Does Nok Air Have The Same Legal Problems As 1-2-go?

[misterme]

At DMK today, it was released to me the reasons that Nok Air cut thier flights...

They have only 3 planes flying.

Which to me means only a few possibilities:

*they could have the pilots with falsified documentations

*they could have safety issues with some of thier planes

and have withdrawn all that don't comply in order to keep flying

Or

*financial problems mean that they can only operate 3 planes

Given how secretive the industry is, I'm suspicious that they have the same legal problems that One-Two-Go do. They tried to pawn off thier temporary closure to financial problems, but then it was leaked that they were suspended until they could resolved the safety issues. Nok Air says it was fuel and business levels, but the service cuts resume in November, and all the planes are full NOW.

I'm hoping Thai Visa members can get to the bottom of if there is a cover up or not.

Does anyone know if they still have possession of thier aircraft? Or if they are in need of any re-certification on thier planes or cabin crew? Have they been issued warnings or suspensions? Are there any reports to clarify the facts from the questions?

[lomatopo]

There has been a number of articles, some/all posted here, re: Nok Air and their cut-backs in service.

AFAIK they have nine (9) 737-400's, four (4) of which are leased from TG, which also holds a ~40% share in Nok Air.

There are no legal or safety issues outstanding; they just got hit with the increase in fuel prices and had to re-trench.

I don't think there are any secrets? Perhaps the person you spoke with was misinformed or maybe some sort of language/communication issue?

Can you share the issues causing your apparent consternation?

[lomatopo]

Found this article...from Wed. 30 July 2008, yes only three aircraft flying...

http://www.bangkokpost.com/300708_Business...l2008_biz33.php

AVIATION

Nok's idle 737s rankle lessors

BOONSONG KOSITCHOTETHANA

Nok Airlines' decision to ground six leased Boeing 737-400s as part of its survival plan has led to contractual complications with two global aircraft lessors.

Gecas, part of the US corporate giant General Electric, and the Netherlands-based AerCap, have both insisted that the Thai budget carrier, commonly known as Nok Air, honour the lease deals for the five single-aisle jetliners.

Nok Air is negotiating with the two aircraft lessors to terminate with default charges the five-year contracts which were entered into in 2006, a time when the business prospects of low-cost carriers looked promising.

But Nok Air chief executive Patee Sarasin is optimistic about reaching a settlement with Gecas and AerCap.

''They understand our situation and are unlikely to deal with the issue harshly as Nok Air was on time in paying the lease charge,'' he told the Bangkok Post.

The airline, with 39% ownership by Thai Airways International (THAI), leased four B737-400s from Gecas and one from AerCap. All are being grounded.

Nok Air is only using three of the four B737-400s leased from THAI, partly due to the competitive terms in the contract with the national carrier. The fourth B737-400 leased from THAI is left idle.

Last May the budget airline returned two Boeing 737-800s, a newer aircraft in the B737 family, leased from the British charter airline XL Airways, upon the end of the contract.

Hit by skyrocketing fuel prices, a slowdown in demand, plummeting consumer confidence and mounting losses, Nok Air has recently begun to significantly curtail its operations.

Its flights were slashed to 25 a day, from 79 previously, as the airline is struggling to stay afloat. Management won a major reprieve from shareholders earlier this month by committing to a rehabilitation package that includes cutting salary of senior staff by 20-25% and workers 10%.

Since July of last year, Nok Air has posted a cumulative loss of more than 114 million baht, mainly because of oil prices.

The losses occurred because future ticket sales were priced based on lower crude oil but the oil costs incurred by Nok when the travel was made by passengers were much higher than projected.

Mr Patee reported that the reduced capacity had enabled Nok Air to increase load factor to a high of 90% in the past two weeks.

There should not be any major fallout in terms of reduced consumer confidence arising from the Department of Civil Aviation's order last week to ground the budget airline One-Two-Go and its parent carrier Orient Thai Airlines.

''People perceive us as being closely associated with THAI and that helps with public image,'' he said.

He is cautiously optimistic about the effect of the recent decline in crude oil prices.

''There is light at the end of the tunnel but the problem is we are in the dark as to how long this downtrend will persist,'' he said. ''If crude oil prices were maintained at around $120 a barrel, our chances of breaking even are increased.''

The airline is also assessing the possibility of increasing aircraft utilisation from nine hours a day to 12 if demand warrants, according to Mr Patee.

In the past month, Nok Air increased its fares by 20% to better reflect its higher costs.

[misterme]

Can you share the issues causing your apparent consternation?

My sixth sense tells me somethings wrong here. I thank you for the press releases, but given One-Two-Go's press release to cover up the truth regarding the suspension of thier license, I still have to take the press releases with a grain of salt.

Let's disect what we know and see if it holds the sniff test.

They've parked 6 planes, appearing to be breaking the leases on 5 of the aircraft. The other parked one, from TG, sits unused. but they're still paying the lease. In the press release, they mention that they'd sold tickets and the price of fuel rose between then and the flight dates.

With capacity on domestic flights at about 100% for the next few weeks, they could increase flights, sell tickets at full price, and bring the 4th (TG) aircraft back into service and make profits, but they're not. WHY NOT?

Nok Air is currently charging 2,950+THB DMK-HKT

Air Asia is currently charging 3,300+THB for BKK-HKT

Thai Air is currently charging 3,400+THB for DMK/BKK-HKT

At these prices they could recover thier losses, but instead they leave planes parked on the tarmak.

My theory would agrue that either they cannot fly the planes or they don't have the pilots to fly them. Either they have safety issues with the aircraft, or have lost pilots to false documentation (which I believe to be widespread in Thailand) With 9 planes, asuming they all flew everyday, they'd have to have more than 9 pilots. Now that they're flying only 3 planes, are they rotating pilots? Or are they only flying with the same few?

If my theories are wrong, fine. But if this is a cover-up, aren't people the least bit worried? One-Two-Go got caught flying with improperly licensed cabin crew. Is it a co-incidence that Nok Air drops to flying 3 planes at exactly the same time?

[billp]

Nok Air's safety record is fine. By contrast, 1-2-Go and its parent Orient Thai have long had a terrible reputation among pilots and aviation professionals, long before the crash at Phuket.

Unfortunately, with soaring fuel prices, some low cost carriers are losing money with every flight. So it makes sense to ground their less economical aircraft, lay off personnel, keep only a shoestring service in operation and wait for better times.

[tw25rw]

You would hope that a benefit of being part of Thai Airlines and having former air force officers as senior management was that planes are well maintained and that pilots had the right credentials. It tends to be business decisions where they suddenly become hard of thinking.

[lomatopo]

My sixth sense tells me somethings wrong here.

If my theories are wrong, fine.

Sixth sense? Theories? Both wrong. Move on.

[misterme]

I will move on.

Good of you to drum up 2 newspaper articles before declaring my theory wrong. Dispite finding any evidence to support your statements, you obviously trust the govenment monitored press relaeases.

Of many buletin boards to bring my questions to, I thought Thai Visa had the best chance of getting to the bottom this issue. A potentially damaging coverup, exposed. I would still encourage discussion to improve the safety of air travel in Thailand.

As I find out more information, I'll bring it here to hash out.

[percy2]

What's your motivation for your investigation?

Cheers