On 6/14/2026 at 4:08 AM, BilllyGOAT said:

My "Plan B" would definitely not be to post another version of this same topic again.

I've seen at least two versions of it in the last 6-8 months and maybe even more if you go back further. If you do some searching on the forum surely you'll find those other topics along with the answers to your questions.

Appearently asking similar question twice over 8 months upsets some people. Com'on think before you post!!

I lived in Thailand for 5 plus years, then moved to Surabaya Indonesia. Bali 1 hour flight, mountains 1 to 2 hours drive. Rent a house under 1,500 USD a year. Apartment 200 to 500 USD month

Food super cheap. Good place to live with tropical climate.

2 hours ago, KhunLA said:

Never seriously thought about a plan B, enough to actually research another location. Longer I stayed in TH, the more it became home.

Just wish the country was a bit bigger, and had more diverse weather seasons. Can't think of any reason to leave, and too many reasons to stay.

No sense wasting brain cells on something that's never going to happen.

So you have permanent residency or Thai citizenship?

I've been living in Thailand for several years, but my backup plan would be the Philippines, where I spent a few weeks in the past.

Haven't given it much thought; married to a Thai so likely here for the long haul. If I absolutely had to leave, might end up back in the US, possibly Florida. Has to be someplace warm as I hate cold weather and a pool is a must. Probably not anywhere in Europe and definitely not the Philippines--I never felt safe the one time I visited. Have only read the first page of posts, maybe I'll get some ideas but don't see myself going anywhere, except one or two more moves around Pattaya and Bangkok.

Aside from other reasons moving to another Asean country after Thailand has the advantage of being close enough that if you need to resolve any remaining ties to Thailand after you move, at least you don't need to fly half way around the world.

Edited June 16Jun 16 by Jingthing

And the moral of the story: If one has the financial/visa means to stay in Thailand, STAY. As everywhere else the doors are closing fast, unless one has a "fat wallet". Amen.

10 minutes ago, swissie said:

And the moral of the story: If one has the financial/visa means to stay in Thailand, STAY. As everywhere else the doors are closing fast, unless one has a "fat wallet". Amen.

What doors are closing fast?

1 hour ago, Celsius said:

What doors are closing fast?

For all that have a "small wallet". List "paradise" for retirees with a "small wallet". Thanks. The Op has been searching for such places for years.

17 hours ago, delanoalvis said:

I lived in Thailand for 5 plus years, then moved to Surabaya Indonesia. Bali 1 hour flight, mountains 1 to 2 hours drive. Rent a house under 1,500 USD a year. Apartment 200 to 500 USD month

Food super cheap. Good place to live with tropical climate.

does indonesia have a retirement visa?

For those considering moving to Mexico, to get a Residente Permanente card (the Mexican "Green Card" for foreigners living in Mexico), the income requirements have shot up. When I qualified for mine in late 2019, the required annual income was just below US$30,000. Now, its US$74,000,.

1 minute ago, wpcoe said:

For those considering moving to Mexico, to get a Residente Permanente card (the Mexican "Green Card" for foreigners living in Mexico), the income requirements have shot up. When I qualified for mine in late 2019, the required annual income was just below US$30,000. Now, its US$74,000,.

It goes up every year.

But probably most western retirees have enough to qualify for at least temporary residence by showing money one time which leads to permanent residence in 5 years.

So still very accessible regardless.

Detail on the current show money levels needed for Mexican residency.

Money shown is usually in your home country.

Retirement account money is eligible.

Approximately (depending on exchange rate and the Mexican consulate you're using)

Temporary 75 US USD. Leads to Permanent in 5 years. Show money once.

Permanent 300K USD. You're done.

I think if you don't have at least 75K USD saved for retirement you've got other problems other than qualifying for Mexican residency.

If you're low income and low savings, there are other options. For example Panama only requires 1000 USD a month and Nicaragua even less.

Edited June 16Jun 16 by Jingthing

A general comment on the value of moving to a country that offers retired expats inclusion in a high quality national health care system.

If you're quite old with preexisting conditions, private insurance if you can get it is going to be very very costly and often won't include conditions that you mostly need it for anyway. So in many cases "self insurance" makes sense but very risky.

This puts the taxation in Portugal in some kind of context.

It's high but you get something significant for it.

A personal call if it's worth it for you.

Similarly Costa Rica has become rather high living cost compared to most Latin American options but you get entry into their excellent health care system (for an additional cost of percentage of income).

Another example is France which has one of the top health systems in the world and people are surprised to learn there are more budget friendly location options there (obviously not Paris). Personally, I don't think I could deal with all those French people though.

Edited June 16Jun 16 by Jingthing

Linz, in Austria, would tick many of my boxes. The main ones being that I'd be Income tax exempt, German is my mother tongue and that I miss the snow and altitude. Culture..

Also I'd limit my diet to Apfel Strudel for the first year, my mum's was delicious...

Edited June 17Jun 17 by Peter Crow

Pilsner, Czech Rep. was one that I liked. Can own & apply for PR after 5 years & citizenship after 5 more.

On 6/14/2026 at 9:46 PM, swissie said:

A zillion of countries were mentioned here. What about India?

India is too chaotic and too noisy. There is no real escape, except up in the mountains. How is the hygiene in India? And can you travel freely almost everywhere and still feel safe?

If India was an alternative, I would have chosen Fortaleza in Brazil instead. Safety wise, it is not especially good, but the stabile climate and clean air year around would outweigh India for me. I would also choose it over the Philippines, Cambodia, and even Vietnam.

Edited June 17Jun 17 by Hummin

Ulan Baatar- or Ulan, if you are autistic- is the worst town I’ve been to in Asia. A lot of flat roof crumbling Soviet buildings. Not that friendly either.

My escape destination would be KL. It would be close I know to Bangkok to satisfy, minus the weed, which is really available there from any taxi driver.

I have an offer of a cultural visa in Laos due to the historic preservation work. I have done there. That was a long time ago, so I inquired last year if the offer was still good.

It still is, but I’d have to think of a new pretend project to work on and toss someone $500.

No tax, no 90 day reporting, just a yearly renewable

On 6/16/2026 at 9:29 AM, delanoalvis said:

mountains 1 to 2 hours drive.

Yeah! I used to drive a Kijang. Hahaha

On 6/17/2026 at 5:47 AM, wpcoe said:

For those considering moving to Mexico, to get a Residente Permanente card (the Mexican "Green Card" for foreigners living in Mexico), the income requirements have shot up. When I qualified for mine in late 2019, the required annual income was just below US$30,000. Now, its US$74,000,.

In all honesty, to me, that looks reasonable.

Philippines has a scheme like Thailand where you can be a LTR and avoid paying income tax on remittances. But I don't know where I'd choose. Somewhere not far from Manila or Cebu (for access to hospitals and services). Maybe Angeles City or Subic Bay area?

But Viet Nam, Da Nang or the island in the south (forget the name) would be my first choice if I didn't have to pay tax on remittances.

Otherwise, my home country I guess and joining the hamster wheel of massive taxation. I could try to continue non-residency by staying less than 6 months. So only late spring to early Autumn (so like May - September, then try to ride out the remainder in various warm countries of a tight budget).

I took a look at the tax situation for expat tax residents in Mexico. Details depend on tax treaty. For US people, social security is clearly exempt, but other pensions including withdrawals from IRA accounts (not sure about Roth) ARE taxable. For a middle level income retiree, at about 20 percent.

3 hours ago, Jingthing said:

I took a look at the tax situation for expat tax residents in Mexico. Details depend on tax treaty. For US people, social security is clearly exempt, but other pensions including withdrawals from IRA accounts (not sure about Roth) ARE taxable. For a middle level income retiree, at about 20 percent.

Correction.

For taxable in Mexico income (private pensions, withdraws from IRAs, etc.) refer to this chart:

So as you can the entire amount of the income isn't taxed.

It's the basic as shown plus the rate for overage.

Also for US people you can credit the Mexican tax paid on your US return.

ax Bracket Overview

Taxable Income (MXN)	Basic Tax (MXN)	Tax on Excess (%)
0.01 - 10,135.11	0	1.92
10,135.12 - 20,000	194.00	6.40
20,000.01 - 35,000	1,194.00	10.88
35,000.01 - 50,000	2,194.00	16.00
50,000.01 - 75,000	3,694.00	17.92
75,000.01 - 100,000	5,194.00	21.36
100,000.01 - 150,000	7,194.00	23.52
150,000.01 - 200,000	10,194.00	30.00
200,000.01 - 1,000,000	15,194.00	32.00
1,000,000.01 - 5,107,703.93	30,194.00	34.00
Above 5,107,703.93	1,601,862.46	35.00

Example.

So you withdrew 14K USD from your IRA account.

That's currently about 243K Pesos.

So the Mexican tax on that would be 15,194.00 plus 32 percent of 43K pesos.

Roughly 1650 USD.

So not horrible.

Edited June 18Jun 18 by Jingthing

This explains with a good example exactly how the Portuguese progressive taxation system works.

It's still bad but not nearly as bad as I thought before.

www.tax121.com/blog/portugal-income-tax-complete-guide-for-2025-2026-rates-brackets-filing

There is even a tax calculator!

www.tax121.com/portugal/income-tax-calculator

Example: Single Resident Earning €50,000

Assume you are a single tax resident with a gross employment salary of €50,000 per year and no other income. After the standard Category A deduction of €4,104 (or actual expenses if higher), your taxable income is approximately €45,896.

Applying the 2025/2026 brackets:

Bracket	Taxable Amount	Rate	Tax
Up to €7,703	€7,703	13.25%	€1,020.65
€7,703 – €11,623	€3,920	18.00%	€705.60
€11,623 – €16,472	€4,849	23.00%	€1,115.27
€16,472 – €21,321	€4,849	26.00%	€1,260.74
€21,321 – €27,146	€5,825	32.75%	€1,907.69
€27,146 – €39,791	€12,645	37.00%	€4,678.65
€39,791 – €45,896	€6,105	43.50%	€2,655.68
Total			€13,344.28

Edited June 18Jun 18 by Jingthing

On 6/17/2026 at 6:56 AM, Jingthing said:

A general comment on the value of moving to a country that offers retired expats inclusion in a high quality national health care system.

If you're quite old with preexisting conditions, private insurance if you can get it is going to be very very costly and often won't include conditions that you mostly need it for anyway. So in many cases "self insurance" makes sense but very risky.

This puts the taxation in Portugal in some kind of context.

It's high but you get something significant for it.

A personal call if it's worth it for you.

Similarly Costa Rica has become rather high living cost compared to most Latin American options but you get entry into their excellent health care system (for an additional cost of percentage of income).

Another example is France which has one of the top health systems in the world and people are surprised to learn there are more budget friendly location options there (obviously not Paris). Personally, I don't think I could deal with all those French people though.

French people are lovely - if you speak French with them :)

On 6/17/2026 at 1:01 PM, Prubangboy said:

Ulan Baatar- or Ulan, if you are autistic- is the worst town I’ve been to in Asia. A lot of flat roof crumbling Soviet buildings. Not that friendly either.

My escape destination would be KL. It would be close I know to Bangkok to satisfy, minus the weed, which is really available there from any taxi driver.

I have an offer of a cultural visa in Laos due to the historic preservation work. I have done there. That was a long time ago, so I inquired last year if the offer was still good.

It still is, but I’d have to think of a new pretend project to work on and toss someone $500.

No tax, no 90 day reporting, just a yearly renewable

But leave any ham radio gear at home if you want to avoid deporttion.. :)

6 minutes ago, simon43 said:

French people are lovely - if you speak French with them :)

Yeah but mispronounce a word and off with your head.

OK, here's another one.

I haven't looked into these very deeply yet, but superficially they might even have "Plan A" potential as Chile seems to check so many boxes.

Valparaiso OR Vina del Mar Chile

-- Qualify for retirement visa, path to permanent residency in perhaps 4 years. Citizenship possible. An oddity -- they accept English language documents, no need to translate to Spanish. A long but simple enough application process from months to over a year. You apply from outside Chile. I have no idea why they take so long!

-- Chile is a relatively rich for South America now a higher cost first world country. That means the capitol Santiago is not very affordable for moderate income level retirees. But it's a big country so there are other good options.

-- Highly rated health care. Two options. Can buy into their national system for about 100 USD a month or opt for more expensive private insurance if you can get it.

-- Without a car, no problem

-- Weather mild

-- Haven't looked into the food yet as I know nothing about Chilean food but but both are cities so surely some international options

-- Safety level high.

-- Very gay friendly

-- Taxation -- !!! Much conflicting info. Possible problem. However there is an initial 3 year tax holiday possibly to extend to 6 year. Not sure about pensions, etc. Would need to consult with a Chilean taxation expert.

-- Language -- English widely spoken among younger people and of course in tourism oriented areas.

Special risks -- EARTHQUAKES!

Many people describe Santiago as too boring and not very much like a typical Latin American city.

Special perks -- WINE, You are allowed to work or open a business on retirement visa

Edited June 19Jun 19 by Jingthing

I'm thinking Vina would be better for retirement residence than Valparaiso which would be better for tourism.

Sorry already finding I got some things wrong about Chile. As I said, just went superficial so far. Also I could have been projecting info about good areas of Santiago to the Valparaiso and Vina. English speaking much less than I thought so learning Spanish would be essential. Also, not that safe which of course would be a deal killer for many.

Also it's not only quakes, it also wildfires. Really sounds like California. Vina has been described as like Santa Monica California (which is a very nice very expensive place).

It's always something. An interesting detail -- if you applied for the retirement visa from outside Chile, once you got it you have 90 days to fly to Chile to activate it but I don't think you'd have to stay there long tp keep it valid. Chile is not named afte Chile peppers, as cool as that would have been.

Edited June 19Jun 19 by Jingthing