Israeli fans violently attacked after Amsterdam soccer match

[pattayasan]

4 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

Another deflection from your unsubstantiated claim

 

Still can't say who went first?

[Bkk Brian]

1 minute ago, pattayasan said:

 

Still can't say who went first?

Yawn. You made a claim waiting for you to back it up. Stop trolling

[pattayasan]

1 minute ago, Bkk Brian said:

Yawn. You made a claim waiting for you to back it up. Stop trolling

 

I'm alleging that Israelis provoked the violence. I acknowledge that the response was unjustified. I'm merely trying to establish the question of provocation. Clearly, Maccabi fans provoked the violence.

 

Imagine any human being chanting “Why is school out in Gaza? There are no children left there!” after an entire year of genocide in Gaza.

[Bkk Brian]

Just now, pattayasan said:

 

I'm alleging that Israelis provoked the violence. I acknowledge that the response was unjustified. I'm merely trying to establish the question of provocation. Clearly, Maccabi fans provoked the violence.

 

Imagine any human being chanting “Why is school out in Gaza? There are no children left there!” after an entire year of genocide in Gaza.

No you claimed the soldiers going to the match proves it was not spontaneous. 

[Nick Carter icp]

21 hours ago, pattayasan said:

 

Why won't you answer the question in good faith?

 

The anti Maccabi supporter violence was a response to incitement by Maccabi fans. True or false?

 

   False .

Plans to ambush and confront the arriving  Israeli supporters was discussed online prior to the game , days before the Israelis arrived 

[Nick Carter icp]

22 hours ago, pattayasan said:

 

I'm alleging that Israelis provoked the violence. I acknowledge that the response was unjustified. I'm merely trying to establish the question of provocation. Clearly, Maccabi fans provoked the violence.

 

Imagine any human being chanting “Why is school out in Gaza? There are no children left there!” after an entire year of genocide in Gaza.

 

   The Maccabi fans were singing the songs in Israel after the game when they arrived home , how could that have provoked something that happened a few days previously ?

  Bow down and apologize  to me and beg for me to forgive you .

 

[Social Media]

Off topic report related to France removed.

[stevenl]

12 hours ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

   False .

Plans to ambush and confront the arriving  Israeli supporters was discussed online prior to the game , days before the Israelis arrived 

Making it up again.

[stevenl]

12 hours ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

   The Maccabi fans were singing the songs in Israel after the game when they arrived home , how could that have provoked something that happened a few days previously ?

  Bow down and apologize  to me and beg for me to forgive you .

 

Also not true. They were singing provocative songs, tearing down flags and arming themselves before any threat.

[Bkk Brian]

18 minutes ago, stevenl said:

Making it up again.

No its you who are ignorant to the information that is known:

 

A senior Israeli security official said Friday that Israeli security services had identified a “flare-up” on Dutch social media ahead of the game with calls by pro-Palestinian groups to hold a violent protest near the stadium.

“Due to this, the Mossad passed a warning to security services in the Netherlands with a request to immediately and significantly reinforce the security for Israelis in the area of the stadium and across the city, with an emphasis placed on hotels where the fans were known to be staying,” the official said.

https://www.timesofisrael.com/dutch-government-probing-how-israel-warnings-were-missed-ahead-of-amsterdam-pogrom/

[Nick Carter icp]

2 hours ago, stevenl said:

Also not true. They were singing provocative songs, tearing down flags and arming themselves before any threat.

 

   Yes it was true .

We were talking about the video posted and the video posted was shot after the game back in Israel .

  Also, the threat came from the group of anti Israelis who met the Israelis when they arrived and the anti Israelis had planned to confront the Israelis a few days prior the the game .

    So, there was a threat there 

[Nick Carter icp]

2 hours ago, stevenl said:

Making it up again.

 

Nope it's true .

The day prior to the game and before any violence occurred "

 

"While the evening passed relatively peacefully, police monitored aggressive messages on social media and messaging apps threatening Maccabi supporters, according to the report from the group of officials known as the triangle — Amsterdam Mayor Femke Halsema; René de Beukelaer, the city’s chief prosecutor; and Police Chief Peter Holla. 

 

 

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/violence-surrounding-soccer-match-israeli-dutch-teams-unfolded-rcna179572

 

   Posted a day prior to the game online .

 

 "Maccabi openly supports war crimes and genocide in Gaza. (...) Ask yourself, are you physically and mentally prepared to take on a crowd of hooligans? Staying at home does not make you any less of an activist.

 

 

Edited yesterday at 06:19 AM by Nick Carter icp

[Nick Carter icp]

3 hours ago, stevenl said:

Making it up again.

 

  Right here , posted prior to the game .

Care to retract your claim that I made it up ?

Anti Israelis planning to meet and to  confront the Israelis at the football game .

   They expected violence 

 

 

 

[Bkk Brian]

Only for those that want some moral clarity on the chants of Israel started this. From Sky News Australia's excellent Erin Molan

 

"The one and literally ONLY TV journalist giving a weekly space to Israel and the Jewish people, correcting the false narrative of her less professional colleagues from around the world."

 

 

 

 

 

[candide]

There's a timeline here. I don't know if It's fully accurate, but it seems to be well documented.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/November_2024_Amsterdam_attacks

[stevenl]

3 minutes ago, candide said:

There's a timeline here. I don't know if It's fully accurate, but it seems to be well documented.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/November_2024_Amsterdam_attacks

Yes, very correct according to Dutch media.

[Bkk Brian]

7 minutes ago, stevenl said:

Yes, very correct according to Dutch media.

Well that depends on each link that is associated to each claim from wiki. 

 

However it does mention the Mossad warning pre match and the online pro Palestinian demo that was organized even though all demonstrations had been banned by the Amsterdam Mayor

 

[stevenl]

49 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

Well that depends on each link that is associated to each claim from wiki. 

 

However it does mention the Mossad warning pre match and the online pro Palestinian demo that was organized even though all demonstrations had been banned by the Amsterdam Mayor

 

No, the demonstration had been moved.

 

Regarding the warning, from the article.

"Israel claimed that the Mossad warned of a potential threat to Israelis and Jews in the Netherlands prior to the match, sending a warning to security forces.[46] Dutch security minister David van Weel said they had not received a warning but would continue searching if they had missed something".

[Bkk Brian]

17 minutes ago, stevenl said:

No, the demonstration had been moved.

 

Regarding the warning, from the article.

"Israel claimed that the Mossad warned of a potential threat to Israelis and Jews in the Netherlands prior to the match, sending a warning to security forces.[46] Dutch security minister David van Weel said they had not received a warning but would continue searching if they had missed something".

Can you provide a link to when and where it was moved? 

 

I believe Mossad, they are very good with intelligence as has been proved.

Edited 1 hour ago by Bkk Brian

[stevenl]

14 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

Can you provide a link to when and where it was moved?

 

I believe Mossad, they are very good with intelligence, I take it you believe David van Weel. Why? 

Even the link says demonstrations in the area were not allowed. I think it was moved to the western harbour area, it was all over the news earlier.

 

But the main thing here is, you make a claim, the link disproves your claim so you question it.

Information that doesn't suit you has to be questioned.

 

You're bad at presumptions.

Edited 1 hour ago by stevenl

[Bkk Brian]

8 minutes ago, stevenl said:

Even the link says demonstrations in the area were not allowed. I think it was moved to the western harbour area, it was all over the news earlier.

 

But the main thing here is, you make a claim, the link disproves your claim so you question it.

Information that doesn't suit you has to be questioned.

Yes demos were banned but the Pro Palastinians ignored the ban that's also quoted, still waiting for your  link though on your claim it was moved.

 

Where has the link disproved my claim?

[pattayasan]

Just now, Bkk Brian said:

Yes demos were banned but the Pro Palastinians ignored the ban that's also quoted, still waiting for a link.

 

Where has the link disproved my claim?

 

Hasn't it been established that both sides ignored the ban?

[Bkk Brian]

1 minute ago, pattayasan said:

 

Hasn't it been established that both sides ignored the ban?

No idea, this was about a demo being planned a couple of days before the match. I know nothing about demos being planned bu Israeli fans do you?

[Nick Carter icp]

5 minutes ago, pattayasan said:

 

Hasn't it been established that both sides ignored the ban?

 

   The Israelis were not there to demonstrate , there were there to attend the football match .

   Pro Palestinians arranged a demonstration to confront the arriving Israelis .

   Pro Pallys ignored the ban , Israelis were NOT banned to begin with 

[Nick Carter icp]

31 minutes ago, stevenl said:

No, the demonstration had been moved.

 

 

  I do seem to recall that a Pro Pally demo had been planned to be at the train station to confront the arriving Israelis and that demo was banned and so they arranged to have another demo across the road or something 

[pattayasan]

5 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

No idea, this was about a demo being planned a couple of days before the match. I know nothing about demos being planned bu Israeli fans do you?

 

How did you get to planned here? I know banned rhymes with planned but could we stay focused on what I replied to which was "Yes demos were banned but the Pro Palastinians ignored the ban that's also quoted, still waiting for a link."

[Bkk Brian]

8 minutes ago, pattayasan said:

 

How did you get to planned here? I know banned rhymes with planned but could we stay focused on what I replied to which was "Yes demos were banned but the Pro Palastinians ignored the ban that's also quoted, still waiting for a link."

 

Why are you bringing in a separate quote that was not in your post that I responded to? Here is what you posted:

 

22 minutes ago, pattayasan said:

 

Hasn't it been established that both sides ignored the ban?

 

 

Here is my response:

 

18 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

No idea, this was about a demo being planned a couple of days before the match. I know nothing about demos being planned bu Israeli fans do you?

 

You asked my about both sides ignoring a ban on demos? Again I have no idea about any planned demos by Israel but there is plenty of evidence there were planned demos by Pro Palestinians. 

[pattayasan]

Just now, Bkk Brian said:

 

Why are you bringing in a separate quote that was not in your post that I responded to? Here is what you posted:

 

 

 

Here is my response:

 

 

You asked my about both sides ignoring a ban on demos? Again I have no idea about any planned demos by Israel but there is plenty of evidence there were planned demos by Pro Palestinians. 

 

Did I respond to a post that said they were planned? I'm sorry. I thought I was reply to a post that said they were banned. My bad.