The Doom And Gloom Is Laughable

[zorro1]

EGO gentleman ,look it up. This topic is no longer informative and has degenerated in typical fashion. shame ..

Edited March 24, 2008 by zorro1

[LaoPo]

Live in N. California and to top it off, I'm in the mortgage business. What a ride it was and still is. I was telling an employee the other day that I enjoy work more than I did during the good times. The joy of the new challenges more than compensate for the additional stress.

I get to experience first hand the market timers that jumped on the real estate bandwagon too late. Usually the first ones that send the keys to the lenders ( jingle mail ).

You're a brave man.

Let's talk in another 6 to 12 months as I'm curious to your experiences by that time. It will be interesting times, especially in the American/Californian Mortgage Industry.

Let's see if the 'Doom & Gloom' is still laughable...or not.

LaoPo

The housing market in California is far from laughable. Many of my employees have already lost their houses. Don't understand how one region or investment (real estate ) justifies all the doom and gloom. Many people lost there homes in the mid 80s and the economy recovered. The economy will recover this time also. It's is laughable how some think bubbles are meant to burst and when they do, they come apart at the seams.

Hmmm...that's a strange answer.

First of all it is you who created the topic title "The Doom and Gloom is Laughable".

Secondly I don't understand that if you are the Boss and run a mortgage business that you let it happen that "many of my employees have already lost their houses". That is simply unbelievable and weird. If you are so successful how come you didn't take any action and prevent that so many of your employees lost their houses ?

YOU should have acted, call a meeting and re-arrange their (previous) mortgages. YOU saw it coming (at least I saw it coming and I'm not even an American) and couldn't prevent such a disaster ?

Now you have to run a company with many sad and depressed employees and their families, instead of happy and positive employees.

Good luck...to them !

I would feel deeply ashamed, running a mortgage company, and tell on an open forum that "many of my employees lost their houses"

U N B E L I E V A B L E

LaoPo

[PeaceBlondie]

Surely, the USA may be on the brink of a serious recession, possibly a depression. These times are unprecedented. Real estate values are unsustainable. If real estate values double (as stated in Australia) every ten years, and wages do not increase at 7.2% per year, housing prices itself out of its own market, which then collapses. Indeed, that helps explain the subprime lending practices.

If the present crisis is unprecedented, there is no way to predict the future of it. Regardless of what glasses we wear.

[LaoPo]

Live in N. California and to top it off, I'm in the mortgage business. What a ride it was and still is. I was telling an employee the other day that I enjoy work more than I did during the good times. The joy of the new challenges more than compensate for the additional stress.

I get to experience first hand the market timers that jumped on the real estate bandwagon too late. Usually the first ones that send the keys to the lenders ( jingle mail ).

You're a brave man.

Let's talk in another 6 to 12 months as I'm curious to your experiences by that time. It will be interesting times, especially in the American/Californian Mortgage Industry.

Let's see if the 'Doom & Gloom' is still laughable...or not.

LaoPo

The housing market in California is far from laughable. Many of my employees have already lost their houses. Don't understand how one region or investment (real estate ) justifies all the doom and gloom. Many people lost there homes in the mid 80s and the economy recovered. The economy will recover this time also. It's is laughable how some think bubbles are meant to burst and when they do, they come apart at the seams.

Hmmm...that's a strange answer.

First of all it is you who created the topic title "The Doom and Gloom is Laughable".

Secondly I don't understand that if you are the Boss and run a mortgage business that you let it happen that "many of my employees have already lost their houses". That is simply unbelievable and weird. If you are so successful how come you didn't take any action and prevent that so many of your employees lost their houses ?

YOU should have acted, call a meeting and re-arrange their (previous) mortgages. YOU saw it coming (at least I saw it coming and I'm not even an American) and couldn't prevent such a disaster ?

Now you have to run a company with many sad and depressed employees and their families, instead of happy and positive employees.

Good luck...to them !

I would feel deeply ashamed, running a mortgage company, and tell on an open forum that "many of my employees lost their houses"

U N B E L I E V A B L E

LaoPo

I forgot to add that you also said:

"I was telling an employee the other day that I enjoy work more than I did during the good times. The joy of the new challenges more than compensate for the additional stress."

Was that one of your employees who lost his/her house also ?

LaoPo

[siamamerican]

Hmmm...that's a strange answer.

First of all it is you who created the topic title "The Doom and Gloom is Laughable".

Secondly I don't understand that if you are the Boss and run a mortgage business that you let it happen that "many of my employees have already lost their houses". That is simply unbelievable and weird. If you are so successful how come you didn't take any action and prevent that so many of your employees lost their houses ?

YOU should have acted, call a meeting and re-arrange their (previous) mortgages. YOU saw it coming (at least I saw it coming and I'm not even an American) and couldn't prevent such a disaster ?

Now you have to run a company with many sad and depressed employees and their families, instead of happy and positive employees.

Good luck...to them !

I would feel deeply ashamed, running a mortgage company, and tell on an open forum that "many of my employees lost their houses"

U N B E L I E V A B L E

LaoPo

Are you kidding! What world do you live in? Call a meeting to discuss their personal investments and then negotiate with there current lenders that I have no affiliation with. That would go over well - they might ask me to seek professional help.

"Now you have to run a company with many sad and depressed employees and their families, instead of happy and positive employees."

Go hug a tree! I didn't state most my employees were depressed; I only mentioned that many lost there homes, but a small number compared to the total employees.

Investments are risky - real estate is no different. Too bad all the people that lost money in the dot com bubble and in real estate weren't as astute as yourself and saw it coming.

House prices will recover just like the stock market has since the dot com debacle.

[siamamerican]

EGO gentleman ,look it up. This topic is no longer informative and has degenerated in typical fashion. shame ..

Touche, I assume this was directed towards me and it is well deserved. It seems I have a bigger EGO online.

[LaoPo]

Hmmm...that's a strange answer.

First of all it is you who created the topic title "The Doom and Gloom is Laughable".

Secondly I don't understand that if you are the Boss and run a mortgage business that you let it happen that "many of my employees have already lost their houses". That is simply unbelievable and weird. If you are so successful how come you didn't take any action and prevent that so many of your employees lost their houses ?

YOU should have acted, call a meeting and re-arrange their (previous) mortgages. YOU saw it coming (at least I saw it coming and I'm not even an American) and couldn't prevent such a disaster ?

Now you have to run a company with many sad and depressed employees and their families, instead of happy and positive employees.

Good luck...to them !

I would feel deeply ashamed, running a mortgage company, and tell on an open forum that "many of my employees lost their houses"

U N B E L I E V A B L E

LaoPo

Are you kidding! What world do you live in? Call a meeting to discuss their personal investments and then negotiate with there current lenders that I have no affiliation with. That would go over well - they might ask me to seek professional help.

"Now you have to run a company with many sad and depressed employees and their families, instead of happy and positive employees."

Go hug a tree! I didn't state most my employees were depressed; I only mentioned that many lost there homes, but a small number compared to the total employees.

Investments are risky - real estate is no different. Too bad all the people that lost money in the dot com bubble and in real estate weren't as astute as yourself and saw it coming.

House prices will recover just like the stock market has since the dot com debacle.

YES, you would have been THE man; instead you did nothing for your employees...

You are in the mortgage business....and You said "many of my employees", NOT a small number compared to the total...You are twisting your own words, not me.

Well, you are a big Boss aren't you ? You seem to be quite proud of yourself. I suppose YOU didn't lose your house did you ? Ever heard of compassion for your employees ?

No wonder there is doom and gloom in the US...

What world I live in ? I have been around, even built my own business in N. California, San Francisco to be exact. And that's 12+ hours flying from where I am from, Europe.

And I did the same in many other countries in Europe and Far East as well. NOT for a company..my own risk and money.

And you, where have you been ?

Have a nice day big egocentric man.

LaoPo

[siamamerican]

Hmmm...that's a strange answer.

First of all it is you who created the topic title "The Doom and Gloom is Laughable".

Secondly I don't understand that if you are the Boss and run a mortgage business that you let it happen that "many of my employees have already lost their houses". That is simply unbelievable and weird. If you are so successful how come you didn't take any action and prevent that so many of your employees lost their houses ?

YOU should have acted, call a meeting and re-arrange their (previous) mortgages. YOU saw it coming (at least I saw it coming and I'm not even an American) and couldn't prevent such a disaster ?

Now you have to run a company with many sad and depressed employees and their families, instead of happy and positive employees.

Good luck...to them !

I would feel deeply ashamed, running a mortgage company, and tell on an open forum that "many of my employees lost their houses"

U N B E L I E V A B L E

LaoPo

Are you kidding! What world do you live in? Call a meeting to discuss their personal investments and then negotiate with there current lenders that I have no affiliation with. That would go over well - they might ask me to seek professional help.

"Now you have to run a company with many sad and depressed employees and their families, instead of happy and positive employees."

Go hug a tree! I didn't state most my employees were depressed; I only mentioned that many lost there homes, but a small number compared to the total employees.

Investments are risky - real estate is no different. Too bad all the people that lost money in the dot com bubble and in real estate weren't as astute as yourself and saw it coming.

House prices will recover just like the stock market has since the dot com debacle.

YES, you would have been THE man; instead you did nothing for your employees...

You are in the mortgage business....and You said "many of my employees", NOT a small number compared to the total...You are twisting your own words, not me.

Well, you are a big Boss aren't you ? You seem to be quite proud of yourself. I suppose YOU didn't lose your house did you ? Ever heard of compassion for your employees ?

No wonder there is doom and gloom in the US...

What world I live in ? I have been around, even built my own business in N. California, San Francisco to be exact. And that's 12+ hours flying from where I am from, Europe.

And I did the same in many other countries in Europe and Far East as well. NOT for a company..my own risk and money.

And you, where have you been ?

Have a nice day big egocentric man.

LaoPo

You can't be that simple. This is a joke isn't it.

Definately heard of compassion and never stated I didn't feel for the ones that lost their houses. You on the other hand ramble on about an employee meeting and saving them from the choices they made. The only fair thing to do would be to have all the people that made so much money between 2000 and 2005, donate it to those that lost it after 2005. Just a fairy tale approach for a believer like yourself.

Congrats on your successes and good luck on seeing the US fall apart. Would you extend your compasionate side to us poor Americans or just gloat.

[johnnyk]

.....Well, I would agree the USA has some serious fundamental problems, but you exaggerate a bit. The US education system is mixed; hardly the best overall in the world, and at the lower ages, quality is often dependent on class, but still "producing" plenty of future skilled workers. The other strength is cultural. America still values innovation and independent critical thinking in its education culture and this will no doubt pay continuing dividends for the US economy. Also, brain drained people from all over the world still come to the US to work in great numbers.....

Here's something about "job creation" using official US Gov't stats....

January 07, 2008

No Jobs for the New Economy or the Old

By Paul Craig Roberts

December did not bring Americans any jobs. To the contrary, the private sector lost 13,000 jobs from the previous month.

If December is a harbinger of the New Year, it is going to be a bad one. The past year, hailed by Republican propagandists and "free trade" economists as proof of globalism’s benefit to Americans, was dismal. According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics’ nonfarm payroll data, the US "super economy" created a miserable 1,054,000 net new jobs during 2007. [bLS Job Numbers, January 4, 2008]

This is not enough to keep up with population growth—even at the rate discouraged Americans, unable to find jobs, are dropping out of the work force—thus the rise in the unemployment rate to 5%.

During the past year, US goods producing industries, continuing a long trend, lost 374,000 jobs.

But making things was the "old economy." The "new economy" provides services. Last year 1,428,000 private sector service jobs were created.

Are the "free trade" propagandists correct that these service jobs, which are our future, are high-end jobs in research and development, innovation, venture capitalism, information technology, high finance, and science and engineering where the US allegedly has such a shortage of scientists and engineers that it must import them from abroad on work visas?

Not according to the official job statistics.

What occupations provided the 1.4 million service jobs in 2007?

Waitresses and bartenders accounted for 304,200, or 21% of the new service jobs last year and 29% of the net new jobs.

Health care and social assistance accounted for 478,400, or 33% of the new service jobs and 45% of the net new jobs. Ambulatory health care and hospitals (bed pan emptiers?) accounted for the lion’s share of these jobs.

Professional and business services accounted for 314,000, or 22% of the new service jobs and 30% of the net new jobs. Are these professional and business service jobs the high-end jobs of which "free traders" speak? Decide for yourself. Services to buildings and dwellings (janitors?) account for 53,600 of the jobs. Accounting and bookkeeping services account for 60,500 of the jobs. Architectural and engineering services account for 54,700 of the jobs. Computer systems design and related services account for 70,400 of the jobs. Management consultants account for 88,400 of the jobs.

There were more jobs for hospital orderlies than for architects and engineers. Waitresses and bartenders accounted for as many of last year’s new jobs as the entirety of professional and business services.

Wholesale and retail trade, transportation, and utilities accounted for 181,000 of 2007’s new jobs.

Where are the rest of the new jobs? There are a few scattered among arts, entertainment, and recreation, repair and maintenance, personal and laundry services, and membership associations and organizations.

That’s it.

Keep in mind that the loss of 374,000 goods producing jobs must be subtracted from the 1,428,000 new service jobs to arrive at the net job gain figure. The new service jobs account for more than 100% of the net new jobs.

Keep in mind, too, that many of the new jobs are not filled by American citizens. Many of the engineering and science jobs were filled by foreigners brought in on work visas. Indians and others from abroad can be hired to work in the US for one-third less. The engineering and science jobs that are offshored are paid as little as one-fifth of the US salary. Even foreign nurses are brought in on work visas. No one knows how many of the hospital orderlies are illegals.

What a super new economy Americans have! US job growth has a distinctly third world flavor. A very small percentage of 2007’s new jobs required a college education. Since there are so few jobs for university graduates, how is "education the answer"?

Where is the benefit to Americans of offshoring? The answer is that the benefit is confined to a few highly paid executives who receive multi-million dollar bonuses for increasing profits by offshoring jobs. The rest of the big money went to Wall Street crooks who sold trusting people subprime derivatives.

"Free traders" will assert that the benefit is in low Wal-Mart prices. But the prices are low only because China keeps its currency pegged to the dollar. Thus, the Chinese currency value falls with the dollar. The peg will not continue forever. The dollar has lost 60% of its value against the Euro during the years of the Bush regime. Already China is having to adjust the peg. When the peg goes, Wal-Mart shoppers will think they are in Neiman Marcus.

Just as Americans have been betrayed by "their" leaders in government at all levels, they have been betrayed by business "leaders" on Wall Street and in the corporations. US government and business elites have proven themselves to be Americans’ worst enemies.

Edited March 25, 2008 by johnnyk

[Mighty Mouse]

In Australia for example, our house prices double every ten years.

correction! should read "have doubled every ten years." i stand of course corrected if you can look into the future

I've already looked into the future and I can see myself in 10 years time sitting in my favourite beer bar, halfway along Walking Street.

If you would like to join me, not only will I buy you are beer, but I'll show you Aussie house prices being double what they are today.

[WeekendWarrior]

For all the doom and gloom around, I have to say that whenever a slow down in the economy happens or any other finansial reason. In my busines we always notice an increase in busines.

I sell guns and I think people just want to stop spending big and have some simple fun and entertaynment,

[Naam]

In Australia for example, our house prices double every ten years.

correction! should read "have doubled every ten years." i stand of course corrected if you can look into the future

I've already looked into the future and I can see myself in 10 years time sitting in my favourite beer bar, halfway along Walking Street.

If you would like to join me, not only will I buy you are beer, but I'll show you Aussie house prices being double what they are today.

MightyM, i am well aware how aussie real estate has done as we intended to settle in QLD where we bought some land nearly a decade ago. being a foreigner i don't look only at prices in AUD but in those currencies from which i derive my income. the fact remains that for somebody thinking e.g. in US-Dollars house prices in Aussieland nearly halved from 1992 till 2002 so the "doubling every decade" does not necessarily apply for each and everybody and all times. however, your invitation to a beer in Walking Street 2018 is accepted. shall we say at 20.30?

[LaoPo]

Congrats on your successes and good luck on seeing the US fall apart. Would you extend your compasionate side to us poor Americans or just gloat.

..Maybe it's time to put lots of greedy mortgage people behind bars....Compassion ? For greedy people ?

You are the Joker of the Day !

LaoPo

[siamamerican]

Congrats on your successes and good luck on seeing the US fall apart. Would you extend your compasionate side to us poor Americans or just gloat.

..Maybe it's time to put lots of greedy mortgage people behind bars....Compassion ? For greedy people ?

You are the Joker of the Day !

LaoPo

Quite the intellect LaoPo. How about all the stock brokers, CEOs...

Going forward I'm going to have my pet chimp reply to your posts. He isn't as smart as most chimps, but I think he will only have a small advantage over you.

[LaoPo]

Congrats on your successes and good luck on seeing the US fall apart. Would you extend your compasionate side to us poor Americans or just gloat.

..Maybe it's time to put lots of greedy mortgage people behind bars....Compassion ? For greedy people ?

You are the Joker of the Day !

LaoPo

Quite the intellect LaoPo. How about all the stock brokers, CEOs...

Going forward I'm going to have my pet chimp reply to your posts. He isn't as smart as most chimps, but I think he will only have a small advantage over you.

That's nice; don't forget to put your chimp on YouTube and send me the link, ok ?

LaoPo

[LaoPo]

Siamamerican:

Have a read here and let me know what you think; read the comments as advised at the bottom of the message:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?sh...t&p=1895444

LaoPo

[siamamerican]

Siamamerican:

Have a read here and let me know what you think; read the comments as advised at the bottom of the message:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?sh...t&p=1895444

LaoPo

I wish the story was unique, but it isn't. The world, not just the US, has individuals that cross the morality line. America's corporate greed, because of the size and well known brands, it is more apparent. Not making excuses here, just trying to make the point that it isn't apples to apples.

Even considering that the US corporate sandals gets more press, American companies need to clean there act up. There are always going to be Enrons and Worldcoms, but there have been too many of late.

America is far from perfect and it never will be, but the righteous attitude of some TV members can get a little tiresome.

[LaoPo]

Siamamerican:

Have a read here and let me know what you think; read the comments as advised at the bottom of the message:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?sh...t&p=1895444

LaoPo

I wish the story was unique, but it isn't. The world, not just the US, has individuals that cross the morality line. America's corporate greed, because of the size and well known brands, it is more apparent. Not making excuses here, just trying to make the point that it isn't apples to apples.

Even considering that the US corporate sandals gets more press, American companies need to clean there act up. There are always going to be Enrons and Worldcoms, but there have been too many of late.

America is far from perfect and it never will be, but the righteous attitude of some TV members can get a little tiresome.

I hope you're wrong about more Enrons and Worldcoms...

"Tiresome"...indeed, the river of bad news is tiresome and not a kind of happy news lately, is it ?

It will be quite a while before the positive news starts, I'm afraid.

But, read my signature

LaoPo

[johnnyk]

Proud to say a Canadian pulled off the biggest fraud in corporate history (so far), Mr. Worldcom Bernie Ebbers, ex-Edmonton milkman.

[LaoPo]

Proud to say a Canadian pulled off the biggest fraud in corporate history (so far), Mr. Worldcom Bernie Ebbers, ex-Edmonton milkman.

Proud...?

"Ebbers was found guilty of all charges on March 15, 2005. On July 13, 2005, federal judge Barbara Jones, of the U.S. District Court, Southern District of New York in Manhattan, sentenced Ebbers to twenty-five years in a federal prison in Louisiana, the toughest sentence yet among other recent corporate accounting scandals.

Ebbers was allowed to remain free for another year while his appeal was being considered, however, his conviction was upheld in a federal circuit court on July 28, 2006. On 6 September 2006, the presiding judge ordered him to report to jail on 26 September to start serving his 25-year sentence.

Ebbers self-reported to Oakdale Federal Correctional Institution in Oakdale, Louisiana on September 26, 2006, driving himself to the prison in his Mercedes. He is serving his sentence as inmate #56022-054 in the low-security portion of the complex, which typically houses non-violent offenders and is built more like a school dormitory. The earliest date he can be considered for parole is in July 2028, at which time he will be over 85 years old."

Wikipedia

LaoPo

[twschw]

It's called sarcasm LaoPo. Lighten up

[LaoPo]

It's called sarcasm LaoPo. Lighten up

LaoPo

[siamamerican]

I hope you're wrong about more Enrons and Worldcoms...

"Tiresome"...indeed, the river of bad news is tiresome and not a kind of happy news lately, is it ?

It will be quite a while before the positive news starts, I'm afraid.

But, read my signature

LaoPo

Sorry LaoPo, there will be more Enrons as sure as there will be those that think the sky is falling everytime the economy hickups ( 6months from all time highs ). We get it LaoPo - the US economy is struggling just like it has many times in the past.

As for your signature, most people respect those that coherently warn others. I just don't respect your opinions. A little harsh, but all you do is cut and paste, make claims with no substance, or ramble about impracticle solutions.

Just my 2 cents and I can wait for you response.

Edited March 28, 2008 by siamamerican

[LaoPo]

I hope you're wrong about more Enrons and Worldcoms...

"Tiresome"...indeed, the river of bad news is tiresome and not a kind of happy news lately, is it ?

It will be quite a while before the positive news starts, I'm afraid.

But, read my signature

LaoPo

Sorry LaoPo, there will be more Enrons as sure as there will be those that think the sky is falling everytime the economy hickups ( 6months from all time highs ). We get it LaoPo - the US economy is struggling just like it has many times in the past.

As for your signature, most people respect those that coherently warn others. I just don't respect your opinions. A little harsh, but all you do is cut and paste, make claims with no substance, or ramble about impracticle solutions.

Just my 2 cents and I can wait for you response.

You don't have to be sorry nor respect me, siamamerican. It's mutual.

Have a nice weekend.

LaoPo

[johnnyk]

Proud to say a Canadian pulled off the biggest fraud in corporate history (so far), Mr. Worldcom Bernie Ebbers, ex-Edmonton milkman.

Proud...?

LaoPo

We Canadians don't leave a big footprint so we take pride at being mentioned in the news any way we can!

[shochu]

something interesting to make you have a laugh,

youtube,

job market 2009

[egg6447]

In Australia for example, our house prices double every ten years. An investor who can identify the highs and lows of each cycle and who get the timing right, can make a killing by investing in that particular market. The timing being the important part.

I, for one, hope that the doom sayers get this one right. I'd love to see the DOW crash. If it does it will drag most, if not all, other world markets down with it.

That will create a huge buying opportunity for those investors who are cashed up waiting to buy oversold blue chip stocks....but again, the timing must be spot on.

wow how right u are, recession?, what recession. stand by to invest. this is boom time for me, or would have been 10yrs ago. got enough now thank you very much. all made at other peoples folly. one mans loss is another mans gain. or one mans gain is another mans loss. take your pick.

[egg6447]

All will mostlikely be fine with the US and world economies. Hey, we might have a recession, but haven't we had those before?

i don't believe in gloom and doom but your optimism is not warranted and any arguments pointing to history are not valid. there is always a first time when things turn out different. history does not necessarily always repeat itself.

oh dear, you,ve let me down dear dr. you are one of my heroes on here too. obviously history repeats itself. maybe not on every piont but in general always. pick the generals and invest. but then i suspect you have arrived/are where i,m at and lost the need/drive. one of the few pleasures of age, i,m now an expert on all things. wish i could have said the same forty yrs ago.

[egg6447]

Are you kidding! What world do you live in? Call a meeting to discuss their personal investments and then negotiate with there current lenders that I have no affiliation with. That would go over well - they might ask me to seek professional help.

"Now you have to run a company with many sad and depressed employees and their families, instead of happy and positive employees."

Go hug a tree! I didn't state most my employees were depressed; I only mentioned that many lost there homes, but a small number compared to the total employees.

Investments are risky - real estate is no different. Too bad all the people that lost money in the dot com bubble and in real estate weren't as astute as yourself and saw it coming.

House prices will recover just like the stock market has since the dot com debacle.

although i agree with most of your comments. please tell how your employees, the small number, lost there homes, if the,re still employed. there mortgage hasen,t gone up to the piont that its impossible to make the repayments. surely. and they would have worked out how much they could afford on mortgage. i have noticed many times in my life, bank managers are the worst people for managing there own money, add to this mortgage company employees. or is that the smell of b/s.

[egg6447]

. however, your invitation to a beer in Walking Street 2018 is accepted. shall we say at 20.30?

naam your a gem . nice one,lol.