High Oil Prices Good For The Planet ?

[churchill]

Will the high prices force faster change to more fuel efficient cars and heating for homes .

I notice today Ford say they are not selling as many SUV's and trucks and am sure GM is in the same boat - I also heard that every flight that takes off with Air Italia looses 1 Million dollars because of older less fuel efficient planes ( I don't understand why they are still in business ) .

Even though fuel prices in the US are generally lower than Europe they seem to be feeling it more - and so will the politicians in the US eventually be forced to push for more measures to protect our environment and planet ? and also to start to eventually take climate change more seriosly .

Edited May 23, 2008 by churchill

[lannarebirth]

Radical changes are coming faster than anyone can imagine.

http://www.nextenergynews.com/

[villagefarang]

Some companies are likely to go out of business and some people will have to cut back. Still think it needs to go further before there is any real change. Not really enough pain yet.

[thomast]

Pogue of the Ford Motor Company patented a 300mpg carburettor, making use of pre- vapoutised fuel. cant remember the date, 1950s I think. Garrett patented in-car-produced-hydrogen in 1935, using platinum and palladium electrodes, for electrolysis. Swiss had hydrogen engines in the mid 1970s running 300 trucks and tractors, using a radio frequency to split water vapour. The corrupt Swiss Govt of that time made the scientist dismantle them. This radio frequency method was again demonstrated recently on international TV. Any person who today manufactures such a hydrogen device meets a mysterious, untimely death, accident..The facilities burn down, and staff are threatened. Note that under Gull Island off the USA NW coast, and under Colorado there is more oil that of Saudi and Iraq. So this high price is just a design by the Elite to kill the middle class. And that is not a conspiracy theory like the one about an Arab in a cave in Afghan shutting down the half trillion dollar US air defenses with his laptop. With the naive comments from the starter of this thread, it is obvious he/she relies on C(sewer)NN for his news and not www.rense.com Somebody from the BIG OIL please explain that in an age when a color digital picture can be sent back from planet Mars, our brilliant scientists cannot efficiently split a water molecule.

[PeaceBlondie]

Alitalia survives, I understand, because the Italian govt. subsidizes it. The domestic auto production of GM, Ford, and Chrysler is hopelessly mired in mind-boggling annual losses and shrinking shares of the domestic market to local production by Japanese companies. Detroit car companies cannot build a really modern, successful, efficient car, although their life depends on it. The major American airline companies are in the death throes of merging their impossible debts.

In the long run, oil at - you guess a number - $400 a barrel (today's prices seemed just as unbelievable six years ago) - WILL change the world's energy consumption habits. We may have social upheaval for energy shortages long before we have such upheavals for water shortages or food shortages.

I suspect that developing countries such as Thailand can go back to riding their motorcycle in the rain, while in the First World, that would only be evidence of lunacy.

[h90]

In the long run, oil at - you guess a number - $400 a barrel (today's prices seemed just as unbelievable six years ago) - WILL change the world's energy consumption habits. We may have social upheaval for energy shortages long before we have such upheavals for water shortages or food shortages.

I suspect that developing countries such as Thailand can go back to riding their motorcycle in the rain, while in the First World, that would only be evidence of lunacy.

Well the oil price can't hit 400 $ for a long time. You can make gasoline for coal (Fischer-Tropsch) in the second worldwar Hitler could do that in large scale, large factories are in South Africa. China has some and build some. Estimate costs 60 USD/Barrel.

Of course it need some years to build that, but as well over 250 USD the people will start to save gasoline, so I guess more than 300 is impossible. (beside some peaks).

[jstumbo]

Higher oil prices will probably lead to them searching and drilling for oil in areas that were to environmentally sensitive before.

Reason it is affecting the US hard, is twofold. Other countries whose currency has increased against the dollar do not have to pay as much of their currency. If prices are now twice what they were a year ago, then the US has to come up with twice the money. If the Euro has appreciated by 50% in the last few years against the dollar, then that would help when buying oil in dollars. Second reason is that the price of gas has doubled in the US. Even though gas is more expensive in Europe, I do not think it has doubled in the last year. Hard to absorb a doubling of the cost of anything.

Back in 1990 a friend had a Honda CRX HF car. He got around 50mpg in it. That was in the days before the hybrid. I wonder what it would get if they put hybrid technology into it. Actually thinking about getting a used one for commuting to work with. It will be about 200 mile round trip to the office from home, and I do not want put that many miles on the Z3, and at half the mpg.

It is not like there is not enough oil to go around. When is the last time you went to a gas station and it was out of oil? We would have the same amount of oil if they were only paying $80 a barrel for it. They are not even re-investing the huge profits they are making in finding more as far as I can tell. Why find more oil reserves or increase production, it will only lower the price you are getting. If the world uses 100,000,000 barrels of oil a day, then if you produce 100,000,000 barrels of oil a day, it will sell at a high price. But if you produce 150,000,000 million barrels a day, and the world uses only 100,000,000 barrels of it a day, then your price is going to drop. You will still sell the same amount, just get a lot less for it.

The US government should definitely suspend or just outright cancel the subsidies that they give to oil companies. Why do companies that are making hundreds of billions of dollars in profits need subsidies?

They have to be careful though because if the price goes up too much, you create a world wide depression, which cuts usage of oil. So they would sell less. But then again, they would just reduce production, and keep the price high, instead of the price going down because of surplus. Why do companies get hit with big fines when they work together to fix prices or manipulate the market, but when countries (OPEC) work together, it is OK? Maybe the rest of the world should get together and charge the OPEC countries a surcharge on every product they purchase?

Edited May 23, 2008 by jstumbo

[churchill]

Pogue of the Ford Motor Company patented a 300mpg carburettor, making use of pre- vapoutised fuel. cant remember the date, 1950s I think. Garrett patented in-car-produced-hydrogen in 1935, using platinum and palladium electrodes, for electrolysis. Swiss had hydrogen engines in the mid 1970s running 300 trucks and tractors, using a radio frequency to split water vapour. The corrupt Swiss Govt of that time made the scientist dismantle them. This radio frequency method was again demonstrated recently on international TV. Any person who today manufactures such a hydrogen device meets a mysterious, untimely death, accident..The facilities burn down, and staff are threatened. Note that under Gull Island off the USA NW coast, and under Colorado there is more oil that of Saudi and Iraq. So this high price is just a design by the Elite to kill the middle class. And that is not a conspiracy theory like the one about an Arab in a cave in Afghan shutting down the half trillion dollar US air defenses with his laptop. With the naive comments from the starter of this thread, it is obvious he/she relies on C(sewer)NN for his news and not www.rense.com Somebody from the BIG OIL please explain that in an age when a color digital picture can be sent back from planet Mars, our brilliant scientists cannot efficiently split a water molecule.

"So this high price is just a design by the Elite to kill the middle class"

Who are the "Elite"?! and why do they want to kill the middle class ?

"he/she relies on C(sewer)NN for his news and not www.rense.com "

and you rely on www.rense.com ?

[jstumbo]

Note that under Gull Island off the USA NW coast, and under Colorado there is more oil that of Saudi and Iraq.

If this is true, then leave it there. Then when the rest of the world runs out of oil, then the US can nationalize these oil reserves and we will have plenty of oil while the rest of the world goes back to the stone age.

[Sakeopete]

One negative impact is that the factories making cooking oil are running by burning wood. They are buying it from the farmers and don't care where it comes from. People are worried that the province will be stripped of trees in no time. OFC the forestry people have been inspecting the wood they have been burning and according to the little brown envelope's contents all of it is legal.

[Naam]

Pogue of the Ford Motor Company patented a 300mpg carburettor, making use of pre- vapoutised fuel. cant remember the date, 1950s I think. Garrett patented in-car-produced-hydrogen in 1935, using platinum and palladium electrodes, for electrolysis. Swiss had hydrogen engines in the mid 1970s running 300 trucks and tractors, using a radio frequency to split water vapour. The corrupt Swiss Govt of that time made the scientist dismantle them. This radio frequency method was again demonstrated recently on international TV. Any person who today manufactures such a hydrogen device meets a mysterious, untimely death, accident..The facilities burn down, and staff are threatened. Note that under Gull Island off the USA NW coast, and under Colorado there is more oil that of Saudi and Iraq. So this high price is just a design by the Elite to kill the middle class. And that is not a conspiracy theory like the one about an Arab in a cave in Afghan shutting down the half trillion dollar US air defenses with his laptop. With the naive comments from the starter of this thread, it is obvious he/she relies on C(sewer)NN for his news and not www.rense.com Somebody from the BIG OIL please explain that in an age when a color digital picture can be sent back from planet Mars, our brilliant scientists cannot efficiently split a water molecule.

all these patents and technical details were stolen by aliens and taken to the Delta Quadrant. the Saudis and other crude producers are paying royalties to the aliens in return for the favour

[thomast]

Churchill. Read The Truth Shall Set You Free by David Icke. Find out who is running the planet. The Central Banks, owned by the London bankers, read Rothschilds, and Rockefellers in US. They call the shots, create depressions, create wars. destroy this nation or that that is too powerful. Czarist Russia, Germany, Serbia, etc. China will defeat them however. That is foretold. It is all greed, power and evil. The so called democratically elected leaders are part of the scam, or end up as mere puppets. ie Obama is Brezinskis puppet, and of course Israels. Any body brave enough to rock the boat? Kennedy with his no more Fed. Reserve idea, (neither Federal nor has any reserves, just prints paper money and charges interest, privately owned by the bankers) and no more CIA idea. Didnt take long to drop him off the table. A powerful middle class is not good for their one world govt plan. Didnt they starve to death 7 million during the US great depression, destroying food stocks to keep prices high, and foreclosing farmlands? The mainstream media is owned by them and control little minds to believe an alternative reality, 911 was done by yound Arabs, (who couldnt even solo a Cessna 172, Pentagon)peak oil, need for GM crops for food, no cures for cancer, heart disease, diabetes, MS, and other BS. World Wars One, Two, Vietnam etc are al Bankers wars for profit, deliberately started. Do you still believe Gulf of Tonkin really happened to start the Vietnam war? Explain why the war was extended. Was it not so that US planes could keep dropping bombs into the sea, off the coast of Vietnam, so seismologoist aboard navy vessels could map out the possible oil bearing strata? In World War One both sides were financed by the London bankers.. WW2, Ford supplied engines for the German tanks, Standard oil gave fuel to Germany, (Rockefella) US banks bank-rolled Germany. grandpa Bush was involved in this financing. The whole point of this mind control is to make you believe an alternative reality, theirs. This experiment has been successfully carried out in Denmark, with its high taxes, and massive fluoridation of drinking water to dumb down the population. Fluoride was the preferred method, given by their scientists to the Soviet leaders, after WW 2 to control their newly conquered/negotiated countries populations. I will expect the usual wing-nut, whacko, conspiracy theorist, anti-semitic responses from those pre-programmed to automatically reject any or all of these statements that dont toe the official line..

[PeaceBlondie]

The main tax break that oil companies in the USA traditionally got was the depletion allowance, which is logical for the depletion of any natural resource that is taken out of the ground. The big oil executives were grilled by Congress this week in Washington. I have seen the income tax returns of Shell and Mobil, and adjusted the taxes on one of them. They are giant companies that occasionally reap windfall profits, but pay huge taxes on them. If you think it is a good investment, buy their stock. They are not the main problem.

[thomast]

all these patents and technical details were stolen by aliens and taken to the Delta Quadrant. the Saudis and other crude producers are paying royalties to the aliens in return for the favour

Very intelligent discussion, Naam. back to your computor games.

[AmeriThai]

Read The Truth Shall Set You Free by David Icke. Find out who is running the planet.

Now it all makes sense. David Icke claims virtually every person in power is a shape-shifting Reptilian alien. No wonder oil prices are so high. If it's posted on Rense.com's site, it's gotta be true!

[Naam]

all these patents and technical details were stolen by aliens and taken to the Delta Quadrant. the Saudis and other crude producers are paying royalties to the aliens in return for the favour

Very intelligent discussion, Naam. back to your computor games.

at least as intelligent as yours. by the way, i never play "computer games" as my time is too precious and i'm not a little boy anymore

[Pepe']

Pogue of the Ford Motor Company patented a 300mpg carburettor, making use of pre- vapoutised fuel. cant remember the date, 1950s I think. Garrett patented in-car-produced-hydrogen in 1935, using platinum and palladium electrodes, for electrolysis. Swiss had hydrogen engines in the mid 1970s running 300 trucks and tractors, using a radio frequency to split water vapour. The corrupt Swiss Govt of that time made the scientist dismantle them. This radio frequency method was again demonstrated recently on international TV. Any person who today manufactures such a hydrogen device meets a mysterious, untimely death, accident..The facilities burn down, and staff are threatened. Note that under Gull Island off the USA NW coast, and under Colorado there is more oil that of Saudi and Iraq. So this high price is just a design by the Elite to kill the middle class. And that is not a conspiracy theory like the one about an Arab in a cave in Afghan shutting down the half trillion dollar US air defenses with his laptop. With the naive comments from the starter of this thread, it is obvious he/she relies on C(sewer)NN for his news and not www.rense.com Somebody from the BIG OIL please explain that in an age when a color digital picture can be sent back from planet Mars, our brilliant scientists cannot efficiently split a water molecule.

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Wow excellent post. These are things I've known for a long time but don't bother talking about any more.

I tried to get plans for a Pogue carburettor on several occassions with no success...

[Prakanong]

Churchill. Read The Truth Shall Set You Free by David Icke. Find out who is running the planet. The Central Banks, owned by the London bankers, read Rothschilds, and Rockefellers in US. They call the shots, create depressions, create wars. destroy this nation or that that is too powerful. Czarist Russia, Germany, Serbia, etc. China will defeat them however. That is foretold. It is all greed, power and evil. The so called democratically elected leaders are part of the scam, or end up as mere puppets. ie Obama is Brezinskis puppet, and of course Israels. Any body brave enough to rock the boat? Kennedy with his no more Fed. Reserve idea, (neither Federal nor has any reserves, just prints paper money and charges interest, privately owned by the bankers) and no more CIA idea. Didnt take long to drop him off the table. A powerful middle class is not good for their one world govt plan. Didnt they starve to death 7 million during the US great depression, destroying food stocks to keep prices high, and foreclosing farmlands? The mainstream media is owned by them and control little minds to believe an alternative reality, 911 was done by yound Arabs, (who couldnt even solo a Cessna 172, Pentagon)peak oil, need for GM crops for food, no cures for cancer, heart disease, diabetes, MS, and other BS. World Wars One, Two, Vietnam etc are al Bankers wars for profit, deliberately started. Do you still believe Gulf of Tonkin really happened to start the Vietnam war? Explain why the war was extended. Was it not so that US planes could keep dropping bombs into the sea, off the coast of Vietnam, so seismologoist aboard navy vessels could map out the possible oil bearing strata? In World War One both sides were financed by the London bankers.. WW2, Ford supplied engines for the German tanks, Standard oil gave fuel to Germany, (Rockefella) US banks bank-rolled Germany. grandpa Bush was involved in this financing. The whole point of this mind control is to make you believe an alternative reality, theirs. This experiment has been successfully carried out in Denmark, with its high taxes, and massive fluoridation of drinking water to dumb down the population. Fluoride was the preferred method, given by their scientists to the Soviet leaders, after WW 2 to control their newly conquered/negotiated countries populations. I will expect the usual wing-nut, whacko, conspiracy theorist, anti-semitic responses from those pre-programmed to automatically reject any or all of these statements that dont toe the official line..

They did a job on you did they not - when they abducted you and re-programmed you after using you for breeding material?

[thomast]

Nah prakarang, wasnt an abduction, it was our common ancestor ets from www.theyfly.com. They opened my eyes, much, much more. 1800 pages of contact notes with et translated-from Gernan. Could that be a fraud? Nah, check it out and come back and discuss.

[Prakanong]

Nah prakarang, wasnt an abduction, it was our common ancestor ets from www.theyfly.com. They opened my eyes, much, much more. 1800 pages of contact notes with et translated-from Gernan. Could that be a fraud? Nah, check it out and come back and discuss.

Those pesky aliens - I reckon they are in cahoots with the elites (the EU is part of them elite too Fox News says - I bet you would agree?)

[thomast]

Yore getting warmer than you think, Prakanong.

[lardy]

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Global_Economy/JE24Dj02.html

[Heng]

Yes, good for the planet. Now hopefully whatever they think of next won't involve "burning something" as a way to release energy. Caveman say: *fire good.*

[teatree]

Yes, good for the planet. Now hopefully whatever they think of next won't involve "burning something" as a way to release energy. Caveman say: *fire good.*

To stop using oil would be great for the quality of air but would do NOTHING to stop climate change - that is primarily down to the sun. Jumping on the global warming bandwagon will only lead to higher prices for EVERYTHING and extra taxes.

[Heng]

I wasn't talking about global warning, but I must say bandwagons are fun... especially if the band is good. I was referring to the possibility of more efficient and less finite sources of energy.

[Naam]

Churchill. Read The Truth Shall Set You Free by David Icke. Find out who is running the planet. The Central Banks, owned by the London bankers, read Rothschilds, and Rockefellers in US. They call the shots, create depressions, create wars. destroy this nation or that that is too powerful. Czarist Russia, Germany, Serbia, etc. China will defeat them however. That is foretold. It is all greed, power and evil. The so called democratically elected leaders are part of the scam, or end up as mere puppets. ie Obama is Brezinskis puppet, and of course Israels. Any body brave enough to rock the boat? Kennedy with his no more Fed. Reserve idea, (neither Federal nor has any reserves, just prints paper money and charges interest, privately owned by the bankers) and no more CIA idea. Didnt take long to drop him off the table. A powerful middle class is not good for their one world govt plan. Didnt they starve to death 7 million during the US great depression, destroying food stocks to keep prices high, and foreclosing farmlands? The mainstream media is owned by them and control little minds to believe an alternative reality, 911 was done by yound Arabs, (who couldnt even solo a Cessna 172, Pentagon)peak oil, need for GM crops for food, no cures for cancer, heart disease, diabetes, MS, and other BS. World Wars One, Two, Vietnam etc are al Bankers wars for profit, deliberately started. Do you still believe Gulf of Tonkin really happened to start the Vietnam war? Explain why the war was extended. Was it not so that US planes could keep dropping bombs into the sea, off the coast of Vietnam, so seismologoist aboard navy vessels could map out the possible oil bearing strata? In World War One both sides were financed by the London bankers.. WW2, Ford supplied engines for the German tanks, Standard oil gave fuel to Germany, (Rockefella) US banks bank-rolled Germany. grandpa Bush was involved in this financing. The whole point of this mind control is to make you believe an alternative reality, theirs. This experiment has been successfully carried out in Denmark, with its high taxes, and massive fluoridation of drinking water to dumb down the population. Fluoride was the preferred method, given by their scientists to the Soviet leaders, after WW 2 to control their newly conquered/negotiated countries populations. I will expect the usual wing-nut, whacko, conspiracy theorist, anti-semitic responses from those pre-programmed to automatically reject any or all of these statements that dont toe the official line..

They did a job on you did they not - when they abducted you and re-programmed you after using you for breeding material?

never heard of any aliens with an IQ that low. i'm referring of course only to my quadrant

[Crushdepth]

And that is not a conspiracy theory like the one about an Arab in a cave in Afghan shutting down the half trillion dollar US air defenses with his laptop.

Are you really weird, or just pretending to be really weird?

Can somebody from the BIG OIL please explain that in an age when a color digital picture can be sent back from planet Mars, our brilliant scientists cannot efficiently split a water molecule.

Any peanut can split a water molecule (you did go to school didn't you?). But it takes *power* so its more a way to store energy than to generate energy per se. And hydrogen is a bitch to contain because the molecule is so small. And it can be kind of dangerous. Anyway, I'm sure we will see sudden renewal of interest in hydrogen and hydrogen-powered vehicles a lot sooner than we may have thought even 12 months ago.

[GuestHouse]

I'm not sure if Higher Oil Prices are good for the planet, but they are certainly good for my pay cheque.

---

The driving force behind the US search for alternative energy sources is not higher prices but the need for energy security - ie energy sources from within US boarders or at the very least from within continental America.

---

Pogue of the Ford Motor Company patented a 300mpg carburettor, making use of pre- vapoutised fuel. cant remember the date, 1950s I think. Garrett patented in-car-produced-hydrogen in 1935, using platinum and palladium electrodes, for electrolysis. Swiss had hydrogen engines in the mid 1970s running 300 trucks and tractors, using a radio frequency to split water vapour. The corrupt Swiss Govt of that time made the scientist dismantle them. This radio frequency method was again demonstrated recently on international TV. Any person who today manufactures such a hydrogen device meets a mysterious, untimely death, accident..The facilities burn down, and staff are threatened. Note that under Gull Island off the USA NW coast, and under Colorado there is more oil that of Saudi and Iraq. So this high price is just a design by the Elite to kill the middle class. And that is not a conspiracy theory like the one about an Arab in a cave in Afghan shutting down the half trillion dollar US air defenses with his laptop. With the naive comments from the starter of this thread, it is obvious he/she relies on C(sewer)NN for his news and not www.rense.com Somebody from the BIG OIL please explain that in an age when a color digital picture can be sent back from planet Mars, our brilliant scientists cannot efficiently split a water molecule.

What kind of <deleted> are you smoking?...... and could this be distilled into a new energy source?

[Crushdepth]

I think I just found his photo on that website he mentioned:

[Boater]

This is a global problem, i read today 4,000 trucks in northern Thailand have been taken off the road to rising fuel costs, the price of a fish and chip supper in the UK will rise 50% due to boat fuel increase and the revert affect in the price of Cod!

When will this end, can a barrel of oil realy hit 200 USD!,