoming year so I am guessing that under the double tax ruling, if it is not updated, we will have to send a copy of the Thai tax return with proof of payment to HMRC and claim a rebate?

2. When the Thai tax return is completed and taken to the local office is it up to the person ( me ) to work out what I owe and pay it to the cashier along with the return or do I wait for confirmation that that the return is correct and then pay?

1. The filing date for Thai tax returns ends 31 March so you are too late to file for last year, without penalty.

 

I don't know yet how the UK rebate will work, as a credit or a refund.

 

2. No, and I've been dying to say this, it's up to you. 🙂

 

You file the return, you pay and if it's wrong they will let you know, depending on whether it's checked or not and depending on who owes whom.

 

[OJAS]

Mike - the following link contains an overview map which some might find useful in identifying the locations of their local revenue regional and area offices (I certainly found it useful in identifying mine):

 

https://www.rd.go.th/337.html

 

Despite it being solely in Thai, might still be worthwhile quoting it in your guide (around paras 72 & 73), perhaps?

 

[Mike Lister]

5 minutes ago, OJAS said:

Mike - the following link contains an overview map which some might find useful in identifying the locations of their local revenue regional and area offices (I certainly found it useful in identifying mine):

 

https://www.rd.go.th/337.html

 

Despite it being solely in Thai, might still be worthwhile quoting it in your guide (around paras 72 & 73), perhaps?

 

Nice, thanks, yes I will. 

[proton]

On 4/24/2024 at 4:55 PM, Mike Lister said:

Don't forget that the gift must be for the use of the person it is gifted to, otherwise it is not a gift.

 

What if it's not, they can never find out what the money is spent even if they wanted to

[Mike Lister]

23 minutes ago, proton said:

 

What if it's not, they can never find out what the money is spent even if they wanted to

I'm describing the law, you're describing tax evasion.

[Mutt Daeng]

6 hours ago, OJAS said:

Mike - the following link contains an overview map which some might find useful in identifying the locations of their local revenue regional and area offices (I certainly found it useful in identifying mine):

 

https://www.rd.go.th/337.html

 

Despite it being solely in Thai, might still be worthwhile quoting it in your guide (around paras 72 & 73), perhaps?

 

Thanks for this info @OJAS