[OT] EV battery for home solar installations [OT]

[CharlesHolzhauer]

I find this young Thai entrepreneur fascinating...
https://www.facebook.com/poshoof?rdid=7qcACnPtoFOpNfxF&share_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.facebook.com%2Fshare%2FH8xMJYryWDWMMYB6%2F

He seems to be able providing ev batteries for home solar installations in large numbers. I wonder why none of the esteemed solar/EV/battery experts represented in either this Alternative/Renewable Energy Forum or the Electric Vehicles in Thailand Forum have commented on using EV batteries for solar home installations.

[JBChiangRai]

Actually, we have!

[Bandersnatch]

3 hours ago, CharlesHolzhauer said:

wonder why none of the esteemed solar/EV/battery experts represented in either this Alternative/Renewable Energy Forum or the Electric Vehicles in Thailand Forum have commented on using EV batteries for solar home installations.

 

This is my setup:

 

 

[CharlesHolzhauer]

I am aware of bidirectional charging EV batteries and your setup that allows you to power your home at night with the battery from one of your EVs. How about individuals who have a solar-powered home installation but don't have an EV? What type of batteries are they using when the sun isn't shining, particularly at night?

[KhunLA]

17 minutes ago, CharlesHolzhauer said:

I am aware of bidirectional charging EV batteries and your setup that allows you to power your home at night with the battery from one of your EVs. How about individuals who have a solar-powered home installation but don't have an EV? What type of batteries are they using when the sun isn't shining, particularly at night?

Almost the same, I believe, as we use LFP chemistry ESS on our solar system, same as in our EV (car).  Ebike & MB are a bit different.

[BritManToo]

4 hours ago, CharlesHolzhauer said:

I wonder why none of the esteemed solar/EV/battery experts represented in either this Alternative/Renewable Energy Forum or the Electric Vehicles in Thailand

Probably because they're not cost effective.

[OneMoreFarang]

4 hours ago, CharlesHolzhauer said:

I find this young Thai entrepreneur fascinating...

Does he provide warranty for whatever he does?

And does he have a huge insurance cover so that he is able to pay if things go wrong?

All is fine if everything works. But if there is a problem it can be fast a big problem.

 

 

[Bandersnatch]

1 hour ago, CharlesHolzhauer said:

How about individuals who have a solar-powered home installation but don't have an EV? What type of batteries are they using when the sun isn't shining, particularly at night?

My solar system has LFP batteries, which are the same chemistry as my BYD Seal. I imported them from China, but in recent years you can now buy similar batteries in Thailand.
 

Regarding using old EV batteries for home use, in Thailand there are just not enough of them available yet. Thailand only started ramping up EV sales in 2019

 

If you are able to find one you have 2 choices currently, either dismantle the battery to gain access to the individual cells to make a new battery or find a way to communicate with the battery as a pack, bearing in mind many of the components you will need are probably still in the donor car

Many of these problems have already been solved for older cars like the Nissan Leaf (which didn’t sell well in Thailand)

 

 

[KhunLA]

2 hours ago, BritManToo said:

Probably because they're not cost effective.

Yea ... if he refers to actually using an EV's battery pack, I don't need 50kWh of ESS. 

 

Would be nice to have, though I'd prefer some redundancy, as if the pack crapped out, then having five 10kWh packs or two 20kWh packs would have been a better idea.   That forward thinking instead of ... hindsight ... oops.

 

Sort of made that oops with our 8kWh system instead of two 5kWh inverters.  Though if never a problem, then irrelevant.   Cost of 50kWh of ESS, would be a bit different.

 

As much as we abuse our AC use now, we only use 3-4kWh overnight.  If running whole house overnight, (AC), would still only use another 4kWh, if that.  

 

@CharlesHolzhauer  Thanks for the FB link, as now know who to call, if the rest of our MG ZS craps out before the battery pack.   Well the wife, as I'll be long gone before we kill the rest of the car.  Expect the battery pack & motors to outlast me.

[CharlesHolzhauer]

12 hours ago, Bandersnatch said:

My solar system has LFP batteries, which are the same chemistry as my BYD Seal. I imported them from China, but in recent years you can now buy similar batteries in Thailand.
 

Regarding using old EV batteries for home use, in Thailand there are just not enough of them available yet. Thailand only started ramping up EV sales in 2019

 

If you are able to find one you have 2 choices currently, either dismantle the battery to gain access to the individual cells to make a new battery or find a way to communicate with the battery as a pack, bearing in mind many of the components you will need are probably still in the donor car

Many of these problems have already been solved for older cars like the Nissan Leaf (which didn’t sell well in Thailand)

 

 

Thank you for the detailed explanation regarding used EV batteries. Concerning my original post, due to my lack of proficiency in the Thai written language, I did not realize that this young Thai entrepreneur is using old EV batteries for home use (there must be a lot of 'old/used' EV batteries floating around Thailand already). I was under the impression that he is selling and installing new BYD batteries for home solar systems.

 

Translated to English:
"Solar cell system with BYD SEAL Premium 82 kw battery It can be used all day and night. Installing solar cells nationwide Get electric car battery packs for solar cell work Repair all electric vehicles Lamphun BTS Garage WP."

 

And I have no idea about the costs, but his prices seem affordable considering the EV battery setup.

Translated to English:
Hybrid 1P/3P On-Grid System 12 kw 3P Inverter 60 KW Battery BYD Lift Tray 15.9 KW Solar 570*28 Sheets Budget 595,000 Baht (Produce 1900-2400 units per month) Lamphun BTS Garage WP.
==
Roi Et Province Ends On-Off-Grid Hybrid System 20 kw Inverter 3 p 60 KW Battery BYD Lift Tray 27.3 KW 570W*48 Solar Sheet 790,000 Baht (Produce 3600 - 4100 units per month)
==
Nevertheless he seems to be very competent and knows what he is doing. I was hoping he would sell new BYD EV batteries, which would eliminate the importation issues.

[CharlesHolzhauer]

11 hours ago, KhunLA said:

Thanks for the FB link, as now know who to call, if the rest of our MG ZS craps out before the battery pack.   Well the wife, as I'll be long gone before we kill the rest of the car.  Expect the battery pack & motors to outlast me.

Credits should be directed to poster 'mistral53' https://aseannow.com/topic/1257405-electric-vehicles-in-thailand/page/245/#comment-19050068

[Crossy]

12 hours ago, KhunLA said:

... as now know who to call, if the rest of our MG ZS craps out before the battery pack.   Well the wife, as I'll be long gone before we kill the rest of the car.  Expect the battery pack & motors to outlast me.

 

MG have modified their battery warranty (even for existing owners) to be unlimited mileage.

 

https://www.bangkokpost.com/business/motoring/2829412/mg-announces-extended-lifetime-warranty-for-four-models

 

and here (use Google Translate) https://brandinside.asia/mg-lifetime-warranty-battery-ev/

 

I expect other manufacturers to follow suit forthwith.

 

 

[Crossy]

It's also worth noting that many of the used packs (including the Nissan Leaf) use the older NMC chemistry.

 

NMC packs have a rather greater propensity for going "whoosh" than the newer (and now favoured for EVs) LiFePO₄ chemistry.

 

Personally, I would rather not have either chemistry inside my home (our 70kWh of LiFePO₄ storage is in its own fire-resistant shed) but having an NMC pack inside your living space would be a definite no-no.

 

EDIT For any type of ESS it's worth remembering that a "reasonably sized" i.e. 14kWh pack contains as much electrical energy as about 1.5litres of petrol/gasoline. Treat your energy storage in the same way as the gas can for your mower!

 

 

 

[Bandersnatch]

1 hour ago, CharlesHolzhauer said:

I was hoping he would sell new BYD EV batteries, which would eliminate the importation issues

I would recommend buying a BYD domestic solar battery that comes with a warranty and should cost a reasonable ฿5-10k per kWh

 

 

1 hour ago, CharlesHolzhauer said:

there must be a lot of 'old/used' EV batteries floating around Thailand already

There are definitely no “old” EV batteries available in Thailand only crash damaged recovered ones.

 

The standard warranty on EV batteries is 8 years with a minimum of 70% capacity remaining.

 

The oldest EVs in Thailand are only 6 years old.

[Crossy]

Back in April this year we got two new 280Ah x 48V (about 14kWh) packs from China for USD 3,774 the pair including DDP shipping (no duty or tax to pay at this end).

 

Unless your second-life packs are very competitive is it worth the risk?

 

 

[CharlesHolzhauer]

36 minutes ago, Crossy said:

Unless your second-life packs are very competitive is it worth the risk?

Considering the overall investment cost of a solar installation, I personally don't think so.

[CharlesHolzhauer]

57 minutes ago, Bandersnatch said:

I would recommend buying a BYD domestic solar battery that comes with a warranty and should cost a reasonable ฿5-10k per kWh

Thanks for the recommendation, this certainly would take out the importation issue. 

What is your opinion on GEL type batteries?

[KhunLA]

23 minutes ago, CharlesHolzhauer said:

Thanks for the recommendation, this certainly would take out the importation issue. 

What is your opinion on GEL type batteries?

I'm not the techie that 'B' is, but there is no real comparison of GEL to LiFePO_4, , and the latter wins hands down.  Why newer EV and solar systems use.

 

As stated, treat them nicely, and they'll treat you nicely.   Our ESSs (LiFePO_4,) are in AC comfort, in the house (foyer/entrance way).   Pretty sure they'll out last me, and probably the wife.

 

 

[Bandersnatch]

30 minutes ago, CharlesHolzhauer said:

Thanks for the recommendation, this certainly would take out the importation issue. 

What is your opinion on GEL type batteries?

I had deep cycle gel batteries in my first solar setup 7 years ago and they still have some life in them.

 

If you want to hear more about their story and why I now have LFP instead watch this video

 

 

[UWEB]

34 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

I'm not the techie that 'B' is, but there is no real comparison of GEL to LiFePO_4, , and the latter wins hands down.  Why newer EV and solar systems use.

 

As stated, treat them nicely, and they'll treat you nicely.   Our ESSs (LiFePO_4,) are in AC comfort, in the house (foyer/entrance way).   Pretty sure they'll out last me, and probably the wife.

 

 

Is it really a LVTOPSUN Inverter, looks pretty much like a Deye. Are you satisfied with the performance of the Batteries? Have one 10 KW Topsun installed and will get two more tomorrow.

[KhunLA]

1 hour ago, UWEB said:

Is it really a LVTOPSUN Inverter, looks pretty much like a Deye. Are you satisfied with the performance of the Batteries? Have one 10 KW Topsun installed and will get two more tomorrow.

Yes, it is a Deye inverter ... our system

 

Coming up on 2 years having, and very happy.  No issues so far.

 

From side of installed inverter:

 

From Deye site, product date sheet ...