Israel To Kick Out Asian Restaurant Workers

[Ulysses G.]

Stop trying to make it about something that it isn't.

Yea, sure.

[Jingthing]

All I'm saying is, sucks to be them (The Thais & other Asians getting booted) and I feel for em. Stop trying to make it about something that it isn't

Yes, it sucks to be a lot of people. Again, we don't even really know if these Asian workers were actually ever booted (old news item). I was not only commenting on your posts. As if the Israeli government is the only government with harsh immigration policies, which btw, I agree, they do have. I don't think it is relevant in the least about why these workers chose Israel vs. any other country. If its such a bad choice, don't they have some personal responsibility for their choice? Contract workers go all over the world, Israel or any other country doesn't owe any special gratitude to contract workers.

Edited October 15, 2009 by Jingthing

[Huey]

Bottom line -- for some people for whatever reason (guess) it is kind of a sport to demonize Israel.

It is not politically correct to lynch African Americans these days.

It never was, but don't let that stop you. We can meet up any time you feel the urge

[Ulysses G.]

Why don't you stick to attacking Israel and the Jews. Threatening other members violates Thai Visa rules.

[Jingthing]

I wonder Israel is using this as a tactic and negotiation ploy. I wonder if the Thai workers in Israel are forced to do Visa runs and now limited to how much time they can spend in Israel in one year?

No, the Israelis have a better solution, they expel the foreigners altogether.

If this statement is true, than Israel has created these laws to suit it`s self, the righteous and the holier than thou, Whose policies, no one dares to question.

There are many Israelis living in Thailand, who are left alone, free to practice their religion and work without hindrance or prejudice by the Thai Government, as is the case in most countries of the world, excluding the Middle east who are at loggerheads with Israel.

If the Thai government expelled them from the Kingdom, than see how fast the world’s media would be accusing the Thais of anti Semitism and unjustifiable conduct.

If the Israelis kicked ALL Thai nationals out, I do not believe the world would find much to criticize if Thailand kicked ALL Israelis out. The OP news item, if true, is about RESTAURANT WORKERS only, and not about kicking ALL Thais out.

As it stands now and I hope it continues, my understanding is that Thailand and Israel enjoy excellent diplomatic relations. Diplomatic relations are not only about contract workers, there is much more to it, such as trade and tourism.

Edited October 15, 2009 by Jingthing

[Huey]

General information -

this topic was started 2008-02-14 - 20 month ago...

The last posting was made 20 month ago.

The post received a reply on October 15, 2009

I'm not sure whether the information in the OP is still valid or not.

If someone cant update this old/new topic it may not live very long.

Looks like it was still going on as of August. http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/WO0907/S00506.htm But anyway, Unless they pay the Asians that go to work there more, they are making a sacrifice as opposed to working someplace less dangerous and that doesn't get them black listed from prime markets in the gulf.

I wish them luck.

Edited October 15, 2009 by Huey

[zaza]

If they have originally get away with wiping out the native people of there homeland, I find nothing weird in kicking out Asian workers.

BTW, hey! JingThing, UG; I am a friend not an -enemy- don't come after me , I just had my dinner at Chabad Restaurant, the Jewish center in khaoSan Road. (you can check this out )

[Ulysses G.]

Looks like it was still going on as of August. http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/WO0907/S00506.htm

How many countries allow "undocumented migrant workers" to hang around? Seems like all you helpful, self rightous folks might complain about a few other countries.

[Scott]

If the Thais are kicked out they can probably go to Saudi Arabia, just as soon as they get the real blue diamond back to the royal family!

[Huey]

Hehe, they could have the blue diamond in their hand at the airport they wouldn't even let them on the plane to Saudi with a israeli entry stamp in their passport. That black lists you in most of the gulf

[Jingthing]

Hehe, they could have the blue diamond in their hand at the airport they wouldn't even let them on the plane to Saudi with a israeli entry stamp in their passport. That black lists you in most of the gulf

Israel has control over certain things, policies on restaurant workers for example. Last time I checked they have no control over immigration policies of countries like Saudi Arabia. Why not start a new thread about the various gulf countries? If they ban Israeli stamps, just like the case I cited of them beating up my Catholic friend, surely this has nothing to do with Israel. But for some people (big mystery) the indignation about what is happening in that region is only reserved for that one very small country.

(Now expecting another snide violin playing icon in reply ... you can deny a bias against Israel, but I do not believe you, how do you like them apples? Why not just be OPEN about it as such a bias is so very common and even popular?)

Edited October 15, 2009 by Jingthing

[Ulysses G.]

Huey, I would appreciate it if you stopped sending me thinly veiled, threatening PMs offering to '"meet" me. It is against Thai Visa rules.

By the way, I've seen your VDOs on You Tube and you have a lot more in common with JJ Jimmy Walker than Joe Frazier!

[Huey]

Jing- My personal feelings about middle east politics is something I am very open about. however this is not the place for it, unlike you I keep my comments at least somewhat relevant to the post.

Ulysses- I never threatened you. Though for someone who thinks I look like JJ Walker and who thinks Lynching African Americans is the thing to do you sure seem to feel threatened easily my friend We really should have a beer.

[Jingthing]

Jing- My personal feelings about middle east politics is something I am very open about. however this is not the place for it, unlike you I keep my comments at least somewhat relevant to the post.

Interesting. You could have fooled me. Reading between your lines is easier than finding white on rice.

BTW, it was YOU who brought up the topic of immigration policies of OTHER countries other than Israel in relation to Thai contract workers, not me. I just don't see how the immigration peculiarities of OTHER countries is Israel's responsibility.

Edited October 15, 2009 by Jingthing

[Huey]

Jing - I'm open about my political opinions in Person, but we all need to stick within the forum guidelines, so here on these threads we must show some restraint. Over a beer is another story.

As far as immigration to other countries, your 100% correct it's not isreal's responsibility about what happens to you when you leave their country and try to go else where. I never said it was. However it IS a fact and it DOSE bear relevance to Asian workers who commonly work in the middle east. israel's responsibility or not, anyone who works there dose so at a sacrifice, both in working in other countries and with their safety.

Do you deny this?

[Jingthing]

I can't confirm or deny but unlike you I know nothing about the immigration policies of the various Middle Eastern countries in regards to Thai nationals with Israeli stamps. Yes I have heard some countries won't allow entry to those with Israeli stamps, but I have no idea as to the specific policies of the various countries. DO YOU? In any case, if anyone should be responsible for informing Thais of the consequences of their adult actions, I would put that on the recruitment agencies and also on the Thais themselves. In any case, this has nothing to do with Israel. I agree kicking these workers out if they actually did that was crappy, and I do know for a fact Israeli immigration has done many crappy things (as do most other countries). However, again, they have nothing to do with the policies of other countries nor do they assume the role of nanny state to foreign contract workers, they go where they go AYOR.

Bottom line, we live in a global economy. It is brutal and unfair in a million ways. If Israel or Outer Mongolia opens up 10,000 contract jobs tomorrow, there will be 10,000 workers on the plane ASAP, either from Thailand or countless other countries with labor surpluses. Israel is just another player in this global reality, no better, no worse. If as you say the Saudis offer such a better deal, why did these workers go to Israel in the FIRST place, huh?

Edited October 15, 2009 by Jingthing

[alyx]

Dear Webfact

I am aware of it and , as you may have noticed I am not a native English speaker either: this was the reason I had started my post with an apology and also why I had praised his comments

I am sure the OP is not upset ( at least I hope so) but put it this way: if I were to make mistakes (trust me I do) I would be glad to be told. Don't we learn from our mistakes????

I also guess you wrote netiquette in lieu of etiquette purposely

[smokie36]

I can't confirm or deny but unlike you I know nothing about the immigration policies of the various Middle Eastern countries in regards to Thai nationals with Israeli stamps. Yes I have heard some countries won't allow entry to those with Israeli stamps, but I have no idea as to the specific policies of the various countries. DO YOU? In any case, if anyone should be responsible for informing Thais of the consequences of their adult actions, I would put that on the recruitment agencies and also on the Thais themselves. In any case, this has nothing to do with Israel. I agree kicking these workers out if they actually did that was crappy, and I do know for a fact Israeli immigration has done many crappy things (as do most other countries). However, again, they have nothing to do with the policies of other countries nor do they assume the role of nanny state to foreign contract workers, they go where they go AYOR.

I had heard the Israeli immigration will put the entry/exit stamps on a piece of paper attached to your passport which can later be removed.

[Jingthing]

I had heard the Israeli immigration will put the entry/exit stamps on a piece of paper attached to your passport which can later be removed.

That's interesting. I know that Cuba will do that for Americans as it is illegal for Americans to travel to Cuba (talk about stupid government policies!).

[bonobo]

I had heard the Israeli immigration will put the entry/exit stamps on a piece of paper attached to your passport which can later be removed.

That's interesting. I know that Cuba will do that for Americans as it is illegal for Americans to travel to Cuba (talk about stupid government policies!).

My Israeli entry stamp was done in just that way.  It was on a piece of white paper stapled to one of my passport pages.

[Huey]

I can't confirm or deny but unlike you I know nothing about the immigration policies of the various Middle Eastern countries in regards to Thai nationals with Israeli stamps. Yes I have heard some countries won't allow entry to those with Israeli stamps, but I have no idea as to the specific policies of the various countries. DO YOU? In any case, if anyone should be responsible for informing Thais of the consequences of their adult actions, I would put that on the recruitment agencies and also on the Thais themselves. In any case, this has nothing to do with Israel. I agree kicking these workers out if they actually did that was crappy, and I do know for a fact Israeli immigration has done many crappy things (as do most other countries). However, again, they have nothing to do with the policies of other countries nor do they assume the role of nanny state to foreign contract workers, they go where they go AYOR.

Bottom line, we live in a global economy. It is brutal and unfair in a million ways. If Israel or Outer Mongolia opens up 10,000 contract jobs tomorrow, there will be 10,000 workers on the plane ASAP, either from Thailand or countless other countries with labor surpluses. Israel is just another player in this global reality, no better, no worse. If as you say the Saudis offer such a better deal, why did these workers go to Israel in the FIRST place, huh?

Do I know about the specifics of immigration for some of these middle eastern countries? Yes for some I do, I have lived and worked in several nations in the Gulf since 2001.

Saudi's offer a better deal? *Shrug* who knows, but I wouldn't wanna work there either, however those that do would not be black listed from working anywhere else because of a stamp in their passport. hel_l they may HAVE went there first who knows. Maybe jobs in israel offer incentive pay to get people over the fear of terrorisim to go out there too work.

If they do then good on the workers there, I can't knock the hustle. But if they are not getting paid more I feel for em, heck better for them to come work in Iraq, I know long term filipenoes there making 3000+ a month for glorified administrave jobs.

Your bottom line is correct in that yes, hel_l yes even, the global market is unfair, thats why I say make the most of what you have, take risks, sure, but be compensated for them. And don't burn your bridges unless you have too.

And if they put Work Permits in stamp form inside their passports (and I don't know if when it comes to WORK visas do they stamp or is it a white peice of paper like some folks here mentioned) then they burn some briges. If they are now getting kicked out I hope they made it worth it.

[sassienie]

Just to change the subject a little and make this more light hearted, back in the 1960s, my cousin joined one of those Israeli Kibbutz schemes that were well advertised at the time.

These were volunteer agricultural projects where young people of any nationality or religion could live in Israel free for a year, provided they worked on the farms. They only received a small wage as pocket money plus free food and accommodation within these farm areas.

By what my cousin told me, life on these farms was like having a full moon party every night. On his first year at a Kibbutz my cousin met a Scottish girl, Kate, they married and he brought her back to London. Soon after they divorced, so he volunteered to do another year on the kibbutz. That time he met a stunning Swedish girl named, Inga. I can remember her well, all my cousins and myself were lusting after her.

My cousin and Inga bought a lodging house in Essex, England. My cousin came home from work unexpectedly early one day and discovered Inga in bed with one of the lodgers. So thus ended that relationship.

I wonder if those Kibbutz schemes are still going, a great experience if you’re young footloose and fancy free.

Edited October 15, 2009 by sassienie

[bina]

OMG

cant beleive someone resurrected this article;

jing thing, calm down.......

huey lots of thais go on to work in dubai no problem; we have lots of friends that do that...and thai workers are not getting kicked out, just grandfathered out , htose that finished visas cant ever renew them anyway, as there is a five year limit on every thai. (there are those that the manpower companies do 'throw out' but i have news for u, they are working together with the thai side of the manpower companies. its not an israeli plot. its a joint thai/israeli economic business tactic to bring over new workers that pay more than a worker that is here for three years and the manpower company doesnt make anymore money off of him. its called 'revolving door' policy. it has nothing to do with israel's immigration policy. ) and no, i am not at liberty to give more info than that. try googling 'kav l'oved' to get more info on that stuff.

just ot make a point, its a hel_l of a lot easier to have anon (thai husband working in restaraunt) get citizenship here then me in thailand (we dont need minimum salary for either of us, i just found out two days ago at the immigration office, he can work and i dont need to or vice versa; he can own whatever he wants; bank accounts/car whatever, as he is a temp. resident now. just have to renew every year for five years and then he's a citizen. not like thailand eh? )

***the situation as of today, is that last year a new immigration police set- up called 'oz unit (oz= strenght, not old zealand) was developed. yesterday the commander resigned since several ministers refused to give him back up support on sending illegal aliens' kids (and therefore their mothers/fathers) back to their original countries, because most of the kids are israeli in culture language and actions and woudl not survive in the philipines/nigeria/columbia/peru/sudan. most thai kids are with filipana mothers. ti was seen as a nonhumanitarian move to send the kids back so the decsion was delayed for a year (school year).

so two weeks ago they were rounding illegal aliens by the dozens. this week, nothing is happening.

second, the restaraunt policy seems to have fizzled although at the moment there is a 'closed skies' positon, but that happens every october when all the agric workers have to get their visas renewed and approved ; meaning that all the moshav/kibbutz employers have to send in a request for how many workers they need this year, and they either get them or get reductiosn. there are some reductions in which case the thais are either sent home (if they are close to their fifth year of being here) or get moved to somewhere else. many thai hear and know about this and therefore do a 'runner' (anon's cousin just did that) to somewhere else and become illegal aliens. for restaraunt employees, there are less this year, as the conditions for hiring have become more difficult, but a good business man /woman here knows how to work the system and so far, no changes as far as i can see/hear...

and i am a native english speaker but living in israel for 22+ years (daughter out of army already and son now in, geez time flies......) i am a lazy speller and typer..

and no, not too many kibbutzim do that program anymore. it cost more damage then good economically, since now factories/agriculture is professional ; although someone here's norweigen wife had her nieces here for the summer... suddenly every male teenager was at the pool every single day, including my son.... and we do have other programs for living/studying for over 18 yr olds, unfortunately they live across from me, yes... full moon parties full blast in my salon when i have to get up early....i guess im getting old...

Maybe jobs in israel offer incentive pay to get people over the fear of terrorisim to go out there too work

. thats hilarious. no thais i know have fear of terrorism, most couldnt care less, and while they werent thrilled during last december's little war, life goes on here, as they live in their little/big enclaves of thais and are not terribly interested in teh political situation here, even if i bother to explain or translate news items, they are very isaan-- they prefer immediate interests like when they will slaughter a calf or pig, who has new discs of movies in thai dubbed, etc . most thai were concerned that the moshavim/kibbutzim wouldnt have work for them or wouldnt/couldnt pay them salary for the days lost or crops lost... the war previous to that, we tried to do bombshelter drills with the thais on our kibbutz and they jsut laughed it off and refused ... 'u think to much'....

if this thread gets out of hand, ill just close it so skip the political stuff, please, and some of u are with almost ten warnings u know who u are so dont push it i am more tolerant then some here so tone it down all of u....

bina

israel

[Huey]

bina, very throughout post. And without a doubt the most well informed I'm sure. As for the spelling who cares, I think everyone understands exactly what your saying so grammar is pretty much irrelevant. You bring up a good observation, I guess unless the Thais there actually see drama first hand they got better things to worry about...like the pig slaughter or the dubed DvD's. My fillipenos have seen allot in our company in Iraq, rockets, mortars, we lost one 2 years ago and a Sri Lankin before that. However they are a tough lot and they stick around because the money is good. But with Thai's I don't know, you don't see them as much as you do filipenos, though I would bet if they came into contact with a suicide bombing at the market or some rockets into their work area, there might be some danger pay to cough up.

As for the immigration Policies of Dubai I know if I had the stamp in my passport I would have serious issues trying to get into, Kuwait, UAE & Iraq for sure Saudi is a given, and I couldn't go to Iran even if I wanted to .

I'm gonna leave the post at this then before politics cause this thread to get even uglier.

[Ulysses G.]

Ulysses- I never threatened you. Though for someone who thinks I look like JJ Walker and who thinks Lynching African Americans is the thing to do you sure seem to feel threatened easily my friend We really should have a beer.

Of course you did. You are trying to do it it in such a way as to trick the mods into letting you get away with it, but it is obvious what you really mean. It is against the rules and other people refrain from such stupid behavior. You are lying about that like all your statements about me wanting to lynch African Americans. Actually, I am a big Obama fan.

This is what I said below as an answer to Jingthing's question. Many weak and stupid people demonize Isreal for the same reason as others of their ilk used to lynch African Americans. It was fashionable and they could get away with it.

Anyone without an agenda can see that it is not about wanting to lynch anyone and that someone is lying through their teeth once again.

Bottom line -- for some people for whatever reason (guess) it is kind of a sport to demonize Israel.

It is not politically correct to lynch African Americans these days.

[bina]

knock it off.!!!

all of u. this isnt about israeli politics per se. its thai workers in israel. that is the discussion. stick to it.

any more allusions to possible 'taking it outside to settle the score' then three people at least will be getting 'cooled off' ...and stop acting like little children each one claiming that 'he started it' , 'he threatened me' really u are all grown people i assume....

bina

israel

[rgs2001uk]

I can't confirm or deny but unlike you I know nothing about the immigration policies of the various Middle Eastern countries in regards to Thai nationals with Israeli stamps. Yes I have heard some countries won't allow entry to those with Israeli stamps, but I have no idea as to the specific policies of the various countries. DO YOU? In any case, if anyone should be responsible for informing Thais of the consequences of their adult actions, I would put that on the recruitment agencies and also on the Thais themselves. In any case, this has nothing to do with Israel. I agree kicking these workers out if they actually did that was crappy, and I do know for a fact Israeli immigration has done many crappy things (as do most other countries). However, again, they have nothing to do with the policies of other countries nor do they assume the role of nanny state to foreign contract workers, they go where they go AYOR.

Bottom line, we live in a global economy. It is brutal and unfair in a million ways. If Israel or Outer Mongolia opens up 10,000 contract jobs tomorrow, there will be 10,000 workers on the plane ASAP, either from Thailand or countless other countries with labor surpluses. Israel is just another player in this global reality, no better, no worse. If as you say the Saudis offer such a better deal, why did these workers go to Israel in the FIRST place, huh?

Do I know about the specifics of immigration for some of these middle eastern countries? Yes for some I do, I have lived and worked in several nations in the Gulf since 2001.

Saudi's offer a better deal? *Shrug* who knows, but I wouldn't wanna work there either, however those that do would not be black listed from working anywhere else because of a stamp in their passport. hel_l they may HAVE went there first who knows. Maybe jobs in israel offer incentive pay to get people over the fear of terrorisim to go out there too work.

If they do then good on the workers there, I can't knock the hustle. But if they are not getting paid more I feel for em, heck better for them to come work in Iraq, I know long term filipenoes there making 3000+ a month for glorified administrave jobs.

Your bottom line is correct in that yes, hel_l yes even, the global market is unfair, thats why I say make the most of what you have, take risks, sure, but be compensated for them. And don't burn your bridges unless you have too.

And if they put Work Permits in stamp form inside their passports (and I don't know if when it comes to WORK visas do they stamp or is it a white peice of paper like some folks here mentioned) then they burn some briges. If they are now getting kicked out I hope they made it worth it.

Is this how much they are actually being paid,

work in Iraq, I know long term filipenoes there making 3000+ a month for glorified administrave jobs.

I take it that is $3k per month, is that how much theses long term fillipinoes actually get paid, or is that how much the customer is billed.

Outsource to , Pakistan, India or Sri Lnaka, you will get tri lingual speakers, English, Arabic and native language way cheaper.

[Huey]

RGS2001UK; The customer gets billed a good bit more than that. the ones I am talking about are the management types that have been there since 03/04 and are over seeing the TCN labor for prime contractors. These jobs that an expat would make 4 or 5 times that much for. Also its hard getting fillipenos in iraq after they snatched that driver a few years back and the filipeno govt started stamping new passports "not good for travel in Iraq" All in a all a good fililpeno worker is worth their weight in gold IMHO.

[smokie36]

RGS2001UK; The customer gets billed a good bit more than that. the ones I am talking about are the management types that have been there since 03/04 and are over seeing the TCN labor for prime contractors. These jobs that an expat would make 4 or 5 times that much for. Also its hard getting fillipenos in iraq after they snatched that driver a few years back and the filipeno govt started stamping new passports "not good for travel in Iraq" All in a all a good fililpeno worker is worth their weight in gold IMHO.

All the middle eastern countries operate a form of wage discrimination. Same as every other place in the world in one guise or another. Just more obvious there.

Agree with you on filipino workers...lovely people.

[astral]

Tit for Tat is the way the Thais should go.

I am in India this week.

The Chinese severely criticised India about the border region this week.

The next day India announced that they will no longer be issuing business

visas for Chinese.

Only work visas will be issued, and then only for highly qualified person,

no labourers.