Soy, Too Much Is Bad, Who Knew?

[mark100]

Yes, it's very true about lactose intolerance of Asian and Afro-Carib people, of which my bio father was a combination of all. However, what I recently found out through my own research (because my Western, HMO doctor was actually more of a hindrance than a help), is that cow's milk allergies and lactose intolerance are two different conditions. Both can affect the GI tract, but lactose intolerance is primarily about the GI tract, whereas an allergy presents auto-immune symptoms in your respiratory system, such as chronic sneezing, runny nose, puffy and red eyes, nasal drip, which can even progress to slight wheezing and asthmatic symptoms. I think in lactose intolerance, it comes down to a lack of lactase (sp?) in your digestive tract, whereas the allergies are a reaction to the protein in the cow's milk.

There are also two proteins in cow's milk which can produce different reactions, such as the whey in milk or the casein found in cheese. They say you are allergic to either one, but I don't know which it is because my ineffectual HMO doctor did not test me or refer me to an allergist, so I will have to figure it out through an elimination diet. I will try to find some good links and post.

*links (the verdict is still out on soy products):

http://www.kidshealth.org/parent/medical/a...lk_allergy.html

http://www.nutramed.com/children/kidsmilk.htm

http://www.faiusa.org/section_home.cfm?sec...ub_section_id=3

http://www.hpakids.org/holistic-health/art...fe-for-Children

http://nutrition.about.com/od/askyournutri...oy_and_kids.htm

http://www.westonaprice.org/soy/darkside.html

http://www.thevegetariansite.com/vegchild.htm

https://www.lawyersandsettlements.com/case/...infant_leukemia

http://www.parenting.com/parenting/child/a...1620006,00.html

Kat an allergy is where your immune system produces a strong response to a certain food or chemical being ingested, very few of us have these, an intolerance is more common and may be affected by the amount of offending food you eat, a small amount may have a little or no effect.

[kat]

Yes, I know what an allergy is, and I explained it already in a former post, including the difference between allergies and intolerance.

I have an allergy, and I am sure, because I was tested for it by a doctor.

*and also because the reactions and direct cause and effect between what you eat and your body become completely obvious to yourself and everyone around you. When I eat dairy products, everyone in my office knows, because I sneeze literally about 15 times in a row, with runny nose and puffy, red eyes, sometimes in more than one set.

Edited November 3, 2007 by kat

[Boo]

It's very difficult in a 5month old to diagnose the exact problem but the dietician & pediatrician here in the UK both beleive he is allergic rather than lactose intolerant as his symptoms were more in line with allergy. The dietician here has advised that some soya, like yogurt, is fine in small doses as when you are weaning a baby it is very restricting if they can't eat yogurt for example & as this is coming from a society that doens't like soya for young children, I feel her advice is safe enough but have decided that once he is well into the finger food stage, will remove all other soya but at this stage have to use the yogurts to make up his dietry requirements. Will def look around for more rice based products though.

God it's a minefield isn't it? Hopefully he may grow out of it as they have advised that many babies will be able to eat a limited dairy diet once over the age of 2 but they plan on starting the actual allergy testing once he is over a year old.

Thanks all for the advice on this.

[mark100]

Yes, I know what an allergy is, and I explained it already in a former post, including the difference between allergies and intolerance.

I have an allergy, and I am sure, because I was tested for it by a doctor.

*and also because the reactions and direct cause and effect between what you eat and your body become completely obvious to yourself and everyone around you. When I eat dairy products, everyone in my office knows, because I sneeze literally about 15 times in a row, with runny nose and puffy, red eyes, sometimes in more than one set.

lm sorry l did'nt read the post properley, you did explain it very well.

[mark100]

It's very difficult in a 5month old to diagnose the exact problem but the dietician & pediatrician here in the UK both beleive he is allergic rather than lactose intolerant as his symptoms were more in line with allergy. The dietician here has advised that some soya, like yogurt, is fine in small doses as when you are weaning a baby it is very restricting if they can't eat yogurt for example & as this is coming from a society that doens't like soya for young children, I feel her advice is safe enough but have decided that once he is well into the finger food stage, will remove all other soya but at this stage have to use the yogurts to make up his dietry requirements. Will def look around for more rice based products though.

God it's a minefield isn't it? Hopefully he may grow out of it as they have advised that many babies will be able to eat a limited dairy diet once over the age of 2 but they plan on starting the actual allergy testing once he is over a year old.

Thanks all for the advice on this.

lt really is a minefield, my lectures at uni on the subject last week took up the whole day !! With an allergy the fist time you eat the offending food you will have a reaction, the second time your body will send an army of cells from the immune system to attack the food because it has built antibodies against the intruder, this is what causes the violent reactions you see in people when they just consume a tiny amount of a food they are allergic to. With an intolerance the reaction is normally mild compared to allergies, my lactose intolerance is uncomfortable but not damaging to my health.

There is around 80% chance your son will grow out of the problem, good luck and l hope your son is well in the future.

[kat]

Yes, I know what an allergy is, and I explained it already in a former post, including the difference between allergies and intolerance.

I have an allergy, and I am sure, because I was tested for it by a doctor.

*and also because the reactions and direct cause and effect between what you eat and your body become completely obvious to yourself and everyone around you. When I eat dairy products, everyone in my office knows, because I sneeze literally about 15 times in a row, with runny nose and puffy, red eyes, sometimes in more than one set.

lm sorry l did'nt read the post properley, you did explain it very well.

It's alright - I know it was a bit confusing because first I said I wasn't tested, and in the responding post I said I was tested. What I mean is that I was tested initially for allergies with the IgE blood test, which confirmed it, but I wasn't given any further tests to whittle down what exactly, such as skin tests, etc.

Since you know a lot about allergies, I want to share my experience. I grew up drinking and eating cow milk products, and never once thought or suspected I had an allergy. In graduate school, well into adult life, I decided to stop eating all dairy for a summer after listening to Gary Null, a food nutritionist advocate. When I returned to school in the fall, stress and rushed eating habits kicked in, and I started eating dairy again. I had such a severe reaction, that at one point I almost couldn't breathe, my face was swollen, my eyes fire red, and it was so obvious to my house mates that they insisted on taking me to the emergency clinic on campus. I had a sneaking suspicion that it could've been the reintroduction of milk, but I didn't know for sure, because it could've been the dust in my room as well - I didn't know. I went to live in Asia after my studies concluded, and drank and consumed dairy much less frequently. So, I'm not surprised that I was recently diagnosed with a milk allergy, but it didn't really "appear" until I removed the substance for a couple of months, and then reintroduced it.

Does that sound logical? If that is the case, then isn't there something to say about building up a tolerance to it? I love cheese and dairy, and I just cannot imagine never again eating a beautiful, stuffed ravioli with goat cheese and pasta sauce, or brie and .... well, you get the idea - cheese!

What say you? How should I cope with this?

Thanks for your advice.

[mark100]

Yes, I know what an allergy is, and I explained it already in a former post, including the difference between allergies and intolerance.

I have an allergy, and I am sure, because I was tested for it by a doctor.

*and also because the reactions and direct cause and effect between what you eat and your body become completely obvious to yourself and everyone around you. When I eat dairy products, everyone in my office knows, because I sneeze literally about 15 times in a row, with runny nose and puffy, red eyes, sometimes in more than one set.

lm sorry l did'nt read the post properley, you did explain it very well.

It's alright - I know it was a bit confusing because first I said I wasn't tested, and in the responding post I said I was tested. What I mean is that I was tested initially for allergies with the IgE blood test, which confirmed it, but I wasn't given any further tests to whittle down what exactly, such as skin tests, etc.

Since you know a lot about allergies, I want to share my experience. I grew up drinking and eating cow milk products, and never once thought or suspected I had an allergy. In graduate school, well into adult life, I decided to stop eating all dairy for a summer after listening to Gary Null, a food nutritionist advocate. When I returned to school in the fall, stress and rushed eating habits kicked in, and I started eating dairy again. I had such a severe reaction, that at one point I almost couldn't breathe, my face was swollen, my eyes fire red, and it was so obvious to my house mates that they insisted on taking me to the emergency clinic on campus. I had a sneaking suspicion that it could've been the reintroduction of milk, but I didn't know for sure, because it could've been the dust in my room as well - I didn't know. I went to live in Asia after my studies concluded, and drank and consumed dairy much less frequently. So, I'm not surprised that I was recently diagnosed with a milk allergy, but it didn't really "appear" until I removed the substance for a couple of months, and then reintroduced it.

Does that sound logical? If that is the case, then isn't there something to say about building up a tolerance to it? I love cheese and dairy, and I just cannot imagine never again eating a beautiful, stuffed ravioli with goat cheese and pasta sauce, or brie and .... well, you get the idea - cheese!

What say you? How should I cope with this?

Thanks for your advice.

Kat l will try to answer your questions as best l can, although your case is a little confusing. Normally children grow out of allergies but adults rarely do.

People diagnosd with allergies are all different, some can eat a tiny piece of the offending food and have a teribble reaction, whereas others can eat a relatively large amount and not have a reaction. So for sure tolerance definitely plays a part in the equation, and l think it's possible in your case your tolerance level has altered over the years but you still remained allergic for the whole period.

Something to consider with milk is the chemicals added to preserve it, would this have a bearing on your allergy ??

l will try to find out some more information for you on this and what foods you may be able to eat as alternatives, because l work as a personal trainer l will only give advice when lm 100% sure, so give me a few days and l will get back to you.

[kat]

oh, thanks Mark, that's really sweet. Don't worry too much about it. I think sometimes we can have a dormant allergy, but once you remove the substance and then reintroduce it like I did, your built up tolerance lowers, and your body seems to "suddenly" react. Anyway, that's my theory.

Cool that you're a personal trainer. I'm glad you're on the forum. I need to work out, but I'm in the states right now.

[mark100]

oh, thanks Mark, that's really sweet. Don't worry too much about it. I think sometimes we can have a dormant allergy, but once you remove the substance and then reintroduce it like I did, your built up tolerance lowers, and your body seems to "suddenly" react. Anyway, that's my theory.

Cool that you're a personal trainer. I'm glad you're on the forum. I need to work out, but I'm in the states right now.

l think you could be right, and we have to remember no two people are the same and we all react in different ways.

l'm currently in my second year of a degree course in Nutritional Therapy which l study by distance learning format, last week l was in the UK for one of my attendance weeks and oddly enough we had a day of lectures on food allergies. l have to write an essay on the subject and l've decided to focus on allergies in different cultures, Thailand and the UK will be included, and the USA where there seems to be high allergy rates amoungst the population.

Part of what l'm doing will include milk and dairy products and l will post my findings here on forum, and l will look deeper into what we discussed today with regards to tolerance and let you know in the next few days.

[kat]

Thanks so much, Mark. Let me know if you need information on allergies in the states. It seems like everyone here has them.

[madted]

Having read through this thread, two things occur to me that I didn't see mentioned.

First, it's only unfermented soya products that are harmful.

Second, have those who are allergic to cows' milk tried goats' milk, or even sheep's or more exotic animals'?

Ted

[Kaojai]

OK, according to this article. too much soy, and many of us are eating too much soy without even knowing it because its hidden in many modern food products, is harmful.

Sounds like the article was written by a shill for the dairy industry.

From a Harvard report:

Finally, there's no evidence that pills containing isoflavones extracted from soybeans offer benefits, and some studies raise concerns about harmful side effects.(12)

But, as for regular soy in the diet:

Straight talk about soy

One protein source that has been getting a lot of attention is soybeans. We've been told that regularly eating soy-based foods lowers cholesterol, chills hot flashes, prevents breast and prostate cancer, aids weight loss, and wards off osteoporosis. Some of these benefits have been attributed a unique characteristic of soybeans-their high concentrations of isoflavones, a type of plant-made estrogen (phytoestrogen).

Media reports tout the joys of soy, and food makers are churning out new soy products that are moving into the mainstream. In Boston, for example, soymilk is now advertised on the radio during Boston Red Sox games, alongside donuts, oil additives, and beer.

As is so often the case, some of the claims made for soy were based on preliminary evidence, while others go far beyond the available evidence. Back in 1999, the Food and Drug Administration let companies claim that foods containing soy protein "may reduce the risk of heart disease."(11) The claim was based on early research showing that soy protein lowered levels of LDL (bad) cholesterol. A number of solid studies done since then have tempered this finding,(12) as well as those regarding soy's effects on other conditions.

Heart disease: A 1995 meta-analysis of 38 controlled clinical trials showed that eating approximately 50 grams of soy protein a day in place of animal protein reduced total cholesterol levels by 9.3 percent, LDL cholesterol by 12.9 percent, and triglycerides by 10.5 percent.(13) Such reductions, if sustained over time, could have meant a 20 percent reduction in the risk of heart attack, stroke, or other forms of cardiovascular disease. An updated look at the soy story, which includes several strong studies published since 2000, isn't so bullish on soy and cholesterol. According to this comprehensive update of soy research by the American Heart Association's nutrition committee, eating 50 grams of soy lowers LDL only about 3%.(12) Keep in mind that 50 grams of soy protein is more than half the average person's daily protein requirement. It's the equivalent of 1½ pounds of tofu or eight 8-ounce glasses of soymilk a day.

All this doesn't mean you need to turn up your nose at tofu, tempeh, soy milk or ignore edamame (a fancy name for soybeans). The AHA committee says that even though soy protein itself has little direct effect on cholesterol, soy foods are good for the heart and blood vessels because they usually replace less healthful choices, like red meat, and because they deliver plenty of polyunsaturated fat, fiber, vitamins, and minerals, and are low in saturated fat.

http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/protein.html

[Jingthing]

Sounds like the article was written by a shill for the dairy industry.

You really think so????? So you think left wing Utne Reader is a shill for any industry (except maybe hemp and Birkenstocks?)? I doubt it!

Editor's Note: Kaayla Daniel is a certified clinical nutritionist with a Ph.D. in nutritional sciences and anti-aging therapies from the Union Institute and University of Cincinnati, Ohio. She is the author of The Whole Soy Story: The Dark Side of America's Favorite Health Food (New Trends, 2005).

Edited November 4, 2007 by Jingthing

[mark100]

Having read through this thread, two things occur to me that I didn't see mentioned.

First, it's only unfermented soya products that are harmful.

Second, have those who are allergic to cows' milk tried goats' milk, or even sheep's or more exotic animals'?

Ted

Sorry your information is wrong, fermentation does reduce the Phytoestrogens count but it does not elimnate them.

[mark100]

OK, according to this article. too much soy, and many of us are eating too much soy without even knowing it because its hidden in many modern food products, is harmful.

Sounds like the article was written by a shill for the dairy industry.

From a Harvard report:

Finally, there's no evidence that pills containing isoflavones extracted from soybeans offer benefits, and some studies raise concerns about harmful side effects.(12)

But, as for regular soy in the diet:

Straight talk about soy

One protein source that has been getting a lot of attention is soybeans. We've been told that regularly eating soy-based foods lowers cholesterol, chills hot flashes, prevents breast and prostate cancer, aids weight loss, and wards off osteoporosis. Some of these benefits have been attributed a unique characteristic of soybeans-their high concentrations of isoflavones, a type of plant-made estrogen (phytoestrogen).

Media reports tout the joys of soy, and food makers are churning out new soy products that are moving into the mainstream. In Boston, for example, soymilk is now advertised on the radio during Boston Red Sox games, alongside donuts, oil additives, and beer.

As is so often the case, some of the claims made for soy were based on preliminary evidence, while others go far beyond the available evidence. Back in 1999, the Food and Drug Administration let companies claim that foods containing soy protein "may reduce the risk of heart disease."(11) The claim was based on early research showing that soy protein lowered levels of LDL (bad) cholesterol. A number of solid studies done since then have tempered this finding,(12) as well as those regarding soy's effects on other conditions.

Heart disease: A 1995 meta-analysis of 38 controlled clinical trials showed that eating approximately 50 grams of soy protein a day in place of animal protein reduced total cholesterol levels by 9.3 percent, LDL cholesterol by 12.9 percent, and triglycerides by 10.5 percent.(13) Such reductions, if sustained over time, could have meant a 20 percent reduction in the risk of heart attack, stroke, or other forms of cardiovascular disease. An updated look at the soy story, which includes several strong studies published since 2000, isn't so bullish on soy and cholesterol. According to this comprehensive update of soy research by the American Heart Association's nutrition committee, eating 50 grams of soy lowers LDL only about 3%.(12) Keep in mind that 50 grams of soy protein is more than half the average person's daily protein requirement. It's the equivalent of 1½ pounds of tofu or eight 8-ounce glasses of soymilk a day.

All this doesn't mean you need to turn up your nose at tofu, tempeh, soy milk or ignore edamame (a fancy name for soybeans). The AHA committee says that even though soy protein itself has little direct effect on cholesterol, soy foods are good for the heart and blood vessels because they usually replace less healthful choices, like red meat, and because they deliver plenty of polyunsaturated fat, fiber, vitamins, and minerals, and are low in saturated fat.

http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/protein.html

lt is true soya does have health benefits, but l think the chance of developing thyroid problems would be enough of reason not to consume this product. The post l wrote on the bad effects of soya only touched on the subject, there are other side effects l did not list. Children seem to more at risk of developng problems, and l know l will not let my 3 year old daughter anywhere near soya if l can help it.

[Beachbunny]

If you have gout you should limit your intake of any soy products and do NOT drink soy milk....too much protein. It can actually give you a gout attack.

Beachbunny

[Kaojai]

Editor's Note: Kaayla Daniel is a certified clinical nutritionist with a Ph.D. in nutritional sciences and anti-aging therapies from the Union Institute and University of Cincinnati, Ohio. She is the author of The Whole Soy Story: The Dark Side of America's Favorite Health Food (New Trends, 2005).

Getting a Ph.D. and writing a book doesn't exempt one from being a nutcase.

Since the comment by the American Heart Association represents a consensus of opinion in a genuinely respected medical association, I would give it greater credence.

The AHA committee says that even though soy protein itself has little direct effect on cholesterol, soy foods are good for the heart and blood vessels because they usually replace less healthful choices, like red meat, and because they deliver plenty of polyunsaturated fat, fiber, vitamins, and minerals, and are low in saturated fat

In any event, the article was written by Mary Vance, whose qualifications aren't mentionned.

And, the allegedly super qualified nutritionist is all over the place with her conspiracy worrries:

In Kenya, the soy industry is talking to bakers, teaching them to use soy flour in baked goods, and down in Johannesburg they're working on using soy protein shake powders to help AIDS patients. When the tsunami hit [in 2004], the soy industry was right there giving people assistance and free soy products. Rather than helping people pick up the pieces and get their small farms back together, they're replacing local foods with something that's global.

Following the devastation of the tsunami these nefarious demons were handing out soy products rather than local food??

She didn't mention alien invaders, but she was headed in that direction.

Here's an extract from a response by someone else who wrote a book (since you are obviously impressed by people who get their ideas printed):

The article’s author, Kaayla Daniel, repeatedly says that people of China, Japan and other countries in Asia eat very little soy, so there is no historical precedent for eating the amounts being recommended by people like Dr. Andrew Weil and Dr. Christiane Northrup. This is a misleading half truth. It is true that in parts of Asia, most notably China, soy consumption has been low. But Asia is a very large area with several billion people.

What’s important is not the average soy consumption for the whole of Asia, but the soy consumption in those parts of Asia which demonstrate the highest levels of human health. And there is no question about where that is. The elder population of Okinawa (a prefecture of Japan) have the best health and greatest longevity on the planet.

This is important because the highest soy consumption in the world is in Okinawa. Many North Americans know of Okinawa only for being the site of one of the longest and bloodiest battles of World War II, and for now housing U.S. military bases. But the people of Okinawa have repeatedly been shown to be the healthiest and longest-lived people in the world. This has been demonstrated conclusively by the renowned Okinawa Centenarian Study, a 25-year study sponsored by the Japanese Ministry of Health.

How much soy have the elder Okinawans eaten throughout their lives? The Okinawa Centenarian Study included an extremely thorough analysis of food consumption in the prefecture. The principle investigators and authors of the study (Makoto Suzuki, M.D., Bradley J. Willcox, M.D., and D. Craig Willcox, Ph.D.) state: “Okinawan elders eat an average of two servings of flavonoid-rich soy products per day.”

This is about 20 times more than the amount of soy Kaayla Daniel claims “Asians really eat.” When she says “there is no historical precedent for eating the large amounts of soy food now being consumed,” she is incorrect. Soy makes up twelve percent of the diet of Okinawan elders.

The authors of the Okinawan Centenarian Study analyzed the diet and health profiles of Okinawan elders and compared them to other elder populations throughout the world. They conclude that high soy consumption is one of the main reasons that Okinawans are at extremely low risk for hormone–dependent cancers, including cancers of the breast, prostate, ovaries, and colon. Compared to North Americans, they have a staggering 80 percent less breast cancer and prostate cancer, and less than half the ovarian cancer and colon cancer.

This enormously reduced cancer risk arises in part, the study’s authors say, from the Okinawans large consumption of isoflavones from soy. This is an important finding. The lowest cancer rates in the industrialized world are found in the Okinawans who consume the most soy.

Other studies have confirmed the link between soy consumption and reduced cancer risk. The Japan Public Health Center Study found the lowest breast cancer rates in those prefectures where women ate the most soy products. And a recent study published in the British medical journal Lancet showed that women who ate the most flavonoids (mostly isoflavones from soy products) had a substantially lower risk for breast cancer than those who had lower flavonoid intake.

The reason the ardently pro-pharmaceutical FDA wound up affirming that soybeans are a food that can prevent and even help cure disease was not, as Kaayla Daniel says, because the agency is in bed with the soy industry, but because the evidence was so convincing. The reason the FDA now allows food manufacturers to talk about the benefits of heart-healthy soy in their products is because the substantiating data are overwhelming.

Indeed, the authors of the 25-year Okinawa Centenarian Study state that high soy consumption in Okinawa is one of the primary reasons elder Okinawans have 80 percent fewer heart attacks than North Americans do. Their high soy consumption is also why, if Okinawans do suffer a heart attack, they are more than twice as likely to survive.

John Robbins

Author, Diet For A New America, May All Be Fed, and The Food Revolution

[Jingthing]

So there is major disagreement.

I already lost my thyroid.

What are people who still have thyroids supposed to do? This is typical really with these kinds of things, mixed messages.

[madted]

As with many foodstuffs, there are pros and cons to soya beans. Certain fermented soya products have been shown to be beneficial to heart health, for example, which may outweigh the effect of small amounts of some toxic substances.

Anything consumed in excess can kill, even water. As for cows' milk, or any other animals' milk, it was designed for babies, and any adult drinking large quantities on a regular basis is asking for trouble.

Ted

[Jingthing]

Soy milk and tofu are not fermented.

[mark100]

So there is major disagreement.

I already lost my thyroid.

What are people who still have thyroids supposed to do? This is typical really with these kinds of things, mixed messages.

Jingthing because l work as a personal trainer l really can't afford to give advice that is my personal opinion, l only offer scientifically proven facts and the university l study at is one of the best in the UK, and doesn't teach students conjecture.

l'm now 35 years old and l have been working in this industry since l was 16, l've been invovled in top level sport since l was 8, and participated in 2 or 3 different sports at national level. Currently l'm in my second year of a degree in Nutritional Therapy which l study by distance learning format from here in Thailand. l have worked with Premership football teams, atheletes, national level rugby sides and various companies here in Asia, so my repuatation means everything to me.

The problem in this case is that there are health benefits of soya, l don't dispute this, and you only have to do a google search to do see a long list of positives, but the negative effects of soya can't be ignored, especially the very strong link to thyroid damage.

My personal opinion is that consuming large amounts of soya is not good for your health, small amounts maybe ok because l think tolerance plays apart here, but l would not risk it.

Playing russian roulette with your thyroid is not my idea of fun, especially when there are safe alternatives to eating soya.

Hope this helps and l'm sorry if you are confused, good luck in the future. Mark

[mark100]

Please note in the above post l make a reference to my personal opinion, the facts l have offered are my personal opinion based upon proven facts, not something l have thought up for myself. Sorry for the confusion.

[Jingthing]

Thanks Mark. Its not so much that I am confused. More that like many of these nutritional controversies, there tends to be a vast range of opinions. Plus, we are dealing with a moving target and different studies done under different standards over time. Similar to coffee. Sometimes you hear benefits. Sometime you hear about risks. It is a shame if soy really is damaging as it is a very economic protein that is enjoyed throughout the world.

I am glad some more people are aware of the risks and they can decide for themselves.

Edited November 5, 2007 by Jingthing

[mark100]

Thanks Mark. Its not so much that I am confused. More that like many of these nutritional controversies, there tends to be a vast range of opinions. Plus, we are dealing with a moving target and different studies done under different standards over time. Similar to coffee. Sometimes you hear benefits. Sometime you hear about risks. It is a shame if soy really is damaging as it is a very economic protein that is enjoyed throughout the world.

I am glad some more people are aware of the risks and they can decide for themselves.

There have been 2 high profile studies on tomatoes released within the last 6 months, both totally contradict the other, which one is correct ??

One thing for sure if a product that the majority of the world consumes on a regular basis turns out to be harmful, there are going to be a large group of people invovled that would not want that information made public.

Watch this space because l'm sure there will be more media interest in soya in the near future.

[Tammi]

I suppose that soy is eaten in Japan the most. Does anyone know if studies have been done on the Japanese and what the results were?

I think I will carry on enjoying soy once or twice a week and not get my knickers in a twist.

[Jingthing]

I suppose that soy is eaten in Japan the most. Does anyone know if studies have been done on the Japanese and what the results were?

I think I will carry on enjoying soy once or twice a week and not get my knickers in a twist.

Also depends on what kind of soy, whether fermented or not. For example, miso soup is much different than tofu or soy milk. Also consider genetic differences varying across racial groups. A population that has been eating this for a long time might have adapted?

[sabaijai]

OK, according to this article. too much soy, and many of us are eating too much soy without even knowing it because its hidden in many modern food products, is harmful. And people who have been using soy milk to replace cows milk (as I do) are really damaged. Does this sound credible?

Another interesting problem. According to this article, drinking soy milk hurts your thyroid. My thyroid is already gone, and I don't like milk, I prefer soy milk. Can someone like me continue to drink soy milk without harm because the damage is already done?

<a href="http://www.utne.com/2007-07-01/2007-142-Ho...s-Too-Much.aspx" target="_blank">http://www.utne.com/2007-07-01/2007-142-Ho...s-Too-Much.aspx</a>

More on the dark side of soy. Its funny real. Something we were taught is healthy, perhaps the opposite of healthy? Chang beer is looking better, but it doesn't go so well over breakfast cereal:

<a href="http://"http://www.utne.com/2007-07-01/TheDarkSideofSoy.aspx"" target="_blank"><a href="http://www.utne.com/2007-07-01/TheDarkSideofSoy.aspx" target="_blank">http://www.utne.com/2007-07-01/TheDarkSideofSoy.aspx</a></a>

l work as a personal trainer and lm currently studying for a degree in Nutritonal Therapy so maybe l can answer some of your questions on Soya.

Soya contrary to popular believe is no longer considered to be good for you, and there is overwhelming scientific eveidence to support this theory.

Soya is widely used in over 60% of the processed foods we consume (food industry figures), although food companies use many different names on their food labels so it's not always apparent that the food you are eating contains Soya.

Soya contains chemicals that have been proved to damage your health, they are called Phytates. Phytates ( Phlic Acid )affect your abilty to absorb certain minerals and can interfere with protein digestion. Calcium is one of the minerals effected by Phytates so if you become deficient in this vitally important mineral it could effect your bone denisty and lead to osteoporosis.

The main problem with Soya is it contains Phytoestrogens, originally these chemicals were thought to be beneficial to health, but these are some of the possible side-effects of consuming large amounts Phytoestrogens.

Thyroid function is effected, normally depressed which can lead to Goitre, Hypothyroidism and Auto-Immune Thyroid Disease.

Feeding your baby with Soya milk is the equivalent to giving your child five birth control pills a day, girls can have puberty at age 3 from ingesting Phytoestrogens and there is a possible link to penis damage in young boys. Brain damage and retardation is another possible side effect for young boys.

Years ago it was thought Soya was good for you because it was consumed in the far east in large amounts,especially Japan. Studies have found this to be inaccurate and the average consumption of Soya was no more than 8-10 grams in the average Japanese person.

For sure Phytoestrogens do have health benefits, but for me the negatives far outweigh the postives.

Good post. Google 'soy(a) toxicity' and you will find hundreds of corroborating articles.

[Sheryl]

The amount of phytoestrogens in soy is small (for which reason, the idea that eating a lot of soy milk & tofu will help menopasual symptoms is pretty far-fetched...you'd have to consume a ridiculously large amount to make any difference).

Where we are all being over-exposed to phytoestrogenes is through the insecticides our fruits and vegetables and grains have been ttreated with. in addition, there are sex hormones in milk products and meat have as a result of supplements given to livestock.

The scare talk about early puberty, male feminization etc has some grain of truth in it but the main culprit is not soya but insecticides and other trappings of non-organic farming and animal husbandry.

As for soya itself, the Japanese probably consume more of it than anyone else, and have excellent health status.

Go right ahead and eat as much soya as you want. If you're worried about phtytoestrogens, make it organic soy products and organically grown/raised everything else too, or as much as practical.