Two Tourists In Pai Shot By A Police Officer

[geriatrickid]

And everyone writing with such venom on this thread about the Thai police and Pol Sgt Unthai are conveniently overlooking the three New York detectives cleared this week of shooting and killing a man with 50 shots on his wedding day in November 2006.

Writing without any venom, <deleted> has one apparent injustice in the US got to do with a looming further potential injustice in NW Thailand?

Can you please name which publications you write for, so I can make a point of avoiding them.

How can the event in NY be termed an injustice when in fact justice was served? There was a fair and open judicial proceeding, unlike the Pai incident.

Although there are some similarities between the Pai incident and the 4 AM, 25-Nov- 2006 NYPD incident in Jamaica, NY, these events are not comparable. In NY, the "victims" who had all been drinking, got into a loud argument outside Club Kahlua. The club was under police surveillance as part of an investigation into prostitution. The accused officers had recently come on shift when the argument erupted. In Pai, while we do have allegations of drinking on the part of the deceased, the officer in question was not on an authorized stakeout.

In NY, the deceased drove his vehicle into a police officer and then a police vehicle. The court heard evidence that the police officer had identified himself as a police detective, clipping his badge on his collar and shouting "police". In Pai I do not think the deceased attacked with a lethal weapon.

In NY, a number of witnesses, including club patrons testified that they heard talk of guns during the argument, and that one of the injured had said: "yo, go get my gun". The defense successfully demonstrated that there was a likelihood of firearms and the prosecution could not counter that argument. To the best of my knowledge, no one has indicated that the deceased in the Pai case made mention of a firearm.

In NY, the defense was successful in showing that the "victims" were people we would term thugs, with a history of dangerous behaviour including criminal convictions. They were also physically big men that one would be difficult to contain. The Pai deceased was by all accounts not a violent thug and hardly presented a threatening figure.

I'd suggest that anyone who wants to simplify or to compare the two cases, read the court transcripts. The ruling judge in NY said he was troubled by inconsistencies among witnesses, as well as contradictions in accounts before the grand jury and in trial testimony. "At times the testimony just didn't make sense," he said. The judge also indicated that the injured witnesses seemed to be more motivated by getting money from the police rather than in seeing justice done. I think the Pai deceased's family is focused on justice rather than getting money. The officers implicated in NY had clean records and no history or allegations of being drunk while on duty. I do not think the shooter in the Pai case is comparable.

BTW, what is the purpose of stating that it was the deceased's wedding day? What does it have to do with the case? It is thrown in only to elicit sympathy and present the situation in a more favourable light for the implicated parties.

Edited May 3, 2008 by geriatrickid

[thaigene2]

Any update on this story?

[sabaijai]

So Pai and it's innocent (mainly, maybe) tourists is just awaiting another tragedy, yes? So A.Drummond Esq had better show responsibility and put out another story fast, warning the world away from Pai until this moron is locked safely away.

Anyone in Pai who cares, Thai or foreigner, should also insist to all in authority that this is done. Pronto.

If it's not, then my only observation can be - get out of Dodge! YOU could be next!!

I'm sure Drummond has found another fresh murder by now. Better to wonder what the DSI is doing about it.

[kat]

FYI - maybe you have seen this already..........

http://www.andrew-drummond.com/2008/04/11/thai-pm-orders-investigation-into-tourist-killings-april-10-2008/

://http://www.andrew-drummond.com/2008...pril-10-2008/

://http://www.andrew-drummond.com/2008...pril-10-2008/

://http://www.andrew-drummond.com/2008...pril-10-2008/

..........good thing.

The officer in question can sometimes still be seen on the streets of Pai, still drunk and still carrying a gun. He very recently said to a friend of mine 'Either I take your passport or you let me take your girlfriend home'. His gun was seen at his waist at the time. Apparently he also threatened to shoot someone the same evening in a separate conversation.

When the tourist police were told the reply was something along the lines of 'Well, we don't want to make a problem'.

Amazing.

I can confirm this story from a direct observer

The police officer in question showed up drunk at Be-bop last week with 2 guns strapped under his jacket. he then approached a Thai woman from Bangkok who arrived with a Falang tourist and began talking to her - apparently he knew her or her family or something.

He then went to the falang and told him that he has the choice of giving him his passport and being taken to the police station for arrest or he lets the officer go home with his girlfriend.

the falang in question just stood their speechless. the girl then berated the officer publicly and he left. Later that night the same officer was seen at the bamboo bar in plain clothes very drunk and brandishing his pistols.

Great job Pai Police force.

If this is true, it is extremely significant and needs to be documented for the world to hear, albeit very carefully. Many on this board and on this thread have made the case over and over again about the lack of responsibility and countless cases of impunity for murdering, corrupt and lawless police and government officials, only to be put through a witch hunt by deniers and apologists. Meanwhile, a senseless murder and attempted EXECUTION has taken place, and he is stumbling about threatening other innocent foreigners.

Nice work.

[kat]

So Pai and it's innocent (mainly, maybe) tourists is just awaiting another tragedy, yes? So A.Drummond Esq had better show responsibility and put out another story fast, warning the world away from Pai until this moron is locked safely away.

Anyone in Pai who cares, Thai or foreigner, should also insist to all in authority that this is done. Pronto.

If it's not, then my only observation can be - get out of Dodge! YOU could be next!!

I'm sure Drummond has found another fresh murder by now. Better to wonder what the DSI is doing about it.

Most significant changes that have occurred in Thailand regarding justice and a semblance of human rights have occurred because of public and international pressure, full stop.

[Flatouthruthefog]

So Pai and it's innocent (mainly, maybe) tourists is just awaiting another tragedy, yes? So A.Drummond Esq had better show responsibility and put out another story fast, warning the world away from Pai until this moron is locked safely away.

Anyone in Pai who cares, Thai or foreigner, should also insist to all in authority that this is done. Pronto.

If it's not, then my only observation can be - get out of Dodge! YOU could be next!!

I'm sure Drummond has found another fresh murder by now. Better to wonder what the DSI is doing about it.

Yes, sadly, Sabajai (and the other - many - posters here with sensitivity), I fear that 'Bulldog' Drummond, having made a great impression, locally, and a big contribution to his bank balance, internationally, has already moved on to the next side show - ie headline-grabbing tragedies elsewhere. And tragically, given the boys in brown here, he will have quite enough raw material to last him for ever, or until he becomes a victim himself.......

Apologies, 'Photojourn'! I was being terribly old fashioned and ingenuous, thinking that REAL journalists had a responsibility to their READERS as well as their editors and their bank accounts. Lord, how out of date can one be?

The extremely disturbing information posted here, which rings true to me, that this (possibly murderous) moron is still wandering around, armed, in a drunken haze, threatening foreign tourists and young women in particular, does merit what responsible scribes would call a 'follow up' story!

One which might (as well as earning MORE cash for you folks) preclude a repeat tragedy. An historically proved benefit of good media around the world, as any REAL police force will tell you.

But of course, if you are not going to risk wasting an air fare or petrol money to Pai because it's possible that no-one else may die in the latter days of this horrific episode impacting the general public, well, that's your decision, yes? An ECONOMIC decision, right?!

Yes. You stick to 'photojournalling' with INCOME at the top of your agenda. Leave the tourists and residents of Pai to their fate. Until and unless you are there with your camera - to chase the next ambulance.

[thaigene2]

What a joke. You two really are a joke. And of course the many thousands of people who have viewed your comments - but not commented - think so too, rather clearly I'd guess..

Where were the Thai reporters in this story? Same place they've always been. Drummond may never win a Pulitzer Prize, but at least he's got balls enough to actually FILE the story - evidently bigger than many of you apologists (sorry Sabajai - please forgive the coarse gender reference).

Edited May 4, 2008 by thaigene2

[waza]

What a joke. You two really are a joke. And of course the many thousands of people who have viewed your comments - but not commented - think so too, rather clearly I'd guess..

Where were the Thai reporters in this story? Same place they've always been. Drummond may never win a Pulitzer Prize, but at least he's got balls enough to actually FILE the story - evidently bigger than many of you apologists (sorry Sabajai - please forgive the coarse gender reference).

I agree

[photojourn]

>>But of course, if you are not going to risk wasting an air fare or petrol money to Pai because it's possible that no-one else may die in the latter days of this horrific episode impacting the general public, well, that's your decision, yes? An ECONOMIC decision, right?! <<

I drove four hours on a motorbike to another location (and four hours back) one month ago based on the "credible" reports made by members of this forum who live in Pai to investigate these same accusations against Pol Sgt Unthai at another location. The result. Nothing. No foundation to the accusations at all - as verified by foreigners living in the town where the actions were alleged to have occurred.

I think a few people here need to get a grip on reality. This is third world. If you want a Western style legal system and a Western style police force then live in a Western country.

>>An ECONOMIC decision, right?!<<

Wrong. It's called newsworthyness and Canadian editors are not interested enough in the death of one individual in a far-off land to devote publication space or pay for someone to write the story.

So Andrew or I can write the story and then what? It doesn't get published because there are significantly more important events occurring in Canada (and the rest of the world) to maintain the interest of Canadian editors.

In case you haven't noticed, neither Andrew, I or any of the other journalists in Thailand wake up each morning and put on saffron robes and have our meals and living expenses donated to us. We either have publications who will advance or guarantee costs, or we pay for our expenses out of our own pockets. We are not charities at the beck and call of every every gin addled expatriate in Thailand.

I also haven't seen one response to any of the people with the big mouths on this forum who are prepared to stand next to Andrew or I and take photo's of a drinking, drunk and possibly armed Pol Sgt Unthai. But that's ok. The world is full of armchair critics who are happy to point the finger at others while gripping their can off Chang or sipping a G&T with the other in the comfort and safety of their own livingroom.

The next time this becomes newsworthy is (1) the anniversary of the shooting; (2) when the matter proceeds to trial; (3) if the same police officer commits a similar offence; (4) the matter doesn't proceed to trial in the normal time-frame of the Thai judicial system.

In the meantime, proper, credible reports stating time, date, location and the names of witnesses to any new indiscretions by Pol Sgt Unthai should be collected and coordinated by people so concerned. If these were to be presented to the officer in charge of Pai police, or to the Government, by expatriates or a local NGO demanding action be taken then it would be newsworthy again.

But one outrageous claim by someone who joined this forum on the same day they made the claim and has not made any posts since, nor filled out any personal details in their forum registration, does not in my opinion count as a credible claim.

[JohnPeel]

>>But of course, if you are not going to risk wasting an air fare or petrol money to Pai because it's possible that no-one else may die in the latter days of this horrific episode impacting the general public, well, that's your decision, yes? An ECONOMIC decision, right?! <<

I drove four hours on a motorbike to another location (and four hours back) one month ago based on the "credible" reports made by members of this forum who live in Pai to investigate these same accusations against Pol Sgt Unthai at another location. The result. Nothing. No foundation to the accusations at all - as verified by foreigners living in the town where the actions were alleged to have occurred.

I think a few people here need to get a grip on reality. This is third world. If you want a Western style legal system and a Western style police force then live in a Western country.

>>An ECONOMIC decision, right?!<<

Wrong. It's called newsworthyness and Canadian editors are not interested enough in the death of one individual in a far-off land to devote publication space or pay for someone to write the story.

So Andrew or I can write the story and then what? It doesn't get published because there are significantly more important events occurring in Canada (and the rest of the world) to maintain the interest of Canadian editors.

In case you haven't noticed, neither Andrew, I or any of the other journalists in Thailand wake up each morning and put on saffron robes and have our meals and living expenses donated to us. We either have publications who will advance or guarantee costs, or we pay for our expenses out of our own pockets. We are not charities at the beck and call of every every gin addled expatriate in Thailand.

I also haven't seen one response to any of the people with the big mouths on this forum who are prepared to stand next to Andrew or I and take photo's of a drinking, drunk and possibly armed Pol Sgt Unthai. But that's ok. The world is full of armchair critics who are happy to point the finger at others while gripping their can off Chang or sipping a G&T with the other in the comfort and safety of their own livingroom.

The next time this becomes newsworthy is (1) the anniversary of the shooting; (2) when the matter proceeds to trial; (3) if the same police officer commits a similar offence; (4) the matter doesn't proceed to trial in the normal time-frame of the Thai judicial system.

In the meantime, proper, credible reports stating time, date, location and the names of witnesses to any new indiscretions by Pol Sgt Unthai should be collected and coordinated by people so concerned. If these were to be presented to the officer in charge of Pai police, or to the Government, by expatriates or a local NGO demanding action be taken then it would be newsworthy again.

But one outrageous claim by someone who joined this forum on the same day they made the claim and has not made any posts since, nor filled out any personal details in their forum registration, does not in my opinion count as a credible claim.

Put Uthai next to a pretty blonde tourist and he'' probabably pose Wyatt Earp style. They all do. I wouldnt bother complaining to the local police chief though.

[wayfarer108]

FYI - maybe you have seen this already..........

http://www.andrew-drummond.com/2008/04/11/thai-pm-orders-investigation-into-tourist-killings-april-10-2008/

://http://www.andrew-drummond.com/2008...pril-10-2008/

://http://www.andrew-drummond.com/2008...pril-10-2008/

://http://www.andrew-drummond.com/2008...pril-10-2008/

..........good thing.

The officer in question can sometimes still be seen on the streets of Pai, still drunk and still carrying a gun. He very recently said to a friend of mine 'Either I take your passport or you let me take your girlfriend home'. His gun was seen at his waist at the time. Apparently he also threatened to shoot someone the same evening in a separate conversation.

When the tourist police were told the reply was something along the lines of 'Well, we don't want to make a problem'.

Amazing.

I can confirm this story from a direct observer

The police officer in question showed up drunk at Be-bop last week with 2 guns strapped under his jacket. he then approached a Thai woman from Bangkok who arrived with a Falang tourist and began talking to her - apparently he knew her or her family or something.

He then went to the falang and told him that he has the choice of giving him his passport and being taken to the police station for arrest or he lets the officer go home with his girlfriend.

the falang in question just stood their speechless. the girl then berated the officer publicly and he left. Later that night the same officer was seen at the bamboo bar in plain clothes very drunk and brandishing his pistols.

Great job Pai Police force.

Are you the direct observer? If not it's just more second-hand info. Better to have the observer post or better yet file a report with the provincial authorities, Thai and English newspapers, and so on.

Agree with photojourn that lots of folks here are making calls from the sidelines without making any personal effort to do anything for the case. 'Great job Pai police force' doesn't help much.

[JohnPeel]

What a joke. You two really are a joke. And of course the many thousands of people who have viewed your comments - but not commented - think so too, rather clearly I'd guess..

Where were the Thai reporters in this story? Same place they've always been. Drummond may never win a Pulitzer Prize, but at least he's got balls enough to actually FILE the story - evidently bigger than many of you apologists (sorry Sabajai - please forgive the coarse gender reference).

I agree

I agree too. And the reason why we are not hearing from AD on this matter is I believe that one of the 'apologists' had him banned

[kat]

FYI - maybe you have seen this already..........

http://www.andrew-drummond.com/2008/04/11/thai-pm-orders-investigation-into-tourist-killings-april-10-2008/

://http://www.andrew-drummond.com/2008...pril-10-2008/

://http://www.andrew-drummond.com/2008...pril-10-2008/

://http://www.andrew-drummond.com/2008...pril-10-2008/

://http://www.andrew-drummond.com/2008...pril-10-2008/

..........good thing.

The officer in question can sometimes still be seen on the streets of Pai, still drunk and still carrying a gun. He very recently said to a friend of mine 'Either I take your passport or you let me take your girlfriend home'. His gun was seen at his waist at the time. Apparently he also threatened to shoot someone the same evening in a separate conversation.

When the tourist police were told the reply was something along the lines of 'Well, we don't want to make a problem'.

Amazing.

I can confirm this story from a direct observer

The police officer in question showed up drunk at Be-bop last week with 2 guns strapped under his jacket. he then approached a Thai woman from Bangkok who arrived with a Falang tourist and began talking to her - apparently he knew her or her family or something.

He then went to the falang and told him that he has the choice of giving him his passport and being taken to the police station for arrest or he lets the officer go home with his girlfriend.

the falang in question just stood their speechless. the girl then berated the officer publicly and he left. Later that night the same officer was seen at the bamboo bar in plain clothes very drunk and brandishing his pistols.

Great job Pai Police force.

Agree with photojourn that lots of folks here are making calls from the sidelines without making any personal effort to do anything for the case. 'Great job Pai police force' doesn't help much.

Excuse me? In case you haven't noticed, this is a discussion thread, and by definition most of us are on the sidelines because of lack of any choice. You have no idea what kind of impacts any of us have had here on the sidelines anyway, either on the people involved, the press, direction of the investigation, and/or discussion.

Photojourn made some good points, but at the end of the day he had to ride 4 hours there and 4 hours back, and in his short time span in the town interviewing people also has its limitations, no matter how hard he may have tried.

[sbk]

What a joke. You two really are a joke. And of course the many thousands of people who have viewed your comments - but not commented - think so too, rather clearly I'd guess..

Where were the Thai reporters in this story? Same place they've always been. Drummond may never win a Pulitzer Prize, but at least he's got balls enough to actually FILE the story - evidently bigger than many of you apologists (sorry Sabajai - please forgive the coarse gender reference).

I agree

I agree too. And the reason why we are not hearing from AD on this matter is I believe that one of the 'apologists' had him banned

Andrew Drummond broke a cardinal rule of this forum and that is why he was banned. Break a serious rule and it gets you banned immediately. Furthermore, discussion of moderation actions is against forum rules, perhaps you need to re-read those rules. Next time you have a question regarding moderation action may I suggest you contact a mod or admin instead of posting in the open forum?

Further such discussion will result in action by me. I hope that is clear enough.

[stumonster]

Photojourn made some good points, but at the end of the day he had to ride 4 hours there and 4 hours back, and in his short time span in the town interviewing people also has its limitations, no matter how hard he may have tried.

any of the tourists or locals should feel free to post their observances and/or photos - many stories in the internet age start without a professional journalist involved

[Shah Jahan]

FYI - maybe you have seen this already..........

http://www.andrew-drummond.com/2008/04/11/thai-pm-orders-investigation-into-tourist-killings-april-10-2008/

://http://www.andrew-drummond.com/2008...pril-10-2008/

://http://www.andrew-drummond.com/2008...pril-10-2008/

://http://www.andrew-drummond.com/2008...pril-10-2008/

://http://www.andrew-drummond.com/2008...pril-10-2008/

..........good thing.

The officer in question can sometimes still be seen on the streets of Pai, still drunk and still carrying a gun. He very recently said to a friend of mine 'Either I take your passport or you let me take your girlfriend home'. His gun was seen at his waist at the time. Apparently he also threatened to shoot someone the same evening in a separate conversation.

When the tourist police were told the reply was something along the lines of 'Well, we don't want to make a problem'.

Amazing.

I can confirm this story from a direct observer

The police officer in question showed up drunk at Be-bop last week with 2 guns strapped under his jacket. he then approached a Thai woman from Bangkok who arrived with a Falang tourist and began talking to her - apparently he knew her or her family or something.

He then went to the falang and told him that he has the choice of giving him his passport and being taken to the police station for arrest or he lets the officer go home with his girlfriend.

the falang in question just stood their speechless. the girl then berated the officer publicly and he left. Later that night the same officer was seen at the bamboo bar in plain clothes very drunk and brandishing his pistols.

Great job Pai Police force.

Are you the direct observer? If not it's just more second-hand info. Better to have the observer post or better yet file a report with the provincial authorities, Thai and English newspapers, and so on.

Agree with photojourn that lots of folks here are making calls from the sidelines without making any personal effort to do anything for the case. 'Great job Pai police force' doesn't help much.

are you just trying to stir up sh@t or do you have anything positive to add? I relayed the information I know - would it be better if I didnt say anything? those are the only two options. And incidentally - the person in question did go to the tourist police box the next day and they laughed and told him to go away that they didnt want to stir up any trouble. I am sure the incident got reported back though the police channels but no reports filed. i wouldn't be surprised if the accused police officer is on a shorter leash at the moment.

[JohnPeel]

What a joke. You two really are a joke. And of course the many thousands of people who have viewed your comments - but not commented - think so too, rather clearly I'd guess..

Where were the Thai reporters in this story? Same place they've always been. Drummond may never win a Pulitzer Prize, but at least he's got balls enough to actually FILE the story - evidently bigger than many of you apologists (sorry Sabajai - please forgive the coarse gender reference).

I agree

I agree too. And the reason why we are not hearing from AD on this matter is I believe that one of the 'apologists' had him banned

Andrew Drummond broke a cardinal rule of this forum and that is why he was banned. Break a serious rule and it gets you banned immediately. Furthermore, discussion of moderation actions is against forum rules, perhaps you need to re-read those rules. Next time you have a question regarding moderation action may I suggest you contact a mod or admin instead of posting in the open forum?

Further such discussion will result in action by me. I hope that is clear enough.

I am merely pointing out what it potently obvious. I have made no reference at all to the moderators on this site.

It is however clear, as you have stated, that the person concerned is no longer taking part in this thread (for whatever reasons)

And that is a loss. Perhaps I am reminding people of the obvious.

Meanwhile of course certain members and I dont need to mention any names, continue to post snide comments. Is that not a fair enough statement to make in the open forum? If not then we are really not going to find the truth here are we?

[sbk]

Forum rules, since you seem to not have read the relevant rule:

5) Discussion of moderation issues, actions or moderation policies concerning individual cases are not allowed in the forums. Such comments should be directed to a moderator or administrator, and not discussed on the forum.

I hope this is now clear enough for you John Peel.

[waza]

Hmmm so doeas anyone have any updates?

Edited May 7, 2008 by waza

[pliny]

I posed a similar question yesterday of Sabaijai but it seems to have been deleted for reasons which have not yet been made clear.

My post was as far as I was aware entirely innocuous if somewhat critical of Sabaijai's cheap shot against an erstwhile poster who being excluded could not possibly respond. Frankly, I have no interest in the silliness of forum politics but in the course of posting I do try and maintain some semblance of courtesy and politeness which led me to comment upon the less than gentlemanly nature of Sabaijai's post.

Nevertheless, Sabaijai, by the sheer preponderance of his posts and claim to be an accurate pundit upon the doings of Pai, is evidently a source of information and I therefore repeat my earlier request in which I sought an update of the current position as far as he is aware of the Sgt. and his case.

If this post somehow traduces or otherwise offends then could someone please enlighten?

Edited May 7, 2008 by pliny

[sbk]

Posts have been deleted. If you have issues then please bring it up with admin but to do so in the open forum is against forum rules and further such transgressions will be deleted and the poster suspended.

FINAL WARNING HERE

[JohnPeel]

So Pai and it's innocent (mainly, maybe) tourists is just awaiting another tragedy, yes? So A.Drummond Esq had better show responsibility and put out another story fast, warning the world away from Pai until this moron is locked safely away.

Anyone in Pai who cares, Thai or foreigner, should also insist to all in authority that this is done. Pronto.

If it's not, then my only observation can be - get out of Dodge! YOU could be next!!

I'm sure Drummond has found another fresh murder by now. Better to wonder what the DSI is doing about it.

My guess he's probably more focused on Burma right now. But as you are the man on the scene perhaps you could enlighten us as to whether the police sergeant is indeed back on the streets at night drinking and armed.

[JohnPeel]

So Pai and it's innocent (mainly, maybe) tourists is just awaiting another tragedy, yes? So A.Drummond Esq had better show responsibility and put out another story fast, warning the world away from Pai until this moron is locked safely away.

Anyone in Pai who cares, Thai or foreigner, should also insist to all in authority that this is done. Pronto.

If it's not, then my only observation can be - get out of Dodge! YOU could be next!!

I'm sure Drummond has found another fresh murder by now. Better to wonder what the DSI is doing about it.

Yes, sadly, Sabajai (and the other - many - posters here with sensitivity), I fear that 'Bulldog' Drummond, having made a great impression, locally, and a big contribution to his bank balance, internationally, has already moved on to the next side show - ie headline-grabbing tragedies elsewhere. And tragically, given the boys in brown here, he will have quite enough raw material to last him for ever, or until he becomes a victim himself.......

Apologies, 'Photojourn'! I was being terribly old fashioned and ingenuous, thinking that REAL journalists had a responsibility to their READERS as well as their editors and their bank accounts. Lord, how out of date can one be?

The extremely disturbing information posted here, which rings true to me, that this (possibly murderous) moron is still wandering around, armed, in a drunken haze, threatening foreign tourists and young women in particular, does merit what responsible scribes would call a 'follow up' story!

One which might (as well as earning MORE cash for you folks) preclude a repeat tragedy. An historically proved benefit of good media around the world, as any REAL police force will tell you.

But of course, if you are not going to risk wasting an air fare or petrol money to Pai because it's possible that no-one else may die in the latter days of this horrific episode impacting the general public, well, that's your decision, yes? An ECONOMIC decision, right?!

Yes. You stick to 'photojournalling' with INCOME at the top of your agenda. Leave the tourists and residents of Pai to their fate. Until and unless you are there with your camera - to chase the next ambulance.

Fair comment perhaps but rather presumptous and cynical in that you imagine Bulldog made some kind of small fortune on the Pai murder. From the Nation? From Canada? If the current story is true he'll probably get around to doing it in his own time. I dont think its his job to protect the residents of Pai until that time. He's about the only person here who appears to follow up stories I think. Most of them end up here. He does stuff. Sometimes he refuses to do stuff, I guess. But judging by the number of posts here he seemed quite involved in the Pai case. Timing may be an element here.

Lets wait and c what sabaijai says on this............................................................

[JohnPeel]

And tragically, given the boys in brown here, he will have quite enough raw material to last him for ever, or until he becomes a victim himself.......

And there's the rub. I'm a little surprised the Bulldog has actually survived this long on the basis of I hear that 'The Thai police are less likely to kill a farang journalist'. No doubt he will become a victim one day. Sounds like you may be cheering on the sidelines.

[sabaijai]

So Pai and it's innocent (mainly, maybe) tourists is just awaiting another tragedy, yes? So A.Drummond Esq had better show responsibility and put out another story fast, warning the world away from Pai until this moron is locked safely away.

Anyone in Pai who cares, Thai or foreigner, should also insist to all in authority that this is done. Pronto.

If it's not, then my only observation can be - get out of Dodge! YOU could be next!!

I'm sure Drummond has found another fresh murder by now. Better to wonder what the DSI is doing about it.

My guess he's probably more focused on Burma right now. But as you are the man on the scene perhaps you could enlighten us as to whether the police sergeant is indeed back on the streets at night drinking and armed.

I just returned from Pai, where I was told Sgt Maj Uthai had indeed passed through town. The police chief reportedly ordered him to return to his inactive post in Soppong to await trial and not show his face in Pai again till the trail was over.

Sgt Maj Uthai appears to be in worse shape than ever, drinking-wise, according to acquaintances of his. If he is indeed carrying a weapon, it's a travesty the police haven't confiscated it. He obviously doesn't have the pistol used the night of the shootings, and as far as anyone knows the only time he's ever fired a weapon outside of target practice was the night he was allegedly provoked by Carly and crew. I suppose finding a replacement in Thailand isn't difficult since police officers buy their own weapons anyway.

The Pai police chief is being transferred out and is currently awaiting his replacement. No idea whether the transfer is routine or related to the crime.

[Shah Jahan]

The Pai police chief is being transferred out and is currently awaiting his replacement. No idea whether the transfer is routine or related to the crime.

Somebody with more knowledge can correct me, but I seem to remember the current police chief coming in November 2006 - and since police chiefs have 2 year cycles- that means his routine transfer would be November 2008 - any transfer before that would be for extra-ordinary circumstances.

[jstumbo]

Whilst I cannot authoritatively speak for Andrew Drummond, I would hazard a guess that he would be very enamoured with finding someone captured such instances on video (either using a digicam or their mobile phone camera).

My guess would also be that AD would know to whom copies of the video should be passed, both to assist the current court case, and to run an expose on Thai TV and shame the government into locking Sgt Uthai in his own cells until the trial is complete (at least).

Gaz

I am not sure that given this particular officers history and temperament that anyone is suicidal enough to take the chance to video tape him while he is doing this.

[jackspratt]

I just returned from Pai, where I was told Sgt Maj Uthai had indeed passed through town. The police chief reportedly ordered him to return to his inactive post in Soppong to await trial and not show his face in Pai again till the trail was over.

Sgt Maj Uthai appears to be in worse shape than ever, drinking-wise, according to acquaintances of his. If he is indeed carrying a weapon, it's a travesty the police haven't confiscated it. He obviously doesn't have the pistol used the night of the shootings, and as far as anyone knows the only time he's ever fired a weapon outside of target practice was the night he was allegedly provoked by Carly and crew. I suppose finding a replacement in Thailand isn't difficult since police officers buy their own weapons anyway.

The Pai police chief is being transferred out and is currently awaiting his replacement. No idea whether the transfer is routine or related to the crime.

I am sure we are all thankful for the update.

I do find your choice of words interesting - maybe even revealing. I would have thought a more concise and accurate description would have been "the night he shot Carly and crew".

All about emphasis, isn't it

[sabaijai]

The Pai police chief is being transferred out and is currently awaiting his replacement. No idea whether the transfer is routine or related to the crime.

Somebody with more knowledge can correct me, but I seem to remember the current police chief coming in November 2006 - and since police chiefs have 2 year cycles- that means his routine transfer would be November 2008 - any transfer before that would be for extra-ordinary circumstances.

The cycles aren't always followed, ie, I've seen a lot of irregularity in movement of police chiefs both in Mae Hong Son and Chiang Mai. So unless you have inside information it's almost impossible to say whether a transfer is punishment, reward or routine.

[Arkady]

I don't know why this forum now gives me the impression I am back at school with prefects strutting about trying to ingratiate themselves with the teachers by threatening draconian punishments for minor infractions of the school rule book that was written by crusty old buffers a generation before for situations that no longer prevail. Maybe just a nightmare and I'll wake up soon.

There doesn't seem to be any more news on the case apart from allegations about the subsequent behaviour of the suspect. I wonder if Carly is still in Thailand.

A friend of mine said he saw a Thai man shot in his Mercedes in Hua Hin by two men on a motorbike a few days ago. He didn't have a clear view but it looked to him as if the guy was unlikely to have survived the volley of shots. Funnily enough the shooting doesn't seem to have been reported anywhere in English or Thai. Perhaps Thai on Thai shootings are too commonplace for the media to bother with or maybe there is black-out on reporting crimes in tourist resorts not involving foreigners for fear of scaring away tourists. That would certainly save the trouble of foreigners having to debate the pros and cons of Thai justice and whether it is still safe to visit the country at all in forums like this.