Dubai immigration refuse entry for tattooed Brit, says he will never return

[saakura]

3 hours ago, Peter Crow said:

Ridiculous. Make him stateless.

You surely mean "make them stateless". I agree.

[saakura]

They are very likely to wash up on the shores of Thailand some day. Many of their ilk here.

[Cameroni]

He had visited Dubai twice before, without issues.

 

So some IO suddenly decided he's not coming in.

 

The far-reaching powers of IOs have to be curtailed across the board, every country has this issue. There are no detailed rules, so people can make informed decisions. It's just left up to the whim of some IO.

[richard_smith237]

1 minute ago, saakura said:

They are very likely to wash up on the shores of Thailand some day. Many of their ilk here.

 

Why ? its seems there are more bigoted mongers here than there are guys with their girlfriends loaded with tatts... 

 

 

Face tatts - extreme, yes...  But really - does that mean the guy (and the girl) are complete wrong-uns ?... 

 

Far more 'wrong-uns' on this forum already... 

 

[richard_smith237]

1 minute ago, Cameroni said:

He had visited Dubai twice before, without issues.

 

So some IO suddenly decided he's not coming in.

 

The far-reaching powers of IOs have to be curtailed across the board, every country has this issue. There are no detailed rules, so people can make informed decisions. It's just left up to the whim of some IO.

 

Thats the unfair part - IF Dubai had a firm rule, such as no facial tattoo's etc...     then it would be clear not for him to waste £3000 on a trip there only to be refused entry on the whim of an Immigration officer. 

 

I've always found Immigration in Dubai to be quite pleasant or simply indifferent, one time they called my son into the booth so he could 'stamp is own passport'...    But this story is an example of the other side of that same coin. 

 

Its unfair that he was rejected just because of a tattoo....     

 

But.. it seems many on this forum are dead against anyone who differs from the mundane norm...  I get that, face tattoos are somewhat 'alarming' for some to look at, they may indicate some on the fringes of normal society and that makes people uncomfortable...  But, if they are so open in their behavior I wonder whether judging a book by its cover is correct....

 

... A guy who lives near mean is covered in tatts... no face tatts, but all over his body...  he's a lovely guy, doting father, clearly a good husband, works hard etc...      But some on this forum would see a photo of him and pass an extreme judgement....  

 

 

[MalcolmB]

2 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

So where do we draw the line on Tattoos ???

We? 
This is Dubai Immigration who drew the line.

Their country their rules. 
what you think is irrelevant 

[Magictoad]

3 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

Yup - they look ridiculous...   And anyone with face tatts certain sets of alarm-bells... 

 

But really, is that any reason to reject him ???  -    antiquated thinking, he could be a decent guy.

 

 

There are certainly folk around with no facial tatts that are despicable toxic poisonous characters... just think of those pests who admit to drink driving on here... likely far lower on the morality ladder than this guy.

 

 

What next - preventing entry for people with neck tattoo's ??

 

 

For the record - I have no tattoos, but certainly don't pass judgement on those who do - I think he's been treated unfairly....  this is almost a form of bigotry...

 

 

 

It is DUBAI! What did he expect? Didn't he know tattoos are forbidden in Islam?

[Nid_Noi]

8 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

He had visited Dubai twice before, without issues.

 

So some IO suddenly decided he's not coming in.

 

The far-reaching powers of IOs have to be curtailed across the board, every country has this issue. There are no detailed rules, so people can make informed decisions. It's just left up to the whim of some IO.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/21425704/

 

Tattoed faces and facial recognition algorithms are not best friends.

Passport biometrics and facial recognition camera need to match. If not you don’t get in.

[Magictoad]

5 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

Thats the unfair part - IF Dubai had a firm rule, such as no facial tattoo's etc...     then it would be clear not for him to waste £3000 on a trip there only to be refused entry on the whim of an Immigration officer. 

 

I've always found Immigration in Dubai to be quite pleasant or simply indifferent, one time they called my son into the booth so he could 'stamp is own passport'...    But this story is an example of the other side of that same coin. 

 

Its unfair that he was rejected just because of a tattoo....     

 

But.. it seems many on this forum are dead against anyone who differs from the mundane norm...  I get that, face tattoos are somewhat 'alarming' for some to look at, they may indicate some on the fringes of normal society and that makes people uncomfortable...  But, if they are so open in their behavior I wonder whether judging a book by its cover is correct....

 

... A guy who lives near mean is covered in tatts... no face tatts, but all over his body...  he's a lovely guy, doting father, clearly a good husband, works hard etc...      But some on this forum would see a photo of him and pass an extreme judgement....  

 

 

You say he's a great guy but what was he like when he got all the tats? You don't know; do you. I think facial tattoos are a form of inadequacy and attention seeking. Well he got the attention; just from the wrong people at the wrong time!

[Nid_Noi]

3 minutes ago, Magictoad said:

It is DUBAI! What did he expect? Didn't he know tattoos are forbidden in Islam?

You are right. Only temporary tattoos made with henna are allowed for certain occasions (haram).

[Celsius]

12 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

 

 

Its unfair that he was rejected just because of a tattoo....     

 

 

 

There are many things unfair on this planet. This one is about as unfair as not having a bumgun in Pratts Bottom 

[Patong2021]

3 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

Yup - they look ridiculous...   And anyone with face tatts certain sets of alarm-bells... 

 

But really, is that any reason to reject him ???  -    antiquated thinking, he could be a decent guy.

 

 

There are certainly folk around with no facial tatts that are despicable toxic poisonous characters... just think of those pests who admit to drink driving on here... likely far lower on the morality ladder than this guy.

 

 

What next - preventing entry for people with neck tattoo's ??

 

 

For the record - I have no tattoos, but certainly don't pass judgement on those who do - I think he's been treated unfairly....  this is almost a form of bigotry...

 

There are cultural and religious prohibitions. Dubai is Sunni muslim and unlike Shiite muslims are not as accepting. If one wishes to travel to a foreign land, one must be prepared to  accept the local social customs. The locals did not want some heavily inked person amongst them, or maybe the  tattoos were an excuse to just deny entry to an undesirable foreigner.

 

The reality is that the demographic of western males who are heavily inked like this man are more likely to be mentally ill and/or of a lower socio economic demographic than western males who are not marked up. It is particularly pronounced with some western countries. It is not as if he was bringing anything of value to Dubai was he, so it is doubtful that the UAE has lost anything from this. He can go holiday in Cambodia, Thailand and Spain with his countrymen who look just like him.

[richard_smith237]

14 minutes ago, Magictoad said:

You say he's a great guy but what was he like when he got all the tats? You don't know; do you. I think facial tattoos are a form of inadequacy and attention seeking. Well he got the attention; just from the wrong people at the wrong time!

 

No.. You said I said that... I didnt....   I said we don't know...   he 'might be a decent guy'.... 

 

But I do agree with youf comment about attention seeking and perhaps inadequacy... but then that fits all tattoos, no ?... where is the line ?...  What about clothing ?...   thats a form of attention seeking too right ? - people trying to dress well to look good etc... 

 

I don't agree with facial tattoo's...     But I agree less with judging people based on how they appear, their hair cut, nose rings, and tatts...    But, there's a large grey area... clearly this guy is on the fringes of that grey area...  nevertheless - If he sparked up a conversation with me in a bar, I wouldn't crap it and walk out of there because of his tatts...   

 

Given his facial tattoo... I can see the reasoning by some suggesting he deserved to be rejected entry - but I just think thats narrow minded thinking - he's a tourist like any other, he just happens to have more tattoos than most.

 

 

[Cameroni]

29 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

Thats the unfair part - IF Dubai had a firm rule, such as no facial tattoo's etc...     then it would be clear not for him to waste £3000 on a trip there only to be refused entry on the whim of an Immigration officer. 

 

I've always found Immigration in Dubai to be quite pleasant or simply indifferent, one time they called my son into the booth so he could 'stamp is own passport'...    But this story is an example of the other side of that same coin. 

 

Its unfair that he was rejected just because of a tattoo....     

 

But.. it seems many on this forum are dead against anyone who differs from the mundane norm...  I get that, face tattoos are somewhat 'alarming' for some to look at, they may indicate some on the fringes of normal society and that makes people uncomfortable...  But, if they are so open in their behavior I wonder whether judging a book by its cover is correct....

 

... A guy who lives near mean is covered in tatts... no face tatts, but all over his body...  he's a lovely guy, doting father, clearly a good husband, works hard etc...      But some on this forum would see a photo of him and pass an extreme judgement....  

 

 

 

I also always found UAE immigration very pleasant despite the often severe appearance, but one can see why this guy raises an eyebrow. Nevertheless, it's the usual story, if there are rules then people can abide by them, if there aren't, it's extremely arbitrary. Like in Thailand where some people can get x amount of visa waivers, some can't, it's a lottery.

 

Here, again, the guy was just unlucky some IO didn't like his face this time around.

 

Itl's like in Philippines, girls constantly get off-loaded, others aren't. It's just a roll of the dice.

[Cameroni]

24 minutes ago, Nid_Noi said:

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/21425704/

 

Tattoed faces and facial recognition algorithms are not best friends.

Passport biometrics and facial recognition camera need to match. If not you don’t get in.

 

That's a nonsense, the IO could have looked at his passport and inspected a photo, then easily overriden biometrics. 

 

But of course that would require work and brains.

[Magictoad]

17 minutes ago, Celsius said:

 

There are many things unfair on this planet. This one is about as unfair as not having a bumgun in Pratts Bottom 

I think his face was covered in tattoos which is socially unacceptable in most circumstances; so they probably saved him a beating in the streets of Dubai!

[richard_smith237]

2 minutes ago, Patong2021 said:

 

There are cultural and religious prohibitions. Dubai is Sunni muslim and unlike Shiite muslims are not as accepting. If one wishes to travel to a foreign land, one must be prepared to  accept the local social customs. The locals did not want some heavily inked person amongst them, or maybe the  tattoos were an excuse to just deny entry to an undesirable foreigner.

 

I think thats a valid point - but he'd been there twice before and it wasn't a problem...

 

I've worked in Dubai and spent a lot of time in the UAE and many other countries in the Middle East - In Dubai, Tattoo's can be seen everywhere on so many 'Western tourists'...   

 

2 minutes ago, Patong2021 said:

The reality is that the demographic of western males who are heavily inked like this man are more likely to be mentally ill and/or of a lower socio economic demographic than western males who are not marked up.

 

There's that aspect - but the world has moved on, perhaps that thinking is a number of decades old.. 

The modern world - tatts are a nothing burger...   So many have them, they're everywhere amongst normal people... 

 

Maybe you are right and he has mental issues, or thats a reason to suspect he might have, or suspect his attitudes are somewhat 'less restricted' than most people...  But again, thats antiquated thinking.

 

2 minutes ago, Patong2021 said:

It is particularly pronounced with some western countries. It is not as if he was bringing anything of value to Dubai was he, so it is doubtful that the UAE has lost anything from this. He can go holiday in Cambodia, Thailand and Spain with his countrymen who look just like him.

 

The same can be argued of any individual tourist - Both you and I bring no more or no less when we visit places like Dubai - we're no different, until we behave differently - thus... If he had a history of misbehaviour, I'd agree with you.

 

 

I get it - his face draws a lot of attention and when someone draws such attention they can expect to be treated differently and shouldn't cry about it...  However...  I think the decision to reject him, especially as he's been there before is harsh... 

 

 

[richard_smith237]

2 minutes ago, Magictoad said:

I think his face was covered in tattoos which is socially unacceptable in most circumstances; so they probably saved him a beating in the streets of Dubai!

 

A beating on the streets of Dubai... .  "tell us you never been to Dubai without telling us you've never been to Dubai" !!!! 

[quake]

If you alter you natural appearance to an extreme.

Then don't expect , to travel around the world unhindered.

Stupid is as stupid does.

Now stop crying about it, you idiots. 

 

[bannork]

1 hour ago, Magictoad said:

It is DUBAI! What did he expect? Didn't he know tattoos are forbidden in Islam?

Good point. He's another case of exceptionalism-

' I'm from the West, accept me as I am, and if you don't, that's your problem.'

[richard_smith237]

1 hour ago, MalcolmB said:

We? 
This is Dubai Immigration who drew the line.

Their country their rules. 
what you think is irrelevant 

 

Thats a valid point from the perspective of him getting rejected.

But, he was accepted twice before that... 

 

So.. where do they draw the line - 66% ok apparently..    but as another poster mentioned, it seems it just came down to one individual Immigration officer who didn't like his look. 

 

-------

 

As far as we, what I think and what the forum things - its quite relevant to the discussion - thats the point of the discussion, even your trolling and attempt to provoke could bring up a relevant and valid point.

[richard_smith237]

2 minutes ago, bannork said:

1 hour ago, Magictoad said:

It is DUBAI! What did he expect? Didn't he know tattoos are forbidden in Islam?

Good point. He's another case of exceptionalism-

' I'm from the West, accept me as I am, and if you don't, that's your problem.'

 

Isn't that what happens with all the Arab women arriving in Europe in Burkhas ? 

 

"I'm from the Middle East, accept me as I am, and if you don't, that's your problem.'

 

 

What if this guy was a Mauri with face tatts  - would he have been rejected ?

 

I know the tatts were not cultural or religious, so its somewhat of an unfair comparison - however, twice before there was no issue, so why the issue now? 

[ravip]

says he will never return - Would Dubai really miss  him and beg him to come back?

[tjintx]

3 hours ago, MalcolmB said:

He will discover Thailand next

 

I've heard on good authority that they will be attending the AN holiday party but just haven't had the chance to answer your poll (tied up by Dubai immigration, you know).

[ravip]

1 hour ago, Cameroni said:

He had visited Dubai twice before, without issues.

 

So some IO suddenly decided he's not coming in.

 

The far-reaching powers of IOs have to be curtailed across the board, every country has this issue. There are no detailed rules, so people can make informed decisions. It's just left up to the whim of some IO.

You are absolutely correct.

Most times, the Dubai IO's are very  reasonable and polite, compared to some other developed countries IO's.

 

[bannork]

35 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

Isn't that what happens with all the Arab women arriving in Europe in Burkhas ? 

 

"I'm from the Middle East, accept me as I am, and if you don't, that's your problem.'

 

 

What if this guy was a Mauri with face tatts  - would he have been rejected ?

 

I know the tatts were not cultural or religious, so its somewhat of an unfair comparison - however, twice before there was no issue, so why the issue now? 

Good point regarding the burqa, in fact it is banned now in various public places in certain EU states.

 

[richard_smith237]

35 minutes ago, bannork said:

Good point regarding the burqa, in fact it is banned now in various public places in certain EU states.

 

 

From the perspective of ID, facial recognition etc - so it should be...   

 

Its a different conversation, but I don't believe any woman is comfortable wearing a Burkha hiding their face...  its forced by zealots in a draconian society... 

 

... Conversely, this man with facial tattoo's has made himself far more 'facially recognisable'... 

 

 

That said: I understand the sensitivities of 'culture and appropriateness'...     however Dubai actively covets Western Tourists, it has done so for a while and 'in general' it has shown not only incredible tolerance but great hospitality towards foreigners...     I've been out in the dessert dune-bashing and met with land owners, had very pleasant conversations... "please enjoy my land" type of thing...   

 

I've worked with many Arabs from both Abu Dhabi and Dubai and found them pleasant to work with, well educated with a good sense of humour... 

 

I find the folk of the UAE very welcoming, Particularly Dubai and Abu Dhabi... Sharjhah less so, but thats because the laws are more draconian there and thus there is less 'Western exposure'... 

 

That said, I'd absolutely Shyat it if I found myself on the wrong side of some drug law etc...  some of those stories are absolute horror stories...   and when drinking, never get wasted, and never walk home - Taxi door to door...   seems thats the way to do it...  

 

But... I go back to the fact that this man has enjoyed Dubai twice before without issue...    the only question I have is if his full facial tattoo's have been completed since his previous visit...

 

Blocking him on his third visit seems harsh... 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[The Old Bull]

One of the disadvantages of living in a democratic society is its ability to deal with weird f---ers. Less democratic countries can lay the law down with no repercussions. Well done Dubai.

[rattlesnake]

7 hours ago, transam said:

When they get to my age, they will look like something out of a horror movie.......😱

 

They already do. I have several visible tattoos, but facial ones I find very disturbing, IMO there has to be some underlying psychological issue for someone to do something so radical.

[pub2022]

Well done Dubai.

Disgusting ugly monster.