Half Thai / American Looking For Legal Advice About Current Situation

[warrena]

Hello Everyone,

I am currently holding an American passport, and am on a Non-imm type O visa. However I was born in Thailand. One of the mistakes I made was not registering myself as a Thai. My father is Thai and mother is American, Can anyone tell me if I would be able to ask for my Thai Citizenship without having to give up my American Citizenship.

I was recently told that because I was born here, I would not have to wait the 2 - 3 years to ask for citizenship however I must give up my American Citizenship to do so. But I have many friends who hold both Thai & British/Canadian/Australian. What are the laws for this?

I would very much appreciate any help I can get, It is very difficult to find work and get around owning property without the Thai Citizenship.

Thank you for your help in advance.

W.

[jetjock]

I do not know alot about the subject of your question but do know that a friend of mine was in almost the same situation as you are and he choose not to pursue his rightful Thai citizenship because of the Thai requirement of compulsory military service for males of a certain age. I am sure that we have other members that are experts on the subject but I think that if you state your age and sex that it might help them answer your question correctly

[Heng]

You're automatically Thai because you have a Thai parent. The general/basic route to Thai citizenship for Thais (whether born abroad or locally) is:

1) acquire Thai birth certificate

2) have name added to local house registry (this can be ANY house registry... but preferably a home belonging to a family member or relative)

3) id card issued (same day as being added to house registry typically)

4) passport made (optional, but convenient)

It can be anything from completely hassle free to somewhat troublesome (at the two steps that count most: steps 1 and 2 above...), but rest assured that with a little patience, you'll eventually get it, and IMO it's well worth it.

Could give you more specific advice if you wouldn't mind providing more details:

-for instance, did your father register your birth?

-any chance that either of your parents have a copy of your birth certificate?

-were you ever added to any house registration? (then it's just a simple issue of getting a new id card issued... once you locate whoever has that house registry book)

-if none of the above, do you at least know what hospital you were born at? there's a chance you might still be on the hospital's "house registry" and were never transferred to another house registry.

-if parents deceased, do you have other relative's who could be intervied by the amphur as witnesses that you are indeed who you say you are, etc., etc.

[PapiRico]

Hello Everyone,

I am currently holding an American passport, and am on a Non-imm type O visa. However I was born in Thailand. One of the mistakes I made was not registering myself as a Thai. My father is Thai and mother is American, Can anyone tell me if I would be able to ask for my Thai Citizenship without having to give up my American Citizenship.

I was recently told that because I was born here, I would not have to wait the 2 - 3 years to ask for citizenship however I must give up my American Citizenship to do so. But I have many friends who hold both Thai & British/Canadian/Australian. What are the laws for this?

I would very much appreciate any help I can get, It is very difficult to find work and get around owning property without the Thai Citizenship.

Thank you for your help in advance.

W.

Hi, I dont really know the laws and rules about thai citizenship, but i have been kinda in the same situation, just different country (not thailand), so no matter what you do, no matter what you feel like doing now, pls dont give up your american citizenship, even if you have to leave the country like all the farangs do, even if you have to be a farang during your whole stay here, just do it, cause if you give up your American citizenship, you are screwed, they wont let you back to america that easy anymore, they will make it very difficult for you,and why would you give up American for thai??? do what we all do, suffer here and be a farang in your own country man.....

[steveromagnino]

Hi, I dont really know the laws and rules about thai citizenship, but i have been kinda in the same situation, just different country (not thailand), so no matter what you do, no matter what you feel like doing now, pls dont give up your american citizenship, even if you have to leave the country like all the farangs do, even if you have to be a farang during your whole stay here, just do it, cause if you give up your American citizenship, you are screwed, they wont let you back to america that easy anymore, they will make it very difficult for you,and why would you give up American for thai??? do what we all do, suffer here and be a farang in your own country man.....

Nice rant.

Easy enough to consider giving up the Yank passport, more of a liability than an asset in some respects; hwoever only worthwhile for a passport of higher value; i.e. NOT Thailand.

However, since you don't have to give it up at all, then it is a non issue. No one is asking you to give up the yank passport unless you wish to, in which case they won't let you easily - they love collecting the tax as America is one of the few countries where you are still liable for tax as a non resident.

Easy enough; alternative 2 if you have no paperwork; stay here for 3 years on a work permit non imm 0, then apply for residency and you should be able to get PR and Citizenship immediately at the same time (I am told). Military service is an issue but once over 30 OR applying this way it is a non issue.

I'd only do the 3 year way if you cannot get hold of a Thai birth cert.

[Heng]

I should also add that your Thai birth certificate doesn't necessarily have to be the one your parent(s) got for you by presenting your Thai hospital birth documents to the local amphur office a few weeks after you were born. If one or both of your parents are still alive, they can STILL take other legal birth documents (preferably with you in tow) to any Thai embassy or consulate anywhere in the world and they will issue you a Thai birth certificate. For instance for myself, I didn't get a Thai birth certificate until I was 20-21, at the Thai consulate in LA, my parents just presented my State of Texas issued birth registration and my St. David's Hospital (Austin) birth certificate with my parents names on it. I

[NoSpeakIt]

america charges you tax when you are abroad. that is the obvious reason why people would consider giving it up. personally, i think there are easy ways around hiding money that make it silly to give up your us passport.

[daveh]

america charges you tax when you are abroad. that is the obvious reason why people would consider giving it up. personally, i think there are easy ways around hiding money that make it silly to give up your us passport.

The US does charge tax while you are abroad. For most people, this really isn't an issue. If you are working legally in Thailand as a teacher, then you are probably making so little money that you don't actually owe any taxes in the US. If you are working in Thailand with a better paying job, then you are paying higher Thai taxes which are deducted from what you owe the US, which leads to you owing nothing to the US again. If you are working illegally, why do you care? There are cases in which you will have to pay US taxes on top of Thai taxes, but I don't think they are as common as people believe.

[floridaguy]

You're automatically Thai because you have a Thai parent. The general/basic route to Thai citizenship for Thais (whether born abroad or locally) is:

1) acquire Thai birth certificate

2) have name added to local house registry (this can be ANY house registry... but preferably a home belonging to a family member or relative)

3) id card issued (same day as being added to house registry typically)

4) passport made (optional, but convenient)

It can be anything from completely hassle free to somewhat troublesome (at the two steps that count most: steps 1 and 2 above...), but rest assured that with a little patience, you'll eventually get it, and IMO it's well worth it.

Could give you more specific advice if you wouldn't mind providing more details:

-for instance, did your father register your birth?

-any chance that either of your parents have a copy of your birth certificate?

-were you ever added to any house registration? (then it's just a simple issue of getting a new id card issued... once you locate whoever has that house registry book)

-if none of the above, do you at least know what hospital you were born at? there's a chance you might still be on the hospital's "house registry" and were never transferred to another house registry.

-if parents deceased, do you have other relative's who could be intervied by the amphur as witnesses that you are indeed who you say you are, etc., etc.

I should also add that your Thai birth certificate doesn't necessarily have to be the one your parent(s) got for you by presenting your Thai hospital birth documents to the local amphur office a few weeks after you were born. If one or both of your parents are still alive, they can STILL take other legal birth documents (preferably with you in tow) to any Thai embassy or consulate anywhere in the world and they will issue you a Thai birth certificate. For instance for myself, I didn't get a Thai birth certificate until I was 20-21, at the Thai consulate in LA, my parents just presented my State of Texas issued birth registration and my St. David's Hospital (Austin) birth certificate with my parents names on it. I

Hello everyone, new and first post. I was born in Thailand to a Thai mother and an American father. I automatically was a US cititzen. I didn't know that I am considered a Thai citizen also. My half brother, same mother, Thai father, retired recently and moved to Thailand and told me that I receive some kind of ID card every year to a relatives house there in Thailand. We left when I was 8 months old and I haven't been back. I have a photo copy of my Thai/English birth certificate which shows my birth place as City Hospital in Nakhon Ratchasima. I once saw an original House Registration with my name for an Uncle's house in Thailand.

I would like to pursue the Thai citizenship. What is the ID card? What steps do I take to do this? I live in Florida, US. How can I gather information to do this from here? Websites? Online registries?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

[Dakhar]

america charges you tax when you are abroad. that is the obvious reason why people would consider giving it up. personally, i think there are easy ways around hiding money that make it silly to give up your us passport.

The US does charge tax while you are abroad. For most people, this really isn't an issue. If you are working legally in Thailand as a teacher, then you are probably making so little money that you don't actually owe any taxes in the US. If you are working in Thailand with a better paying job, then you are paying higher Thai taxes which are deducted from what you owe the US, which leads to you owing nothing to the US again. If you are working illegally, why do you care? There are cases in which you will have to pay US taxes on top of Thai taxes, but I don't think they are as common as people believe.

Yea, you have to make over 80K USD (+-) before US taxes kick in, and even then the US taxes you on the money earned above the 80K. So you are correct, taxes are a non issue. I paid around 5% tax last year. I was paying over 30% in the US. So yes I eaned more in the US, but I probably saved as much as I do here in THAILAND.

That said, I would still prefer to live in the land of over taxed, and fake smiles than living in Thailand. Life is just a lot more convienient for me there. (subjective, so no reason to argue that)

Edited August 2, 2008 by Dakhar

[barryofthailand]

You're automatically Thai because you have a Thai parent. The general/basic route to Thai citizenship for Thais (whether born abroad or locally) is:

1) acquire Thai birth certificate

2) have name added to local house registry (this can be ANY house registry... but preferably a home belonging to a family member or relative)

3) id card issued (same day as being added to house registry typically)

4) passport made (optional, but convenient)

It can be anything from completely hassle free to somewhat troublesome (at the two steps that count most: steps 1 and 2 above...), but rest assured that with a little patience, you'll eventually get it, and IMO it's well worth it.

Could give you more specific advice if you wouldn't mind providing more details:

-for instance, did your father register your birth?

-any chance that either of your parents have a copy of your birth certificate?

-were you ever added to any house registration? (then it's just a simple issue of getting a new id card issued... once you locate whoever has that house registry book)

-if none of the above, do you at least know what hospital you were born at? there's a chance you might still be on the hospital's "house registry" and were never transferred to another house registry.

-if parents deceased, do you have other relative's who could be intervied by the amphur as witnesses that you are indeed who you say you are, etc., etc.

I should also add that your Thai birth certificate doesn't necessarily have to be the one your parent(s) got for you by presenting your Thai hospital birth documents to the local amphur office a few weeks after you were born. If one or both of your parents are still alive, they can STILL take other legal birth documents (preferably with you in tow) to any Thai embassy or consulate anywhere in the world and they will issue you a Thai birth certificate. For instance for myself, I didn't get a Thai birth certificate until I was 20-21, at the Thai consulate in LA, my parents just presented my State of Texas issued birth registration and my St. David's Hospital (Austin) birth certificate with my parents names on it. I

Hello everyone, new and first post. I was born in Thailand to a Thai mother and an American father. I automatically was a US cititzen. I didn't know that I am considered a Thai citizen also. My half brother, same mother, Thai father, retired recently and moved to Thailand and told me that I receive some kind of ID card every year to a relatives house there in Thailand. We left when I was 8 months old and I haven't been back. I have a photo copy of my Thai/English birth certificate which shows my birth place as City Hospital in Nakhon Ratchasima. I once saw an original House Registration with my name for an Uncle's house in Thailand.

I would like to pursue the Thai citizenship. What is the ID card? What steps do I take to do this? I live in Florida, US. How can I gather information to do this from here? Websites? Online registries?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

Go to a Thai consulate and they will give you all the info on what you have to do. Very easy and can be done from the states.

Barry

[LiveSteam]

Can you believe it, there are 12 million illegal immigrants in the United States now and some of the legal Thai’s want out.

LiveSteam

[Heng]

Hello everyone, new and first post. I was born in Thailand to a Thai mother and an American father. I automatically was a US cititzen. I didn't know that I am considered a Thai citizen also. My half brother, same mother, Thai father, retired recently and moved to Thailand and told me that I receive some kind of ID card every year to a relatives house there in Thailand. We left when I was 8 months old and I haven't been back. I have a photo copy of my Thai/English birth certificate which shows my birth place as City Hospital in Nakhon Ratchasima. I once saw an original House Registration with my name for an Uncle's house in Thailand.

I would like to pursue the Thai citizenship. What is the ID card? What steps do I take to do this? I live in Florida, US. How can I gather information to do this from here? Websites? Online registries?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

The id card mentioned is not THE card that indicates citizenship because you don't get that automatically. You have to actually go to the amphur at age 15 to get that done and issued on the spot, they most certainly don't mail it to you.

You're pretty much a Thai citizen already, you just need the credentials. Stateside you should go with your mom (and dad wouldn't hurt, as some processes require a short interview of "witnesses") to either the Thai consulate-general offices in LA, NYC, or Chicago (I don't know if they have the ability to take care of this at the half dozen or so "honorary" consul offices across the US); or Thai embassy in D.C. with your Thai/English birth certificate -which sounds like just a hospital record- because the official *suthibat* (which you'll need to present at the amphur in Thailand to get your real Thai ID card) is in Thai only. Unless you mean you have a Thai suthibat with the English translation stapled to the back...

Anyhoo, the Thai consulate/embassy can issue you your Thai suthibat (birth certificate) and also a Thai passport, but not a Thai id card. But once you have the birth cert and passport, you can walk into any amphur and have your name added to any house registration (or if you are still in contact with your uncle, you can just go to the amphur office for his house with him and take care of things there), and they'll issue you a Thai ID card. That last step is not necessary if say you have another home in Thailand, perhaps more conveniently located than NR... any amphur office in Bangkok for example if you have a place in Bangkok, as you can be transferred into any house registry from any other house registry without actually having to go to both offices. Having a photocopy of the original house registration (first page and also the page with your name on it) would help.

Note: as most inter-Thais and luk kreungs do, be sure to enter/exit Thailand on your Thai passport and enter/exit the US with your US passport. If they look puzzled as to how you're appearing in Thailand or the US out of *thin air,* just present both passports.

Good luck!

p.s. I'd like to also add that it's easier to get a Thai suthibat issued (years after your birth) at a Thai consulate or embassy abroad than it is at most local amphur offices here. Both are empowered to do so, but the latter tend to be sticklers for the rules... and if your docs are incomplete, torn, with any mispellings, etc. etc. they are known to SOMETIMES slow you down. "Whoa, we can't issue this until you get an official copy from your hospital." And if your hospital no longer exists for instance, you're suddenly in a pothole... which as I've heard, sometimes has to be paved over with a $30 to $50 gratuity... which if you don't execute with proper etiquette (often in a tin of cookies or misc. kanom), can be a permanent pothole at that particular office.

Edited August 2, 2008 by Heng

[PapiRico]

america charges you tax when you are abroad. that is the obvious reason why people would consider giving it up. personally, i think there are easy ways around hiding money that make it silly to give up your us passport.

Thas funny, I havent been charged one cent since i left America 1 year ago, so you got your head on ackwards bro, and they havent touched my bank accounts or anything, and yes being an amercan would be the best option, maybe i dont agree with what america has stood for for the past few years but i am so happy and lucky to have been born is such a country....what if i was born in a 3rd world country or a 5th for that matter, or if i was born english, that would be awful, so yeah I am glad that no matter what I can go back to my country and they will always recieve me with open arms.....this post willmake many of you angry, but hey ots my opinion and you have said someting about americans already, so now deal with it.

[teacup]

Heng

I think the card he mentioned was probably "the national health card”. I have one too somewhere but never used it.

Don’t you have one too, Heng?

[Heng]

Heng

I think the card he mentioned was probably "the national health card”. I have one too somewhere but never used it.

Don’t you have one too, Heng?

Ah yes, Tea. That's probably what it is. I didn't assume it to be so because he mentioned it was being sent to him more than once. I have one as well, I keep it in my wallet tucked behind my "real" insurance card. "30 Baht dtai took rok."

[Heng]

america charges you tax when you are abroad. that is the obvious reason why people would consider giving it up. personally, i think there are easy ways around hiding money that make it silly to give up your us passport.

Thas funny, I havent been charged one cent since i left America 1 year ago, so you got your head on ackwards bro, and they havent touched my bank accounts or anything, and yes being an amercan would be the best option, maybe i dont agree with what america has stood for for the past few years but i am so happy and lucky to have been born is such a country....what if i was born in a 3rd world country or a 5th for that matter, or if i was born english, that would be awful, so yeah I am glad that no matter what I can go back to my country and they will always recieve me with open arms.....this post willmake many of you angry, but hey ots my opinion and you have said someting about americans already, so now deal with it.

They don't "charge" you taxes until they catch you. If you don't have any significant property assets and just "cash" in the bank, than it's probably a non-issue, because very few people have significant amounts of cash without property to match, unless they are involved in illegal businesses (in which cases enough red flags will eventually send you their way anyway). But yeah, if they find you to be owing them, they can most certainly put a lien against your property AND your bank accounts.

But yeah, as for NoSpeakit, I don't think anyone is talking about renouncing their citizenship. Most inter-Thais I know have both.