Chiang Mai In Flames

[Mapguy]

From today's Chiang Mai Mail:

Chiang Mai in flames - but this time it's serious

Huge fire near Doi Saket

Staff Reporter

Following last week's FeMail article about illegal burning, a dramatic example of the very real dangers of this traditional practice took place last Wednesday night adjacent to the southbound carriageway of Highway 118, approximately 3 kilometres south of the Doi Saket turning and dangerously close to Bor Hin village, the Horizon resort complex, and several large modern moo baans (village estate). By 10 p.m. the fire was raging over an area of many rai of land, with palls of smoke illuminated by the flames visible from the city itself. Flames reached high into the night sky; at ground level the smoke was so dense that drivers on Highway 118 could not see the fronts of their own vehicles. Flashing lights were everywhere, confirming the presence of the police, the fire services, and the paramedics, although it is not yet known if there were any casualties, nor if any properties were damaged. In the midst of the chaos of vehicles and emergency services, sightseers wandered about, careless both of their own safety and of the fact that they were hampering efforts to douse the flames. Police seemed not to be monitoring either the traffic or the sightseers.

Whilst we all hope that no injuries were sustained, and no property was damaged or destroyed, the night's trauma was a graphic illustration of how the burning of fields can easily get out of control. How long before a similar conflagration kills and destroys? How long before the people who use this method of clearance realise that there are less deadly ways of fertilising for the next crop? How long before we all take responsibility, both for the environment and for the safety of its inhabitants? How long?

We would like to ask readers to send in their own experiences, their own comments, and their own suggestions. In this way FeMail can join with the environmental groups and organisations who are working towards a solution to this perennial problem.

<script type="text/javascript"> <script type="text/javascript" src="http://pagead2.googlesyndication.com/pagead/show_ads.js">

[Mapguy]

Also from this week's Chiang Mai Mail:

Anti-pollution measures now in place in Chiang Mai

Residents note that burning continues unchecked!

Staff reporters

Further to the recent issuance by the Governor of Chiang Mai, Wibun Sa-nguanphong, of a Public Order banning burning of all kinds in open areas, an announcement has been made that all preventative and safety measures have now been implemented.

The head of the Chiang Mai Office of Public Disaster and Prevention, Prachon Prachayasakul, stated that his office has co-ordinated with forestry officials and local organisations in order to ensure that last year’s disastrous pollution problems are not repeated in 2008. Personnel and equipment to deal with fires are at present on standby, and the public are requested to call the relevant call centre number, 053-409345 to report any burning of stubble, rubbish, etc. The press release does not mention whether the personnel at the call centre are able to take calls in English, but states that the centre will be able to co-ordinate with the police and fire departments to ensure an immediate response.

The report also states that the preventative measures which have been put in place will only be successful if local citizens and the general public respond to and co-operate with the local government’s call to eliminate this traditional practice and to adopt other, more modern methods of land clearance, fertilisation and rubbish disposal

2007’s pollution problems caused massive disruption and damage to the local economy, as tourists cancelled or foreshortened their visits to the entire Northern area of the Kingdom, and residents left the area for fresher locations. Some, no doubt, decided not to return. It is difficult to understand how this problem can be solved when, in at least one other Northern province, Mae Hong Son, “controlled” burning seems to be permitted providing local headmen are informed and give their approval.MailMAIL

[realthaideal]

Do we really need this ? How about posting it to the old threads (Yes, THREADSSSSS) and letting it be. Oh really, fires can spread and cause danger? Great, thanks. Leave it be already.

How about the 'What a frikkin' beautiful day it was today thread? Or the 'Wow! I can see so many stars out tonight thread?' Seriously, let go. Relax. Enjoy. This is getting to be major forum pollution, this here topic.

Maybe form the concerned-about-fires-and-wont'-quit-talking-about-it club, meet amongst yourselves, and talk it to death all living day long. But leave us out of it. I mean seriously, Wow! This is astounding.

I for one think things are great out there right now. Yes, I'm a concerned citizen. But I don't need to post my every microfiber of passing worrisome thoughts for others to read. Any other takers ?

Whew. A little better now.

[Priceless]

Do we really need this ? How about posting it to the old threads (Yes, THREADSSSSS) and letting it be. Oh really, fires can spread and cause danger? Great, thanks. Leave it be already.

How about the 'What a frikkin' beautiful day it was today thread? Or the 'Wow! I can see so many stars out tonight thread?' Seriously, let go. Relax. Enjoy. This is getting to be major forum pollution, this here topic.

Maybe form the concerned-about-fires-and-wont'-quit-talking-about-it club, meet amongst yourselves, and talk it to death all living day long. But leave us out of it. I mean seriously, Wow! This is astounding.

I for one think things are great out there right now. Yes, I'm a concerned citizen. But I don't need to post my every microfiber of passing worrisome thoughts for others to read. Any other takers ?

Whew. A little better now.

I agree wholeheartedly! Furthermore, links to the articles were already posted in post #71 of this thread:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?sh...50&start=50

/ Priceless

[Rasseru]

But leave us out of it. I mean seriously . . .

Very well, you now have official permission to leave yourself out of threads such as this.

[Rasseru]

But leave us out of it. I mean seriously . . .

I agree wholeheartedly! . . .

/ Priceless

In that case, you too now have official permission to leave yourself out of threads on this subject.

[lannarebirth]

Oh, I guess I read it wrong. I thought it said "Chiang Mai Mail In Flames" . As the fire was reported in this weeks edition, can I assume it happened quite some time ago?

[Cyberstar]

My God! Is it the whole province !? - Or is it just the whole city ?

[lannarebirth]

My God! Is it the whole province !? - Or is it just the whole city ?

Nobody knows for sure, but it must have happened sometime after KanWin's visit.

[Mapguy]

Do we really need this ? How about posting it to the old threads (Yes, THREADSSSSS) and letting it be. Oh really, fires can spread and cause danger? Great, thanks. Leave it be already.

How about the 'What a frikkin' beautiful day it was today thread? Or the 'Wow! I can see so many stars out tonight thread?' Seriously, let go. Relax. Enjoy. This is getting to be major forum pollution, this here topic.

Maybe form the concerned-about-fires-and-wont'-quit-talking-about-it club, meet amongst yourselves, and talk it to death all living day long. But leave us out of it. I mean seriously, Wow! This is astounding.

I for one think things are great out there right now. Yes, I'm a concerned citizen. But I don't need to post my every microfiber of passing worrisome thoughts for others to read. Any other takers ?

Whew. A little better now.

"Do we really need this?" Yes, unfortunately! And, unfortunately, there was nothing substantive in this posting; just a rant. But I do agree with the poster on two points.

First, I would like to agree that today was indeed a beautiful day, as have many days been of late --- after the unusual rains for the season cleansed the air. The problem of air pollution and, occasionally, bad fires such as the one featured this week in the Chiang Mai Mail, are also a sad reality that have to be faced. The government of Thailand didn't declare some of the northern provinces disaster areas for nothing last March. This year, health warnings weren't posted for northern Thailand last month for nothing. One has to admire the simple honesty of such declarations in the face of their negative impact upon tourism.

Second, I agree that there are too many different threads on air pollution and related topics on the site. It indeed makes it difficult to have a coherent conversation over time. One of the unfortunate facts about forums like this is that it is not at all easy to manage posts for a number of reasons, one of which is simply that threads "grow stale." It is just the nature of the medium, like yesterday's newspapers end up forgotten. Well........maybe an exception is the focus on finding the perfect hamburger in Chiang Mai!

I write these posts not just because I am some sort of health freak. I'm not. But I do believe that if people keep denying there is a problem or glossing over it lightly, then what is indeed a problem will go unsolved. It takes information, education, and enforcement. Denial doesn't hack it.

[Mapguy]

Oh yes, and check out the "Images of Chiang Mai" thread. THIS is what the area looks like when the air is really clear after a good rain. Look at the fourth photo, a landscape, especially. I believe it looks to the west/northwest on the road circling around Doi Suthep, which has spectacular views when clear. I wish I had been there that morning. By the way, the mist you see is humid air, not pollution, atop Doi Suthep in the wat.

[Cyberstar]

I write these posts not just because I am some sort of health freak. I'm not. But I do believe that if people keep denying there is a problem or glossing over it lightly, then what is indeed a problem will go unsolved. It takes information, education, and enforcement. Denial doesn't hack it.

Your argumentation fails on one essential point: You can feed "information, education, and enforcement" to the readers of this forum in millions of threads grabbing each and every opportunity to preach doom - it's neither the tourists, resident expats, nor the few educated Thais that may bother to read this board, that needs "information, education, and enforcement" in numerous of threads. Neither is it within our power to change anything but maybe the neighbors in our moo baan (whose combined burning, actually amounts to about nothing in the big picture). - Frankly, you're merely pestering us.

Your sense of reality is pretty poor, I'd say.

[davidgtr]

Mapguy

Bloody hel_l, what can we say...... The end of the world is near...... Welcome to Chiang Mai..... What are you doing here? .....Maybe get a life.

[swain]

There are enough people that see the problem and are willing to say this IS a problem and we are not going to remain silent about it anymore. I applaud your intolerance! But this is only the start. If enough of us raise our voices, we will be heard. fine fine... relax Chiang Mai is still my home... I love it here..... so lets fix the problem.

[mcgriffith]

It's the End of the World, as we know it,

It's the End of the world, as we know it,

It's the End of the World as we know it,

I Feel Fiiiiiiiine........

(credit to R.E.M. )

[Mapguy]

I write these posts not just because I am some sort of health freak. I'm not. But I do believe that if people keep denying there is a problem or glossing over it lightly, then what is indeed a problem will go unsolved. It takes information, education, and enforcement. Denial doesn't hack it.

Your argumentation fails on one essential point: You can feed "information, education, and enforcement" to the readers of this forum in millions of threads grabbing each and every opportunity to preach doom - it's neither the tourists, resident expats, nor the few educated Thais that may bother to read this board, that needs "information, education, and enforcement" in numerous of threads. Neither is it within our power to change anything but maybe the neighbors in our moo baan (whose combined burning, actually amounts to about nothing in the big picture). - Frankly, you're merely pestering us.

Your sense of reality is pretty poor, I'd say.

Why bother to read this board, indeed! It can be rough going! To find the ultimate hamburger? To listen to a bunch of bar buddies absorbed with posting "smilies" while being cute with one another? Who is "us?"

"Us" includes a lot of folks, not all of whom agree with you. If you do bother to thread your way through the threads on this topic (which does take a lot of effort beyond what would normally be expected of a reader), you will find quite a few constructive posts by "them." Or, should I say "us?"

I do not agree with you --- nor do many of "us/them" --- that the only people you might personally impress with a plea to clean up their acts are the immediate neighbors who are burning their trash which smoke wafts through your living room. Handling that sort of thing is no easier here than it is in any neighborhood, I think, in any country. There are some interesting posts (on other related threads) about farmer reactions to environmental regulation in (at least) Australia where trash burning apparently was considered a constitutional right, much like some in the USA claim that owning a submachine gun is a constitutional right!

Is my sense of reality lacking? Do I "preach doom?" You are certainly allowed some poetic license, but I am not a card-carrying hardnose of some "radical" environmental group. And I do understand and respect the differences in economic development which create contrasts between a country like Thailand and others more economically favored over time. I rather admire what this goernment and its leaders have done within a very short historical framework compared with, say, the UK where it took the "killer fogs" of London in the 1950s (which did kill thousands of people) to make a start! That wasn't that long ago, really!

To shift gears, I do hope that I am realistic in respecting this forum as a place for a substantive discussion. There are many pub conversations where I will simply smile and walk away from before they become arguments. Why bother! But more than bar buddies read this site. The point, again --- ad hominum arguments aside --- is that there IS a significant problem with pollution in Chiang Mai, that it IS recognized by whoever lives here, both caring Chiang Mai natives and caring expatriate residents.

You don't have to be rich or educated to get it. Poor, uneducated folk know pollution when they breathe it, too, and they have to miss a day's work to visit the hospital with their wheezing child. Have you hung out in the waiting rooms of Chiang Mai hospitals when the air is rotten? Never mind asthma! Do you know about the propensity for Thalassemia Syndrome in native Thais and the increase in respiratory illnesses because of it?

All that means that, indeed, something can and should be accomplished. I don't think that you mean to insult the intelligence of the national government, the governor of the province, the mayor, well-off Thai and expatriate folks in Chiang Mai, or people who suffer through it often without any resources to escape from it. I have read more than a few posts on this site by people who have said, "Well, when it gets bad, I just go to the beach!" I'm glad you have the fare.

A last point. Does this get boring? Yes, until you start to wheeze yourself, I suppose. Regretably, sometimes you have to smack the darn mule across the head with a big stick to get his attention!

[lannarebirth]

There are enough people that see the problem and are willing to say this IS a problem and we are not going to remain silent about it anymore. I applaud your intolerance! But this is only the start. If enough of us raise our voices, we will be heard. fine fine... relax Chiang Mai is still my home... I love it here..... so lets fix the problem.

Many many of us are working to "fix" the problem to the extent we can. Many many others of you are simply chronic whiners. For crissakes, give it a rest.

[swain]

There are enough people that see the problem and are willing to say this IS a problem and we are not going to remain silent about it anymore. I applaud your intolerance! But this is only the start. If enough of us raise our voices, we will be heard. fine fine... relax Chiang Mai is still my home... I love it here..... so lets fix the problem.

Many many of us are working to "fix" the problem to the extent we can. Many many others of you are simply chronic whiners. For crissakes, give it a rest.

ahhh no rest... thats the point... beat it to death or until its not an issue anymore. And I am one that is trying to keep my carbon imprint on Thailand down to a minimum. If you have other suggestions I am open to any words of wisdom you have to offer.

Talking about sunsets and how wonderful it is here is not going to solve the problem... if enough tourists bypass Chiang Mai as a destination this might get some attention from the people that matter.

[lannarebirth]

There are enough people that see the problem and are willing to say this IS a problem and we are not going to remain silent about it anymore. I applaud your intolerance! But this is only the start. If enough of us raise our voices, we will be heard. fine fine... relax Chiang Mai is still my home... I love it here..... so lets fix the problem.

Many many of us are working to "fix" the problem to the extent we can. Many many others of you are simply chronic whiners. For crissakes, give it a rest.

ahhh no rest... thats the point... beat it to death or until its not an issue anymore. And I am one that is trying to keep my carbon imprint on Thailand down to a minimum. If you have other suggestions I am open to any words of wisdom you have to offer.

Talking about sunsets and how wonderful it is here is not going to solve the problem... if enough tourists bypass Chiang Mai as a destination this might get some attention from the people that matter.

I suggested everyone mention what steps they had personally taken to reduce pollution levels. Not one person responded including you people who are constantly whining. The last recorded unhealthful air day was 10 months ago.

[Austhaied]

(RTD) i do agree that someone (perhaps your good self) should start a "wow look at all those awesome stars" thread..

If the mods can sing then so can i..

When I find myself in times of trouble

Mother Mary comes to me

Speaking words of wisdom

Let it be

And in my hour of darkness

She is standing right in front of me

Speaking words of wisdom

Let it be

Let it be, let it be

Let it be, let it be

Whisper words of wisdom

Let it be

When all the broken hearted people

Living in the world agree

There will be an answer

Let it be

For though they may be parted there is

Still a chance that they will see

There will be an answer

Let it be

Let it be, let it be

Let it be, let it be

there will be an answer

Let it be

Let it be, let it be

Let it be, let it be

Whisper words of wisdom

Let it be

Yeah, let it be, let it be

Let it be, let it be

There will be an answer

Let it be

Let it be, let it be

Let it be, let it be

There will be an answer

Let it be

And when the night is cloudy

There is still a light that shines on me

Shine until tomorrow

Let it be

I wake up to the sound of music

Mother Mary comes to me

There will be no sorrow

Let it be

Let it be, let it be

Let it be, let it be

There will be no sorrow

Let it be

Let it be, let it be

Let it be, let it be

Whisper words of wisdom

Let it be

[mcgriffith]

Well then, good suggestion LRB!

My contribution is that I ride a Honda Wave 100 S, and a CBR 150, as my sole mode of transport.

I don't patronize diesel-spewing rot daeng, nor drive a Fortuner.

I've also eliminated beans, brussel sprouts, and other methane producing foods from my diet!

I also have noticed that the air has been marvelous recently.

Just happy to be here, and hope you are, too....

[swain]

There are enough people that see the problem and are willing to say this IS a problem and we are not going to remain silent about it anymore. I applaud your intolerance! But this is only the start. If enough of us raise our voices, we will be heard. fine fine... relax Chiang Mai is still my home... I love it here..... so lets fix the problem.

Many many of us are working to "fix" the problem to the extent we can. Many many others of you are simply chronic whiners. For crissakes, give it a rest.

ahhh no rest... thats the point... beat it to death or until its not an issue anymore. And I am one that is trying to keep my carbon imprint on Thailand down to a minimum. If you have other suggestions I am open to any words of wisdom you have to offer.

Talking about sunsets and how wonderful it is here is not going to solve the problem... if enough tourists bypass Chiang Mai as a destination this might get some attention from the people that matter.

I suggested everyone mention what steps they had personally taken to reduce pollution levels. Not one person responded including you people who are constantly whining. The last recorded unhealthful air day was 10 months ago.

You are talking about when it was down right unhealthy. For me pleasant is one of the reasons I live here, when it dips into the unpleasant range I am motivated to want to correct the problem. I did this where I lived in the USA and the desire is still with me now that I live in Chiang Mai.

When a tourist comes to Chiang Mai.. I am guessing they would be interested in not only when it was down right unhealthy but also when it was unpleasant. Unpleasant is subjective and everyone has an opinion and mine is that it was very unpleasant a great deal longer than it was down right unhealthy.

As for what steps we take... here is my list....

Fine fine... I take canvas bags when doing a shopping as to reduce using plastic bags when doing a shopping. We compost instead of adding our waste to the trash bin. Though we don't recycle we have a cleaning lady that does so she can pick up our cans and bottles to make whatever revenue is made off of this. We are converting our car to NGV which is supposed to be a cleaner burning fuel. We consolidate how often we go to town so to keep our usage of fuel down to the bare minimum. We keep the air con usage down as much as we can. We have a new born and we use cloth diapers instead of disposable. We don't burn our garden waste but again add it to our mulch. Plus we are open to any other suggestions that others may have.

[Mapguy]

There are enough people that see the problem and are willing to say this IS a problem and we are not going to remain silent about it anymore. I applaud your intolerance! But this is only the start. If enough of us raise our voices, we will be heard. fine fine... relax Chiang Mai is still my home... I love it here..... so lets fix the problem.

Many many of us are working to "fix" the problem to the extent we can. Many many others of you are simply chronic whiners. For crissakes, give it a rest.

ahhh no rest... thats the point... beat it to death or until its not an issue anymore. And I am one that is trying to keep my carbon imprint on Thailand down to a minimum. If you have other suggestions I am open to any words of wisdom you have to offer.

Talking about sunsets and how wonderful it is here is not going to solve the problem... if enough tourists bypass Chiang Mai as a destination this might get some attention from the people that matter.

I pray for the day when I can put my boorish big stick aside!

Economic incentive --- keeping the tourists coming, for example --- to solve the problem might be the strongest motive for action. There are other economic motives, as well, such as a decrease in health care costs more than offsetting the cost of controling pollution. Anyway, rather than just moan and groan, what are tactics within the reach of us all to effect change, change as defined by keeping the economy healthy? I say this, keeping in mind that obviously one individual's action has limited impact normally, but collectively there could well be a difference.

Okay, okay, I know this invites all sorts of "cute" humor, but, you who are tempted, please try to restrain yourselves! It's clear that many "silly" posters still have something worthwhile to say. Up to you!

[realthaideal]

Here's the deal: I am actively working on this situation myself. I also applaud LannaRB for his (her?) efforts. These are ideas and courses for auction that are being discussed - emphasis: ideas and action. Telling the people that live here again and again and again and again and again about the situation in front of their very eyes and noses is not necessary on this board. It just isn't. And yes, fine, put all the burger and ribs threads into one thread. But please please please don't start this infinite muddle of fire this, and smoke that threads. Geeze louise! It's just too much. It is eye and brain pollution. You are making one kind of pollution into your raison d'etre for your own kind of pollution. Really, want action ? Start an action group. Here you are just preaching to the choir. Really most of us are on the same page as you. Believe me. So now go form yourself a group of minstrels and start doing things. Also, with resp to LannaRB who acts locally, this stuff is great. I am trying to work with local government people and maybe higher up as well. As things get working, I will give word of my progress. Otherwise I'm keeping it on the down-low till I have something report worthy for everyone. I remember last year in one of the threads there was some guy..full of so much hot air and bitching and moaning.... and I told/asked him if he was going to take action or not ? I pointed out several constructive things he could do and might consider, and would he do them ? Never a reply to that. But continued complaining, yes, and plenty of it. I'm with your feeling about the situation MG, RSRUUUU etc. Seriously, I'm there. But you know, the worldwide pollution problem, the excess use of bags and straws here, the chugging cars, George Bush, Iraq, Darfur, I could start lots of threads in lots of forums, but unless I do something, it's only so much focusing on negatives and alarmist claptrap. Really, an action group could work, do it. Meet at Tuskers, bet they'd be all in for it. CM Expat Action Committee for Positive Change. Could totally happen. Dare you actually do it ? Rssru ? Mapperiffic Guy ? Anyone ?

And Rssru - yeah, I could be excused from ever looking, participating blah blah, but hey dude, it's a forum. So guess what ? I forum-ulated and posted. And I've laid everything out pretty logically too. Sure some emotion in there, but really, all this hemming and hawing, what is it doing? I think it fractures us and puts people off, whereas positive steps and creating a ways and means for ppl to do something would unite us and help move efforts forward. More threads ain't helpin'. There's my 2 baht's worth.

[swain]

Here's the deal: {snip} More threads ain't helpin'. There's my 2 baht's worth.

I love Chiang Mai and your point has some merit ... well at least 2 bahts worth anyway!!! Keeping people that read this forum thinking about coming to Chiang Mai either as a tourist or to live aware of the problem is also effecting change. Property values have gone down (a lot of you will disagree with this but I suspect you are living in denial) Yes yes I am not saying that we have effected any market change but if only a few people reconsider moving or visiting Chiang Mai then we have had an impact. I would join and would be interested in any group that can effect change in Chiang Mai... I dont know enough of you to start a group of my own but would be interested in participating in a group that has a plan of action.

Go along to get along... is that the expression... ?? Never subscribed to this point of view.

[Mapguy]

There is a group of concerned Thais and others who wish to improve the situation. Email one of the leaders of the group, which has already met: [email protected]

From a recent column by Mark Whitman in the Chiang Mai Mail:

... I went along to the second meeting of the group called International Citizens of Chiang Mai, which was held a few days ago at the offices of FM 96 Radio, near the Three Kings Monument. This is a large group of academics, students (mainly from CMU), environmentalists, local workers and concerned residents, both Thais and farangs. The single purpose is to pressure and work with the authorities in the long term solution to Chiang Mai’s pollution problems and those relating to the failing infrastructure of the City’s vital services. Much of the meeting was spent outlining those very real inadequacies and now the work has to begin. Luckily, it seems there is some positive work being done in the city and among the initiatives is a new hot line to ring if you see unauthorized burning. Contact 053 409 345...

[Austhaied]

There is a group of concerned Thais and others who wish to improve the situation. Email one of the leaders of the group, which has already met: [email protected]

From a recent column by Mark Whitman in the Chiang Mai Mail:

... I went along to the second meeting of the group called International Citizens of Chiang Mai, which was held a few days ago at the offices of FM 96 Radio, near the Three Kings Monument. This is a large group of academics, students (mainly from CMU), environmentalists, local workers and concerned residents, both Thais and farangs. The single purpose is to pressure and work with the authorities in the long term solution to Chiang Mai’s pollution problems and those relating to the failing infrastructure of the City’s vital services. Much of the meeting was spent outlining those very real inadequacies and now the work has to begin. Luckily, it seems there is some positive work being done in the city and among the initiatives is a new hot line to ring if you see unauthorized burning. Contact 053 409 345...

Now you're talking..

Now, where can i get a telescope to view all the magnificent stars in Chiang Mai's beautiful night skies??

[Donnyboy]

since some are in a singing mood, I might have a go....

The roof the roof the roof is on fire

The roof the roof the roof is on fire

The roof the roof the roof is on fire

We don't need no water let the motherf*cker burn

Burn motherf*cker burn

Hello my name is Jimmy Pop and I'm a dumb white guy

I'm not old or new but middle school, fifth grade like junior high

I don't know mofo' if y'all peeps be buggin' give props to my ho 'cause she fly

But I can take the heat 'cause I'm the other white meat known as Kid Funky Fry

Yeah I'm hung like planet Pluto hard to see with the naked eye

But if I crashed into Uranus I would stick it where the sun don't shine

'Cause I'm kind of like Han Solo always strokin' my own Whookie

I'm the root of all that's evil yeah but you can call me Cookie

The roof the roof the roof is on fire

The roof the roof the roof is on fire

The roof the roof the roof is on fire

We don't need no water let the motherf*cker burn

Burn motherf*cker burn

Yo yo this hardcore ghetto gangster image takes a lot of practice

I'm not black like Barry White no I am white like Frank Black is,

So if man is five and the Devil is six than that must make me seven

This honkey's gone to heaven

But if I go to hel_l well then I hope I burn well

I'll spend my dayys with J.F.K., Marvin Gaye, Martha Raye, and Lawrence Welk

And Kurt Cobain, Kojak, Mark Twain and Jimmy Hendrix' poltergeist

And Webster yeah Emmanuel Lewis cuz he's the anti-christ

The roof the roof the roof is on fire

The roof the roof the roof is on fire

The roof the roof the roof is on fire

We don't need no water let the motherf*cker burn

Burn motherf*cker burn

**Bloodhound Gang

[Ned]

Spot on Donnyboy. Let it burn! Let 'em cough their lungs out and cram the hospital waiting rooms year after year after year after year.

The rubbish burning starts every day just before dusk in this village. Time to close the doors and turn on the air con. With a bit of luck the stench of burning garbage outside will clear in a couple of hours. When the Big Smoke arrives from the neighbouring countries and Thai hills late Feb it's off to the coast the very next day. And I mean the very next day. Avoidance strategies I call them. Farang , your opinions are nothing and your fears are yours.

[JuniorExPat]

To save reinventing the wheel, these guys seem to be heading in realthaideal's direction:

International Citizens of Chiang Mai - GumHakDoiSuthep(at)yahoo(dot)com

I'm sure I picked this info up in this forum somewhere and I hope that I'm not breaking any rules or etiquette by posting it here.

JxP