"the Expat Rose Colored Glasses Brigade"

[Pepe']

Kat out of all the people who have taken part in this discussion, you are the only one, who has shown wisdom and maturity, understanding human nature.

I still live in LOS as i am married and have a child at school, and am doing well also buying and renting condo's. I do not intend to get a bus to Cambodia, as one YELLOW SHIRT suggested, as i have responsibilities here, and have the intelligence and resources to change when i am ready.

Also i did mention that my home country has problems, as Thailand has, but as i am a person who has travelled extensively, and worked in different countries, i think i qualify to have an opinion, when i say Thailand stinks! I can form this opinion even though i am doing well here. My example of a good country to live in would be Sweden, where i have lived and worked. So i make my comparrisons on past experiences.

What i have found funny, is as you mentioned Kat, is others presuming, that one must be a faliure if they have a bad opinion of Thailand.

------------------------

Nicely done Tiger. Thank you...

[meemiathai]

Kat out of all the people who have taken part in this discussion, you are the only one, who has shown wisdom and maturity, understanding human nature.

I still live in LOS as i am married and have a child at school, and am doing well also buying and renting condo's. I do not intend to get a bus to Cambodia, as one YELLOW SHIRT suggested, as i have responsibilities here, and have the intelligence and resources to change when i am ready.

Also i did mention that my home country has problems, as Thailand has, but as i am a person who has travelled extensively, and worked in different countries, i think i qualify to have an opinion, when i say Thailand stinks! I can form this opinion even though i am doing well here. My example of a good country to live in would be Sweden, where i have lived and worked. So i make my comparrisons on past experiences.

What i have found funny, is as you mentioned Kat, is others presuming, that one must be a faliure if they have a bad opinion of Thailand.

Thanks Tiger50, that's really sweet of you. I think there are many people on this forum who display wisdom and maturity, even some with whom I disagree. I don't even think Thailand stinks, but I can accept your opinion and different experience. My main issue here is being able to have an open discussion with diversity of opinions, experiences, and substantiated facts, without the discussion degenerating into personal insults or cries of victimization, or the amorphous, non-starter refrain: "it's all the same everywhere," over, and over again. *Both responses have a way of trying to snuff out any kind of genuine discussion.

kat, do you have to memorize a lot of passwords or are they just the same?

Now I am going to open a new account as well.

[Pepe']

Meanwhile, Pepe' stirred up the shit and now gloats that he was just serious about being nonserious, and mai bpen rai really matters.

-----------------

May I beg to differ "Your Majesty?"

I simply asked a question.

Please refer to post #114 for the hypothesis and research methodology.

In fact it was "The Brigade" that stirred the shit, as you say, and the Brigade that supplied all the fuel for this nonsense.

All you have demonstrated, IMHO, with this comment is you bias towards their sentiment.

The refreshing part for me were the replies of Kat, Jimmy CA and a few others that dared to speak

the unbiased truth.

As it can be dangerous to do that here...

PS It really is all an illusion.

[kat]

Kat out of all the people who have taken part in this discussion, you are the only one, who has shown wisdom and maturity, understanding human nature.

I still live in LOS as i am married and have a child at school, and am doing well also buying and renting condo's. I do not intend to get a bus to Cambodia, as one YELLOW SHIRT suggested, as i have responsibilities here, and have the intelligence and resources to change when i am ready.

Also i did mention that my home country has problems, as Thailand has, but as i am a person who has travelled extensively, and worked in different countries, i think i qualify to have an opinion, when i say Thailand stinks! I can form this opinion even though i am doing well here. My example of a good country to live in would be Sweden, where i have lived and worked. So i make my comparrisons on past experiences.

What i have found funny, is as you mentioned Kat, is others presuming, that one must be a faliure if they have a bad opinion of Thailand.

Thanks Tiger50, that's really sweet of you. I think there are many people on this forum who display wisdom and maturity, even some with whom I disagree. I don't even think Thailand stinks, but I can accept your opinion and different experience. My main issue here is being able to have an open discussion with diversity of opinions, experiences, and substantiated facts, without the discussion degenerating into personal insults or cries of victimization, or the amorphous, non-starter refrain: "it's all the same everywhere," over, and over again. *Both responses have a way of trying to snuff out any kind of genuine discussion.

kat, do you have to memorize a lot of passwords or are they just the same?

Now I am going to open a new account as well.

Nope, only have 1 account, and spend way too much time posting just as myself.

[madjbs]

as one YELLOW SHIRT suggested

and what exactly does that mean?

[garro]

oh, no, you guys - Pepe' - now we've gone to far There is NO way I'm a politician, as many would've guessed by now.

*And I'm done with these arguments, Pepe', so don't try to stir the flames. It is all there in the posts, but yet many continue to insult, insinuate, make fake intellectual arguments or cry victim to have any kind of discussion. But, it is a fascinating example of the dynamics that exist among foreigners here, so thanks for the thread.

I think it is rich that you should accuse others of continuing to insult when you are in fact the one of the main people throwing insults around. You are obvious so much in love with your own rhetoric that you will go to any lenghts to win an argument. Including altering your posts (post number 155) after they have been responded to. This certainly shows a very high level of desperation to me.

You may enjoy playing around with words but your motives are very clear to me.

Edited November 12, 2007 by garro

[garro]

This is jus like Pablov's experiment with dogs.

You know he put out the food and rang the bell.

The dogs heard the bell, salivated then ate.

One day he just rang the bell. However this time there was nothing there. But the dogs based on habit, conditioning and limited intelligence salivated anyway.

They looked for food but there was nothing there.

Ding-a-ling...

You may feel that you are particulary smart and enjoy playing games with people.

The fact is that anybody can go around promoting dischord; it takes no high level of intelligence.

You continue stirring the shit though if it makes you happy.

There are plenty of people here on Thai Visa willing to support your nastiness.

[Pepe']

This is jus like Pablov's experiment with dogs.

You know he put out the food and rang the bell.

The dogs heard the bell, salivated then ate.

One day he just rang the bell. However this time there was nothing there. But the dogs based on habit, conditioning and limited intelligence salivated anyway.

They looked for food but there was nothing there.

Ding-a-ling...

You may feel that you are particulary smart and enjoy playing games with people.

The fact is that anybody can go around promoting dischord; it takes no high level of intelligence.

You continue stirring the shit though if it makes you happy.

There are plenty of people here on Thai Visa willing to support your nastiness.

------------------------------

I asked a simple question refer to post #213. Again no game but you continue to reinforce the point that has already been made.

Again "The Brigade" stirred the nasty s_it man.

Look at your posts and look in the mirror...

[sbk]

oh, no, you guys - Pepe' - now we've gone to far There is NO way I'm a politician, as many would've guessed by now.

*And I'm done with these arguments, Pepe', so don't try to stir the flames. It is all there in the posts, but yet many continue to insult, insinuate, make fake intellectual arguments or cry victim to have any kind of discussion. But, it is a fascinating example of the dynamics that exist among foreigners here, so thanks for the thread.

Well said Kat, thank you for making that point.

If we can't have a civil discussion without getting personal and abusive then the thread will be closed. So, may I suggest returning to a reasonable debate and behaving like we are all adults here.

And this is being said to everyone!! So don't PM me thinking I am singling you out.

[garro]

This is jus like Pablov's experiment with dogs.

You know he put out the food and rang the bell.

The dogs heard the bell, salivated then ate.

One day he just rang the bell. However this time there was nothing there. But the dogs based on habit, conditioning and limited intelligence salivated anyway.

They looked for food but there was nothing there.

Ding-a-ling...

You may feel that you are particulary smart and enjoy playing games with people.

The fact is that anybody can go around promoting dischord; it takes no high level of intelligence.

You continue stirring the shit though if it makes you happy.

There are plenty of people here on Thai Visa willing to support your nastiness.

------------------------------

I asked a simple question refer to post #213. Again no game but you continue to reinforce the point that has already been made.

Again "The Brigade" stirred the nasty s_it man.

Look at your posts and look in the mirror...

Unfortunately I have read all your posts in this thread including the one you opened it with.

I admit to feeling a certain foolishness for raising to your bait, but I decided that my point of view deserved a hearing; even though I knew that it risked ridicule. I am well aware of the fact that the negative people seem to have the upper hand on the forum. It's easy to get these people riled up because they are just waiting for a chance to lash out at whatever unfairness they feel Thailand has dealt them. It is not difficult for somebody like yourself to come along and set things in motion. As I said before some people like to feed off other people's negativity. There are also those who enjoy the chance to post grandiose posts hoping to somehow puff up their own ego while attempting to deflate other peoples.

Now you can continue lashing out at those who look at life positively and enjoy living in Thailand. It's an open forum. If I felt the need to do this though, I would certainly also see the need to ask myself some serious questions.

[garro]

oh, no, you guys - Pepe' - now we've gone to far There is NO way I'm a politician, as many would've guessed by now.

*And I'm done with these arguments, Pepe', so don't try to stir the flames. It is all there in the posts, but yet many continue to insult, insinuate, make fake intellectual arguments or cry victim to have any kind of discussion. But, it is a fascinating example of the dynamics that exist among foreigners here, so thanks for the thread.

Well said Kat, thank you for making that point.

If we can't have a civil discussion without getting personal and abusive then the thread will be closed. So, may I suggest returning to a reasonable debate and behaving like we are all adults here.

And this is being said to everyone!! So don't PM me thinking I am singling you out.

Glad to see fair and unbiased moderation.

Feel free to give me a red card.

I am gettting past the stage of caring.

[Pepe']

This is jus like Pablov's experiment with dogs.

You know he put out the food and rang the bell.

The dogs heard the bell, salivated then ate.

One day he just rang the bell. However this time there was nothing there. But the dogs based on habit, conditioning and limited intelligence salivated anyway.

They looked for food but there was nothing there.

Ding-a-ling...

You may feel that you are particulary smart and enjoy playing games with people.

The fact is that anybody can go around promoting dischord; it takes no high level of intelligence.

You continue stirring the shit though if it makes you happy.

There are plenty of people here on Thai Visa willing to support your nastiness.

------------------------------

I asked a simple question refer to post #213. Again no game but you continue to reinforce the point that has already been made.

Again "The Brigade" stirred the nasty s_it man.

Look at your posts and look in the mirror...

Unfortunately I have read all your posts in this thread including the one you opened it with.

I admit to feeling a certain foolishness for raising to your bait, but I decided that my point of view deserved a hearing; even though I knew that it risked ridicule. I am well aware of the fact that the negative people seem to have the upper hand on the forum. It's easy to get these people riled up because they are just waiting for a chance to lash out at whatever unfairness they feel Thailand has dealt them. It is not difficult for somebody like yourself to come along and set things in motion. As I said before some people like to feed off other people's negativity. There are also those who enjoy the chance to post grandiose posts hoping to somehow puff up their own ego while attempting to deflate other peoples.

Now you can continue lashing out at those who look at life positively and enjoy living in Thailand. It's an open forum. If I felt the need to do this though, I would certainly also see the need to ask myself some serious questions.

--------------------

My Dear Garro,

If you can give me just one quote from this thread where I lashed out at anyone or spewed negativity I will stand corrected.

The puffing up or deflating of egos all sounds like mental speculation pure and simple.

Again all I did was ask a simple question. Correct? And it went from there quite predictably...

[garro]

This is jus like Pablov's experiment with dogs.

You know he put out the food and rang the bell.

The dogs heard the bell, salivated then ate.

One day he just rang the bell. However this time there was nothing there. But the dogs based on habit, conditioning and limited intelligence salivated anyway.

They looked for food but there was nothing there.

Ding-a-ling...

You may feel that you are particulary smart and enjoy playing games with people.

The fact is that anybody can go around promoting dischord; it takes no high level of intelligence.

You continue stirring the shit though if it makes you happy.

There are plenty of people here on Thai Visa willing to support your nastiness.

------------------------------

I asked a simple question refer to post #213. Again no game but you continue to reinforce the point that has already been made.

Again "The Brigade" stirred the nasty s_it man.

Look at your posts and look in the mirror...

Unfortunately I have read all your posts in this thread including the one you opened it with.

I admit to feeling a certain foolishness for raising to your bait, but I decided that my point of view deserved a hearing; even though I knew that it risked ridicule. I am well aware of the fact that the negative people seem to have the upper hand on the forum. It's easy to get these people riled up because they are just waiting for a chance to lash out at whatever unfairness they feel Thailand has dealt them. It is not difficult for somebody like yourself to come along and set things in motion. As I said before some people like to feed off other people's negativity. There are also those who enjoy the chance to post grandiose posts hoping to somehow puff up their own ego while attempting to deflate other peoples.

Now you can continue lashing out at those who look at life positively and enjoy living in Thailand. It's an open forum. If I felt the need to do this though, I would certainly also see the need to ask myself some serious questions.

--------------------

My Dear Garro,

If you can give me just one quote from this thread where I lashed out at anyone or spewed negativity I will stand corrected.

The puffing up or deflating of egos all sounds like mental speculation pure and simple.

Again all I did was ask a simple question. Correct? And it went from there quite predictably...

You opened a thread called "the Expat Rose Colored Glasses Brigade", Do you think this is a real phenomenon in LOS?" and then posted your views on how posters on TV could be compared to Pavlov's dogs. You may not believe this to be negative but it is certainly a cynical ploy. Some people are happy just to fan the flames of negativity by starting a thread like this one and helping it along with the occasional dig.

[Pepe']

This is jus like Pablov's experiment with dogs.

You know he put out the food and rang the bell.

The dogs heard the bell, salivated then ate.

One day he just rang the bell. However this time there was nothing there. But the dogs based on habit, conditioning and limited intelligence salivated anyway.

They looked for food but there was nothing there.

Ding-a-ling...

You may feel that you are particulary smart and enjoy playing games with people.

The fact is that anybody can go around promoting dischord; it takes no high level of intelligence.

You continue stirring the shit though if it makes you happy.

There are plenty of people here on Thai Visa willing to support your nastiness.

------------------------------

I asked a simple question refer to post #213. Again no game but you continue to reinforce the point that has already been made.

Again "The Brigade" stirred the nasty s_it man.

Look at your posts and look in the mirror...

Unfortunately I have read all your posts in this thread including the one you opened it with.

I admit to feeling a certain foolishness for raising to your bait, but I decided that my point of view deserved a hearing; even though I knew that it risked ridicule. I am well aware of the fact that the negative people seem to have the upper hand on the forum. It's easy to get these people riled up because they are just waiting for a chance to lash out at whatever unfairness they feel Thailand has dealt them. It is not difficult for somebody like yourself to come along and set things in motion. As I said before some people like to feed off other people's negativity. There are also those who enjoy the chance to post grandiose posts hoping to somehow puff up their own ego while attempting to deflate other peoples.

Now you can continue lashing out at those who look at life positively and enjoy living in Thailand. It's an open forum. If I felt the need to do this though, I would certainly also see the need to ask myself some serious questions.

--------------------

My Dear Garro,

If you can give me just one quote from this thread where I lashed out at anyone or spewed negativity I will stand corrected.

The puffing up or deflating of egos all sounds like mental speculation pure and simple.

Again all I did was ask a simple question. Correct? And it went from there quite predictably...

You opened a thread called "the Expat Rose Colored Glasses Brigade", Do you think this is a real phenomenon in LOS?" and then posted your views on how posters on TV could be compared to Pavlov's dogs. You may not believe this to be negative but it is certainly a cynical ploy. Some people are happy just to fan the flames of negativity by starting a thread like this one and helping it along with the occasional dig.

-----------------------

Pablovian response is used comparatively in human psycology all the time as well as the behaviour or rats, monkeys and many other animals.

Try again.

You said I lashed out and to the effect spewed negativity.

The polite thing to do would be to admit you are wrong and apologize.

Try it. I guarantee you'll feel much better immediately ...

[kat]

I have lived here 4 years, age 57, British. Came here because really fed up with how my once wonderfull country changed, and gets worse year by year!

Also think it stinks here to, there is nothing good about Thailand, apart from women and Thai food, and owing to my low income i can also have a good lifestyle here.

I have never been ripped off by Thai, only because they are not as cute as me, and never given away or lost money to a thai lady...so i bear no grudges, its just as i see it.

I hate the farlangs who grease up to Thai you know the ones who wear the yellow shirts! and wei everyone.

And yes i thank my lucky stars, that i can move on when i'm ready, and that is my intentions, and yes of course, i will find problems everywhere, because that's the truth.

But please don't keep saying the LOS, BECAUSE THE TRUTH IS ITS NOT!

Let me give you a tip. You can take a bus to Cambodia for only a few hundred baht. Go to the eastern bus terminal and get on it. Oh and dont come back! If you think Thailand is so bad why have you been here 4 years? You say you can have a good lifestyle here and you also say Thailand stinks, what is it then?

One question, If Thailand is not for you why do you need to carry on posting here then? Surely if you have left then there is no need for you to still be on this board.

hmm, well there's another way to justify thought control: 1) if you live there and are critical - go home 2) if you don't live there now, don't post

What a novel approach to free thought and open discussion.

*of course, it puts everyone in a bit of a bind, since the forum is hosted in another country, and many of the mods post from somewhere else as well, lol.

What I find strange is the number of people who decided that Thailand wasn't right for them yet spend their time on Thai Visa bitching about the place. I wonder do they stalk ex-girlfriends too? It all seems a bit sad to me.

If I ever have enough of Thailand I will not be wasting my time visiting forums about the place but instead just move on with my life.

I think people need to accept that Thailand is what it is.

In regards to the OP.

I find it annoying that he keeps pretending that he has this 'life is an illusion, mai pen rai' attitude when he deliberately set this very contentious subject in motion. What other possible motive could he have? He knew exactly what he was doing and I feel it speaks volumes about his personality that he spends his time trying to cause friction.

In regards to question of whether those who previously lived in Thailand, but left, are failures? I have no idea nor do I care. If somebody came for two years and lasted two years I would say they achieved their goal. If somebody moved to Thailand for the rest of their life and left after a couple of years I would say they failed at this. None of my business though.

There are plenty of people who don't take to Thailand for whatever reason. There are plenty of other places in the world they can go to. What I find unreasonable is their insistence that everyone else share their negative view of the country.

I think there are negatives and positives to everything, but this is a forum that primarily deals with the foreign experience of Thailand, full stop. I find it incredible that Westerners who come from a culture of open differences of opinion and experience berate others or try to control the flow of thought to how they think things SHOULD be conducted and viewed. What some may see as bitching is just a matter of honest and open discussion to others. I see that viewpoint as the most controlling element here, not vice versa.

As for people from all over the world joining in on this thread, well, I hate to break it to you, but that's the internet. Secondly, people may live in other places but still have attachments or investments in Thailand, such as marriages, relationships, work, research, interests - there is no need for a justification. If you have lived in a place for some time and have established relationships or experiences, then understanding the place and the culture is a lifelong pursuit. Furthermore, since there is such a split along these lines on almost every discussion thread, the OP's topic is perfectly relevant, and very much within the bounds of the forum and decency. If you are having such a problem with this thread and other's opinion, then perhaps you should follow your own advice and avoid those whose comments you don't like, or avoid the thread. This is how adults co-exist in the world.

Of course, there is the option of discussion and offering your dissent, which is what the thread offers in the first place.

I find it childish that people on this forum see a need for others to justify or explain this over and over again.

*So, Grow up.

Garro, I've collected and reposted our first responses since this melodrama has started. Somewhere further back I even highlighted some of your contradictions, but you still go on and on. I use the edit function quite a bit, and did it quite obviously when you were still on the thread, which is why I used the arrow function. Dear heavens, it was not meant as a personal slur to your existence - I do it all the time, which is why I use the *. This is a web forum, not a pact written in blood!

So, Here we are again, please listen carefully: I posted my thoughts above; you and others responded above; I then responded to your responses, and so on, and so on. This is how it works on a forum - get it? You then told us a sad, beautiful story about your life and your determination, which was beautiful btw, but not at all related to the thread. Since you can't seem to take responsibility for your words as they stand here, you have to turn it into something else, such as (jarring music please): me - the very, very, bad, bad person, and .... (soft, butterfly music) YOU, the very, very, abused and upstanding victim who will overcome. The only problem is that we weren't discussing our lives here.

[garro]

Why are you quoting posts from madjbs and other?

I never posted these.

Again nowhere do I say that people should go home or not post.

I have only merely stated what I would do.

I am familar with reading posts in a linear fashion and would not have noticed that you had altered your post unless it was pointed out to me by another member. I find your need to go back and change posts after they have been written very sneaky, but you can continue to justify this however you want.

I mentioned something that occured in my life in an attempt to demonstrate the value of remaining positive no matter where we are. I did not do this to gain any sympathy from anybody. I thought this very relevant to the thread as it was about people wearing 'rose coloured glasses'. I have never seen myself as a victim of anything.

[kat]

Garro:

Let me repeat: you can view my use of the edit button however you want. To you: sneaky, and sinister, and imbued with a conspiratorial plot. To me: something I have been doing as long as it has been available. I'm sure it is SOooo sneaky, which is why I flag it with an asterisk.

Posts appear in linear fashion, and so I showed madjb's posts because that is what I was also responding to in my post, which followed yours. In this case I was collectively responding to you both, because he outright says what he does, and you simply allude to it, which is the same thing in my book; talk about being sneaky He tells people to go home, to not post if they don't live in the country, and you compare people to a stalker and call them sad.

I am not knocking anyone's life here, nor do I need to bring up sad stories of triumph of my own to try and fashion myself into some holier than thou martyr. I am simply trying to comment on a thread and hold others responsible for their own condescension, which was met with the same.

************************************************************************* BTW, I'm done with this monotonous exchange.

Edited November 13, 2007 by kat

[garro]

Kat,

As I said before my posts say exactly what I mean and there is no secret meanings and no alluding to anything.

I am sorry that you find it necessary to read between the lines.

Unfortunately I have no control over how you decide to interpret my posts.

Now you may see my using a story to demonstrate a principal as trying to fashion myself into a 'holier than thou' type of person. I see it as merely showing that my principals have some thought and experince behind them.

I do not post on Thai Visa in order to inflate my own ego or deflate the ego of others.

I do not rely on this forum as a means to feel valued but get this inside.

I do not post grandiose entrys.

I do not feel the need to impress anybody.

[oldgit]

oh, no, you guys - Pepe' - now we've gone to far There is NO way I'm a politician, as many would've guessed by now.

*And I'm done with these arguments, Pepe', so don't try to stir the flames. It is all there in the posts, but yet many continue to insult, insinuate, make fake intellectual arguments or cry victim to have any kind of discussion. But, it is a fascinating example of the dynamics that exist among foreigners here, so thanks for the thread.

Well said Kat, thank you for making that point.

If we can't have a civil discussion without getting personal and abusive then the thread will be closed. So, may I suggest returning to a reasonable debate and behaving like we are all adults here.

And this is being said to everyone!! So don't PM me thinking I am singling you out.

The answer to the original question - No

The Alternative Blinkered Contemplating Suicide Brigade - No

A rather mischevious thread posted by a devilish mind guaranted to get members of the two factions hot under the collar.I only hope that someone of the second ilk does not throw themselves in front of MY car.

[ThaiPauly]

20 minutes reading this thread.

What have I learnt?

NOTHING NEW

In my book everyone is different.. some people:

Love it here

Like it here

Don't mind it here

Put up with it here

Are stuck here

Hate it here

Want to leave here.

and all for differing reasons

Since when have things changed?

I am sure that ex-pats in every country in the world fall into all of these catagories

[Rumpole]

I mentioned something that occured in my life in an attempt to demonstrate the value of remaining positive no matter where we are.

Did you feel positive about actually being in the gutter? Or did your positivity enable you to extricate yourself from an intolerable situation and put that part of your life behind you?

[garro]

I mentioned something that occured in my life in an attempt to demonstrate the value of remaining positive no matter where we are.

Did you feel positive about actually being in the gutter? Or did your positivity enable you to extricate yourself from an intolerable situation and put that part of your life behind you?

Yes I did feel positive about this.

It is very liberating realising that I could handle something that others live in fear of.

When I hit the gutter I realised that this was as bad as it gets and the only way is to stay down or go up.

It allowed me to see that I had become a bit of a scumbag.

There was no denying it.

There are plenty of people out there who are scumbags but don't see it; some even appear succesful.

I feel no shame about things in my life but instead feel proud.

I learnt valuable lessons.

That's all I can say on the subject really.

I don't want further accusations of looking for sympathy or playing the martyr.

There will always be people looking for the hateful and spiteful in every post.

I have never seen myself as a victim as I have been fully responsible for everything that occured in mt life.

I was fully deserving of all the good and the bad.

Luckily for me the good has far outweighed the bad

Edited November 13, 2007 by garro

[Neeranam]

As a wise 'ignoramus' mentioned Krishnamurti, I have to post something he said -

To me, then, true criticism consists in trying to find out the intrinsic worth of the thing itself, and not in attributing a quality to that thing. You attribute a quality to an environment, to an experience, only when you want to derive something from it, when you want to gain or to have power or happiness. Now this destroys true criticism. Your desire is perverted through attributing values, and therefore you cannot see clearly. Instead of trying to see the flower in its original and entire beauty, you look at it through coloured glasses, and therefore you can never see it as it is. If you leave the pool you have dug for yourself and go out into the river of life then life has an astonishing way of taking care of you, because then there is no taking care on your part.

and -

It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society.

Edited November 13, 2007 by Neeranam

[Rumpole]

Post deleted.

Edited November 13, 2007 by Rumpole

[kat]

You are obvious so much in love with your own rhetoric that you will go to any lenghts to win an argument.

Garro:

I come on this forum because I like to argue. I like to debate, I like repartee, I like to learn things and discuss, I like to substantiate. I also like this forum because I have been here awhile, and believe it or not I have made friends, and created relationships.

I am sorry if you took some of my comments to heart. It can get a little heated around here sometimes. But, I am in no way commenting on you as a person, because I don't know you! I am merely commenting and debating your words, and pointing out contradictions as I see them.

I'm sure *you must be a good person, and I would be glad to buy you a cup of tea sometimes. I am merely engaged in debates around ideas here, not souls.

Peace.

*typo - left out a word

Edited November 13, 2007 by kat

[fletchsmile]

This is jus like Pablov's experiment with dogs.

You know he put out the food and rang the bell.

The dogs heard the bell, salivated then ate.

One day he just rang the bell. However this time there was nothing there. But the dogs based on habit, conditioning and limited intelligence salivated anyway.

They looked for food but there was nothing there.

Ding-a-ling...

Maybe some similarities, but some big differences too. Pablov did it as an experiment to find the answer.

Keep ringing the bell when you know the answer, says more about the bell ringer than it does the dogs

Some of the salivating bell ringers overlook that bit.

Edited November 13, 2007 by fletchthai68

[TonyLeung]

Sorry but it seems very obvious that those who aren't 100% happy here are jealous/envious/angry at those who are 100% happy. They insist on reminding us that "we've only been here for three years" "that we don't know the real Thailand".

Whereas those of us who are 100% happy just take pity on the unhappy farang.

[TonyLeung]

For those of you who aren't 100% happy in Thailand, what is it exactly that causes you discomfort?

[naka]

<deleted>, has material wealth got to do with how people perceive Thailand? What a load of BS. Who cares? Surely success is about self fufillment and being contented with ones life. In the end these p%ssing contests are no different than the my dads bigger than yours, that people used when they were 6 years of age.

I am truly humbled mrtoad ... How could I not be after reading your sage words ?

Naka.

[meemiathai]

20 minutes reading this thread.

What have I learnt?

NOTHING NEW

In my book everyone is different.. some people:

Love it here

Like it here

Don't mind it here

Put up with it here

Are stuck here

Hate it here

Want to leave here.

and all for differing reasons

Since when have things changed?

I am sure that ex-pats in every country in the world fall into all of these catagories

There is always something to be learnt if you want to.

Did you mean "categories"?

Edited November 13, 2007 by meemiathai