Wise vs Revolut - This is what I've found out

[RSD1]

27 minutes ago, Delta Shift said:

 

I didn't know that. Interesting.

It is indeed pretty good news for neobanks.

Kind of a dumb decision on the part of the Thai government imo.

But yeah it changes the entire logic one should follow if living here more than 180 days.

 

I don’t believe the main target of the Thai government’s new taxation structure is particularly focused on foreign residents. I think their primary aim is to tax local Thai residents who are transferring large sums of money into Thailand from overseas, typically from business activities outside of Thailand. If foreigners find creative ways to spend money in Thailand without first transferring it into local Thai bank accounts, or to declare it as Thai income, then I don’t think the government is overly concerned. After all, the money is still entering and circulating within the economy.

 

Furthermore, if the government tries too hard to impose heavy taxes on foreign residents’ overseas income without offering the typical social services and benefits found in other countries (things like healthcare, retirement benefits, long-term residency visas, etc), there is a greater risk that more foreigners might withdraw their money and investments from Thailand altogether.

[Blueman1]

9 hours ago, mikebell said:

How do I get a Wise card?  I am a member from UK but live full time in Thailand?  I use Wise to transfer 5000 UKP to my BKK bank as & when I need it?

How do I get a Wise card?   YOU Can't, They are not yet available in Thailand !!

[Surasak]

40 minutes ago, RSD1 said:

I doubt there would be any difference in Revolut’s fees between the UK and the USA.

 

For comparison with Wise though, if you exchanged £1,000 into baht within your Wise account, they would charge a fee of roughly 0.54% for the currency conversion, which would be just under £6. Wise would then charge an additional ฿44.76 to transfer the baht from your Wise account to your KBank account in Thailand. With Wise, transfers under ฿50,000 typically take only a few seconds to reach your Thai bank account too.

 

The key difference between Revolut and Wise is that if you transferred £1,000 a second time within the same month from your Revolut account to your Thai baht bank account, Revolut would charge a 1% fee, whereas Wise would still only charge around 0.54%. This means that after the first £1,000 transfer in a month, Revolut is no longer cheaper or fee-free when compared to Wise.

Apologies, I missed it. There was a charge although rather small, of 59.64 THB. Sorry for the mistake.

[Blueman1]

47 minutes ago, chilly07 said:

Wise will provide without and will send card to Thailand 

NO They Won't SEND Any Cards to Thailand......

[RSD1]

1 minute ago, Surasak said:

Apologies, I missed it. There was a charge although rather small, of 59.64 THB. Sorry for the mistake.

No problem. And that's presumably a £1.5 equivalent fee in Baht.
 

Wise would charge 44.76 Baht for the same type of transfer, for whatever it's worth. 

[Jonathan Swift]

4 hours ago, Moonlover said:

That's because I have never used Revolt nor do I know what they charge. So I can't comment can I.

You can easily look it up. For a 67.000 baht transfer wise charges me about $17.00

[oldcpu]

2 hours ago, Freddy42OZ said:

 

 

How would Interactive Brokers feel if you used them as a bank account rather than a trading account?

 

That was my thought also.

 

Further, if one did start using Interactive Brokers as a trading account, would one then also be 'on the hook' to file a USA tax return (even thou not a USA citizen and not a USA tax resident)?

[Jonathan Swift]

Just now, Jonathan Swift said:

You can easily look it up. For a 67.000 baht transfer wise charges me about $17.00

 

[RSD1]

16 minutes ago, Blueman1 said:

NO They Won't SEND Any Cards to Thailand......

 

YES, they will SEND a replacement Green card or an additional Wise White card to Thailand, as long as it’s for the same Wise account that has already had a Wise Green card issued to the account in the past. However, the first Green card issued cannot be sent to Thailand. To receive a Wise Green card initially, your Wise account must have an overseas address (outside of Thailand), and the first Green card will be sent to that address. It must then be activated at an overseas ATM. But all cards ordered after the initial Green card can be sent to Thailand. I've done it multiple times and no problem.

 

[RSD1]

4 minutes ago, oldcpu said:

if one did start using Interactive Brokers as a trading account, would one then also be 'on the hook' to file a USA tax return (even thou not a USA citizen and not a USA tax resident)?

No, not necessary to file at all. As a non-US citizen, any capital gains made from buying and selling US securities, and any interest earned on your Interactive Brokers account cash balance is tax-free. The only thing that non-US citizens are responsible for would be taxes on dividends from US held equities or ETFs. But this tax is withheld by the broker automatically so there is no reason to file a tax return. The standard withholding tax is 30% on dividend income, but if you reside in a country like Thailand that has a tax treaty with the United States, then the withholding tax on dividends is only 15%. So there is only a withholding tax but no tax filing is ever necessary for non-US citizens.

[Millian]

1 hour ago, Surasak said:

You may find they wont. Plus, if you don't have a UK address and a UK TEL number, you will miss out. Or do you have family in the UK?

I've already got a Revolut account set up, just have never ordered a physical card.

Seems they will ship your card anywhere around the world for £5.99.
 

[Surasak]

2 minutes ago, Millian said:

I've already got a Revolut account set up, just have never ordered a physical card.

Seems they will ship your card anywhere around the world for £5.99.
 

Okay, so give it a go. If you have the APP you should be able to organize that. Just ensure the card is current.

[Surasak]

Just now, Surasak said:

Okay, so give it a go. If you have the APP you should be able to organize that. Just ensure the card is current.

 

Just now, Surasak said:

Okay, so give it a go. If you have the APP you should be able to organize that. Just ensure the card is current.

Sorry, got ahead of myself. make sure the A/C is current.

[Dan O]

5 hours ago, RSD1 said:

As far as I know, merchants never charge for using a foreign credit or debit card. The foreign card fees are normally levied by your bank.

quite a few hotels and other business's have in fact started to charge a fee to use a foreign credit card. usually, 3 to 4 %

[oldcpu]

21 minutes ago, RSD1 said:

No, not necessary to file at all. As a non-US citizen, any capital gains made from buying and selling US securities, and any interest earned on your Interactive Brokers account cash balance is tax-free. The only thing that non-US citizens are responsible for would be taxes on dividends from US held equities or ETFs. But this tax is withheld by the broker automatically so there is no reason to file a tax return. The standard withholding tax is 30% on dividend income, but if you reside in a country like Thailand that has a tax treaty with the United States, then the withholding tax on dividends is only 15%. So there is only a withholding tax but no tax filing is ever necessary for non-US citizens.

 

Ok - thanks - thats interesting.

 

I considered about a year ago to open an account with them , but the intent then was to move both my Canadian bank RRSP (which that bank 'froze' because the bank discovered I was no longer a Canadian non-resident) and my margin trading account to Interactive Brokers.

 

But research (which may have been wrong) indicated interactive brokers changed their policy and would not allow Canadian RRSPs & RRIFs  (which are sort of the Canadian equivalent of a USA 401(k)) for those who were residents of neither USA nor Canada.  Also, I read posts on a forum (possibly reddit) claiming I had to file USA income tax return for the margin trading account that I was considering to open (and those posts may have been wrong).  So I went with a Canadian company (Questrade) instead.  Although Questrade is not great for currency exchange.

 

I don't mind paying taxes that are required - but filing another country's tax return would be a major PIA for me.

 

I might look again sometime to open a second trading account (with Interactive Brokers) and also use it for currency exchange.  Limitations on transferring funds to Thailand thou (if there are any) probably would be a show stopper.

[Delta Shift]

54 minutes ago, RSD1 said:

Yes, that was eventually a dealbreaker for me too.

 

It ain't a deal breaker for me. Just an annoyance really.

It's still great to be able to avoid the 5% fee on foreign cards on Grab and get a couple of deals / discounts here and there.

I just don't get why they don't make the experience as smooth as possible for everyone.

 

57 minutes ago, RSD1 said:

I feel like it's only a matter of time before these Thai companies get hacked

 

It's possible but unlikely.

True Money is part of the Ascend Corporation.

These large companies have usually solid partnerships with a whole bunch of top players in cybersecurity and cloud services.

[Delta Shift]

1 hour ago, RSD1 said:

I don’t believe the main target of the Thai government’s new taxation structure is particularly focused on foreign residents. I think their primary aim is to tax local Thai residents who are transferring large sums of money into Thailand from overseas, typically from business activities outside of Thailand. If foreigners find creative ways to spend money in Thailand without first transferring it into local Thai bank accounts, or to declare it as Thai income, then I don’t think the government is overly concerned. After all, the money is still entering and circulating within the economy.

 

Furthermore, if the government tries too hard to impose heavy taxes on foreign residents’ overseas income without offering the typical social services and benefits found in other countries (things like healthcare, retirement benefits, long-term residency visas, etc), there is a greater risk that more foreigners might withdraw their money and investments from Thailand altogether.

 

We might not be the main target but we are a target nonetheless and we will be more and more as more old westerners retire to Thailand (which is absolutely gonna happen). Otherwise they would have left foreign residents out of their new taxation scheme altogether. I think you're being too nice. They are being greedy and dumb, and it might very well backfire. The money will indeed end up in the Thai economy eventually but Thai banks won't benefit as much as they could have. Essentially the Thai gov is playing against its own banks in favor of foreign institutions.

 

I wouldn't be too surprised if this is rolled back at some point in the future....

We'll see I guess.

[pete43]

20 hours ago, KannikaP said:

If you need the transfer to show as an International Transfer, then WISE to Bkk Bank is by far the best, Depending on the time you instigate the transfer, and from where can make a difference.

I did UK WISE to Bkk Bank last week, 08am here, arrived 14.01 same day,

Wise currently takes less than 20 seconds from UK Bank to BKB, with low fees and good rates. ( my UK bank has free transfers, but Wise beat the BKB fees)

[KannikaP]

3 hours ago, chilly07 said:

Problem with BB is their appaling branch service - sheer lack of  branches and sheer lack of staff in the branches they have left open. Wise to BB yes but need to  transfer monies to  another bank to obtain service.  And don't start me on BB facial (farcical) recognition!!

I only went into my Bkk branch ONCE last year to get the statement and letters for Immigration.

Otherwise Nationwide to WISE GBP, (free) then convert to WISE THB account when the rate seems OK = instant & cheap ,

WISE to my Monthly Bkk Bank in first week of every month, all done online and almost always within 24 hours depending on time the transfer is instigated to arrive as a Foreign Transaction for Mr IO.

Transfer from Monthly to Bkk Current = instant. Mr IO only needs to see the 12 Monthly transfers all in one book, nothing else. Update bank books in a machine outside the branch when I do a withdrawl.

Works like a dream.

[KannikaP]

1 hour ago, pete43 said:

Wise currently takes less than 20 seconds from UK Bank to BKB, with low fees and good rates. ( my UK bank has free transfers, but Wise beat the BKB fees)

OK, unless you need it to show as a Foreign Transfer for Immigration. Then it takes until 14.01 the following day.

[oliverphoenix2]

23 hours ago, Delta Shift said:

Revolut is the cheapest for card payments (physical cards and virtual cards)

 

I 've used both cards for a few years. I think if you delve into the details you'll find that although Revolut charges no conversion fees (Wise charges .5% - .6%) Revolut gives about .5% worse exchange rate for Thai Baht (it fluctuates a little) and so it averages out the same. I have just reconfirmed this in my Wise/Revolut apps. And as already mentioned there is additional fee for Revolut on conversions over 1000GBP per month and also converting over the weekend. For me Wise inches out Revolut but I don't make international transfers or trade stocks/crypto.

[Delta Shift]

32 minutes ago, oliverphoenix2 said:

 

I 've used both cards for a few years. I think if you delve into the details you'll find that although Revolut charges no exchange fees (Wise charges .5% - .6%) Revolut gives about .5% worse exchange rate for Thai Baht (it fluctuates a little) and so it averages out the same. I have just reconfirmed this in my Wise/Revolut apps. And as already mentioned there is additional fee for Revolut on exchanges over 1000GBP per month and exchanging over the weekend. For me Wise inches out Revolut but I don't make international transfers or trade stocks/crypto.

 

You're wrong.

 

Right now ( Monday Jan 13th 2025 @ 20:48)

 

Wise --- 100 EUR = 3525,71 THB

Revolut --- 100 EUR = 3531,10 THB

 

Revolut is cheaper (you're getting on extra 6THB)

It's not much cheaper but it's cheaper nonetheless.

 

So the rational course of action here is to use Revolut up to 1000EUR/GBP/USD and then Wise if needed.

Wise also has extra fees on weekends. All banks do.

 

Unless of course you want to get cash. In that case, I would say neither of them is a good option. Better find a bank with cards offering the Visa or Mastercard rate (1%) with no markup or withdrawal limit.

 

Wise has the upper hand for transfers but that's it.

[norsurin]

8 hours ago, Liverpool Lou said:

You don't, they're not issued in Thailand.

I have a wise card and it can only be send to my home address in my country where i recide.

[norsurin]

I use wise..its easy for me.And if i go out having fun i just take out what i need at the ATM and after i "freeze"my card in case i loose it.I dont know if Revolut have the same option.

[Andrew Dwyer]

2 minutes ago, norsurin said:

I use wise..its easy for me.And if i go out having fun i just take out what i need at the ATM and after i "freeze"my card in case i loose it.I dont know if Revolut have the same option.

Yes, Revolut have the freeze option, most do nowadays, my U.K. credit card also has that option.

[thaibreaker]

8 hours ago, bradiston said:

Revolut won't allow signing up from a Thai address.

 

Why wouldn't they? Is that in their FAQ?

 

I signed up with Revolut from Indonesia years ago. Got my three total cards sent to my temporary address there by DHL, free of any charge (Metal Plan, which includes travel insurance, free NordVPN etc.). All as a Norwegian citizen.

 

Have anyone tried to open an account while in Thailand? Maybe trying VPN? 

[thaibreaker]

7 hours ago, Millian said:

How long does it take them to sent the card to Thailand?

I see some people say they won't, but I very much doubt that. Revolut has sent 3 cards the last 2 years to my temporary address in Indonesia, as a Norwegian, with DHL (took 3 days). So I don't understand sending them to Thailand would be any different.

I'm pretty sure you can. 

 

The fee depends on your level of program (I use Metal Plan, the shipment is totally free), and with DHL it takes 3 days from ordering, until it's at your doorstep. That's pretty darn fast.

[thaibreaker]

5 hours ago, Millian said:

I've already got a Revolut account set up, just have never ordered a physical card.

Seems they will ship your card anywhere around the world for £5.99.
 

They'll send it for free (several cards) with DHL if you sign up on one of their plans. I use Metal Plan, 12 pounds a month, which includes travel insurance and a few other insurances as well, free NordVPN, higher limits and much more. The NordVPN alone is worth it for me.

[Delta Shift]

30 minutes ago, thaibreaker said:

I'm pretty sure you can. 

 

I think you're right. You can ask for it with Revolut but not with Wise.

Wise will only send a card to your home address in Europe.

[oliverphoenix2]

2 hours ago, Delta Shift said:

You're wrong.

 

Right now ( Monday Jan 13th 2025 @ 20:48)

 

Wise --- 100 EUR = 3525,71 THB

Revolut --- 100 EUR = 3531,10 THB

 

Revolut is cheaper (you're getting on extra 6THB)

It's not much cheaper but it's cheaper nonetheless.

  That's interesting. My UK Wise/Revolut accounts are in GBP. I get better rate with Wise than Revolut converting GBP to THB.

 

 Right now 12.28am KL...

 

 Wise           42.2864

 Revolut      42.037

 

     Wise exchange rate over .5% better than Revolut which more than offsets Wises' .5% conversion fee!!! 

 

    Also I do not have extra fees using Wise at weekends!!! I use my virtual card linked to google wallet every day and always get spot exchange rate plus around .5% conversion fee on every day, in KL and Thailand and everywhere else I've used it.  What extra fees do you believe Wise has at the weekends?