Fahrenheit 911 Too Hot For Bangkok

[Boon Mee]

Michael Moore is a raving lunitic and his "movie" is the biggest heap of Ca Ca since his last stupid movie. For example:

"We need to change our ethic and aspire to be more Canadian-like,"

Friday September 6 6:31 PM EST

Michael Moore Takes Aim at U.S. Gun Culture

That's right EH! We need a really BIG government to raise our taxes to like 60% so that we can get sh1t medical care for free. He wants Socialism.

[Khun ?]

Wish we could trade him for a slab of canadian bacon. He could not pass the military entrance exam to get in and was to big of a slob also. Maybe that is his vendette. Unemployable Ford and GM could not afford lazy nonproductive people as

such and exist any longer..... He is a slagger and the only way he can get attention is by trying to make others look worse than himself. I don't even think he could quailfy to carry books for a english teacher in thailand.

[igotworms]

Michael Moore is a raving lunitic and his "movie" is the biggest heap of Ca Ca since his last stupid movie.  For example:

"We need to change our ethic and aspire to be more Canadian-like,"

Friday September 6 6:31 PM EST

Michael Moore Takes Aim at U.S. Gun Culture

That's right EH! We need a really BIG government to raise our taxes to like 60% so that we can get sh1t medical care for free. He wants Socialism.

Thats right...blame Canada! With regards to that quote, Moore was speaking about gun culture: Hand guns are illegal in Canada. We have tight, restrictive gun laws. We do not have Gun Shows. We do not walk around armed to the teeth. For the most part, Canadians do not shoot each other as frequently as Americans do. The statistics show this. Thus, Moore is saying that America should look at Canada and see where they are going wrong. I would start with the hand guns and the gun shows. The NRA is a sick and twisted organization. They are gun pimps. As are the republicans. http://www.guncontrol.ca/Content/Cda-US.htm

Canada has a tax rate of 60%? For the middleclass its more like 32%. Our taxes may be higher than America's but our cost of living is much lower.

We have free health care! 60 million Americans do not have health insurance. Granted, some Canadian city health care providers are overworked and underfunded but the majority of Canadians have easy access to high quality health care. So far the Canadian health care experiment is working but it will need to be improved upon and optimized.

The U.N. has continually ranked Canada has the best overall country to live in for the past 1o years consecutively....this is in regards to standard of living, health care, crime rate, education, etc. However, recently Canada has been bumped to fourth after Australia, Sweden and Norway. But that will change. http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Canada/2004/07/15/544170-cp.html

I have lived in the States. I enjoyed it. They are both great countries. 1 billion dollars of trade crosses the border beween Canada and the US daily. It is the largest trade partnership in the world. The two countries are dependent upon each other.

Alas, Canada is the fly on the wall. We see everything but nobody sees us and we like it that way. We are among the G7 countries, one of the 7 richest countries in the world. Yet, we only have 30 million people. We are doing something right.

[drummer]

Honestly I could care less who wins, all politicians are the same, not a honest one in the lot.

I just get a nagging feeling we'll be seeing another 4 yrs! I'd like to see what he might do with no re-election process hanging over his head. (might be interesting to say the least)

Interesting? How about morbid! How about my earlier post that said their plan was to invade all of the Middle East starting with Iraq? That is exactly what you can expect if he wins again. First Iran, then Syria. They've alerady used 26.2 million to restart the draft board. You are starting to sound like a Naderite!

Bush has a track record of lying, cheating, stealing, pushing through dangerous legislation that is in no way, shape or form in the US's interests.

Kerry, at least, has a track record of doing what he thinks best. I say this because the League of Environmental Voters give his the highest rating out of any Senator. This indicates to me that, at least, he is making his own decisions.

Even if they were the same, what would Kerry do - Invade Mexico for the tomatoes?

[drummer]

That's right EH! We need a really BIG government to raise our taxes to like 60% so that we can get sh1t medical care for free. He wants Socialism.

Thats on the level as the anti-american post earlier.

That is unfair because you are comparing apples and oranges to get an unfavorable comparison.

(To use Bush Lingo)

You see, some people on this forum care about the high crime rate in the US. Americans should be able to walk down the street without fear of getting mugged.

People are saying that crime is a big issue in this race, and they are saying that Boon Mee's are unamerican.

You miss the point entirely in your anti-Moore blindness. Your farther off that the guy talking about Hitler. At least he was on the same subject!

re: shit medical care. Many very large US Businesses are now (as of the last couple of years) *advocating* a government health package. They do this because they realize that the premiums they pay are consting them more than extra taxes they would pay if there was a socialized healch care system. Thus, their taxes go up, but their net income go up too. It is in their selfish best interest to have socialized healthcare.

Thats not "from each according to their abilities, to each according to their needs." Thats running the government as a business.

Of course, I haven't even started with the cost of care, the insured paying the uninsured, the drop in disease among covered citizens... Incidentally, the US already has a larger public health system that England or Canada- the Veterans Administration.

I guess your post makes you

(1) pro crime

(2) anti business

(3) pro disease

(4) anti military

(5) anti guns

Way to go, chief. All Aces.

[SoCal]

Canada has a tax rate of 60%? For the middleclass its more like 32%. Our taxes may be higher than America's but our cost of living is much lower.

Please define middle class? Jeesh, that's what I pay the Fed in U.S., not to mention 10% to state, property, gas, sales tax, and yes my arse hurts.

PS- your obviously an impostor, and a fraud. Not once do you end your sentence with - Eh? Nor do you mention beer, or quote Bob & Doug.

[SoCal]

F911 is an excellent documentary. I think it was too conservative and it should have been more critical of Bush. He get away pretty well in that documentary. I was expecting more damaging evidence.

of course the Conservatives Nazis over at Bear Pit (the new NeoCon drinking place) will say otherwise as they are too afraid of the debates and the truth it would reveal.

Go see it, you won't regret it

Ah Bitterfly, Moore only tells white lies and half truths, not blatant. Why did you expect more from Moore?

[igotworms]

Canada has a tax rate of 60%?  For the middleclass its more like 32%.  Our taxes may be higher than America's but our cost of living is much lower.

Please define middle class? Jeesh, that's what I pay the Fed in U.S., not to mention 10% to state, property, gas, sales tax, and yes my arse hurts.

PS- your obviously an impostor, and a fraud. Not once do you end your sentence with - Eh? Nor do you mention beer, or quote Bob & Doug.

32%...thats the federal tax...I forgot to include the provinical tax on top of that.....now we're approaching 40%. But its still cheaper to live eh....sorry...gotta go play beerhunter. Later hoser.

PS

I love moose and beavers. Oh yes, beavers.

[drummer]

I would start with the hand guns and the gun shows. The NRA is a sick and twisted organization. They are gun pimps. As are the republicans.

See- thats the big problem I had with Bowling for Columbine. Moore makes a good argument that guns don't kill people, people kill people. Then he goes and gets Kmart to stop selling bullets!

<deleted>???

The root cause has nothing to do with guns. It has to do with education- both in knowing what the gun does and how it works, and also in knowing enough to not be paranoid.

[Boon Mee]

THE DEMOCRATIC LEADERSHIP COUNCIL has published an article…

"And there you have the essential Moore -- a worldview of America as a failed project and an abiding danger to the planet. No wonder they so love Moore abroad: His is a 1960s vision, hardened in the pre-NAFTA plant closings of the 1980s, of a nation hijacked by the suits, the very guys who for decades gave Moore's father a good job at General Motors. It's from this posture that all the Moorean invective flows."

Full of hateful fiction, Michael Moore's work is the Turner Diaries of the left, and it's likely to have a similar consequence.

http://www.ndol.org/ndol_ci.cfm?cp=1&kaid=...ontentid=252483

[SoCal]

32%...thats the federal tax...I forgot to include the provinical tax on top of that.....now we're approaching 40%. But its still cheaper to live eh....sorry...gotta go play beerhunter. Later hoser.

PS

I love moose and beavers. Oh yes, beavers.

Ah Beaver.

Now I'm more familiar with the south of the border, but hope it still applies.

Just make my way to the border, and run like he!! right? Do you guys provide sandwiches, and maybe some soup on your side of the border like we do, or should I pack a lunch?

Once there, I am entitled to free medical, welfare, and schooling for the kids right?

Is it unlawful for the police (excuse me) mounties to ask for my papers or if I am legal, like it is here?

I better stop before I see all these Brits or Germans crossing our border. Oh yeah, they hate us, ands would rather die than....blah blah blah.

PS- Does Berlitz make a tape on how to speak Canadain, eh?

PSS- Moore is a puss filled, lying, misleading, American hater, but watch him if you want. Your derision means nothing to me.

Make room wormy. I'm commin' in.

[plachon]

F911 is an excellent documentary. I think it was too conservative and it should have been more critical of Bush. He get away pretty well in that documentary. I was expecting more damaging evidence.

of course the Conservatives Nazis over at Bear Pit (the new NeoCon drinking place) will say otherwise as they are too afraid of the debates and the truth it would reveal.

Go see it, you won't regret it

Is that you Butterfly? Haven't seen you round these parts for a while since that little fracas with the NeoCons last year. Where do you hang out these days? I can't be bothered with the circuitous arguments down the Bearpit and so never go there now.

But this kind of nonsense banning documentaries in Bangkok still gets me out of bed for a bit of a laff, reading the substanceless <deleted> that certain old buddies of yore spew. Nothing changes it seems, but it will come November when we can say "Adios" to Dubya. If he stays in any longer, there'll be burning books in the streets of US, like their alter egos - the Muslim fundamentalists.

Bit like a reunion, eh?

PS Hope ya got out the stock market before it folded?

[PvtDick]

Linda Ronstadt was right: Michael Moore is a great American patriot.

[plachon]

Linda Ronstadt was right: Michael Moore is a great American patriot.

Another one who got "banned" for exercising her right to free speech. But then what do you expect in somewhere like Las Vegas?

It's of more concern when people are banned from exercising that same right in New York for the upcoming Neo-Con convention, along with being harassed by the CIA. Should still be a good show in Central Park methinks, when more people turn up to protest than to attend the convention.

[kwiz117]

US Govt have killed enough people in the history of mankind, more than any other terrorist organization or any other govt.

Vietnam, Hiroshima, Nagasaki, Middle east and add all other figures..Hitlar and BinLaden looks like kids compared to this record.

All those killings been justified as, precision guided killings with a good intention of protecting all of us against terror.

Are you being serious?

Do you not know what happened in Vietnam and WWII? Do you call a woman who kills a rapist out of defense, a murderer?!!!

It aggravates me so much if anyone would accuse the americans of being murderers for what they have done to Japan!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Would you still think the same if you were living in China during WWII?(say like your father, mother, brothers and sisters being raped/killed by the Japs)

And for Vietnam, who started the war? Go live in North Korea today yourself!!!

So many bloody idiots in this world!!!!

Don't you understand when I say "Not to quote part of mypost and jump".

You are correct...to say..So many bloody idiots in this world!!!!

"Mirror Mirror on the wall..who is the ..........................."

--------------------------------------------

Just to answer few points..

I did not say "americans of being murderers"..- Don't generalize..

"Interesting to read that your justification of killing millions from two nuclear bombs and invading Vietnam to protect people getting raped, killed by Japanese emperor and Vietnam communist leaders at that time".

Do you know how many innocent Vietnamese died during the war?

If you know anyone married to a Vietnamese girl/boy, you will know how innocent those little people are. I can not imagine how on earth US went and shoot them like culling chicken.

Who started the Vietnam war? That question can be answered, if you can think of 'Who stopped the Vietnam war? If US govt stopped it, then the question should be 'Why on earth US govt didn't do it at the start?'

About North Korea. Yes, no one can go to North Korea like the way (some) went to Iraq? They are dead scared of Koreans coz they really have the stuff that the world is worried about.

You said for me to go and live in North Korea. I am telling you, try to step into Iraq and see how many days/minutes you can live now in Iraq. That is post Sadam era and how they appreciate the help of "Liberating Iraq"..

That's why I say, Sadam, Hitlar, Bin Laden are like kids..compared to real threats..

This 9/11 movie is a personal attack on your Pres. Bush.

Sep 11 is just nothing compared to other past events that I have mentioned above and real threats.

[meadish_sweetball]

Sorry, but what I hear from some of your posts is essentially just the extreme form of individualism that sucks for making a society - what I hear is "I refuse to take responsibility for those who haven't been as lucky as me, who are not as smart, rich or have not landed a job as good as me. They have only themselves to blame. They have freedom, and they mess it up. Tough luck."

While individualism is appealing, in its more extreme forms it is very ugly, because it is egotistic. Were you never raised to consider other people's needs or situations? Is empathy totally beyond you?

We humans are social animals, and need to make concessions with our own needs and wants for the group around us to work smoothly. This is not only true for a small group, it goes for society as well. Your tax paranoia is pretty pathetic, actually. Why should you not contribute to other people's welfare as well as your own? And don't go telling me it evens out in your system, because people with means chose to contribute to private charities by themselves. They don't, not as much, and not for everything that matters for creating a good society.

It is obvious if you check welfare statistics and look at poverty rates, crime rates, levels of education and so forth in countries like Canada, Australia, Sweden, Norway etc. etc.

About guns: the actual proliferation of guns DOES affect the number of killings - it is also totally evident from the statistics.

The ease with which any hillbilly hick can purchase himself the means to wipe out an entire schoolbus is an outdated anomaly and should be done away with as quickly as possible.

Just make sure people undergo some simple testing before they are allowed to play with a deadly weapon. How hard can it be to arrange???? Well, I suppose if you refuse to open your wallet to solve the situation, the situation won't change anyway.

While Michael Moore is not the most sympathetic individual in the universe, exaggerates and simplifies, he provides a nice counterweight to the present ruling bully elite of your happy-clapping empire who daily lay out their smoke screens and successfully create more and more terrorists by the day.

Thai people should have the possibility to see this movie as well, I think. It is being debated and discussed all over the world, and it is not right to leave them out of the discussion, no matter what your opinions are.

Enough. Peace.

[igotworms]

32%...thats the federal tax...I forgot to include the provinical tax on top of that.....now we're approaching 40%.  But its still cheaper to live eh....sorry...gotta go play beerhunter.  Later hoser.

PS

I love moose and beavers.  Oh yes, beavers.

Ah Beaver.

Now I'm more familiar with the south of the border, but hope it still applies.

Just make my way to the border, and run like he!! right? Do you guys provide sandwiches, and maybe some soup on your side of the border like we do, or should I pack a lunch?

Once there, I am entitled to free medical, welfare, and schooling for the kids right?

Is it unlawful for the police (excuse me) mounties to ask for my papers or if I am legal, like it is here?

I better stop before I see all these Brits or Germans crossing our border. Oh yeah, they hate us, ands would rather die than....blah blah blah.

PS- Does Berlitz make a tape on how to speak Canadain, eh?

PSS- Moore is a puss filled, lying, misleading, American hater, but watch him if you want. Your derision means nothing to me.

Make room wormy. I'm commin' in.

Are you a professional? Currently, we are only accepting professionals (i.e. doctors, engineers, etc.). If you are not, try immigrating when the last of the baby boomers finally kick it, there will be a much greater demand then. Or perhaps you can try the refugee angle (unless you are a morman polygamist...they don't fit under the religous persecution umbrella, and will actually be imprisoned in an effort to cleanse the gene pool)

The Mounties will greet you upon arrival...complimentary joints, beers and gay marriage licenses are provided upon request. They may also escort you to your final destination but you'll have to make many stops, to accomodate the horses' feeding schedule.

As for Mr. Moore, at least someone is breaking the norm and voicing an opposition to your current government. He was doing it from the beginning, where no one would dare speak out against Bush and company. Bill Maher got fired from his ABC show, Politically Incorrect for voicing his opinion. The corporate gestapos have a tight grip on every form of media. Moore makes his own to avoid this, albeit with some serious struggle (Disney's decision not to distribute the film).

Moore is obviosly biased. He claims this. He is spreading his opinion...his insights on America and its current path. He is a good manipulator, a good film maker, a great editor. He gets his opinion across very well. Of all the sh*t he claims, surely some of it is true, if not most. Who has outright disproved his claims?

My favourite Bushism from the movie is when Bushy was talking to a crowd of his supporters at a formal dinner:

To paraphrase:

"Its great to be here with the 'haves' and 'have-mores'. My people, my base."

[igotworms]

TORNADO:

You can find the movie at a few of the shops along Bangla Road in Patong. Happy hunting.

[Nemesis]

Did I miss sumpin'? Isn't freedom of speech one of the platforms of a 'democracy?'

Doesn't Thailand claim to be a 'democracy?'

Unless Moore's artistic piece is obscene or intrudes on the rights of others, shouldn't others be able to see it and make up their own mind?

Is this the kind of democracy being 'exported' to Iraq, where I see journalists are now being warned to leave the country or be shot?

[stumonster]

A deep unwavering belief is a sure sign you're missing something

[Nemesis]

Certainly opened my eyes to a few things

I agree totally. Particulaly, the dumb-founded look of Bush as he sat idly in a grade school reading class while Americans, under attack, were dying by the thousands at the WTC.

Exactly. That is what scares the Bush people - us having our eyes opened, not to mention our minds. Seven long minutes of DUUUUUUUUUUUUUHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH.

Wait till the Americans (and others) find out Al Qaeda and OBL had nothing to do with the WTC Demolition.

[Nemesis]

A deep unwavering belief is a sure sign you're missing something

Depends on what you're believing in.

[Nemesis]

The ease with which any hillbilly hick can purchase himself the means to wipe out an entire schoolbus is an outdated anomaly and should be done away with as quickly as possible.

Just make sure people undergo some simple testing before they are allowed to play with a deadly weapon. How hard can it be to arrange????

Maybe we should have had Bush undergo some of these 'tests' you advocate before this Texas hillbilly used the big guns of the US military to invade and occupy Iraq under false pretenses, eh?

Remove defensive weapons from everyone is just what Hitler, Mao and Stalin did, so you're in good company.

As for me, I'll take my chances with the rare deranged hillbilly in a school ground than an allf too often deranged Leader who gains control of an ignorant un-armed population.

The only thing stoppin' the appointed unelected nut in the White House from further moves toward a dictatorship is an armed educated people, an inalienable right granted by God to defend ourselves from people like Hitler, Mao, Stalin and yes, Bush/Cheney/Ashcroft.

[Dancali]

Wow, there's so many arguments flying around I'll just throw in a few points.

About America being an individualistic country to the extreme and that's bad, people tend to forget that America too has high taxes and tons of welfare and social services.

About the conspiracy theory that it wasn't Islamic Terrorists that crashed into the WTC, that sort of nonsense destroys the debater's credibility.

[drummer]

About America being an individualistic country to the extreme and that's bad, people tend to forget that America too has high taxes and tons of welfare and social services. 

About the conspiracy theory that it wasn't Islamic Terrorists that crashed into the WTC, that sort of nonsense destroys the debater's credibility.

Those people aren't forgetting- they're *complaining* about it.

re: conspiracy theory. I was a bit, surprised, at that one, too- but Henry Kissinger once said "Just because you are paranoid, doesn't mean they aren't out to get you."

personally, I really don't know if Bush + Co. had anything to do with it. I highly doubt they had anything to do with the planning, but I would not be surprised if they just allowed it to happen. I reserve judgement for the following reasons...

(1) a 1998 letter to Bill Clinton, signed by Cheney, Rusfeld, et al says ... We need a "catastrophic and catalyzing event, like a new Pearl Harbor" to advance out agenda.

(2) Many, many examples of just such sacrifices include

(a) allowing cruise ships to sail in German U Boat waters. This led to the sinking of the Lusitania and America's entrance into the European side of WW2

( sinking our own ship to enter the Spanish American War

( C.) some reports indicate that Pearl Harbor was anticipated

(d) The Iran-Contra affair, trading arms to the Iranians to keep the hostages to secure the election for Regean

(3) The extroidinary amount of financial gain made by Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld et al from said event.

(4) The extroidinary amount of political gain for by Bush, et al from said event.

(5) The neocon track record, including (2d), Grenada, Panama, Iraq 1+2, etc. + their own statements.

(6) 17 countries giving us sometimes very specific warnings abuot said event.

(7) We gave OURSELVES warning about said event (FBI agents in Minnesota warned about guys with torror connections taking flight school, the head office told them to stand down)

Motive, opportunity, past history. Call me a nut, (everyone else does! ) but it seems plausible, at least. Even if highly circumstantial. Persoanlly, I think the guys a sunnofabush and I really wouldn't put it past him- even less Cheney.

[sprq]

Boon Mee, that's a joke, of course, isn't it? I mean, there can't still in this day and age be Americans that stupid, can there?

But then a destructive moron is president and half the US population doesn't seem to mind, indeed, quite a lot of them love him, so I suppose you could be real, Boon Mee, god help us.

[britmaveric]

Dunno- I think alot of you scare me more than W. I have to laff at all of you yanks with conspiracy theories.

Anyways I think we are way off topic here... I think everyone will agree that Moore's picture should be shown and let yourself decide if its rubbish or not. What more has to be said????

Everyone fails to realize that W haters aren't going to change the minds of W lovers and visa/versa!

[Johpa]

I would start with the hand guns and the gun shows.  The NRA is a sick and twisted organization.  They are gun pimps.  As are the republicans.

See- thats the big problem I had with Bowling for Columbine. Moore makes a good argument that guns don't kill people, people kill people. Then he goes and gets Kmart to stop selling bullets!

<deleted>???

How can you be so naive as to fall for that NRA propaganda? People with guns kill people. A handgun is designed for only one purpose, and that is to allow just about anyone to kill another person with ease from a short distance. Get rid of the guns and bullets and there is no longer a simple way for your short tempered or mean spirited fool to kill another human being. The easy availability of guns and bullets are indeed a huge problem in the US. Moore's "Bowling for Columbine" was indeed opinionated and at times a bit over the top but it was also spot on in addressing a serious issue.

The NRA use to be a fine institution for firearm safety and education, now it is a lobbying group for the irreponsible firearm manufacturers and a rallying point for idiot right-wing fanatics who are so freaking insecure that they associate their imagined masculinity with gun ownership.

[britmaveric]

Handguns are also used for sport. You left out target practice mate! Definitely have more than one purpose.

[drummer]

People with guns kill people.

The NRA use to be a fine institution for firearm safety and education, now it is a lobbying group for the irreponsible firearm manufacturers and a rallying point for idiot right-wing fanatics who are so freaking insecure that they associate their imagined masculinity with gun ownership.

People with knifes kill people too. People, in fact, have been killing people for a very, very long time. I base my statistics on crime rates across different cultures. Canada, it has already been pointed out, has less crime and more guns. Switzerland has more guns than people and much less crime.

Therefore, logically, one is compelled to accept that guns don't cause crime. Thats my rationale. I don't see any way to avoid those stats.

My point was Michael Moore brought up these same facts in Bowling for Columbine - explictly making the point the the presence of guns doesn't, by itself, cause criminal behavior.

As for my way of thinking, I am a bit of a social libretarian. I'm not much on banning behaviour that isn't harmful, and most gun owners never shoot anyone with their guns. Why is crime higher in the States than elsewhere? Michael Moore had a very interesting idea in BfC. Education almost certainly plays a part. It certainly reduces gun accidents (another big anti-gun topic)

If you can reasonably prove to me that guns create criminals I'll change my mind. Otherwise, I support associated, mandatory gun education and licensing programs.

(BTW- I have never owned or fired a gun. I don't feel I need one.)

Re: NRA ... I don't really know a whole lot about 'em. What I do know indicates that your dscription may not be far off base- They strongly advocate some rather irresponsible stuff)

Cheers

Machiavelli:

"I have never seen a people so armed and so free as the Swiss."