800.000 Due Nov.but € Low Now. How To Push Out Payment?

[THAIPHUKET]

I should have 800.000 in my bank account on Nov 3. to meet visa requirements of 3 mos ahead of expiry.

Not keen to convert € into THB now, may be better in couple of months the € will perhaps have recovered because less hysteria. A gamble which I would make

Plus given what is happening to banks around the world it is not inconceivable that a Thai bank may be hit too. And then my money would be stuck.

Any clever and legal suggestion how to push out the due date of the 800.000?

[Mario2008]

No. But there are 3 ways to meet the requirements:

1. 800,000 baht on a Thai bank

2. 65,000 incoem a month

3. a combination of both, for example 400,000 at the bank and an income of 32,500 a mont.

[samuibeachcomber]

If this is the first extension of your retirement visa ,my understanding is you have to transfer money 3 months before extension is due.However after your first extension the required amount does not have to transferred until one month before .

[GungaDin]

Similar thread here: http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Aussie-Dollar-t216382.html

[Mario2008]

The rules are clear, it has yo be in a Thai bank for 3 months. But it is indeed true that one of the immigration offices, I believe Phuket, currently has a more liberal interpretation of the rules. As this is not according to the offical rules they can change that policy any moment. That is the risk you would take.

Edit:

should read Phuket.

Edited October 7, 2008 by Mario2008

[ubonjoe]

I should have 800.000 in my bank account on Nov 3. to meet visa requirements of 3 mos ahead of expiry.

Not keen to convert € into THB now, may be better in couple of months the € will perhaps have recovered because less hysteria. A gamble which I would make

Plus given what is happening to banks around the world it is not inconceivable that a Thai bank may be hit too. And then my money would be stuck.

Any clever and legal suggestion how to push out the due date of the 800.000?

If you put it into to any of the larger banks. I don't think you have to worry about them folding.

You can put it into a CD which pays better interest than a savings account.

What the baht does in relation to any currency would be a guess.

According to the rules it has to be in bank for 3 months. As someone mentioned this has been discussed on other threads.

All I can say is that I would follow the better safe than sorry rule.

[samuibeachcomber]

I stand corrected then.When i went to Samui immigration for my 3rd 90 day report i asked them if i needed my money in A/C 3 months before renewing my retirement visa(2nd year of renewing)and they said no,just 1 month before.

I had heard it was only the first time of getting an extention that the money needed to be in a/c 3 months before.

[Lite Beer]

I stand corrected then.When i went to Samui immigration for my 3rd 90 day report i asked them if i needed my money in A/C 3 months before renewing my retirement visa(2nd year of renewing)and they said no,just 1 month before.

I had heard it was only the first time of getting an extention that the money needed to be in a/c 3 months before.

Every Immigration Office will have a different requirement. Especially Samui who are a law unto themselves.

[janchangtha]

I should have 800.000 in my bank account on Nov 3. to meet visa requirements of 3 mos ahead of expiry.

Not keen to convert € into THB now, may be better in couple of months the € will perhaps have recovered because less hysteria. A gamble which I would make

Plus given what is happening to banks around the world it is not inconceivable that a Thai bank may be hit too. And then my money would be stuck.

Any clever and legal suggestion how to push out the due date of the 800.000?

Why not open a foreign currency deposit account? Then your money is in a Thai bank, but remains in Euros until withdrawn.

Not sure if Immigration will accept that. Try Bank of Auydhya, easy to open account. Just U$ 500 mimimum initial deposit and balance.

http://www.krungsri.com/eng/personal_tranfer05.htm#02

[astral]

Any clever and legal suggestion how to push out the due date of the 800.000?

Keep your money where you feel safe.

That is probably the most important factor in the present situation.

You can check if you local immigration office will accept a Euro deposit in a Thai bank.

If not then in February go to one of the neighbouring countries and get a new Non Imm O visa.

Then apply to have that extended 3 months later, April/May 2009.

As you are retired you have no prospect of PR, so keeping a continuous record of yearly

extensions is not an issue.

[THAIPHUKET]

I blindfolded myself, got too focused on how to handle the fx/bank exposure.

To prove pension income of 65.000THB is the easiest route to go.

Thereby I can manage the exchange of €/THB as I see fit my actual expenses.

As long as the intern. payment systems don´t fail, ATMs may be worth the extra expense, depending on how dicy things get.

The foreign currency account is a helpful suggestion -in any event.

thanks a lot to everyone

[longball53098]

:D

I’ve been reading this string of posts as well as several others related to the retirement extension monetary requirements. I’ve come to the conclusion that most people have a great deal of difficulty wanting to put the required 800k into a Thai bank and keeping that money topped up every year at renewal time.

It seems everyone obviously has the funds but for one reason or another they hesitate to bring it into Thailand but they do it because of the requirement to show 800k in the bank.

For many of us we choose to use the income letter showing our income of 65k or more coming to us from abroad into a Thai bank. We validate this money by showing a letter to Immigration and a bankbook that we have a local account to use for our living expenses.

Many of the folks that have the 800 k in the bank will also say they do not have any income so getting a letter proving income is not possible. Well I may suggest that it is possible to show income if you do what I think may work for income. Of course all the critics will say it won’t work or this idea won’t work for “me”. I don’t know what can or will work for everyone. I only throw this idea out for consumption and the possibilities.

I certainly don’t know all the requirements of all the Embassies regarding the “income letter”. I can say I know the US system regarding the letter of income. For us to receive this notarized letter all that is necessary is for us to stand in front of a consulate rep and swear that the information we provide on this affidavit is true and correct.

The most important sentence for me on this affidavit is that I swear the funds I receive monthly from the US Government and/or other sources is equal to $XX.xx dollars. The wording does not specify what the source is. It does not say pensions or any other specific thing. It only states “other sources”.

Now taking that wording and using it to your advantage we should see that if you have a bank account in the USA and you have money in that account that can be transferred to Thailand a person could legitimately set up a regular transfer system from this USA bank account to the Thai bank account. The transfer method could be an ATM withdrawal and then deposit to a local bank or a swift transfer the goal is the same and that is to show a regular income of the required funds. This method would satisfy the requirement of having the needed 65k a month income for the retirement extension. Immigration does not care what the source of the funds is. They do not care if it is from a pension, investment income, or a business in the US or whatever. They only want proof that the applicant has at least 65k a month coming in to live here in LOS.

For all the folks that do not want to invest 800k here, keep the funds at home and draw on them monthly or bi-monthly or whatever. Get your income letter from the consulate and swear that you have that income. You’re not lying. I’m thinking this may be one way that someone can show an income from their home country. As I said earlier I don’t know the other countries letter of income and what proof you need to show funds for your consulate to certify your income so maybe my idea is bust but just food for thought.

I think if a person gets creative a solution to the guaranteed income and funds in the bank can be found.

[Lite Beer]

The majority of Consulates require some kind of proof of the income . It's only the USA that hands this out without any proof.

Also a regular Swift transfer would not be very cost affective at £20/30 a time.

[astral]

For many of us we choose to use the income letter showing our income of 65k or more coming to us from abroad into a Thai bank.

We validate this money by showing a letter to Immigration and a bankbook that we have a local account to use for our living expenses.

Are you reading in more than is actually there??

The Order of the Royal Thai Police Headquarters http://www.immigration.go.th/nov2004/2notice/rtp606EN.pdf

states:

Section 7.21

(3) Proof of income of not less than Baht 65,000 per month

I don't see anything that says that money has to be remitted to a Thai bank.

Just prove to your embassy that you have the income and they will issue the letter.

As to how to set up that income.

Place your assets in an Insurance policy, such as the Executive Investment Bond with Royal Skandia

and instruct them to pay you a monthly income.

[torrenova]

Surely you could just have some money go from one UK account to another each month (and back again if you want) and show them only one account statement ?

[Martian]

This is the first time I have heard one needs a bank book showing the income coming in if using the "letter from embassy" method to show 65K a month income. After all, unless someone just doesn't have the lump sum 800K at the moment they want to do the retirement visa thing, why would anyone who is afraid to do a lump sum 800K deposit for 3 months turn around and transfer 65K every month for a year ending up with 780K coming in.

My point is if you have to show 65K coming in to a Thai bank account every month (not just proof of having the income) then you are just as exposed to whatever risk, possibly more than you see by depositing 800K for 3 months and going that route. 800K for three months, withdraw and place back into a high yield account 9 months, then do it again. Depending upon your banking arrangements you would have to run the numbers on what is best for you in the long run. Either doing all the transferring or just leave it sitting in the lower yield account, considering risk of course. Someone mentioned it might be ok to place into time deposit or CD's as they are called in the USA. some doubt it will work while others claim it does.

Regards,

Martian

[Martian]

For many of us we choose to use the income letter showing our income of 65k or more coming to us from abroad into a Thai bank.

We validate this money by showing a letter to Immigration and a bankbook that we have a local account to use for our living expenses.

Are you reading in more than is actually there??

The Order of the Royal Thai Police Headquarters http://www.immigration.go.th/nov2004/2notice/rtp606EN.pdf

states:

Section 7.21

(3) Proof of income of not less than Baht 65,000 per month

I don't see anything that says that money has to be remitted to a Thai bank.

Just prove to your embassy that you have the income and they will issue the letter.

As to how to set up that income.

Place your assets in an Insurance policy, such as the Executive Investment Bond with Royal Skandia

and instruct them to pay you a monthly income.

If you are speaking of something like an annuity, in the USA (not sure about other countries) annuities are not covered by FDIC or other insurance like CD's and savings accounts. So, if the insurance company fails, bye, bye money. Quite a risk in today's financial markets.

I looked at this as a means to meet the 40k per month requirement when married to a Thai. The whole no-insurance risk shot that idea down quickly.

Regards,

Martian

[K2K]

Wise advice there Martian - last place I'd want my money now is with an insurance company - another $38 bil to AIG last night and who's next? Metlife? and European insureres are in potentially even worse shape than the US.

I'll add as well - this talk of this or that immigration office being 'flexible' with interpretation of clearly stated (in Police Order 606) requirements is playing a lottery. What happens when Khun Big Boss Immigration Official gets shipped off to another province as happens every 2 years and his replacement is less accomodating - or they get some directive from Bangkok to tighten things up - then by risk of a few Baht, yon could end up in a bad situation.

Follow the rules, keep them (immigration) happy!

[longball53098]

The majority of Consulates require some kind of proof of the income . It's only the USA that hands this out without any proof.

Also a regular Swift transfer would not be very cost affective at £20/30 a time.

When I say "regular" transfer that could be as few as twice a year and some folks may choose the ATM method.

[ubonjoe]

The majority of Consulates require some kind of proof of the income . It's only the USA that hands this out without any proof.

Also a regular Swift transfer would not be very cost affective at £20/30 a time.

I take issue with this statement.

The US consulate hands out nothing.

You make a sworn statement before a consulate officer. Making a false satement to an officer is a US federal crime. You could be charged, extadited and jailed for this.

Edited October 9, 2008 by ubonjoe

[Lite Beer]

The majority of Consulates require some kind of proof of the income . It's only the USA that hands this out without any proof.

Also a regular Swift transfer would not be very cost affective at £20/30 a time.

I take issue with this statement.

The US consulate hands out nothing.

You make a sworn statement before a consulate officer. Making a false satement to an officer is a US federal crime. You could be charged, extadited and jailed for this.

No proof is needed and Thai Immigration know this.

[Carib]

The majority of Consulates require some kind of proof of the income . It's only the USA that hands this out without any proof.

Also a regular Swift transfer would not be very cost affective at £20/30 a time.

I take issue with this statement.

The US consulate hands out nothing.

You make a sworn statement before a consulate officer. Making a false satement to an officer is a US federal crime. You could be charged, extadited and jailed for this.

Ubonjoe, you make take issue on this, but I know a few guys who absolutely don`t.

Like you say, you `could` be charged, and that is why they do it, without any second thoughts.

Ever heard of anyone who was charged?

I am not saying they are right, in fact they could get into trouble because of lack of funds...that is the reason they lie.

[jfchandler]

A couple of points here...

1. The prior post about Foreign Currency Deposit Account offered by Bank of Ayudhya was interesting. The account looks pretty easy to open, not many min bal limits or fees, and allows you to keep your currency in U.S $ or 8 other currencies. And you have the option of savings, current or time accounts. For expats or tourists, looks like nothing more than a passport to open is required...

When I first arrived here, I talked to HSBC in BKK about their foreign currency accounts and, once I understood their set-up, I bailed out. They had high min balances and went crazy charging recurring fees for everything under the sun. By comparison, B of Ayud looks great...

However, THE QUESTION is.... does anyone have any knowledge or experience about whether using that kind of account is considered to satisfy the immigration 800,000 baht retirement funds requirement. B of Ayudhya certainly is a THAI bank... But your balance wouldn't show in baht, I'd presume, but rather in $ or whatever... So???

And 2.... The prior discussion above about the 65,000 baht (or portion thereof) monthly income requirement got me a bit confused.

Apart from showing immigration a document letter from your embassy verifying the income, a person DOES or DOES NOT have to also show immigration a Thai bank account book showing that amount of funds (65,000 or some portion) coming into their Thai (or other) bank account each month???

Of course, it would be much easier to document the income via letter and just leave the funds in one's home country/bank... especially if you don't need 65,000 baht each month for your living expenses. What's the requirement about that??

3. For purposes of Thai immigration and the 800,000, what exactly constitutes a Thai bank???? Of course, regular Thai banks are obvious like BKKB and SCB.... But what about others like HSBC or Standard Chartered and the rest, which operate and have offices here in Thailand???

Thanks much....

[ubonjoe]

However, THE QUESTION is.... does anyone have any knowledge or experience about whether using that kind of account is considered to satisfy the immigration 800,000 baht retirement funds requirement. B of Ayudhya certainly is a THAI bank... But your balance wouldn't show in baht, I'd presume, but rather in $ or whatever... So???

Question has been asked before but no answer. A check with immigration would be usefull.

Apart from showing immigration a document letter from your embassy verifying the income, a person DOES or DOES NOT have to also show immigration a Thai bank account book showing that amount of funds (65,000 or some portion) coming into their Thai (or other) bank account each month???

Does not. But some immigration offices are reported to be wanting to see a bank book. I think just to see if you have money. (Chang Mai is one)

Of course, it would be much easier to document the income via letter and just leave the funds in one's home country/bank... especially if you don't need 65,000 baht each month for your living expenses. What's the requirement about that??

None that I know of.

3. For purposes of Thai immigration and the 800,000, what exactly constitutes a Thai bank???? Of course, regular Thai banks are obvious like BKKB and SCB.... But what about others like HSBC or Standard Chartered and the rest, which operate and have offices here in Thailand???

Another good question. Anybody have the answer. Immigration maybe.

Thanks much....

I wonder if an email to immigration with the above questions about banking would result in a reply? That would put them on written record rather than a verbal which is worthless.

[astral]

As I understand it, if you take the income route, it is up to your Embassy to verify the details,

or not, as in the case of the USA.

Immigration will certainly want to see a bank book with some money in it, but NOT the full 65K a month.

As for the Investment funds, if you choose a location with good financial regulation, then you should

be able to sleep soundly.

[dotcom]

Any clever and legal suggestion how to push out the due date of the 800.000?

Keep your money where you feel safe.

That is probably the most important factor in the present situation.

You can check if you local immigration office will accept a Euro deposit in a Thai bank.

If not then in February go to one of the neighbouring countries and get a new Non Imm O visa.

Then apply to have that extended 3 months later, April/May 2009.

As you are retired you have no prospect of PR, so keeping a continuous record of yearly

extensions is not an issue.

Astral. What is PR? Thanks

[Lite Beer]

Astral. What is PR? Thanks

Permanent Residence

[jfchandler]

A couple of points here...

3. For purposes of Thai immigration and the 800,000, what exactly constitutes a Thai bank???? Of course, regular Thai banks are obvious like BKKB and SCB.... But what about others like HSBC or Standard Chartered and the rest, which operate and have offices here in Thailand???

So on the point above, I re-read the 2006 police order language cited above. And it doesn't say the money must be in a "Thai bank". It says the money must be on deposit "with a bank in Thailand". So, I presume, that means in the Thailand branches of non-Thai native banks like HSBC and Standard Chartered would be fine...

That still doesn't answer, however, whether the required funds have to be denominated in baht, or alternatively, could they be in a foreign currency deposit account held here.... Someone's got to have tried or done this before...

[torrenova]

This is the first time I have heard one needs a bank book showing the income coming in if using the "letter from embassy" method to show 65K a month income. After all, unless someone just doesn't have the lump sum 800K at the moment they want to do the retirement visa thing, why would anyone who is afraid to do a lump sum 800K deposit for 3 months turn around and transfer 65K every month for a year ending up with 780K coming in.

My point is if you have to show 65K coming in to a Thai bank account every month (not just proof of having the income) then you are just as exposed to whatever risk, possibly more than you see by depositing 800K for 3 months and going that route. 800K for three months, withdraw and place back into a high yield account 9 months, then do it again. Depending upon your banking arrangements you would have to run the numbers on what is best for you in the long run. Either doing all the transferring or just leave it sitting in the lower yield account, considering risk of course. Someone mentioned it might be ok to place into time deposit or CD's as they are called in the USA. some doubt it will work while others claim it does.

Regards,

Martian

I disagree. If you have the 800k in a Thai bank for 3 months then you are exposed to the whole 800k. If you have 65k coming in each month then you are only exposed to the excess over your spending to the 65k limit. Thus, if you spend 50k a month, your exposure is 15k multiplied by the number of months you retain that 15k in the bank.

In fact, the 800k issue is not right either. As I understand it, you have to have 800k untouched for 3 months. Thus, what do you live on for 3 months ? If you spend 50k a month, you actually need 950k over that 3 month period.

[torrenova]

The majority of Consulates require some kind of proof of the income . It's only the USA that hands this out without any proof.

Also a regular Swift transfer would not be very cost affective at £20/30 a time.

I take issue with this statement.

The US consulate hands out nothing.

You make a sworn statement before a consulate officer. Making a false satement to an officer is a US federal crime. You could be charged, extadited and jailed for this.

You may take issue with it but it does not change the fact that it is a joke, albeit a very useful one, for people living here. I would use it without a care in the world if I was a US citizen. If you think the US has nothing better to do than chase people who tell some insignificant porkies under oath then you should have a look at the country at large and see where the real problems lie.