what money is taxed 2024 ?

[sandyf]

2 hours ago, CharlesHolzhauer said:

Thailand never issued a retirement visa!

We can only assume English is not your first language.

[Yellowtail]

5 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Many people still seem to need the saying about starting to keep records because you never know. 

With most all financials online, no real need to keep records. 

 

Again, if they get serious about it, they'll just compel the banks to withhold the tax from the remittance and you'll have to file to get them back.  

 

[Jingthing]

5 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

With most all financials online, no real need to keep records. 

 

Again, if they get serious about it, they'll just compel the banks to withhold the tax from the remittance and you'll have to file to get them back.  

 

It's not that simple.

If you have a mix of accessable and non accessable you need to either separate them or design your own tracking system of sources in a mixed account much more complicated, because that's not something financial institutions are going to do for you. If you mix, first in first out is probably acceptable.

I don't believe the banks will do that.

[Yellowtail]

4 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

It's not that simple.

If you have a mix of accessable and non accessable you need to either separate them or design your own tracking system of sources in a mixed account much more complicated, because that's not something financial institutions are going to do for you. If you mix, first in first out is probably acceptable.

I don't believe the banks will do that.

It is as easy as that. Once funds are comingled it is not possible to determine the origin. 

 

Again, if they get serious about it, they'll just compel the banks to withhold the tax from the remittance and you'll have to file to get them back.  

[Jingthing]

2 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

It is as easy as that. Once funds are comingled it is not possible to determine the origin. 

 

Again, if they get serious about it, they'll just compel the banks to withhold the tax from the remittance and you'll have to file to get them back.  

I disagree.

It is possible to track the source with mixed source accounts.

That's exactly what I will be doing. It is a mess though.

You keep mentioning the bank's doing that. I see zero evidence that they ever will. 

[CharlesHolzhauer]

30 minutes ago, sandyf said:

We can only assume English is not your first language.

It appears you’re having difficulty fully grasping what has been written. It would be more constructive if you took the time to do your homework rather than clutching at straws and making unfounded assumptions. Oh well.

[Yellowtail]

13 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

I disagree.

It is possible to track the source with mixed source accounts.

That's exactly what I will be doing. It is a mess though.

You keep mentioning the bank's doing that. I see zero evidence that they ever will. 

 

 

Do you think they are stupid? That is the only easy way to collect. 

 

[The Cyclist]

5 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

 

 

Do you think they are stupid? That is the only easy way to collect. 

 

 

How much of an International ****storm do you think banks witholding tax on monies that are not taxable cause ?

[Yellowtail]

Just now, The Cyclist said:

 

How much of an International ****storm do you think banks witholding tax on monies that are not taxable cause ?

None if all you have to do is go file a form stating they are not, and that you are exempt. 

 

[The Cyclist]

1 minute ago, Yellowtail said:

None if all you have to do is go file a form stating they are not, and that you are exempt. 

 

 

That is not a banks job. That is the revenue Departments Job.

 

Or the IRS

 

Or HMRC

 

Or whatever every other Countries tax department is called

 

HMRC's form for declaring Foreign Income, declaring taxes already paid and income covered by a DTA.

 

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/6602c41265ca2fa78e7da897/SA106-2024.pdf

[Yellowtail]

4 minutes ago, The Cyclist said:

 

That is not a banks job. That is the revenue Departments Job.

 

Or the IRS

 

Or HMRC

 

Or whatever every other Countries tax department is called

 

HMRC's form for declaring Foreign Income, declaring taxes already paid and income covered by a DTA.

 

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/6602c41265ca2fa78e7da897/SA106-2024.pdf

I think banks in the US withhold taxes on interest payments if one does not have a TIN. 

 

It's not much of a stretch to think that if Thailand wants to tax at least some remittances they would compel people the receive remittances to have a TIN. 

[The Cyclist]

6 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

I think banks in the US withhold taxes on interest payments if one does not have a TIN. 

 

Bank Account interest is a different animal, and is probably ( As I am not American ) done in conjunction with the IRS.

 

7 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

t's not much of a stretch to think that if Thailand wants to tax at least some remittances they would compel people the receive remittances to have a TIN. 

 

This is about more than collecting a few beans in tax from foreigners. And I have no intention of going into the reasons why.

 

Just have a look at the SA160 I posted, and it is not a stretch to imagine Thailand doing the same, in compliance with an International agreement.

[Jingthing]

Imagine retirees using the 800k bank method, topping up, and then having the bank ruins their retirement extension.

I think saying banks will withhold remittances is bald faced fear mongering.

[Yellowtail]

3 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Imagine retirees using the 800k bank method, topping up, and then having the bank ruins their retirement extension.

I think saying banks will withhold remittances is bald faced fear mongering.

I am not saying they will, you are making that up. 

 

I am saying that IF they want to tax remittances, they will need the banks to help, and the easiest way to get someone in to get a TIN is to withhold taxes. 

[anrcaccount]

2 hours ago, MartinL said:

 

I've just come back from my local District Tax Office, the 3rd. time I've been there in my 15 years in Thailand.

 

On the previous 2 occasions I was told 'No income earnt in Thailand = No income tax to pay'. 

 

This time I was expecting something different and told them I'd stayed in Thailand >180 days, had sent foreign-source already-taxed income to Thailand and had received a miniscule sum in interest on my savings account but No, exactly the same answer. They weren't interested in any details. I was refused a TIN because I have no earnings in Thailand. I was told, however, that things might change in the future - maybe the TO people are waiting for proper instructions from their senior people.

 

Everything in these tax threads might be telling us that conclusion is wrong but the Manager of this TO was convinced his interpretation was correct for the time being - and why wouldn't he be? - and I've now decided that the likes of me and all the AN membership won't change that interpretation so those of us who've been denied a TIN will just have to live with it and hope the tax investigators understand that we asked for and were refused TINs. Not a lot we can do about that.

 

Thanks, here we have another real world report, must be 10+ of these by now, all saying the same thing.

 

The theory jockeys can bleat all they want, but the status quo remains, Thailand RD isn't interested in taxing income, unless you work or earn it here. 

 

 

[Moonlover]

On 1/14/2025 at 6:02 PM, Carver2 said:

HI   Talked to Lamphun Revenue Dept. and also Chiang Mai Revenue Dept. When I asked about taxation of foreign income I was told that retirees don't pay tax only people that work in Thailand or have income from Thailand  have to pay income tax . Has anyone else received a similar response from the revenue dept. ?

No I haven't had that experience because I've been nowhere near a TRD office.

 

But I did read this back in September 2023:

 

'The program will begin January 1, 2024 and apply only to tax residents in Thailand meaning tourists and short term workers will be exempt. Also exempt will be those who have been taxed in a foreign country that has a standing Double Tax Agreement with Thailand'

 

And the more I read, the I more hear and more I see, the more I believe it to be true. I also read recently that in a poll conducted by the Thai Enquirer, 58% of expats polled said they have not registered with the TRD for a TIN and do not intend to do so. So I am in good company. (I hope)

 

https://www.thaienquirer.com/50744/thai-government-to-tax-all-income-from-abroad-for-tax-residents-starting-2024/

[The Cyclist]

41 minutes ago, anrcaccount said:

The theory jockeys can bleat all they want, but the status quo remains, Thailand RD isn't interested in taxing income, unless you work or earn it here. 

 

I did try and tell you

 

Quote

Concerns about enforcement were addressed, with Patcha citing international agreements like the Global Forum on Transparency, enabling Thai officials to request banking information globally. Both experts urged expats to retain detailed records of foreign transactions to avoid audits and potential penalties.

 

https://aseannow.com/topic/1348917-thai-tax-tangle-expats-warned-of-new-rules-on-overseas-income/#comment-19515691

 

It's not about Thailand. It is about International treaties.

 

Here is the UK's foreign Income Tax form.

 

6 pages long, covers all types of foreign income, income tax paid abroad and DTA's.

 

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/6602c41265ca2fa78e7da897/SA106-2024.pdf

[NoDisplayName]

6 hours ago, kimothai said:

Since I file my taxes in the USA, I'm in the camp that says I don't pay Thailand anything because of the Double taxation treaty.  Until I get a certified letter from the Thai tax people telling me otherwise, I will assume that my tax obligations have been satisfied.  Time will tell how this whole tax hysteria works out.  

 

You are in the camp of the misinformed.

 

Unless excluded by the DTA, if a tax resident your income is assessable and taxable by Thailand.  If you have paid tax in the US, you can apply for a tax credit.

 

You are expected to know the law and comply.

 

Otherwise, just claim innocence because the Royal Police never sent you a personal certified letter informing you that meth is illegal.

[NoDisplayName]

21 minutes ago, The Cyclist said:

Here is the UK's foreign Income Tax form.

 

6 pages long, covers all types of foreign income, income tax paid abroad and DTA's.

 

Cool beans.

 

Now how about a link to the Thai tax forms covering all types of foreign income, income tax paid abroad and DTA's!

 

Thai language forms will do............

[Yellowtail]

2 minutes ago, NoDisplayName said:

 

Cool beans.

 

Now how about a link to the Thai tax forms covering all types of foreign income, income tax paid abroad and DTA's!

 

Thai language forms will do............

Just file online 

e-Service | The Revenue Department (English Site)

[NoDisplayName]

1 hour ago, The Cyclist said:

Bank Account interest is a different animal, and is probably ( As I am not American ) done in conjunction with the IRS.

 

Withholding is done by the financial institution.

 

'Merkans fill out a W-9 form for citizens to provide their SSN or green carders/resident aliens to give their ITIN, then no tax is withheld, unless you have previous naughty dealings with the IRS.  The taxpayer will send in any taxes due next filing season.

 

For non-citizen non-residents, the W8-BEN is used to identify nationality and claim treaty rights under the relevant DTA.  Tax is withheld on dividends and interest (15% for Thai filers, 10% for Chinese), but no withholding on capital gains, which are tax-free for this category of filer.

 

For these filers, the financial institution transfers the withheld tax to the treasure, reports to the IRS.  These taxpayers are not required to file US tax returns if this is their only US-related income.

[NoDisplayName]

4 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

Just file online 

e-Service | The Revenue Department (English Site)

 

Thai forms have no provision to claim foreign tax credit or DTA benefits, and no way to exempt income that has been declared.

 

Shirley, you aren't suggesting I can file UK tax forms with TRD!

 

 

[Yellowtail]

3 minutes ago, NoDisplayName said:

 

Thai forms have no provision to claim foreign tax credit or DTA benefits, and no way to exempt income that has been declared.

 

Shirley, you aren't suggesting I can file UK tax forms with TRD!

 

 

My staff filed my taxes every year from 1999 to 2019. 

 

And don't call me Shirly. 

 

 

[NoDisplayName]

6 hours ago, The Cyclist said:

 

Now we are getting somewhere.

 

The UK, a CRS Country requires all foreigners to complete Self Assessment 100 ( SA100 )

 

File in your personal details and check 1 box, No 5, Foreign income.

 

Fill in Self Assessment 106 ( SA106 ) which is 6 pages long and covers every type of income, tax already paid on that income and whether that income is subject to a DTA.

 

I still think this page has not been updated yet

 

https://www.rd.go.th/english/65308.html

 

simply because they haven't finalised the paperwork yet.

 

I can't find the US SA100 anywhere on the Thai Revenue Department website.

 

Why is that?

[The Cyclist]

15 minutes ago, NoDisplayName said:

 

I can't find the US SA100 anywhere on the Thai Revenue Department website.

 

Why is that?

 

Perhaps because you are not the brightest ?
 

Perhaps because no-one mentioned a US SA 100 or SA106, or anything to do with the RD Website.

 

Perhaps because the 2024 forms have not been uploaded to the RD website yet.

 

Perhaps you are hoping like a man possessed that it cannot be true.

 

After all the RD is not going to raise much, if any Revenue, due to the amount of posters that

 

1. Income is exempt by virtue of a DTA.

 

2. With tax credits there will be nothing to pay anyway.

 

3. And the biggest cohort of all, the cohort who only remit savings from prior to 31 Dec 2023.

 

Makes me scratch my head, wondering why so many people are absolutely aghast that they might have to fill in a bit of paper and hand it in 😀😀😀

 

 

 

[NoDisplayName]

8 minutes ago, The Cyclist said:

2. With tax credits there will be nothing to pay anyway.

 

You know this for a fact?

 

Some pensions not taxable in home countries ARE taxable in Thailand.  Deductions and allowances in foreign tax systems are not recognized by Thailand.  0% tax brackets in other countries may not correspond to Thai tax brackets.

 

Income that has passed through other tax systems with zero tax liability may be assessable and taxable by Thailand.  Income taxed at lower rates will have tax due here, despite already paying once.

 

I have US$60K in long term capital gains, zero tax due because of IRS 0% LTCG bracket.  What's my tax on 2 million baht remitted, and where's my tax credit to offset the $10,000 tax due?

 

 

[The Cyclist]

9 minutes ago, NoDisplayName said:

You know this for a fact?

 

You would need to argue that point with the RD

 

1. Exemption Method

 

2. Tax Credit Method.

 

Quote

9.    What is the method for elimination of double taxation provided in the agreement?  

- In a double taxation agreement, there are credit and exemption methods.  

 

https://www.rd.go.th/english/23520.html

 

[NoDisplayName]

2 minutes ago, The Cyclist said:

 

You would need to argue that point with the RD

 

1. Exemption Method

 

2. Tax Credit Method.

 

 

https://www.rd.go.th/english/23520.html

 

 

So you do not know.

Thanks.

[The Cyclist]

8 minutes ago, NoDisplayName said:

 

So you do not know.

Thanks.

 

No, I do not know your personal circumstances.

 

I do know that someone on a UK State Pension will probably pay nothing in Thai tax.

 

I also know that monies already taxed will be subject to tax credits.

 

I also know that people on a large number of Pensions with pay nothing

 

As will people on US SS.

 

There are probably a whole load of others.

 

So no, in the main, I don't see many that will pay any tax in Thailand and it will be nothing more than a paper exercise.

 

Why people are getting so vexed about a paper exercise, I have no idea.

 

And just to cheer you up.

 

The UK joined CRS in 2107. The SA106 Foreign Income form was added for tax year 2018 - 19.

[NoDisplayName]

5 minutes ago, The Cyclist said:

 

No, I do not know your personal circumstances.

 

I do know that someone on a UK State Pension will probably pay nothing in Thai tax.

 

I also know that monies already taxed will be subject to tax credits.

 

I also know that people on a large number of Pensions with pay nothing

 

As will people on US SS.

 

There are probably a whole load of others.

 

So no, in the main, I don't see many that will pay any tax in Thailand and it will be nothing more than a paper exercise.

 

Why people are getting so vexed about a paper exercise, I have no idea.

 

And just to cheer you up.

 

The UK joined CRS in 2107. The SA106 Foreign Income form was added for tax year 2018 - 19.

 

All of those may be true, but only if they do NOT declare their non-assessable income.

 

Claiming an exemption per DTA or applying a tax credit is currently UNpossible under the current system with the current forms, including the brand spanking new 2024 Thai forms.

 

If you claim the income, it's assessable, and if above your TEDA is taxable.

 

No way around that other than hiring a professional to sit with you in the tax office, explain the situation, and then having the officer tell you DO NOT DECLARE NON_ASSESSABLE INCOME.

 

Congratulations!  You've just spent 25k baht for a professional to do what you could have done at home for free in your underwear.