Numb Feeling

[AlexLah]

Hi all,

Since a week or three I started to notice a numb feeling in my pinky.

Now after 3 weeks it has spread to the palm of my hand and the finger next to my pink.

It feels like that part of my body has been deprived of blood so it feels like you are being stacked with needles in that area.

Now I know that when I use the PC my arm is resting on the sharp corner of my table so could it be that I blocked blood circulation?

For the last week I gave my arm rest but no improvement so far.

Any ideas what it could be?

Kind regards,

Alex

[geriatrickid]

clot, nerve damage, and a thousand and one items. I get my numbness because of the way I can sit in bed. My arm or leg can die on me. Without knowing your age and general medical condition (e.g. diabetes) all people can do is guess. if you type heavily with a pinkie (some people do), then it may be as simple as that but it would usually be accompanied with other discomfort. If this has been your typing style for a long time then it is likely that. As you didn't mention discolourations it's not an apparent trauma.

You know the drill, have someone look at it, preferably a medical person that knows how to use a computer and has experience with white collar people. (They usually have the carpal et al type of injuries.) In the meantime, how about trying a different position or easing up on the computer use with that arm.

[Tony Clifton]

Happened to me in exact same order 2 years ago and has gone away somewhat, pinkie still feels a bit numb. I also think it's caused by the way I sat at my desk resting my elbow on the sharp corner. I'm thinking more nerve damage or pinched. I now use a gel pad to rest that elbow, seems to improve slooowly.

[FBN]

Happened to me in exact same order 2 years ago and has gone away somewhat, pinkie still feels a bit numb. I also think it's caused by the way I sat at my desk resting my elbow on the sharp corner. I'm thinking more nerve damage or pinched. I now use a gel pad to rest that elbow, seems to improve slooowly.

You have an Ulnar nerve compression syndrome. The ulnar nerve supplies sensation to the little finger and half of the ring finger. It runs down the arm at the inside of the elbow (it is the "funny bone"); any pressure on the inside of the elbow can cause this. If it continues past a week or 10 days or so, have an electromyography test done. This will show where the nerve is compressed/injured. Can also be down at the hand but this is less likely.

If the test shows compression at the elbow, a small operation may be necessary. If it is due to you resting your arm in a certain way on a chair, it should be temporary and normal feeling should return in a few weeks.

[cobra]

Happened to me in exact same order 2 years ago and has gone away somewhat, pinkie still feels a bit numb. I also think it's caused by the way I sat at my desk resting my elbow on the sharp corner. I'm thinking more nerve damage or pinched. I now use a gel pad to rest that elbow, seems to improve slooowly.

You have an Ulnar nerve compression syndrome. The ulnar nerve supplies sensation to the little finger and half of the ring finger. It runs down the arm at the inside of the elbow (it is the "funny bone"); any pressure on the inside of the elbow can cause this. If it continues past a week or 10 days or so, have an electromyography test done. This will show where the nerve is compressed/injured. Can also be down at the hand but this is less likely.

If the test shows compression at the elbow, a small operation may be necessary. If it is due to you resting your arm in a certain way on a chair, it should be temporary and normal feeling should return in a few weeks.

True, more common is issue with one of the vertibra/disk in the neck pinching the nerve.

If it was a carpel issue would also affect thumb and palm,

other possibilities but less likely is diabetes and any number of neuropathies, (of which heavy drinking is one).

I had the same condition as you speak for over a year now with little abatement, (nerve issue in the neck),

Good luck.

[drbill]

Agree with FBN

[ThaiPauly]

Happened to me in exact same order 2 years ago and has gone away somewhat, pinkie still feels a bit numb. I also think it's caused by the way I sat at my desk resting my elbow on the sharp corner. I'm thinking more nerve damage or pinched. I now use a gel pad to rest that elbow, seems to improve slooowly.

You have an Ulnar nerve compression syndrome. The ulnar nerve supplies sensation to the little finger and half of the ring finger. It runs down the arm at the inside of the elbow (it is the "funny bone"); any pressure on the inside of the elbow can cause this. If it continues past a week or 10 days or so, have an electromyography test done. This will show where the nerve is compressed/injured. Can also be down at the hand but this is less likely.

If the test shows compression at the elbow, a small operation may be necessary. If it is due to you resting your arm in a certain way on a chair, it should be temporary and normal feeling should return in a few weeks.

Have the same complaint myself, so a year ago I had the test done at Bumrungrad. Doctor said I had Ulner Nerve Compression Syndrome, and a small op would fix it, but the numbness which had spread to my ring finger has now retreated to my Pinky again. As it really does not give me that much trouble I have not had the op. If it starts to spread again then I would have it.

I have had the numbness for 4-5 years.

[Maejo Man]

I have had the same problem for nearly a month now, and have been in and out of hospital in that time for various tests. I have been diagnosed as having "Cubital Tunnel Syndrome" which is similar to Carpel Tunnel Syndrome but in the elbow instead of the wrist, which they now tell me I have also. The pinching of the Ulnar nerve causes the tingling and numbness. Complete rest of the arm is the only remedy, unless you prefer to undergo "tunnel relief" surgery. You will learn heaps more by doing a simple web search. There is also a thread on TV from way back on this.

Depending on the severity, healing can take up to a few months. In my case I'm using my left had for most tasks, which to put it mildly, is a nuisance. I hope your's was not as severe as mine.

Edited for syntax. The left hand typing is a bummer

Edited June 7, 2008 by Maejo Man

[AlexLah]

Hi all,

Thanks so much for your replies.

FBN is totally right!

Found this site that really explains it all.

http://orthoinfo.aaos.org/topic.cfm?topic=a00069

Will try to keep it straight as much as possible for a few weeks and see if it goes away.

And indeed, typing with left hand sukcs.

Thanks all!

Alex

[zaphodbeeblebrox]

It could be a combination of carpal tunnel and some cervical (neck) nerve compression. Adjust your work station. If you can, switch mouse hands. You may want to replace your standard mouse with a track-ball (Kensington and Logitech have some great models). Start up an exercise program to strengthen your wrists and neck. Look for finger strengtheners (used by musicians and baseball pitchers - a squeeze ball will do) If you can, get a wrist brace and use it when you sleep for about 30 days. This should eliminate the numbness/tingling, but, if you continue with a lot of computer work, you will need to keep up the exercise program.

I also had the ulnar entrapment, and making work station adjustments along with exercises should clear up the problem.

Edited June 7, 2008 by zaphodbeeblebrox

[Sheryl]

It is not carpal tunnel (location of the numbness preculdes that) but rather compression of the ulnar nerve.

Conservative management would be:

- rest the arm as much as possible and in particular avoid activities that require sharp bending of the elbow or take frequent breaks when doing them.

- NSAIDs (ibuprofen and the like) as long as you have no contraindication, can be bought over the counter in any pharmacy, always take with food. Contraindications would incvlude any type of bleeding disorder or ulcer.

- applying a splint to the arm at night so that you don't bend the elbow in your sleep, if it does not interfere with your sleep can be very helpful. You can jerry-rig your own,anything that keeps the elbow unbent will do.

If such measures don't work, an EMG and possibly surgery will be indicated, but try these first.

[Tony Clifton]

Happened to me in exact same order 2 years ago and has gone away somewhat, pinkie still feels a bit numb. I also think it's caused by the way I sat at my desk resting my elbow on the sharp corner. I'm thinking more nerve damage or pinched. I now use a gel pad to rest that elbow, seems to improve slooowly.

You have an Ulnar nerve compression syndrome. The ulnar nerve supplies sensation to the little finger and half of the ring finger. It runs down the arm at the inside of the elbow (it is the "funny bone"); any pressure on the inside of the elbow can cause this. If it continues past a week or 10 days or so, have an electromyography test done. This will show where the nerve is compressed/injured. Can also be down at the hand but this is less likely.

If the test shows compression at the elbow, a small operation may be necessary. If it is due to you resting your arm in a certain way on a chair, it should be temporary and normal feeling should return in a few weeks.

Happened to me in exact same order 2 years ago and has gone away somewhat, pinkie still feels a bit numb. I also think it's caused by the way I sat at my desk resting my elbow on the sharp corner. I'm thinking more nerve damage or pinched. I now use a gel pad to rest that elbow, seems to improve slooowly.

You have an Ulnar nerve compression syndrome. The ulnar nerve supplies sensation to the little finger and half of the ring finger. It runs down the arm at the inside of the elbow (it is the "funny bone"); any pressure on the inside of the elbow can cause this. If it continues past a week or 10 days or so, have an electromyography test done. This will show where the nerve is compressed/injured. Can also be down at the hand but this is less likely.

If the test shows compression at the elbow, a small operation may be necessary. If it is due to you resting your arm in a certain way on a chair, it should be temporary and normal feeling should return in a few weeks.

True, more common is issue with one of the vertibra/disk in the neck pinching the nerve.

If it was a carpel issue would also affect thumb and palm,

other possibilities but less likely is diabetes and any number of neuropathies, (of which heavy drinking is one).

I had the same condition as you speak for over a year now with little abatement, (nerve issue in the neck),

Good luck.

Agree with FBN

Wow!

Saw the doc a few weeks ago and he said I had spurs on vertebrae 4-5-6.

[Sheryl]

Tony,

If the doc says you have spurs (and assuming he did at keast neck X-rays if not also MRI) then you have spurs. They are common. However the fact that you have them does not mean they are the cause of your problem. Might be, might not be, altho if it were the case one would usually expect pain radiating down from the shoulder rather than numbness limited to pinky finger and parts of hand, the latter while perhaps possibly due to vertebral nerve root compression sounds more like ulnar nerve compression.

There is a test called an EMG whereby the nerve responsible for the problem can be identified (as well as the seveerity), such a test can conclusively determine whether or not what you have is ulnar nerve compression and can also tell whether the spurs are compressing nerve roots. Should definitely be done before contemplating surgery of any kind.

It has happened that people with back and/or arm pain underwent surgery for vertebral spurs or disk problems and failed to get any relief because, altho those abnormalities were present, they were not the cause of the pain. Not all spurs and disk problems are symptomatic.

[AlexLah]

Hi all.

ThaiPauly you mention you had the EMG done at Bum, what was the cost?

And Sheryl could it be possible that the nerve is compressed somewhere halfway my underarm as that is the area

that rests on the sharp corner of my table?

I have read that they can do an operation near the funny bone and a zig zag in your hand but would that help if the nerve is compressed halfway the underarm?

If an operation can solve this numb feeling I will just go for it as I need my hand to be able to do my work.

I am using guns on a daily basis and I would not forgive myself if I missed a target (and hit a non target) because of the numb feeling in my hand, knowing a simple operation could do the job.

No I am not in the army, no worry.

Cheers all, and thanks a lot for the replies and helping me and others that are suffering from this syndrome.

Kind regards,

Alex

[Maejo Man]

Hi all.

ThaiPauly you mention you had the EMG done at Bum, what was the cost?

Kind regards,

Alex

I had mine done at the faculty of medicine in Chiangmai, and the cost was 1500 baht and lasted approximately two hours.

[farangene]

I had some occasional numbness in my hand about 10+ years ago. I saw a dr in US who said that a shot of cortisone fixes this problem in most cases. I got the shot and never experienced the problem again. A friend also had the same problem, got the cortisone shot and her problem also went away.

Maybe there are other alternatives to an operation. I don't recall what the specific medical diagnosis was

Edited June 10, 2008 by farangene

[zzdocxx]

I think there are two or three previous threads on this subject.

[Maejo Man]

I had some occasional numbness in my hand about 10+ years ago. I saw a dr in US who said that a shot of cortisone fixes this problem in most cases.

A rather slack approach by your GP in this instance, if you'll pardon me saying so. Further tests should always be performed to establish if it is cubital or carpel related, and of course the severity of nerve damage.

Steroidal injections work well in arthritic conditions but not always in the case of CTS. It's like saying take an asprin and lie down, they did not find the exact cause of your problem, or you didn't mention it, but it worked in your case, which was fortunate.

The ligament compressing the "tunnel" is more often than not unresponsive to steroidal injections, and relief surgery, or complete immobilisation of the joint is the only option.

Four weeks now and my condition has only improved marginally, so surgery is looming ever closer.

[Sheryl]

I just took someone for an EMG at BNH and it was 4,000 Baht plus another 2,000 approximately for the report. Bummers won't be any kless I'm sure. It is a time-consuming procedure that has to be done by a specially trained technician. That said, you can get it done for half that or less at Phyathai 2 where you can also be treated by the country's best hand surgeon.

Some insurance companies require an EM before they will pay for surgery. Even if you are self-paying, should have it before considering surgery.

Maejo Man,

I suffered through years of attempts to manage by CTS conservatively (mainly because I was concerned that there would be some loss of wrist strength). Afetr I had it done I wished I had done so way sooner.

And Alex, I won't ask just what it is you do use those guns for....I just trust it's not from the balcony of your Bkk condo!

[AlexLah]

Thanks for tha Sheryl but I am a bit confused, let me explain by a copy paste from a hospital.

Nerve Conduction Studies (NCS)

NCS are performed next and take about 30-45 minutes. While lying down, surface electrodes are taped over several cutaneous zones and muscles. The nerves which supply those zones or muscles are then stimulated with a surface probe and the resulting electrical responses are recorded by the surface electrodes which are in turn attached to an EMG machine. The electrical responses provide detailed information about nerve function. These stimuli feel like a small shock (as when touching a metal object after walking on a rug) and are almost always well tolerated.

Electromyography (EMG)

EMG is performed last and takes about 5 - 15 minutes. During this test, a very small needle electrode (smaller than the needle employed during a blood draw) is placed in one or more muscles in the arm, leg or back. The electrical activity of the muscle is fed back through the electrode to the EMG machine when the muscle is at rest and then when it is voluntarily activated by the patient. The electrical information obtained from EMG provides precise information about muscle function. EMG may be slightly painful, but only lasts several seconds per muscle. There is no electrical stimulation during this part of the test.

Sould I ask for an EMG or mention NCS?

[Maejo Man]

I just took someone for an EMG at BNH and it was 4,000 Baht plus another 2,000 approximately for the report. Bummers won't be any kless I'm sure. It is a time-consuming procedure that has to be done by a specially trained technician. That said, you can get it done for half that or less at Phyathai 2 where you can also be treated by the country's best hand surgeon.

Maejo Man,

I suffered through years of attempts to manage by CTS conservatively (mainly because I was concerned that there would be some loss of wrist strength). Afetr I had it done I wished I had done so way sooner.

Thanks for the information Sheryl. I just looked at my bill again, and it was actually 1760 baht which included the consultation from one of Chiangmai's top neurologists.

Alex your first step is to get a "nerve conduction" test which should pin point the problem, if it doesn't, then onto the "painful" one. Once they have established the exact problem, Ulnar or Median nerve compression, they can go from there. Little finger numbness is a sign that it is Ulnar nerve compression.

I used to rest my forearm on the desk as well, and that had a lot to do with the problem. However, I have CTS as well, which makes normal tasks extremely difficult.

I have virtually cleared up the the Ulnal nerve problem, and now there is no numbness and the strength has returned to my little finger. Thumb and fore finger are now the problem.

Please keep us posted.....

[PeaceBlondie]

I am still unsure what to do. On my last two quarterly visits to my neurologist (who diagnosed my May 2007 lacunar infarction), he examined my right little finger and said it was okay. He would not recommend further diagnosis or refer me to a hand specialist. That finger is still weak. Here, I will try to ty['e p; -see? At first it hit bracket and apostrophe, then it hit p and semicolon. Now I try to type question mark - did not hit that key. Or the semicolon;' -again, it hit two keys. But I have learned to work around it, and I have spare time (but my handwriting is still poor). In the morning, parts of my left hand goes numb about 20 minutes after I arise. Then those left hand parts stay numb for about 10 minutes more.

Sorry - I did not mean to hijack AlexLah's thread.

[Sheryl]

Sorry for the confusion, nerve conduction studies & EMGs are different tests altho often done in conjunction with each other. The price I mentioned was for both tests, in a patient with vertebral compression of a nerve root. Nerve conduction test incolves only sensors placed on the skin (with some tingly sensation resulting) while EMG involves needle pricking.

Either test will have to be ordered by a doctor. Alex, I suggest you just go see Dr. Panupan. He'll then order NCS and, if indicated, EMG as well. I believe these would have to be done on a weekday while his hours are Sundays only but the hospital is conveniently located to the BTS.

PB: your case is a biot more complicated in that the symptoms could be due to residual effect of the stroke or could be utterly unrelated and due to ulnar nerve compression or other cause. One problem with specialists is that they really have tunnel vision and tend to dismiss problems that don't fall under their bailiwick. I advise you to just go ahead on your own and see a hand specialist, the most you have to lose is a single consultation fee and if in fact you do have nerve compression it can be treated effectively, so what you stand to gain is use of your pinkie back.

Good luck to you both, as well as Maejo, and keep us posted

[AlexLah]

Hi Sheryl

You mention Dr. Panupan, does he work in BNH?

Kind regards,

Alex

[Sheryl]

No. He is a Professor at Siriraj. His only private practice is:

Phaythai 2 Hosp Sundays 9-11 AM

Caho Phya Hospital Thursdays 6-7 PM

see also priopr post o nthis thread

Highly recommend him. Best hand surgeon in the country, world class and also a very kind, good man.

[coventry]

I've had Carpal Tunnel Syndrom in both hands for years. I worked in construction and used vibration tools regularly, which probably induced the condition. I've had corrective surgery twice in one hand and once in the other. Neither worked. Operations aren't a cure all, as per my case. So don't think everything will be happy ever after.

[FBN]

I've had Carpal Tunnel Syndrom in both hands for years. I worked in construction and used vibration tools regularly, which probably induced the condition. I've had corrective surgery twice in one hand and once in the other. Neither worked. Operations aren't a cure all, as per my case. So don't think everything will be happy ever after.

This is indeed tragic. HAV (hand arm vibration syndrome) is now recognised in the industry as an Occupational Illnes and carpal tunnel due to handling these tools may be eligible for compensation in some countries. (Have you tried to pursue this?)

The mechanism of injury to the nerve here is different. It occures over en extended period and the damage becomes cumulative resulting in fibrosis of the nerve and nerve sheath. The operation for carpal tunnel is intended to relieve pressure on the nerve where it passes into the hand through the carpal tunnel by cutting through the tough connective tissue bands covering the structures passing through this tunnel (tendons to fingers, blood vessels etc). Sometimes the nerve sheath need to be opened right along each of the individual branches it splits into after passing through this "tunnel" into the hand.

In this case, extended damage of the nerve probably occurred over time. Basically, the longer the history of symptoms and signs, the poorer the outcome of any intervention.

[coventry]

I received no compensation because Carpal Tunnel Synrome can be attributed to being caused by other means. It can be hereditary. Where as, White Finger is attributable to vibratory tools. C.T.S is recognised as an industrial disease by the DSS for which they pay me Industrial Injuries Benefit, about 25 quid a week for life. But my employer gives me nothing. I also had to have the Scaphoid bone removed from my left hand because of vibratory damage. Once again no compensation as damage to this bone can be caused by other means. To get compensation one really needs to have an accident and one can pin point a time and place of the injury.

Edited June 15, 2008 by coventry

[AlexLah]

No. He is a Professor at Siriraj. His only private practice is:

Phaythai 2 Hosp Sundays 9-11 AM

Caho Phya Hospital Thursdays 6-7 PM

see also priopr post o nthis thread

Highly recommend him. Best hand surgeon in the country, world class and also a very kind, good man.

Ho Sheryl,

How do I make an appointment?

Any contact details?

Will be greatly appreciated!

Kind regards,

Alex

[Sheryl]

No. He is a Professor at Siriraj. His only private practice is:

Phaythai 2 Hosp Sundays 9-11 AM

Caho Phya Hospital Thursdays 6-7 PM

see also priopr post o nthis thread

Highly recommend him. Best hand surgeon in the country, world class and also a very kind, good man.

Ho Sheryl,

How do I make an appointment?

Any contact details?

Will be greatly appreciated!

Kind regards,

Alex

email to [email protected]

Or call 02-617-249, ask for orthopedics then ask for the appointment. If calling better have a Thai speaker do it. Dr. Panupan himslef is US trained and speaks excellent English but most of the nurses and office staff etc do not. The email tho will go to a special office for international patients. If you supply your full name, address, date of birth and passport details they may be able to aheva ptaient number and chart ready when you arrive, saves time registering.