Plus Posted May 21, 2008 Share Posted May 21, 2008 Does anyone experience power fluctuations depending on pressure in the tank? I feel like on cold mornings there isn't enough LPG going into the system, even if the injectors are doing their job. Once the tank warms up, it goes back to normal again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tracker Posted May 21, 2008 Share Posted May 21, 2008 gary: On what is that based? I have an 8 cylinder car, so the biggest sedan evaporator is on there. Also I had before a tiny leak at a valve before and in no time the whole valve was covered with ice. I use 1 liter of liquid lpg on 1 kilometer... Some part of that should do the job... please comment with technical details if you can. Plus: I have more power with lpg after a fill up. after 50km or so it goes back to "normal". Also i record all my fillups to calculate my mileage. If filling up in the evening or early morning, the tank can contain more. It can fluctate in mileage because of this for more than 10%. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hans1977 Posted May 21, 2008 Share Posted May 21, 2008 The requirement for the EID is to have the mechanical ignition points, but i have only seen those systems using the mechanical ignition points together with a capacitor. Thus, you are likely to have mechanical ignition points if you have the capacitor. It's not worth it to go here just to tune your car. You certainly have someone who is good around there to, but in my experience it's a non-trivial task to find them. The good things about the EID is: * The spark gets more powerful - The engine gets stronger. - The engine can be tuned to consume less fuel - The engine runs smoother (for cars running on gas in particular) * You don't need a capacitor. * Your points will last longer. You might be able to get an EID from here: http://www.ultimateproducts.com.au/index ign mod.htm You can have a look around and see what you can find, or else i think i can get one from here for about 1200 THB and send it to you. /Hans mmm, maybe i read you wrong, as i thought to read that a capacitor attached to the distributor would indicate old system. But i see now that is related to the possibility to install an electronic drive. Sorry.I live in Nakhon Pathom province, which is about 40km west of bkk. I guess there are tuners around here too, but i rather learn and do it myself, that's my I looking for a service book/cd... I'm an electronic engineer through education, but have experience in most technical fields through experience (including safety :-) that electronic ignition you installed: can it be adjusted to advance ignition, and if yes, how much? (any website reference to it?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hans1977 Posted May 21, 2008 Share Posted May 21, 2008 I would have thought this problem is due to the reducer getting too cold before the engine gets warm enough to warm it properly. My engine is ready to go even in the early morning. I've got quite warm mornings here, though... /Hans Does anyone experience power fluctuations depending on pressure in the tank? I feel like on cold mornings there isn't enough LPG going into the system, even if the injectors are doing their job. Once the tank warms up, it goes back to normal again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary A Posted May 22, 2008 Share Posted May 22, 2008 gary:On what is that based? I have an 8 cylinder car, so the biggest sedan evaporator is on there. Also I had before a tiny leak at a valve before and in no time the whole valve was covered with ice. I use 1 liter of liquid lpg on 1 kilometer... Some part of that should do the job... please comment with technical details if you can. You are getting ONE kilometer per liter of LPG ??? I think you have more problems than keeping cool. You can Google it and you will find that on a hot day your car air conditioner needs to remove about 5,000 BTUs a minute to make it comfortable. I think evaporating a liter of LPG takes about 200 BTUs. I'm not at all sure of those numbers and anyone is welcome to correct me. I'm too lazy to properly research the figures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clausewitz Posted May 22, 2008 Share Posted May 22, 2008 gary: I use 1 liter of liquid lpg on 1 kilometer... . I would consider a tune up..... at least. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cloudhopper Posted May 22, 2008 Share Posted May 22, 2008 Hi "LPG" can have a wide ratio of propane to butane depending on the regional temps. Does anyone know if the cooking gas sold here is the same formulation as the auto gas? The cooking gas costs more than the auto gas but maybe that's entirely due to the economics of the distribution/tankage... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Who, me ? Posted May 23, 2008 Share Posted May 23, 2008 anyone has a Corolla converted to LPG ? If yes, what is the cost, and did you notice any change in the way the car run ?? Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plus Posted May 23, 2008 Share Posted May 23, 2008 Lots of taxis use Corollas on LPG. They install the cheapest system, for 15-18k baht, and deal with engine backfiring issues. Proper system (injection-"Hua Chit") for a Corolla cost about 35k. For older cars the cheap system is quite ok. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Who, me ? Posted May 23, 2008 Share Posted May 23, 2008 Thanks for the answer. What is back firing ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monty Posted May 23, 2008 Share Posted May 23, 2008 Back firing is when the gas/air mixture in the inlet manifold ignites. Pressure can only get away through your air inlet system, so mostly a proper backfire will wreck your air filter. Actually when your ignition is in good shape, you should not have any issues with back firing. My old Volvo has the old gas system and it never backfires. If on your engine backfiring is an issue (possible due to design of the inlet manifold, place of the gas injection venturi etc), you normally introduce a "weak" link in the intake system. You loosen the inlet air tube somewhere, so when you have a back fure the tube just pops of, easier to repair then going out for a new air filter every time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Who, me ? Posted May 23, 2008 Share Posted May 23, 2008 Back firing is when the gas/air mixture in the inlet manifold ignites.Pressure can only get away through your air inlet system, so mostly a proper backfire will wreck your air filter. Actually when your ignition is in good shape, you should not have any issues with back firing. My old Volvo has the old gas system and it never backfires. If on your engine backfiring is an issue (possible due to design of the inlet manifold, place of the gas injection venturi etc), you normally introduce a "weak" link in the intake system. You loosen the inlet air tube somewhere, so when you have a back fure the tube just pops of, easier to repair then going out for a new air filter every time Got it !! Thanks for the explanation Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monty Posted May 23, 2008 Share Posted May 23, 2008 Hi"LPG" can have a wide ratio of propane to butane depending on the regional temps. Does anyone know if the cooking gas sold here is the same formulation as the auto gas? The cooking gas costs more than the auto gas but maybe that's entirely due to the economics of the distribution/tankage... In Thailand the the gas in the cooking cylinders is exactly the same as what cars drive on! Actually at the LPG fuel stations you often see people filling their cooking gas tanks. Guess it's slightly cheaper the swapping for a full one... It's also one of the reasons the Thai government is not keen on changing the LPG price, since it will hit the lowest income earners hard as that is what they cook on... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hans1977 Posted May 23, 2008 Share Posted May 23, 2008 I'd suggest the weak link _only_ as an emergency fuse. Something is wrong if you have to live with backfire. It could be the installation itself, other components in the car or that the car itself is actually not suitable to run on gas. /Hans Back firing is when the gas/air mixture in the inlet manifold ignites.Pressure can only get away through your air inlet system, so mostly a proper backfire will wreck your air filter. Actually when your ignition is in good shape, you should not have any issues with back firing. My old Volvo has the old gas system and it never backfires. If on your engine backfiring is an issue (possible due to design of the inlet manifold, place of the gas injection venturi etc), you normally introduce a "weak" link in the intake system. You loosen the inlet air tube somewhere, so when you have a back fure the tube just pops of, easier to repair then going out for a new air filter every time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Who, me ? Posted May 23, 2008 Share Posted May 23, 2008 I'd suggest the weak link _only_ as an emergency fuse. Something is wrong if you have to live with backfire. It could be the installation itself, other components in the car or that the car itself is actually not suitable to run on gas./Hans Back firing is when the gas/air mixture in the inlet manifold ignites.Pressure can only get away through your air inlet system, so mostly a proper backfire will wreck your air filter. Actually when your ignition is in good shape, you should not have any issues with back firing. My old Volvo has the old gas system and it never backfires. If on your engine backfiring is an issue (possible due to design of the inlet manifold, place of the gas injection venturi etc), you normally introduce a "weak" link in the intake system. You loosen the inlet air tube somewhere, so when you have a back fure the tube just pops of, easier to repair then going out for a new air filter every time So, Hans, if I read you well, backfiring does not always occur, no matter which installation system I choose. And it is not always necessary to pay 35,000 to have a good one. Am I right ? So if the car is a 2005, has run 100,000 km, the cheap system can run good without troubles . Or is it recommended to go for the more expensive ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hans1977 Posted May 23, 2008 Share Posted May 23, 2008 Yes, backfire is not supposed to occur, but common anyway... The quality of the system you'll get depends on the equipment _and_ the people installing the system. I can see that you want a cheap system (of course), but you'd like to avoid backfire as well. I think there is a good chance that you can have both if you find the right guy to do it for you. What i think you can try to do is to buy a reducer with an adjustable needle valve that bypasses the last stage of the reducer, and one of those cheap nosels to fit inside your air inlet. The adjustable needle valve is what they used to suggest to avoid backfire problems. You should also be prepared to replace the cheap nosel with the expensive gas injector, as a possible way out, if you get stuck in backfire problems. Following this procedure gives you the opportunity to try the cheap system before you have spent the money on an expensive system. So, you have a chance to save 20000-30000 THB at a cost of less than 500 THB. But you cannot know in advance if your car can be successfully converted, of course... /Hans I'd suggest the weak link _only_ as an emergency fuse. Something is wrong if you have to live with backfire. It could be the installation itself, other components in the car or that the car itself is actually not suitable to run on gas./Hans Back firing is when the gas/air mixture in the inlet manifold ignites.Pressure can only get away through your air inlet system, so mostly a proper backfire will wreck your air filter. Actually when your ignition is in good shape, you should not have any issues with back firing. My old Volvo has the old gas system and it never backfires. If on your engine backfiring is an issue (possible due to design of the inlet manifold, place of the gas injection venturi etc), you normally introduce a "weak" link in the intake system. You loosen the inlet air tube somewhere, so when you have a back fure the tube just pops of, easier to repair then going out for a new air filter every time So, Hans, if I read you well, backfiring does not always occur, no matter which installation system I choose. And it is not always necessary to pay 35,000 to have a good one. Am I right ? So if the car is a 2005, has run 100,000 km, the cheap system can run good without troubles . Or is it recommended to go for the more expensive ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Who, me ? Posted May 23, 2008 Share Posted May 23, 2008 Thanks for that explanation Some parts sound a bit like chinese language to me, but I see what you mean..... Will go and survey, and see what shops say .... Will ask a Thai friend to do it in order to keep price as low as possible Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plus Posted May 23, 2008 Share Posted May 23, 2008 Backfire is a common problem for variable valve engines. It was the first thing they told me when I asked to VVTi. I've looked at several VVTi cars with cheap LPG installation and they all had traces of backfiring. The Corolla taxi guy used a rabber band to hold his air inlet together. I read about one guy who drilled a whole in the pipe and plugged it with a common cork from a wine bottle, the cork was attached with a piece of string so that it didin't get lost after popping out - good recycling trick - corks are relatively expensive in Thailand as you have to pay for the wine as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tracker Posted May 25, 2008 Share Posted May 25, 2008 That 1 km to 1 litre was a typo. 7 km/ltr is what i get. and it is not bad considering a 8 cylinder 5000cc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KhunDtaa Posted May 25, 2008 Share Posted May 25, 2008 Can someone tell me can you convert a diesel engine car to NGV. Does it cost more? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkeytunes Posted May 25, 2008 Share Posted May 25, 2008 (edited) Has anyone converted a Toyota Fortuna 2.7, could you tell me the cost also where you put the tank and how big it is. Thanks Edited May 25, 2008 by monkeytunes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tracker Posted May 25, 2008 Share Posted May 25, 2008 converting diesels to lpg or ngv is expensive. I saw a year ago a converted diesel engine running also on gas (don't lpg or ngv) and the engine conversion was priced at 200.000+ something.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hans1977 Posted May 25, 2008 Share Posted May 25, 2008 You'll probably need most of those additional things: - Spark Plugs - Engine Speed and Crankshaft Position Sensor - Spark plug Wires - Pistons and Piston Rings (lower compression) - Ignition Controller - Ignition Coil(s) I'd rather look for a petrol engine to replace the diesel engine with and sell the diesel engine to someone else if everything seams ok after the conversion. /Hans Can someone tell me can you convert a diesel engine car to NGV. Does it cost more? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plus Posted May 26, 2008 Share Posted May 26, 2008 I replaced my diesel engine with a petrol one and converted it to LPG. Price difference after engine installation was something like 15,000 baht but you could probably gain something on some swaps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy2004 Posted May 29, 2008 Share Posted May 29, 2008 Can someone tell me can you convert a diesel engine car to NGV. Does it cost more? Yes, it is possible on turbo-diesels but I don't know whee in Thailand you could get it done Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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