power grid failure / blackout in spain

[SMIAI]

30,000 baht vs 350,000 baht. Tariffs aren't going to fix that.

[Patong2021]

6 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

But it wouldn't have affected anyone with home solar and Gas cylinders.

What it comes down to (in my mind), is you can't trust your government to provide utils any more.

They've cut their infrastructure costs to the point they are no longer reliable.

And they are so interconnected, that a minor problem will take everything out.

Fair point and I agree with you, but it is an impractical solution for most people. One needs to own one's home and to have the land to set up an optional system. I rent and my landlord isn't going to let me go solar, nor do the condo bylaws allow for it. For others, if they don't get access to sufficient sunlight they can't go with solar.

[Tarteso]

35 minutes ago, Patong2021 said:

Why spread unsubstantiated claims? Do you get a thrill, or is this just your attempt to stir up people?

After the initial disruption, the utilities  intentionally  cut  additional power supply to prevent damage until they knew what the problem was. This is called a safeguard action.

Please update your information before making such a derogatory comment. Secondly, I feel I have the authority and conviction to respond to this post, so please respect my opinion. Unfortunately, it's well known in highly knowledgeable circles that the security systems of Energy companies in Spain are outdated and obsolete. I'm in direct contact with relatives who are considered the best industrial engineers at companies in the US and Spain like IBERDROLA... It's only a matter of days before the truth comes to light.

[impulse]

32 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

But it wouldn't have affected anyone with home solar and Gas cylinders.

 

Maybe not.  But I'd hate to be the only house in town with my lights on when the hungry hordes go "shopping".

 

 

[save the frogs]

11 hours ago, impulse said:

 

Maybe not.  But I'd hate to be the only house in town with my lights on when the hungry hordes go "shopping".

 

 

 

Exactly. If the crap hits the fan, the guys who have sth everybody else needs will be the first to be killed.

 

If you want to prep for the apocalypse, form a small militia with your drinking buddies on Soi 6. 

 

[BritManToo]

19 minutes ago, impulse said:

Maybe not.  But I'd hate to be the only house in town with my lights on when the hungry hordes go "shopping".

When I first installed mine, and there was the usual windy rain so power gone for 2 hours.

The neighbours all came round to ask why I had electricity and they didn't.

[BritManToo]

1 hour ago, Patong2021 said:

Why spread unsubstantiated claims? Do you get a thrill, or is this just your attempt to stir up people?

After the initial disruption, the utilities  intentionally  cut  additional power supply to prevent damage until they knew what the problem was. This is called a safeguard action.

I call it the 'connect everything together and then the internet' madness.

Just another lazy utility company risking failure to lower staff costs.

[Patong2021]

22 minutes ago, Tarteso said:

Please update your information before making such a derogatory comment. Secondly, I feel I have the authority and conviction to respond to this post, so please respect my opinion. Unfortunately, it's well known in highly knowledgeable circles that the security systems of Energy companies in Spain are outdated and obsolete. I'm in direct contact with relatives who are considered the best industrial engineers at companies in the US and Spain like IBERDROLA... It's only a matter of days before the truth comes to light.

 

It is wonderful that you are  good friends with important and prestigious engineers.  Until such time as there is actual evidence of a cyber attack, one should not claim that it occurred. It is a possibility however, the utility company provided its explanation.The utility even stated that it was the  entity which cut the power once the disruption started. It also stated that it delayed  the re-energization of the power grid to ensure that there was no overload.   The shutdown of a power grid once an event  occurs is SOP and is done to prevent further damage. Then as the network comes back up, there is a  rebooting process.  Unless you can show that the two outages were a direct result of cyber sabotage, the explanation of  power disruption through inadequacy of cable stabilization  is reasonable. At the very least, let the  investigation determine the cause before offering a conspiracy claim.  Yes, the  power grid in Spain  has weakness, and yes it needs investment. That is no secret. It is public knowledge. Whether or not the power disruption  was directly caused by the deficiency  has to be determined. It may very well have been if the fail safe overload  switches failed, but even that is not known yet.

[Cameroni]

1 hour ago, Patong2021 said:

he  utility explanation   was; 

Red Electrica identified two incidents of power generation loss, probably from solar plants, in southwestern Spain that caused instability in the electric system and led to a breakdown of its interconnection with France. The electrical system collapsed, affecting both the Spanish and Portuguese systems.

Spain was exporting power to France and Portugal at the time of the outage. Exports to France were close to the available net export capacity until 1000 local time. According to Red Electrica data, exports to France stopped at 1235 local time from 868 MW beforehand.

 

The south of Spain was indeed experiencing  fluctuations in its temperatures, going from cool to hot quickly in some regions.  When  the ground  heats up very quickly  the air above it warms, expands and becomes lighter. That rising warm air creates a pressure imbalance with the surrounding cooler, denser air. The atmosphere responds to this imbalance by generating waves, not unlike ripples spreading across a pond.  These pressure waves can travel through the atmosphere. In some cases, they can interact with power infrastructure — particularly long-distance, high-voltage transmission lines.

 

I'm not sure that's a convincing explanation. After all in the South of Spain temperatures above 40 degrees are not unheard of hey get that every single year. But it has never caused an off grid incident like this.

 

We get temperatures over 40 in Thailand routinely too and there are none of these region wide off grid incidents just because of heat.

[Tarteso]

12 minutes ago, Patong2021 said:

the utility company provided its explanation

The utility company is the voice of the Presidential ruling party... Don't believe a word they say; they need your vote.

[connda]

Oh, by the way, when the lights went out?  So did The Cashless Society. 

If you choose to live in a country which plans to be 100% "renewable" energy and 100% Cashless, you better understand how the local black market works and what can be used as "money."

And btw, this isn't a "one-off" event.  It's baked-into-the-cake so to speak of these new 100% "renewable" systems which are prone to grid oscillations that can damage the entire grid and take it off line for extended periods of time.

[rough diamond]

3 hours ago, hotsun said:

Guns arent such a bad way to die.  

How do you know that?

Have you been killed by a gun and resurrected?

[Photoguy21]

Coming to a city near you soon