(If this topic, or similar, is lurking somewhere in the forum, apologies)

I would like to know how your Thai boyfriends/husbands respond if you are emotional (as I believe it is different to how western men respond, right?). I dont mean ranting and raving (which i believe is not good in any relationship, same culture or otherwise). Im talking about if you are upset about something, or want to confront about something that you find upsetting. Or if your emotions get the better of you and you cry and state your feelings about something he did that upset you.

I wonder also how Thai women respond when they are upset or emotional within their personal relationship. Do they always keep their worries or upset inside?

I dont like confrontation or complaining, but I also believe if you find something upsetting (that happens regularly), you should be able to voice it. I was brought up that when problems, misunderstanding, or upset about something arose, it is best to discuss it and try resolve or put the person at ease that they misunderstood. If I am ignored or not given any reassurance, i feel that my feelings/concerns are not considered.

Would like some insight into how Thai men deal with womens emotions (and how Thai women usually deal with their emotions to their men).

Usual answer... Mai Pen Rai

Ok, I can understand a Mai Pen Rai attitude when you are forgiving something/someone or they you..but is the Mai Pen Rai attitude also applied to when someone is visibly upset? Meaning..you just walk away from it? For me that one is difficult to understand, its like turning your back on someone when they need emotional support and reassurance. Is it understood by all Thai that that is the general way and best way to do/handle a relationship problem?..just think 'Mai Pen Rai' and leave it be? Thai women like it this way too?

Ok, I can understand a Mai Pen Rai attitude when you are forgiving something/someone or they you..but is the Mai Pen Rai attitude also applied to when someone is visibly upset? Meaning..you just walk away from it? For me that one is difficult to understand, its like turning your back on someone when they need emotional support and reassurance. Is it understood by all Thai that that is the general way and best way to do/handle a relationship problem?..just think 'Mai Pen Rai' and leave it be? Thai women like it this way too?

Yes they don't give a #### how you feel.

Because that is the #### they feed minds in the west.

Edited July 20, 200817 yr by RakJungTorlae

Ok, I can understand a Mai Pen Rai attitude when you are forgiving something/someone or they you..but is the Mai Pen Rai attitude also applied to when someone is visibly upset? Meaning..you just walk away from it? For me that one is difficult to understand, its like turning your back on someone when they need emotional support and reassurance. Is it understood by all Thai that that is the general way and best way to do/handle a relationship problem?..just think 'Mai Pen Rai' and leave it be? Thai women like it this way too?

Yes they don't give a #### how you feel.

Because that is the #### they feed minds in the west.

Hardly the clearest post of the century, if you don't mind me saying.....RakJungTorlae.

What do you mean by 'Because that is the #### they feed minds in the west.???? '

Interesting post eek, I'm curious too as to the responses this will generate. I'm afraid, I don't know so can't contribute further, however, I would be very surprised if someone received a 'mai pen rai' response if visibly upset...

Edited July 20, 200817 yr by Andiamo

I always believe that men are the same all over the world, and so do women;

Thus; every relation is an individual case and a unique experience, considering the differences in many factors such as :culture, social class ,financial status ,education , childhood and previous life-love experiences and etc......

you can have a violent brother/sister in your own family from the same parents; who tremble and shakes for the silliest reasons. And you can have a sister who is so calm and soft which completely differ to your own personality and nature.

Therefore, reactions of anger or consent between couples trying to "work out things well or not "

usually follows: ''"To each it's own'' law.

Well said zaza. But, that said, I think in general most men have difficulty expressing emotions and then add into that a culture that frowns on public expression of emotions and it makes it even more difficult for us emotional women

My husband has learned (over the years) that it is ok to be sad or angry with me and to show that to me. But, he doesn't necessarily show that to the rest of the world.

well,

from the few thai women ive met here, i've noticed that they use the 'silent treatment' and 'kicking out of bed treatments' as the two ways to express their annoyance, anger or being upset. or run to stay with a girlfriend (what a thai woman would do in thailand is go back to her mother's house or sister's house)...

public tears and histrionics abxolutely frowned upon. and no discussing, cause the men seem to not have patience. for the most part they are not woody allen new york verbose types it seems.

however, at night, what goes on could be anything from a tropical storm to an ice over.

i asked anon how do couples fight /argue /discuss stuff when living in small houses/apartments/multi generational. he said exactly that... at night when others are sleeping (hoepefully) things are discussed if at all. for the most part, a lot of guess work, and issues seem separated. women's stuff is kept to be discussed with other women (sisters/mother/et al)...husbands are not 'best friends'. they are less likely to discuss with husband and more likely to discuss with females. male female roles are still polarized. but my experience and info comes from issan uneducated men.

if u ask the farang men, u would think that every thai woman goes ballistic and throws stuff including knives. i actually did witness that once about 25 yrs ago at univerisity among a bangkok thai rich girl not getting her way with a thai rich fiancee....

however what i do hear from most of the men is they just push the 'ignore' button, let it all wash over, then wait to be told what the problem is, if the woman wants to say what it is. if not, its guess work or mai ben rai...

i am considered a cold cucumber by my very emotional israeli friends male and female where emotion is something to be cultivated and shown and used at every oppurtunity. i use the cold, sullen faces or getting up and moving to a different area of the house type things to convey hurt/anger/upset. yelling just gets anon going in to the bedroom to listen to music. however if i am quiet, a bit 'cold', then discussions happen rapidly. tears just get scoffed at. anon is more physical and if he notices that i am upset or whatever, will just be more physically affectionate, but usually wont instigate an intellectual conversation bout the reasons. (usually i'm told by thai men that i 'think to much').

such was the comment to my best friend when she was showing us ( me anon and a few thai men friends) her newly built but unfinished house. she started yelling at a foreman, and then burst in to tears. the thais, shocked by the site of an angry woman yelling until she was crying , felt very uncomfortable. (i'm used to such scenes as they occur daily with all different people in different incidents, everyone here yells, carries on, etc). they turned to me, i said that her nerves were shot, and they all said together: 'headaches-- u think too much'. and then they put themselves on 'ignore' and went off to see the patio stone work (avoidance behavior). an israeli male would have either started yelling at the foreman, yelling at the woman or try to placate the woman or take some kind of action by talking/asking questions, etc. it wasnt the language barrier that prevented them from talking (they could have asked me, as most israelis would ask me if anon went stomping off in a huff ). they just pressed the 'mai ben rai' button.

i hope that made some sense.

bina

I always believe that men are the same all over the world, and so do women;

Not this woman. In my experience, men are not the same the world over. We are indeed all individuals, but we are individuals from a cultural framework laden with values and customs, and even a cursory look at varying approaches to casual friendship between men and women will tell you what a mine field courtship within the so-called "sameness" really is. We share the same biology, but that's where generic similarities end.

Bina you are a legend, your post made perfect sense and I can't wait to meet you

I always believe that men are the same all over the world, and so do women;

Not this woman. In my experience, men are not the same the world over. We are indeed all individuals, but we are individuals from a cultural framework laden with values and customs, and even a cursory look at varying approaches to casual friendship between men and women will tell you what a mine field courtship within the so-called "sameness" really is. We share the same biology, but that's where generic similarities end.

I don't know Kat, yes I agree with you but I have also seen that men in general share some traits that seem to cross cultural boundaries.

Husband hearing, for one. (all you ladies do know what I mean by this ) Also, the general inability to see messes (or smell them!), the inability to find things ("honey, where is the... ", is a refrain that most women are familiar with) etc etc. None of these are, of course, really emotional issues but again, another thing that seems to be generally shared is an inability to emote as much as women do. Or to put as much as importance on it as women tend to do.

So, yes, of course there are cultural behaviors that make a Thai man unique, and then there are individual traits that make the person unique but I've got to say, from what I've seen and from what I have heard from the myriad of women who have stayed at our place, women from many different cultures and nationalities, some things just seem to be "guy things"

bina, you've got it down to a "T". Exactly my experience as a western male living with a Thai male for many years.

Thank you bina for taking the time to write that.

I really hope others can give their thoughts and such clear examples too.

Would be interesting to read a Thai womans perspective also.

Ive noticed the silent treatment thing also, and have had to do that myself too in order to get a better response to my upset. But I am finding that way of doing things a bit frustrating, yet it seems that its difficult to try address things in other ways (in my experience), even if trying to point out things in a calm and respectful way (I also get met with "you think too much" and "only in your mind".). I wondered if this is the norm. It just feels like a tit-for-tat game playing. Something i dont find easy.

The 'think too much line' is very normal!! If I'm visibly upset (crying) my husband will comfort me, he doesn't just walk away and leave me...only if I'm angry and tell him to bugger off!! I think when the relationship is new(er) Thai men can be overwhelmed with how emotional we get. My hub had no idea what PMS was before me as his mother and sister never showed signs of it. There seems to be a varying degree of how Thai women show their emotions (just like us funnily enough ) with the extremes being women stabbing you with a fork (husband's ex!) to silent treatment. I guess it depends on the indivdual relationship as to how much discussion of feelings go on.

From my experience, when my hub and I argue, I will generally have to wait to the next day or at least many hours before we can finish the discussion in a reasonable, understanding way without yelling/getting more upset or he will just go quiet and I'll be frustrated that I think he doesn't care or whatever... it's not that he doesn't care, he just needs time to think things through before coming to a decision or being able to discuss things, otherwise he'll get frustrated feeling he's been pressured. Oh the complexities of the male species!!

Guy input....

Me- canadian male of mixed asian heritage

I grew up with brothers, no females in the house except for mom. In extended family all boys as well except for 1 females cousin. I do not see the signs, do not know the signs and more often then not miss the signs of inpending doom.

Wife - Thai, only daughter/ only child. (that should explain everything)

Wife usually goes quiet before exploding. And when she exploedes she explodes, no throwing things or screaming though. But she explodes and woe be anything that is the object of her wrath.

The problem is when a guy (me) try to calm things down we (me) are seen as being insensitive of not caring or not even thinking. Which of course rile us (me) up.....

But thankfully the wife is like the rainy season in BKK, massive storm then all is clear again in hours if not minutes. (only child syndrome I call it).

Me I keep everything bottled inside (grew up with boys) until I start to crack. Thats when the wife sends me out to play with the boys and afterthat we can have a nice reasonable discussion (her lecturing me and me agreeing)

some ppl have unkindly said that I have been tamed......

More guy input...

My (recently) ex Spanish wife was a bit of a perfectionist. She took care of me extremely well, but had tremendously high standards. Despite my best endeavors, I used to drive her nuts on many occasions by not delivering or living up to those standards. She would always try to "educate" me towards doing things her (the best) way in order for me to become a "better" person. I walked on eggs for many years in fear of her wrath/criticism, I had definitely "been tamed".

I have now been with my new Thai GF in Thailand for nearly a year now. If I want to do something a certain way (my way and in my own time) it's "no problem" and there's no upset or friction. I finally feel I can relax again. I guess it's early days yet in the new relationship. Will this tolerance fade as the newness of the relationship fades or is it an inherent character of my new lady? Time will tell but I'll still be mentally referring to the "lessons" learned from my ex wife and I'll still be trying not to give reason to be reprimanded.

There must be equally on-edge AND relaxed people in both Europe AND Thailand, I don't believe it's a wholly cultural thing but maybe the "mai bpen rai" is more easily found in Thailand - what does everybody think? All I know is that I prefer the "mai bpen rai/mai me bpen hah" to the stress of living in fear of criticism of my every other action.

I too, wonder how a Thai man would respond to a Thai OR non-Thai woman who got ever more exasperated because he left hairs on the bathroom floor?

both of my thai exes were completely opposite to each other. one was a very traditional kinda guy from isaan. one was a more progressive type from the south. never would they have reacted in the same ways to the same situation. the first one, when i got emotional, would at first be solicitous, but couldn't keep it up for long and he would just disappear. when he came back around he would be solicitous again, but never really wanted to discuss anything and was definitely more "mai pen rai". my second boyfriend would either get disgusted (if i cried or was too emotional) and berate me as being "too soft". or if it was an issue that concerned him as well he would get pretty obsessively analytical about it, just like i tend to do. we never balanced each other out enough to work. he wasn't the type to say "mai pen rai" or "don't think too mut" though, as he was just as likely to think too much.

so though i do think a lot of reactions to certain situations by thais have cultural influences, in other cases it does ultimately come down to the individual personality and experience.

one thing i wholeheartedly agree with (and detest) is that there is still a separation of the sexes in thailand and girls are expected to stick to girls rather than their guy when it comes to anything personal (and in social situations- ugh). that is an example of a cultural influence.

I too, wonder how a Thai man would respond to a Thai OR non-Thai woman who got ever more exasperated because he left hairs on the bathroom floor?

Do you mean, like, when you shave and leave hair all over the sink, the counter, and the floor? Hmmm?

Steady desi, it was only a few off the top of my bonce that I was in denial about losing. It didn't happen often - I showered every year whether I needed it or not.

Steady desi, it was only a few off the top of my bonce that I was in denial about losing. It didn't happen often - I showered every year whether I needed it or not.

Love it!

From my experience, when my hub and I argue, I will generally have to wait to the next day or at least many hours before we can finish the discussion in a reasonable, understanding way without yelling/getting more upset or he will just go quiet and I'll be frustrated that I think he doesn't care or whatever... it's not that he doesn't care, he just needs time to think things through before coming to a decision or being able to discuss things, otherwise he'll get frustrated feeling he's been pressured. Oh the complexities of the male species!!

oh, that's my line. men are not complex one bit. you ladies read us like an open book!!! you know exactly what to do and know how to responce.

Lady!, you got us by the B-A-L-L !

let me analized my self....men are simple creature. we see pretty thing...we like...we want..we must have.

first, we landed ourself a wife- love her to death! Then come the time to find our own domain...buying house...we could careless..( they all look the same honey! but i like the living room and the garage, it so big !! )

Then come the first car- a big fancy pick up truck. can't see why you need a pick up, you work in an office dear....

a few year down the road, a ski boat for the family. yes....for the family...so we can go to the lake dear.... (we go to the lake 2-3 time a year)

now you got a rebel son or daughter...got to do something about it... so we got ourself a hotrod so that we can work on it in the garage.. Honey, this will bring our son/ daughter closer. we will work side by side, we will talk and we will get this strighted up! ( I hope she bought it)

by now, kid are in collage, so we get our self a motorcycle....a nice looking harley.....wow...let go honey! ( it's good to feel young again!)

see, man are simple creature. you read us like an open book. it's the same any where in the world. American or Thai men. But to the point of this tread...men do not responce well to emotion...period. we do take time to learn about you and how to approach you when the storm hit.

we will comfort you in our own way and we are always there for you when you needed us most. This is not holly wood, this is real life, what u see on the TV screen is not always the case. some men are just like in the movie, but i have to say least likely.

culture make a hugh difference. Asian responec to emotion differently than American/ Westerner. do i need to go on?

thank yoo allll for the votes of confidence....

girlx says--

one thing i wholeheartedly agree with (and detest) is that there is still a separation of the sexes in thailand and girls are expected to stick to girls rather than their guy when it comes to anything personal (and in social situations- ugh). that is an example of a cultural influence.

actually, i think that women talking with women/sisters/aunts is in a way a more powerful action. it means that u arent reliant on your husband for all emotional needs but can deal even if he isnt around.... i have to admit, and i've said it before i think in other posts, that i have my three or four close women friends (like sisters) and they are my emotional safety net and discussion panel for when times get tough. however, gthat doesnt mean that anon isnt my soulmate and love. it just means that he fulfills certain emotional needs (and physical ones as well, obviously) that arent fulfilled by my women friends. it goes back to tribal times i guess when women and men had separate but parallel lives and 'occupations'... not better or worse then each other but different. the same is seen in the religious families here. the women have strong connections among themselves to discuss things that they wont or cant discuss with their husbands. the rule of the man in the family is not 'friend' but 'supporter/father'.

and as a woman who has been accused often as being 'like a man' in my ways of thinking/talking, i find that now that i am older (and wiser ha!ha!) i prefer to 'hang' with the girls ... being a mother had a lot to do with my change in dealing with other women and my expectations from my husband.

just as an aside to girlx and kat: we have busses now in jeruslaem that segregates the women (back of the bus) and men (front of the bus) for the religious sector... and proper attire (long sleeves, skirts) taliban style...

sorry, hijacked the thread a bit...

nampueng, would love to meet all of u, but prices and money being what they are, dont think that will happen in the near future unless iran tries to blow us up, and then we might zoom over to the land of smiles...

bina

Edited July 21, 200817 yr by bina

Agree wiht Bina on the talking with girlfriends rather than my husband bit. If I have an emotional situation then I want to talk with other women about it, the only time I discuss my feeling with my husband is when he has upset them somehow or is being some sort of pig/insensitive wanke_r/lazy ass (add relevant depending on situation)

We have deep & meaningfuls but they revolve around our plans for the future, our son & if there is a problem in the extended family. But if I need to get womens stuff off my chest then I go straight for the girls.

How does my husband handle my emotions? Well, he has learned to not make me guess at his, if he is annoyed at something, tell me or get over it, if I have pissed him off, tell me, don't sulk, don't stomp & don't pout. I have no time for any of it & just don't play those games. I'm a grown up, I can handle grown up situations. I dont' need to be cajouled, pandered to or lied to in sneaky ways & I don't expect that he wants that treatment either so I do the same with him. So in this house straightforward honesty is the name of the game.

If he or I do sulk or pout (as happens on occasion) then the other tends to just ignore until the person feels ready to say whats up.

And just for marvo

I too, wonder how a Thai man would respond to a Thai OR non-Thai woman who got ever more exasperated because he left hairs on the bathroom floor?

Honey, can you please clean up your hairs from the bathroom otherwise you might wake up with a shaved head one of these days

Joke, I just clear them away, life is way too short to be bothered by something so petty

boo, i think one of the reasons my ex and i did divorce was one of those stupid endless arguements with him having a conniption about a hair (gasp! a pubic hair, the same one that he probably had met at some previous moment while conceiving a child or three with me) stuck on the bar of soap. jsut wash the darn soap off and shower already!!...

men!!!

bina

LOL, I am not gonna deny that on occasion seeing his (head ) hair all over the bath or when I hoover & the nozzle gets clogged with it doesn't annoy me but not enough to create a row about it.

Agree wiht Bina on the talking with girlfriends rather than my husband bit. If I have an emotional situation then I want to talk with other women about it, the only

How does my husband handle my emotions? Well, he has learned to not make me guess at his, if he is annoyed at something, tell me or get over it, if I have pissed him off, tell me, don't sulk, don't stomp & don't pout. I have no time for any of it & just don't play those games. I'm a grown up, I can handle grown up situations. I dont' need to be cajouled, pandered to or lied to in sneaky ways & I don't expect that he wants that treatment either so I do the same with him. So in this house straightforward honesty is the name of the game.

If he or I do sulk or pout (as happens on occasion) then the other tends to just ignore until the person feels ready to say whats up.

And just for marvo

I too, wonder how a Thai man would respond to a Thai OR non-Thai woman who got ever more exasperated because he left hairs on the bathroom floor?

Honey, can you please clean up your hairs from the bathroom otherwise you might wake up with a shaved head one of these days

Brilliant posts.

Steady desi, it was only a few off the top of my bonce that I was in denial about losing. It didn't happen often - I showered every year whether I needed it or not.

Hehhh hehhhhh...

Sigh. If guys only knew how often women exchanged grumbles about hair in the bathroom. And it's such a small thing.

But that's what maids are for, right? To clean up after everyone? Only, not all have full-time maids. Hmmm...

But long relationships are like that. It's not always the big things that matter in daily living. It's the piled up little things. And whether or not you want to make them into big things.

(hair in the sink, constant overspending, talking on a mobile incessantly and loud, leaving empty wrappers around, coming in late without calling, leaving toenail clippings on the sofa, not taking up the slack... I'm scrambling for memories of past relationshiops here as my other half really is decent about pretty much everything - in my eyes anyway, as he might not suit others - and my bad, it did take 15 years for me to admit dismay over sink hair :-)

Does it really change whatever nationality you are? Or is it down to personality? Or a combo? Or can you really mai bpen rai everything away?

I don't know that your list would constitute all little things for me desi, ie coming in late and not taking up the slack seem to me to be pretty big things.

I am fortunate (or not, depending on how I am feeling ) that my husband takes after his father, a brutally honest man. The man has no tact and if you ask him his opinion, he will tell you. Needles to say, while my father-in-law is respected he doesn't have many friends. My husband is a bit more tactful but this willingness to be honest has also made it possible for him to tell me what is going on with his feelings.

He's also learned to not take everything personally, something Thai people especially, but many others do this as well, seem to have difficulty with. If I've got PMS and I am cranky and I tell him I have cranky PMS, he is fine with it and doesn't take it personally and doesn't get angry cause I am a crazy bitch

I don't know that your list would constitute all little things for me desi, ie coming in late and not taking up the slack seem to me to be pretty big things.

Me too, but I was scrambling for irritating things to add to the list and I just couldn't remember many offhand (also, brain and caffeine had not connected yet :-)

I'm not wedded to a Thai, but he does have some Thai (I believe) traits. He's very laid back and doesn't harp all the time (don't you just hate nagging?). He doesn't see getting upset about things he can't change. And if he does start off (it's rare, but it occasionally happens), I just leave it to him to sort out. I just leave it be. Thailand has taught me that. Mai pben rai...

He's not brutally honest though. I'd say He's more wanting things to be smooth, calm, and happy so he does avoid total honesty. Isn't that Thai in a way too? But he does not take things personally at all. He passes most off by excusing for one reason or another (someone is having a bad day, something external is going on, etc). While I'm more likely to mull over the 'why' of actions.

When I met him I was surprised when he didn't go after me if I was huffy (I used to have a temper, mostly gone now). Being chased after when you are trying to get away was annoying, so after I got over the surprise, all was more than well.

So there are no games (pouting, extreme power plays, etc), which is a relief. It's more like, 'is this really important enough to even discuss, let alone argue over?' And the answer is usually 'no'. Life is too short, so yes, I can see going for mai pben rai instead!

The important thing is there's lots of laugher everyday. And after being in stormy, emotional relationships in the past, sanuk, I like!

Yeah, I do like Thai ways (the little bit I understand anyway). They have opened me up to becoming a better person.

It's not always the big things that matter in daily living. It's the piled up little things. And whether or not you want to make them into big things.

Never a truer word desi. Our partner does a "little" thing that doesn't quite sit right with us but it doesn't seem worth making an issue over at the time. Why upset the atmosphere by seemingly being so petty. Unfortunately with a prolonged exposure, the little almost insignificant things invisibly grow inside us to to become a big (and sometimes fatal) issue when they are all added together over many years.

I'd love to know how we are supposed to handle this phenomenon. I guess that in a perfect world, one quick timely word from one partner would be respected, remembered and acted upon by the other. But in the first place, one has to actually identify that one is burying a tiny niggle that in ten years time will, incredibly, have the power to destroy a relationship. And then who is the one responsible for the demise? The one who creates the niggle or the one who buries it?

So that leaves the question, is the "not rocking the boat - mai pen rai" attitude merely an act of setting a time bomb with a long fuse on it? Oh it's so complicated.