Australian Aged Pension

[bazza73]

2 hours ago, ELVIS123456 said:

Didnt know that  - thanks for the heads up.  Looks like all you have to worry about are the Dorothys and Parkers.

 

And you are right - we have to 'play' or we get nothing back.  Yanks and Poms can apply when they are overseas. It annoys me that the socialist welfare state that is now Oz, spends so much on dole bludgers and druggies and refugees and single mums and others, but makes is hard for people who have paid taxes/contributed for over 30 years to get the pension and live overseas in their 'dying' years.

While I liked this post, I have to point out that it's probably the Liberals ( when they are in power ) that are responsible for the restrictions imposed on pensioners overseas.

[ELVIS123456]

13 hours ago, bazza73 said:

While I liked this post, I have to point out that it's probably the Liberals ( when they are in power ) that are responsible for the restrictions imposed on pensioners overseas.

Fair and correct point.  And believe it or not, I am thinking of voting Labor next time, if the Libs do not reverse their policies on the age pensions.  They tried to bring in some more draconian changes after the election, and I hate to say this, but thankfully Labor blocked them in the Senate, saying they were unfair.  The changes were aimed at all pensioners and not just those overseas.

 

And believe it or not I sent a message to Malcolm telling him he is an idiot if he does not realise that the way to stay in power is to look after your 'base' (that is how angry I got).  I pointed out that the reality is that a majority of 18-35s vote Labor, and that the majority of 50+s vote Libs.  The Libs are trying to rein in the deficit which is good, but they need to be careful about pissing off their largest demographic of voters.  Hopefully they will realise this, but if they dont, then Bill will get my vote and I suspect a majority of 50+ voters will also change their vote at the next election. 

 

Screw over the pensioners, and you will voted out of office - that wmust be the lesson for Libs.  Screw over the dole bludgers, single mums, refugees, druggies on DSP, and the entire Aboriginal 'welfare system', and you will lose very few votes Libs.  But if you screw with us pensioners then we are prepared to sack you, so that you learn your lesson for the next time.  We paid our taxes and contributed - give us our dues or get voted out.

 

 

[Nemises]

 

 
One thing to consider - once on pension you can take a holiday overseas. Call CLink once the pension is being paid and let them know you are interested in having a holiday to catch up with some Aussie mates you got to know while you were there before.  Ask how it would affect your pension - say you heard that up to 6 weeks is OK.   Dont do it too often, and if you must then also visit Myanmar and Cambodia (say you have mates there if asked).  They will get a record of every country you visit. They will think you just like overseas trips. And tell no one in Aust you are married or is a serious relationship - say you had a few GFs but none permanent.  You can even tell them now that you have split with previous and have just found another girlfriend.  Mate - people talk - especially the females - word gets around.
 
 

Copy all that - thanks mate...but after obtaining the OAP I am not sure why I have to tell CL I’m going O/S albeit for a holiday or to live.

For some reason I thought that once you have obtained the OAP and you have done your 2 year penance immediately PRIOR TO obtaining OAP, you have portability?

[ELVIS123456]

4 minutes ago, Gregster said:

Copy all that - thanks mate...but after obtaining the OAP I am not sure why I have to tell CL I’m going O/S albeit for a holiday or to live.

For some reason I thought that once you have obtained the OAP and you have done your 2 year penance immediately PRIOR TO obtaining OAP, you have portability?

 

Once you are receiving any Govt payment, you are required to tell them if you are leaving the country.   If you are on Newstart (Dole) then it is stopped while you are overseas.  If you are on the Pension, then the payment is only continued if you have been approved for 'portability' , and after a certain period (6 weeks) the payment rate is reduced.  After 6 weeks the pension supplement and rental assistance is stopped.

https://www.dss.gov.au/our-responsibilities/seniors/benefits-payments/pensioners-overseas-0

 

Then after 26 weeks the pension payment amount is further reduced, depending on how many years you were resident/living in Australia prior to getting the age pension. If you have over 35 weeks you get 100%, otherwise it is reduced on a pro-rata basis.  You get nil age pension after 26 weeks if you have lived/resided in Aust for less than 10 years (no portability).  Last year the Libs tried to change the 26 weeks period to 6 weeks, but Labor blocked it.

 

Which reminds me - when back in Oz you will get extra pension/newstart payments if you are renting. Own your home and you get zip and have to pay rates etc., but rent and they will pay you up to an additional $124 a f/night.  I worked it out that I am financially better off to keep my money invested, as the interest earned plus the extra rental assistance (and no rates etc.) more than pays for the rent.

 

I think you are right on automatic portability if you have been living in Aust for at least 2 years prior to applying for pension.  I was referring to a few cases I found where guys have been delayed in getting portability approved, when they had returned and claimed the pension straight away, and then stayed the 2 years. CLink claimed that they only came back to get the pension and that they never intended staying in Oz.  Those cases were all eventually 'won' after appeals, but it took many months - and now they can delay portability up to a certain time (forgot when).  The 'source' of the claim by CLink was statements made by the person when they were back in Oz when talking to CLink staff  - "I cant wait to get back to Thailand".  Buggered if I could find the references again  today - but I previously came across them on the DSS/DHS sites.  Maybe I miss read them, but either way I will search again later this week and update if I got it wrong (about to go play golf).

 

 

 

 

[halloween]

29 minutes ago, Gregster said:

 

Copy all that - thanks mate...but after obtaining the OAP I am not sure why I have to tell CL I’m going O/S albeit for a holiday or to live.

For some reason I thought that once you have obtained the OAP and you have done your 2 year penance immediately PRIOR TO obtaining OAP, you have portability?

That is how I understand it as well. When I asked C/L about it, explaining I have been a resident for 6 months each year for 4 years before OAP age, they said no problems with portability.

[Lizard2010]

1 hour ago, Gregster said:

 

Copy all that - thanks mate...but after obtaining the OAP I am not sure why I have to tell CL I’m going O/S albeit for a holiday or to live.

For some reason I thought that once you have obtained the OAP and you have done your 2 year penance immediately PRIOR TO obtaining OAP, you have portability?

With all department being linked to centrelink

Immigration know when we leave and come back

When i come back to Oz they send me a new health care card

But i did do the right thing and advise The international Section 

I was going to live Overseas permanently

 

I can not believe why the Liberals do not think about everyone except themselves

if all partys did not raid the pension fund

We would not have all this problems

They had the 5% of taxation put aside for Our retirement pension The OAP
but they had to give all these tax breaks

Never mind that is all Old hat now

Just have to live the best we can with what we have

Only my 2 cents worth

[keithpa]

18 hours ago, ELVIS123456 said:

I hate it when ignorant people slam into TV postings - like you just did.  Annoying.  Clearly you havent read enough of the postings - nor have you studied the issues by the look of it - likely both.

 

The issue is getting a reduced pension because you are married. FACT. And it doesnt matter if your wife is of pension age or not an Aussie citizen/resident.  Married means less pension. FACT.  System was designed so that two people married both get the pension at the same time. If you have a wife, your pension is reduced to the married rate - whether she is working or not - whether she is on the pension or not - whether she is in Australia or not. 

 

Can they reduce your pension if you say nothing?  Yes they can and yes they have and yes they do.  They can claim he has a wife and reduce his pension payments - they do not have to give source of the information.  He will then have to prove he is not 'married'.  Married means living together for 12 months or more - irrelevent if you have formally married or not - once you are back in Oz their rules apply - not the rules in Thailand.  And only an idiot will try to defraud CLink and risk serious fines or worse.  Sure you can say you seperated (giving full details/records), but then you are under the risk of being made to repay, and pay fines for fraud, in all the years going forward.  Eg. you annoy someone on TV and they dob you in.

 

Yes they can cancel your pension if you go back for less than 2 years. FACT.

http://guides.dss.gov.au/guide-social-security-law/7/1/2/20

 

You want to get an understanding of this subject??  Try reading this article to get a feel about things. Expats overseas on the pension are seen as worse than dole bludgers (in the media).  For the 1st time since 80s I might vote Labor - because they are (so far) refusing to let the Libs/Nats cancel overseas payments. 

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/federal-election-2016/federal-election-2016-800m-cost-of-offshore-pensioners/news-story/fb9a0fae67c217c3420e41d6f23a5830

And try using Google - lots of info in there - and it is free.

https://www.yourlifechoices.com.au/age-pension/claiming-your-pension-overseas/twoyear-residency-rule

 

Your trying to confuse the issue with ifs, buts, and possibilities. Doesnt work with me.

[Nemises]

Have I got this right (for a single OAP living in Thailand ):

1/ the max allowable annual income to keep the FULL OAP is only $4,368 per year?

2/ Centrelink deem assets @ 3.25% ?

3/ if yes to above, the full OAP payment rate therefore starts to decrease once your assets reach approx $135,000?

[rhodie]

1 hour ago, Gregster said:

Have I got this right (for a single OAP living in Thailand ):

1/ the max allowable annual income to keep the FULL OAP is only $4,368 per year?

2/ Centrelink deem assets @ 3.25% ?

3/ if yes to above, the full OAP payment rate therefore starts to decrease once your assets reach approx $135,000?

Off the top of my head, I believe you can earn $250 a fortnight without affecting your payment. You can also have up to $250k in Super and own your home without affecting your payment. 

 

"For financial investments worth up to $49,200 (for singles), and up to $81,600 (for couples), a deeming rate of 1.75% applies. For financial investments above $49,200 (singles) or above $81,600 (couples), a higher deeming rate of 3.25% applies.Jun 22, 2017"

[halloween]

3 hours ago, Gregster said:

Have I got this right (for a single OAP living in Thailand ):

1/ the max allowable annual income to keep the FULL OAP is only $4,368 per year?

2/ Centrelink deem assets @ 3.25% ?

3/ if yes to above, the full OAP payment rate therefore starts to decrease once your assets reach approx $135,000?

 $250 income is allowed per fortnight, and you lose 50c of pension for every dollar above that. BUT any allowance not used accumulates up to one year, so after a year, you could earn $6500 without pension loss if no other income during the year.

[bazza73]

1 hour ago, rhodie said:

Off the top of my head, I believe you can earn $250 a fortnight without affecting your payment. You can also have up to $250k in Super and own your home without affecting your payment. 

 

"For financial investments worth up to $49,200 (for singles), and up to $81,600 (for couples), a deeming rate of 1.75% applies. For financial investments above $49,200 (singles) or above $81,600 (couples), a higher deeming rate of 3.25% applies.Jun 22, 2017"

"and own your own home without affecting your payment".

This is where it gets tricky. I'm on a part pension. I'm single. If I was to buy a property here, irrespective of value, I would lose  a lot in pension. So obviously I'm going to rent.

Somehow, Centrelink has created an anomaly where if you are on the full pension, home ownership is OK. On a part pension, you get savaged. The higher the assets are, the worse it gets.Here's a link:

 

http://www.yourpension.com.au/APCalc/#CalcForm

 

Plug in a few numbers for single homeowner vs single non-homeowner with assets above the threshold for a full pension, and you'll see what I mean.

Edited October 18, 2017 by bazza73
mod

[bazza73]

On 10/17/2017 at 9:20 AM, ELVIS123456 said:

Fair and correct point.  And believe it or not, I am thinking of voting Labor next time, if the Libs do not reverse their policies on the age pensions.  They tried to bring in some more draconian changes after the election, and I hate to say this, but thankfully Labor blocked them in the Senate, saying they were unfair.  The changes were aimed at all pensioners and not just those overseas.

 

And believe it or not I sent a message to Malcolm telling him he is an idiot if he does not realise that the way to stay in power is to look after your 'base' (that is how angry I got).  I pointed out that the reality is that a majority of 18-35s vote Labor, and that the majority of 50+s vote Libs.  The Libs are trying to rein in the deficit which is good, but they need to be careful about pissing off their largest demographic of voters.  Hopefully they will realise this, but if they dont, then Bill will get my vote and I suspect a majority of 50+ voters will also change their vote at the next election. 

 

Screw over the pensioners, and you will voted out of office - that wmust be the lesson for Libs.  Screw over the dole bludgers, single mums, refugees, druggies on DSP, and the entire Aboriginal 'welfare system', and you will lose very few votes Libs.  But if you screw with us pensioners then we are prepared to sack you, so that you learn your lesson for the next time.  We paid our taxes and contributed - give us our dues or get voted out.

 

 

Off topic, OK.

Lee Trevino: "When I get too old to play golf, I'm going to get a navy jacket and a bottle of dandruff, and become a USGA rules official".

[Nemises]

 $250 income is allowed per fortnight, ...you could earn $6500 without pension loss if no other income during the year.

Thanks. I’ve also heard of $250 income per fortnight being allowed, but when I look up:

https://www.humanservices.gov.au/individuals/enablers/pension-rates-payable-people-outside-australia

It says that the amount per year allowable income while outside Australia for the full pension for a single is $4,368.00 ($168.00 per fortnight)

?

[Nemises]

[bazza73]

1 hour ago, Gregster said:

I think you may be confused with the residency situation. Declare yourself non-resident in Australia, and that income may well apply. If you are officially still resident in Australia ( i.e. you are only going overseas for quite a long holiday ) then there's no way those limits would apply. Every government MP in Australia would be beaten to death by outraged pensioners if that were so.

[Nemises]

I think you may be confused with the residency situation. Declare yourself non-resident in Australia, and that income may well apply. If you are officially still resident in Australia ( i.e. you are only going overseas for quite a long holiday ) then there's no way those limits would apply. Every government MP in Australia would be beaten to death by outraged pensioners if that were so.

Thanks for clarifying Bazza. But as mentioned in my original question (post #1808), I WILL be a non-resident... ie “living in Thailand”. As such, I take it you agree it’s an allowable max of $168 not $250 per fortnight income?

[rhodie]

1 hour ago, Gregster said:

 

Thanks for clarifying Bazza. But as mentioned in my original question (post #1808), I WILL be a non-resident... ie “living in Thailand”. As such, I take it you agree it’s an allowable max of $168 not $250 per fortnight income?

 

Sounds correct.

 

Are there any benefits to not keeping Australian residency?

[Nemises]

Sounds correct.
 
Are there any benefits to not keeping Australian residency?

Well, no. None that I know about.

I just assumed that after obtaining OAP portability, moving to/living in Thailand and only returning to AU every few years for 2 week holidays to visit family and friends, that I would automatically be declared a “non-resident” by Centrelink. Have I assumed incorrectly?

[rhodie]

5 minutes ago, Gregster said:

 

Well, no. None that I know about.

I just assumed that after obtaining OAP portability, moving to/living in Thailand and only returning to AU every few years for 2 week holidays to visit family and friends, that I would automatically be declared a “non-resident” by Centrelink. Have I assumed incorrectly?

 

OK, not sure about that. But, unfortunately noting is cast in stone so you only find out when they assess any changes. Still have a few years to go, but I still have my unit, (not rented), there and will keep it and will always maintain that I am a resident, just holidaying. Although I return 3 times a year and intend to keep that up.

[bazza73]

4 hours ago, Gregster said:

 

Well, no. None that I know about.

I just assumed that after obtaining OAP portability, moving to/living in Thailand and only returning to AU every few years for 2 week holidays to visit family and friends, that I would automatically be declared a “non-resident” by Centrelink. Have I assumed incorrectly?

If you continue to maintain an Australian address ( relatives will do ) you continue to be classed as resident in Australia. There are advantages to doing that. I seem to remember some Centrelink rule which kicks in after you have been away for more than six months.

There are definite downsides to being classed as resident in a foreign country. If you have taxable income, the ATO will treat you differently to an Australian resident. While I don't know all the rules there, I do know non-residents are not entitled to the franking credits accompanying share dividends, so their tax payable will be higher.

[bazza73]

5 hours ago, Gregster said:

 

Thanks for clarifying Bazza. But as mentioned in my original question (post #1808), I WILL be a non-resident... ie “living in Thailand”. As such, I take it you agree it’s an allowable max of $168 not $250 per fortnight income?

 

Yes.

[ELVIS123456]

On 10/17/2017 at 1:21 PM, Gregster said:

For some reason I thought that once you have obtained the OAP and you have done your 2 year penance immediately PRIOR TO obtaining OAP, you have portability?

 

I think you are right on automatic portability if you have been living in Aust for at least 2 years prior to applying for pension.  I was referring to a few cases I found where guys have been delayed in getting portability approved, when they had returned and claimed the pension straight away, and then stayed the 2 years. CLink claimed that they only came back to get the pension and that they never intended staying in Oz.  Those cases were all eventually 'won' after appeals, but it took many months - and now they can delay portability up to a certain time (forgot when).  The 'source' of the claim by CLink was statements made by the person when they were back in Oz when talking to CLink staff  - "I cant wait to get back to Thailand".  Buggered if I could find the references again  today - but I previously came across them on the DSS/DHS sites.  Maybe I miss read them, but either way I will search again later this week and update if I got it wrong (about to go play golf).

 

I cannot find the references to those blokes who had returned and waited 2 years, but then had their portability delayed/denied.  Maybe they were on that DSS site where they give examples of previous 'cases' and determinations - but I cannot find them - and maybe CLink has removed them for some reason.  During the year or so before I left Oz I did a lot of research (and lots since to keep up to date).  Maybe I came across them on some forum?

 

I am however convinced (probably) that I am right in that CLink can deny/delay portability.   This is the section from the Act that refers to 'former residents'  who return when they are eligible for OAP,  and who then seek to leave and take the payments with them.

Portability of payments for former residence

The fundamental tenets of the Australian social security system are residence and need. Because residence is a fundamental qualification criterion for Australian social security payments, former residents who return to Australia and subsequently claim Australian social security payments with indefinite portability, are required to stay in Australia for at least two years before their payment becomes portable. The policy rationale for this requirement is that indefinite portability is only available to Australian residents. The former resident rule prevents people who lose their connections with Australia to return to Australia just to obtain a pension and return overseas.

 

 

I have highlighted above, from the main part of the Act, which says  'for at least 2 years'.  

 

7.1.4 Requirements for Former Residents of Australia Receiving a Portable Pension

A person arriving in or returning to Australia (1.1.A.320) must satisfy the Act's definition of Australian resident in order to lodge a proper claim for a pension. A former resident who returns to Australia and is granted a pension (Age, DSP, WP, WidB, BVA), or who transferred under SS(Admin)Act section 12 to Age CANNOT take that pension outside Australia if they leave again within 24 months after having again become an Australian resident. The purpose of this legislation is to discourage people from coming to Australia just to get an Australian pension to take back overseas.

 

As I have highlighted above, the detail part of the Act says  'if they leave again within 24 months'.  This clearly states that leaving within 24 months means automatic disqualification for portability.  BUT it does not state anywhere in ACT, that I could find, that staying for more than 24 months means automatic qualification for portability.

 

What all that means IMO is that the approval for portability is discretionary at the decision of CLink.  Which means at the discretion of the relevent delegate within CLink (whichever Feminist Nazi is in charge on that day). 

 

https://www.dss.gov.au/about-the-department/international/policy/portability-of-australian-income-support-payments

 

I also found this in a fact sheet from a 'social security rights' organisation:

 

Some people who have been living overseas may wish to return to Australia to claim a pension with unlimited portability with a view to taking it overseas with them again. You should be aware that a new claim for such a pension can only be successful where on the evidence available there is a clear intention to remain permanently in Australia. If Centrelink believe that you only intend to return Australia for a 24 month period then they will not be able to find that you “reside in Australia” and will not be able to grant you payment.  

https://www.brq.org.au/assets/Uploads/1FactSheets2016/BRQ-IndefinitePortabilityandFormerResidents-BRQ2016.pdf

 

What that means (IMO) is that if you go back to Australia and CLink believes you have no intention of staying in Australia, they can deny/delay Age Pension payments to you from day 1.  This would undoubtedly mean that even if you win on appeal, that they will have cause to delay approving your portability 2 years later.  I am thinking this is what those blokes did wrong - they said they were only back for that reason (to CLink? to friends? to fellow golfers? drinking mates? ).

 

 

My advice for all who are planning on going back to Oz to get the Pension in order to be able to return ASAP to LOS with full or partial pension payments, is two things:

 

1.  Make it clear to ALL (friends, family, CLink, ATO, golfing/drinking mates, etc etc - this is ALL) that you have been overseas and had your fun, but you have decided to return and 'settle down' and intend to stay in Australia for the rest of your life.  Say things like LOS is great but the medical system is less than ideal and is very expensive, and Oz has a much better system and it is free. Complain about the roads and how dangerous it is.  Say everything and anything to give the impression you are staying long term in Oz.  Telling anyone you will going back to Oz the minute you can take the pension with you, only leaves yourself open to being 'reported' by some ahole who hears that from a friend of a friend of a friend -  and it would be some bitch you have pissed off somehow who dobs you in.

 

For those of you who have a Thai wife/GF and are OK to tell CLink/Govt, then my suggestion would be to take her with you as a Partner Migrant Visa (min 2 years + 2).  If you/she cannot do this, then tell ALL that she is preparing things in Thailand and that you are saving up the money ($7000), to lodge the Partner Migrant Visa in the future/soon.  As the months go by tell ALL that you are sending money to help her/family, but as soon as it is sorted and you have the money for a Migrant Visa she is coming to live here too.  Bring her over once or twice on a tourist Visa.  Next thing you know it is over 2 years later, and things have not worked out, and the Mother is sick, and etc etc etc. So you have to move back to Thailand (with the pension).

 

For those of you who have a Thai wife/GF and are OK to tell CLink/Govt, and can  also afford to get the Partner Migrant Visa before you qualify for the Pension, and can afford to come back to Oz and stay for at least 2 years before the pension -  then do that.   For those that can afford to come back before the pension then do it.  Portability is virtually automatic for anyone who has been a resident in Australia for at least 2 years before applying for the Pension. I never found one example of anyone being denied/delayed portability if they were in Oz for years before getting the pension - the only ones delayed/denied were those who came back to serve out the two years (and were too obvious or talked to much). 

 

2.  Stay across the developments on this matter.  Indefinite portability is a loophole that the Libs want to close, and even Labor one day might decide to stop age pensioners living 'on holidays overseas at the taxpayers expense' (as the media portrays us).  As things change - and they will - you will need to make changes to your plans.  Dont assume what is right today will be right in a few years.  Every election cycle brings the added risk of the Govt seeking to save taxpayers money being wasted on those Expats having an overseas holiday at the taxpayers expense :)

 

 

There are people you can trust, and there are people you cannot trust.  But you can trust that all people will talk about other people - what they know, but also what they have heard.  The greater the  amount of X chromosomes, the greater the level of talk.

 

[Nemises]

Without doubt the most informative, relevant, interesting and HELPFUL TVF post that I have ever had the pleasure in reading!

Couldn’t agree more with ALL that you say.

Sincere thanks mate.

[4MyEgo]

On 17/10/2017 at 1:20 PM, ELVIS123456 said:

Fair and correct point.  And believe it or not, I am thinking of voting Labor next time, if the Libs do not reverse their policies on the age pensions.  They tried to bring in some more draconian changes after the election, and I hate to say this, but thankfully Labor blocked them in the Senate, saying they were unfair.  The changes were aimed at all pensioners and not just those overseas.

 

And believe it or not I sent a message to Malcolm telling him he is an idiot if he does not realise that the way to stay in power is to look after your 'base' (that is how angry I got).  I pointed out that the reality is that a majority of 18-35s vote Labor, and that the majority of 50+s vote Libs.  The Libs are trying to rein in the deficit which is good, but they need to be careful about pissing off their largest demographic of voters.  Hopefully they will realise this, but if they dont, then Bill will get my vote and I suspect a majority of 50+ voters will also change their vote at the next election. 

 

Screw over the pensioners, and you will voted out of office - that wmust be the lesson for Libs.  Screw over the dole bludgers, single mums, refugees, druggies on DSP, and the entire Aboriginal 'welfare system', and you will lose very few votes Libs.  But if you screw with us pensioners then we are prepared to sack you, so that you learn your lesson for the next time.  We paid our taxes and contributed - give us our dues or get voted out.

 

 

Its an absolute disgrace that we can be Australian Citizens, but as foreign residents they take away our voting rights, C....ts have it all worked out, how the F can they do that, we cannot vote in a foreign country because we are not citizens.

 

Stupid, stupid, stupid rule, but clearly it wipes off about a million voters, a clever move then, obviously. 

[4MyEgo]

On 17/10/2017 at 1:50 PM, ELVIS123456 said:

Once you are receiving any Govt payment, you are required to tell them if you are leaving the country.   If you are on Newstart (Dole) then it is stopped while you are overseas.  If you are on the Pension, then the payment is only continued if you have been approved for 'portability' , and after a certain period (6 weeks) the payment rate is reduced.  After 6 weeks the pension supplement and rental assistance is stopped.

https://www.dss.gov.au/our-responsibilities/seniors/benefits-payments/pensioners-overseas-0

 

Then after 26 weeks the pension payment amount is further reduced, depending on how many years you were resident/living in Australia prior to getting the age pension. If you have over 35 weeks you get 100%, otherwise it is reduced on a pro-rata basis.  You get nil age pension after 26 weeks if you have lived/resided in Aust for less than 10 years (no portability).  Last year the Libs tried to change the 26 weeks period to 6 weeks, but Labor blocked it.

 

Which reminds me - when back in Oz you will get extra pension/newstart payments if you are renting. Own your home and you get zip and have to pay rates etc., but rent and they will pay you up to an additional $124 a f/night.  I worked it out that I am financially better off to keep my money invested, as the interest earned plus the extra rental assistance (and no rates etc.) more than pays for the rent.

 

I think you are right on automatic portability if you have been living in Aust for at least 2 years prior to applying for pension.  I was referring to a few cases I found where guys have been delayed in getting portability approved, when they had returned and claimed the pension straight away, and then stayed the 2 years. CLink claimed that they only came back to get the pension and that they never intended staying in Oz.  Those cases were all eventually 'won' after appeals, but it took many months - and now they can delay portability up to a certain time (forgot when).  The 'source' of the claim by CLink was statements made by the person when they were back in Oz when talking to CLink staff  - "I cant wait to get back to Thailand".  Buggered if I could find the references again  today - but I previously came across them on the DSS/DHS sites.  Maybe I miss read them, but either way I will search again later this week and update if I got it wrong (about to go play golf).

 

 

 

 

You are spot on, the legislation clearly states that if the government thinks that you only returned to get the pension and then piss off after 2 years, they can stop your pension portability and you will have to return and state your case under an appeal, months on end of red tape.

 

The moral of the story, return 2 years beforehand, get on the dole/newstart or work as I will, to proud to go on the dole and it will add weight to the already overburdened system.

 

Once you have been approved for the OAP, you can apply for portability and advise C'L that you are going for a holiday back to Thailand, not sure how long, maybe a year, 2, 3, 4, or until you kick the bucket, is that ok Mr/Mrs C/L, if there is a problem, they will tell you up front, as opposed to cancelling you payments doing it the the other way. i.e. returning at OAP age and getting the pension for 2 years and then going back, its as clear as daylight what you are doing, so put that condom on and proceed with care, as opposed to breaking it 555

[4MyEgo]

On 17/10/2017 at 1:53 PM, halloween said:

That is how I understand it as well. When I asked C/L about it, explaining I have been a resident for 6 months each year for 4 years before OAP age, they said no problems with portability.

Correct, if you have been a resident, portability is fine, and if you have been in the country for those years, you will s..t it in, i.e. your plan will work brilliantly and you will be on your way to a paid retirement, living where you choose.

Edited October 20, 2017 by 4MyEgo

[4MyEgo]

On 18/10/2017 at 9:55 PM, rhodie said:

OK, not sure about that. But, unfortunately noting is cast in stone so you only find out when they assess any changes. Still have a few years to go, but I still have my unit, (not rented), there and will keep it and will always maintain that I am a resident, just holidaying. Although I return 3 times a year and intend to keep that up.

I hope you can maintain your residency, not as easy as some think, as the 183 day rule is a hard one to beat from what cases I have read, it is more so the time you spend in the country that gives you "clear residency status" 

 

Be very careful about holding on to your unit post 30 June, 2019 if you think there is a chance you cannot be classed as a resident. as the government is changing things, whereas you will get slugged tax at a scale rate and capital gains tax on your principal place of residence.

 

Don't quote me 100% on this as my memory to changes is about as good as yesterday's news, will see if I can find the link for you to research.

 

5 minutes later, here is the 6 year rule, below it is the change to it for foreign residence: https://www.ato.gov.au/General/Capital-gains-tax/Your-home-and-other-real-estate/Your-main-residence/Treating-a-dwelling-as-your-main-residence-after-you-move-out/

 

This is one to look out for: http://www.budget.gov.au/2017-18/content/glossies/factsheets/html/HA_16.htm

 

Another below, so a lot of people are going to get caught out, hope this brings you up to speed and you can avoid being caught out ?

 

http://www.expattaxes.com.au/the-6-year-rule-tax-advantages-for-expat-aussies-renting-out-their-principal-residence/

 

 

[4MyEgo]

On 19/10/2017 at 2:18 AM, bazza73 said:

If you continue to maintain an Australian address ( relatives will do ) you continue to be classed as resident in Australia. There are advantages to doing that. I seem to remember some Centrelink rule which kicks in after you have been away for more than six months.

There are definite downsides to being classed as resident in a foreign country. If you have taxable income, the ATO will treat you differently to an Australian resident. While I don't know all the rules there, I do know non-residents are not entitled to the franking credits accompanying share dividends, so their tax payable will be higher.

If you buy shares that are fully franked, your fine as the tax has been paid, and any capital gains are tax free for foreign residence, however if you have franked credits, you will have to pay tax on them, but I am pretty sure you can off-set any losses, if any against the tax you are up for. 

[4MyEgo]

On 19/10/2017 at 2:36 PM, ELVIS123456 said:

For those of you who have a Thai wife/GF and are OK to tell CLink/Govt, and can  also afford to get the Partner Migrant Visa before you qualify for the Pension, and can afford to come back to Oz and stay for at least 2 years before the pension -  then do that.   For those that can afford to come back before the pension then do it.  Portability is virtually automatic for anyone who has been a resident in Australia for at least 2 years before applying for the Pension. I never found one example of anyone being denied/delayed portability if they were in Oz for years before getting the pension - the only ones delayed/denied were those who came back to serve out the two years (and were too obvious or talked to much). 

 

2.  Stay across the developments on this matter.  Indefinite portability is a loophole that the Libs want to close, and even Labor one day might decide to stop age pensioners living 'on holidays overseas at the taxpayers expense' (as the media portrays us).  As things change - and they will - you will need to make changes to your plans.  Dont assume what is right today will be right in a few years.  Every election cycle brings the added risk of the Govt seeking to save taxpayers money being wasted on those Expats having an overseas holiday at the taxpayers expense :)

Your all over this like a rash Elvis 123456

 

Naturally we all appreciate the information we all share on this post.

 

My plans are constantly changing, having only found out that I can get a married pension, although about $100 less then the single pension per week, that doesn't both me in the slightest, better safe then sorry and I like to sleep at night.

 

The planned return of two years earlier has always remained and I will do that, health and life allowing at 65.5 to wait the two years out.

 

As I will have my wife, two daughters, and her adult sons with us at the time, I will more than likely buy a place to live in, as title will also show I am fixed to stay, on top of the girls going to public schools, and the Mrs working part time and probably me the same, up to the approval date at 67.5, after that, like you say, the Mrs mum has taken ill, so we have to leave, sell the place, re-coupe the costs, and back to Thailand, once in Thailand, I can say we live in rural Thailand which we do and job opportunities are not good for older Thai women, and request the top up, i.e. the $100 a week.

 

Like you said, keep on top of this, things change, and hopefully things stay as they are for the next 10 years until I get return to sit it out to get my pension, and yes, loose tongues, sink ships !

[sceadugenga]

Breaking news is that Barnaby Joyce, Deputy PM just bit the dust.

The major parties will be thinking about going into election mode, might be an idea to email or call your MP with your wish list.

Age pension portability is an easy fix, it costs the government little and the pensioner vote will matter.