BBC with a brutal takedown of Ukrainian hopes

[beautifulthailand99]

55 minutes ago, frank83628 said:

I thought Russias economy was doomed.... how is Putin going to take over the baltics?

 

Make you mind up. Perhaps he's eyeing up Europe too...🤡

It the Schrodinger's Russia paradox on one hand they are bankrupt, out of tanks,ammo and men and on the verge of collapse relying on donkeys and shovels and on the other hand powerful enough to take on and invade Europe. Pick a side folks which is it ?

[Hellfire]

5 hours ago, Autocan said:

Cat is well and truly among the European pigeons. Life as a vassal state is hard. You keep wondering if your lord and master will have use for you tomorrow. Europeans need to pool their resources and make an army that people won't point and laugh at.

 

In any case fears of Russia are overblown. They'll take everything east of the Dniepr plus Odesa and call it quits. They have zero interest in the rest of Ukraine or Europe. Trump's new non-neocon security team has explained this to him and that there's nothing the US can do about it. Short of a nuclear exchange.

 

And truth is Trump gives a rat's about Ukraine. Who really does? Trump was right the first time around when he called it a corrupt shihole of a country.

Such a delusionary comment. Trump will be gone in 4 years. Putin and his regime are forever (unless the so called free world will get a pair of balls to confront it).  Neocon team… yeah, sure!

 Meanwhile, keep painting yourself a rosy picture that has nothing to do with reality. Future generations will pay for all this short-sightedness and stupidity.

[Hellfire]

38 minutes ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

It the Schrodinger's Russia paradox on one hand they are bankrupt, out of tanks,ammo and men and on the verge of collapse relying on donkeys and shovels and on the other hand powerful enough to take on and invade Europe. Pick a side folks which is it ?

Invade Europe? There is not such country as Europe. Invade Estonia, Lithuania or even Poland - no problem. Then it will turn out those are too very corrupted and bad countries not worth defending. And they stupidly provoked the mighty Tsar from Moscow! Previous agreements and memorandums? Who cares!

[rabas]

1 hour ago, frank83628 said:

The US & NATO didn't respect Putins.

 

Remind me again, which parts of of Russia were invaded and destroyed by NATO? 

 

Note: Russian propaganda is not meant to be logical, factual or, even counter factual, only to spread confusion.

[beautifulthailand99]

3 minutes ago, rabas said:

 

Remind me again, which parts of of Russia were invaded and destroyed by NATO? 

 

Note: Russian propaganda is not meant to be logical, factual or, even counter factual, only to spread confusion.

Russo-American propaganda. Fixed it for you.

 

 

[ronnie50]

Trump was never a fan of NATO and in his first term floated the idea of the US leaving the alliance. He was always ok with Putin - if not right out empathetic with Putin. So Trump is ready to do an end run around both NATO and Ukraine to satisfy Putin. Oh and then there's Gaza.. and the evil Netanyahu, another of Trump's puppetmasters. On behalf of Bibi, Trump is ready to ethnically cleanse all Palestinians from "greater Israel" - and have no doubt, Gaza first, the West Bank next. Plan was likely drawn up long ago.

[Bannoi]

I haven't read all the posts in this thread and maybe I will be repeating what someone else has I don't know.

 

One thing I feel will come out of this is the EU and other European countries  will realise they cannot rely on America or even Nato when it is clearly dominated by America for their defence especially when one man in the White House has the power to dictate policy regardless of what treatys or agreements that are in place.

 

I can foresee the EU possibly in collaboration with other European nations forming their own defence pacts whether that will involve the EU having it's own Army Navy and Air Force or possibly something along the lines of NATO where each country comes together as a defensive pact remains to be seen.

 

I can also see Europe greatly expanding and developing its defence industrys so it is not reliant on buying American weapons and aircraft which can often come with certain conditions.

[rabas]

1 hour ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

It the Schrodinger's Russia paradox on one hand they are bankrupt, out of tanks,ammo and men and on the verge of collapse relying on donkeys and shovels and on the other hand powerful enough to take on and invade Europe. Pick a side folks which is it ?

So you don't understand Schrodinger. There was no paradox (a lay misnomer) nor did he suggest duality, his cat experiment was to disprove it. Much the same way as you don't understand Russia.

 

Russia's economy is doomed because Putin is over spending to attack Ukraine and put Russia on a long term war footing. He also continues to spend on horrific doomsday weapons. You also don't understand Europe, which does take the threat seriously and is now scrambling to shore up defenses.

 

What do you understand? Oh yes, Russian propaganda. You haven't missed yet.

[Hellfire]

[Hellfire]

[frank83628]

1 hour ago, rabas said:

 

Remind me again, which parts of of Russia were invaded and destroyed by NATO? 

 

Note: Russian propaganda is not meant to be logical, factual or, even counter factual, only to spread confusion.

You're fully aware of NATO expansion Eastward. Nato in Ukriane feulled the fire too, head of nato said himself not so long ago

[frank83628]

2 minutes ago, Hellfire said:

You supporting the war Hawks now then

[scottiejohn]

1 hour ago, Hellfire said:

Invade Europe? There is not such country as Europe. Invade Estonia, Lithuania or even Poland - no problem. Then it will turn out those are too very corrupted and bad countries not worth defending. And they stupidly provoked the mighty Tsar from Moscow! Previous agreements and memorandums? Who cares!

The people who care are the ones living under the threat of Putin and his US henchman Trump!

[Hellfire]

10 minutes ago, frank83628 said:

You supporting the war Hawks now then

• The Munich Agreement is often criticized for its role in emboldening Hitler, as it demonstrated the Western powers' reluctance ... Six months later, Hitler violated the agreement by occupying the rest of Czechoslovakia, and another six months later, World War II began when Hitler invaded Poland.

  The Munich Agreement is widely regarded as a failed act of appeasement, and the term has become "a byword for the futility of appeasing expansionist totalitarian states."

[Purdey]

If ever Putin invades another territory, everyone will be so afraid they might let it happen.

[scottiejohn]

Just now, Purdey said:

If ever Putin invades another territory, everyone will be so afraid they might let it happen.

Again!

[Hellfire]

[frank83628]

8 minutes ago, Hellfire said:

World leader Putins attack on what, Europe ?.

[frank83628]

21 minutes ago, Hellfire said:

• The Munich Agreement is often criticized for its role in emboldening Hitler, as it demonstrated the Western powers' reluctance ... Six months later, Hitler violated the agreement by occupying the rest of Czechoslovakia, and another six months later, World War II began when Hitler invaded Poland.

  The Munich Agreement is widely regarded as a failed act of appeasement, and the term has become "a byword for the futility of appeasing expansionist totalitarian states."

So Putin is Hitler?.. I thought Trump was, you guys can never make your minds up, 

[rabas]

1 hour ago, frank83628 said:

2 hours ago, rabas said:

Remind me again, which parts of of Russia were invaded and destroyed by NATO? 

Note: Russian propaganda is not meant to be logical, factual or, even counter factual, only to spread confusion.

You're fully aware of NATO expansion Eastward. Nato in Ukriane feulled the fire too, head of nato said himself not so long ago

 

As you were fully aware, before fingers hit keyboard or bot farm started, that your bait and switch response is just more Russian propaganda. The question was about borders, stealing sovereign territory. What sovereign Russian territory did NATO steal? None. 

 

Did NATO even threaten to steal sovereign Russian territory? No.  ... as Putin continues to threaten NATO capitals with nuclear annihilation.

 

You could claim Putin's threats are just propaganda but then you go full lose-lose. Just like Putin's lose-lose war to steal Ukraine resources and reestablish Russia's outdated empire destroys Russia's economy. 

[candide]

12 hours ago, candide said:

And Russia is 1.7%. And its main neighbour is China with 17% of the world's population! 😆

 

9 hours ago, frank83628 said:

Well done, so just those 2 are more than the west. 

Phagocytosis comes to mind...

[beautifulthailand99]

4 hours ago, rabas said:

So you don't understand Schrodinger. There was no paradox (a lay misnomer) nor did he suggest duality, his cat experiment was to disprove it. Much the same way as you don't understand Russia.

 

Russia's economy is doomed because Putin is over spending to attack Ukraine and put Russia on a long term war footing. He also continues to spend on horrific doomsday weapons. You also don't understand Europe, which does take the threat seriously and is now scrambling to shore up defenses.

 

What do you understand? Oh yes, Russian propaganda. You haven't missed yet.

Ah, the classic mix of condecension and overconfidence. Schrödinger’s cat was a thought experiment to highlight the absurdity of certain quantum interpretations—not to flat-out disprove them. As for Russia, while its economy has serious challenges, your sweeping generalizations ignore the complexities of wartime economics, global energy markets, and the resilience of state-controlled industries. Europe may be scrambling, but its response has been fragmented and sluggish. And propaganda? If questioning oversimplified narratives counts as that, then maybe critical thinking itself is ‘propaganda’ to you.

 

And it's economy is not doomed as you put it and ploughing on as 'one last push' just means countless thousands die on both sides it's easy for those in repose and comfort to cheers it on. Maybe RUSI has been infiltrated by Putin shills , but I doubt it.

 

"Designed to ensure that the Kremlin can pursue a sovereign foreign policy against the interests of the collective West, Russia's economic system is doing its job"

 

https://www.rusi.org/explore-our-research/publications/commentary/russias-wartime-economy-isnt-weak-it-looks

[beautifulthailand99]

3 hours ago, Hellfire said:

• The Munich Agreement is often criticized for its role in emboldening Hitler, as it demonstrated the Western powers' reluctance ... Six months later, Hitler violated the agreement by occupying the rest of Czechoslovakia, and another six months later, World War II began when Hitler invaded Poland.

  The Munich Agreement is widely regarded as a failed act of appeasement, and the term has become "a byword for the futility of appeasing expansionist totalitarian states."

The Security conference is being held in Munich and the European resilence group is called Weimar. What could possibly go wrong !

 

[theblether]

2 hours ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

The Security conference is being held in Munich and the European resilence group is called Weimar. What could possibly go wrong !

 

 

That's good. As a former British army soldier I look forward to them sending in the troops. I only signed up due to a deep and abiding hatred for the Soviets. 

 

However - they'll never do it. All talk and no action as far as boots on the ground are concerned. 

[mogandave]

57 minutes ago, theblether said:

 

That's good. As a former British army soldier I look forward to them sending in the troops. I only signed up due to a deep and abiding hatred for the Soviets. 

 

However - they'll never do it. All talk and no action as far as boots on the ground are concerned. 

Are they still buying gas from Putin?

[Mike_Hunt]

The only to get Russia to exit Ukraine is by force, and no Western nation is willing to enter the fight with Ukraine.