Suvarnabhumi PAD Protest Continues

[Danton]

Letter from PAD Supporter to Clarify Rally

โดย ASTVผู้จัดการออนไลน์ 29 พฤศจิกายน 2551 13:26 น. - MANAGER ONLINE -

On November 26, a young woman, dressed in a yellow shirt, was seen walking around the PAD rally site at Suvarnabhumi Airport, distributing a message in English to help clarify the PAD rally.

This is to clarify the situation here in Thailand as I believe the foreign press have formed the conclusion that the PAD has little chance of winning this final battle to topple the Nominee Government of Somchai Wongsawat, the brother-in-law of former PM Thaksin Shinawatra.

Before I say anything else, I'd like to stress here the the PAD's policy is to use ONLY peaceful means and we have proved our intention by using only reason for the last six months. However, the continuous and nearly daily violence and murderous acts committed against us have come from either the Government, or its representatives, the red-shirted United Frong of Democracy against Dictatorship, which are trying everything in their power to pave the way for the return of Thaksin Shinawatra to become the first President of Thailand.

The aim of the PAD is to rebuild a country based on integrity, honesty, freedom from corruption and fairness from all Thais: all this together with the absolute determination to maintain and honour the Monarchy. We have the most wonderful and exceptional King who has reigned over his people with wisdom and love as the rest of the world is well aware.

Practically the whole of Thailand from all walks of life has converged onto Bangkok to support the PAD. We are not being paid to be here to use violence to get our way. We are not here to support a handful of corrupt politicians serving only one man who wants to divide our country. But we are here by choice, we are here to share an ideal, we are here to realize our goal which is to rebuild our country into a better place for the 60-odd million citizens. It's actually not a question of "winning or losing" -- it's the reality of achieving what is good and right for our country -- Thailand.

How many lies can you pack in a few lines ?

The end is nigh and they know it.

[Nampeung]

Do you have time to look at this http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=15xoq8uYdIE

and please this http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=qz5nHpznnnc&...feature=related

[bulmercke]

Explosion at Govt House Injures 51, 4 Critically - THAILAND OUTLOOK -

UPDATE : 30 November 2008 07:50

Updates have come in about the number of those injured in last night's bomb attack at the PAD rally at Government House. 51 are said to be injured with four in critical condition.

Similar bomb attacks also happened at the ASTV office and the PAD rally site at Don Muang Airport but no injuries were reported.

[RenzoInOz]

[/quote

Homer needs to come here and rung the show.

Just some quick thoughts.

Maybe we have a power vacuum causing this or at least adding to the trouble.

While most of the generals, but not all would back the red, the vast majority of the foot solders back the red.

The police too are split.

This is not a joke and the disagreements are real and profound.

Joking about this would make you feel bad if you woke up to Find a thousand dead in a fight in the future.

If Thailand rejects democracy it will for sure be hit with huge trade tariffs from nations.

The economy is imploding.

I hope for the best but fear from the worst.

Well put!

There IS a complete power vacuum. Somchai has done nothing preferring to "relax" (according to my wife's translation of an interview she watched online this morning) in Chiang Mai while Yellow Rabble from People Against Democracy are destroying property, kidnapping, attacking police and trespassing (and openly lying by saying we're doing everything 'only peacefully' as a previous post stated)... Somchai says he has done nothing wrong. What he didn't explain is that it is hard to do something wrong if you don't do anything in the first place. Trouble is, if he quits, as he rightly should, it looks like these disloyal, self-serving 'treasonistas' at the airport have won.

Somchai and his mob are utterly spineless, weak and pathetic. This is a time when strong leadership is required. Somchai's style is to go into hiding miles away, covering under a blanket....

[Nampeung]

ALL of you out there look at these two videos and then tell me that PAD ARE WRONG... go on... one of you talk to me nah kha

[onlooker]

Chamlong said from now on, PAD volunteer guards will monitor the movement of the police and military officers who are taking care of security for the PAD rally sites to make sure they are doing their duty

Be interesting to know what their duty actually was. Even more interesting to know who was giving the orders.

[Koo82]

everything in Thailand is based on corruption . If you want to turn that around , then you need to change the way people think about money . The only way to get corrution out of the way is get people earn enough money on a fair basis so morallety ( don't know if the english writing is correct ) can step in .

This was what Khun Thaksin did. He said the government people must be selected from best students for instance and well paid, so they are proud of the job and never think of under table money.

He forced government officers to have their review test each year. Who couldn't pass would be fired. They couldn't just slowly go up to level 11 like before whether they did anything or just sat down waiting for salary.

They hate Khun Thaksin for that.

[Nampeung]

Go on answer me you lot, have a look at these two videos of what really hapens in Thailand when things kick off and then talk... give it your best boys

[fauxie]

OK - it sounds like angry farmers with pitchforks and factory workers with hammers & crowbars. Determined not to be intimidated by police & other govt security forces perhaps, but not exactly a blood-crazed killing machine bound for armageddon... I'm truly non-partisan to all this, but all this talk of these brutal PAD death-squads is making me wonder...

Well exactly. I'm non-partisan too. Not a blood-crazed killing machine, but certainly it's not just a 'sit-in' protest. The truth would seem to lie somewhere in the middle. They're not blowing things up and sabotaging the airport, but they are being proactive as far going after the police. The kidnappings, stealing riot shields, puncturing tyres, chasing down police and taking checkpoints, are all things they are going out of their way to do. It's preemptive action aimed at disrupting and slowing down the police trying to evict them. If we can agree that the term 'terrorists' is not justifiable I think it's fair to say that calling the PAD 'peaceful protesters' is no longer tenable.

[Koo82]

I am very sorry for the people who now are out-of-work because of the desier for power from a few people.

They are paying others to do thier dirty work to get the power.

The police or army have to end this madness.

Herman

Now Police said they don't have enough man power.

Army don't want to do a shesh.

Surprised no one has filed a court case to Army Chief General Anupong for not supporting the government to clear terrorists. Someone was excellent that they brought to court that Khun Samak cooked on tv as an employee. He was not an employee in that cooking show. Stupid people based on the dictionary to accuse he was an employee.

[phupaman]

Hi All.

Lots of criticism of PAD lately,That is understandable, but think what is ahead of you with no PAD

Thaksin back with a vengeance,the slate wiped clean,all high ranking officers and officials in every dept of Government who do not agree with everything he says, OUT.

All checks and balances abolished,not needed,Thaksin knows best, Then what ? A new drugs war to get rid of more people who murmer anything against him?,A prgramme put in place for a one party state TRT,etc etc etc , not a very nice scenario is it.

Well done the PAD for standing up against this Tyrant and his proxy Gov, bought with money stolen from the Thai people, I hope PAD are successful.

phupaman

[groovyc]

Chamlong said from now on, PAD volunteer guards will monitor the movement of the police and military officers who are taking care of security for the PAD rally sites to make sure they are doing their duty.

ha????????????

[hammered]

Unfortunately the PAD aren't exactly peaceful, so Tropo does have a point!!!

Brit, you are a top bloke on ThaiVisa and a gentleman, but we disagree about violence. I agree the PAD aren't exactly peaceful, so Tropo does have a point. But PAD has been almost perfectly nonviolent. You seem to have been calling for weeks or years now for violent solution to this nearly perfectly peaceful protest. All of you who call for violence in Thailand have a double standard if you expect the honorable opposition to stand by and be slaughtered like the faithful Indians who followed Gandhi. This is not India in 1939. Takin's goons killed in cold blood in Chiang Mai this month, so the possible scaring away of armed policeman is simply an episode of the Keystone Cops. We have probably seen far more violence at a rock concert, than PAD has done against the bloody violent thugs who are on Taksin's side.

You cannot be serious.I have always respected your fairness and balance, but this is absurd.In all seriousness it's a losing game to try and distinguish between rival sets of street thugs.I have no doubt there are some UDD people in this category.Don't forget also -so far- the UDD rallies have been models of restraint.Of course one recognises that there are many good natured and rightly outraged PAD members, but at the same time there is a disgusting number of violent thugs.

I loathe the PAD leadership,which has disgraced the country - far worse than Thaksin, but never call for violence.Indeed I sincerely regret violence on all sides.

Incidentally you should learn some history.Gandhi's followers were never slaughtered in the independence struggle.That's because the colonial masters were the British who despite their hypocrisy and racialism were capable of being shamed, possessors of a basic decency.Imagine if the colonial masters had been the Japanese or Germans (or French for that matter).

YH while not wanting to get into a study on comparative street violence, it does have to be said that the red side/UDD/province defence groups have not exactly been a model of restraint at their rallies: Udon, Bangkok in the famous long march before the clash, and of course Chiang Mai this week. There are also lesser reported incidents of attacks on Santi Asoke buildings by the red side.

One thing that occasionally gets mentioned on the international reports is that consdiering th level of division, hatred, vitriol etc that the actual casualty figures remain relatively low, which we should be thankful for although the bomb attacks seem to be raising this right now.

One things that needs to be mentioned is that the "Bomb attacks" are decidedly one way. Haven't seen a PAD Granny hurling an M79 at the UDD yet. The PAD has also not unveiled their "Tossing a hand grenade dance".

That being said, the ineptness of the Thai police to handle this situation is amazing. Give me 100 guys, 10 fire trucks with hoses, and body armor, and I'll have that airport cleared out in an hour.

We will probably never know who actually launches the grenades. However, public perception is that it is organised by the government side.

[groovyc]

Hi All.

Lots of criticism of PAD lately,That is understandable, but think what is ahead of you with no PAD

Thaksin back with a vengeance,the slate wiped clean,all high ranking officers and officials in every dept of Government who do not agree with everything he says, OUT.

All checks and balances abolished,not needed,Thaksin knows best, Then what ? A new drugs war to get rid of more people who murmer anything against him?,A prgramme put in place for a one party state TRT,etc etc etc , not a very nice scenario is it.

Well done the PAD for standing up against this Tyrant and his proxy Gov, bought with money stolen from the Thai people, I hope PAD are successful.

phupaman

You forgot to mention one thing: I hope the constitution gets amended so that the perpetrators of the previous group are brought to justice.

[Koo82]

woman with her foot blown off on Oct 7th

How could someone lost her foot when the police used tear gas? What did they do that the police had to use tear gas? Answer please.

I've heard no talks about that woman since then. Where is she now?

Is this poster for real?

Koo82: Please, read some news once in a while, watch some news programs, something...that isn't just more of the Thaksin Kool Aid...if you did, you might have known about the teargas grenades of military grade that blow peoples limbs off and killed one unarmed young woman during the 7 Oct clash.

Tv showed that the Police brought the tear gas they used on 7 Oct to test after being blamed. Not strong enough to tear a sheet of paper.

So, you broke into my house. If I fight with you, I'm wrong.

[chutai]

Incidentally you should learn some history.Gandhi's followers were never slaughtered in the independence struggle.That's because the colonial masters were the British who despite their hypocrisy and racialism were capable of being shamed, possessors of a basic decency.

You should take off your union jack glasses mate. In 1919 ,General Reginald Dyer ordered a platoon of soldiers of the Baluch Regiment to open fire on the unarmed crowd, killing some 380 and wounding 1,500. There were plenty of other instances of sometimes murderous British repression during the struggle for independence too.

There's also this policy as formulated by Churchill that you should also take into consideration"

In 1940, Winston Churchill hoped that Hindu-Muslim antagonism would remain “a bulwark of British rule in India.” Certainly Churchill, who did not want his views on India to be “disturbed by any bloody Indians” . Not much jolly old British decency there I think.

But nevertheless, Gandhi for all his human frailties, is a fine role model for those wishing to resist oppression. Although it must be said that the PAD are anything but standing for civil rights.

[tropo]

I am serious. I personally and consistently condemn the use of violence by everybody, everywhere, always, regardless.

I don't share your enthusiasm for non-violence.

It's easy for a lot of us to sit in our quiet little houses in some peaceful corner of the world and condemn violence, but most freedom and free societies were purchased at the price of bloodshed and violence. The Americans tried doing things your way in 1941. It was a disaster. There was no way to be free from the aggressor (Japanese) without undertaking a fierce and protacted violent war costing millions of lives. Of course this is only one example of many throughout history.

The Americans forgot the famous words of Patrick Henry in 1775 and it cost them dearly.

This speech is one of my favourites:

"If we wish to be free -- if we mean to preserve inviolate those inestimable privileges for which we have been so long contending--if we mean not basely to abandon the noble struggle in which we have been so long engaged, and which we have pledged ourselves never to abandon until the glorious object of our contest shall be obtained--we must fight! I repeat it, sir, we must fight! An appeal to arms and to the God of hosts is all that is left us! ......

Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it, Almighty God! I know not what course others may take; but as for me, give me liberty or give me death!"

In Thailand's case, the aggressors are PAD thugs. The weaker the government's response, the worse things are going to get. Sadly I'm starting to lose any ounce of confidence I had that the government might prevail. They just haven't learnt from history that playing too nicely doesn't always get the job done. They need to be strong, but instead they show only weakness.

Edited November 30, 2008 by tropo

[Nampeung]

Please read post 814 and tell us what you think

[marshbags]

A live present time observation

My wifes just been to a rememberance paying respect ect. for a locals father who died a short while ago.

She was seated at a table with several people including the Moo Ban Puyai.

The conversation was started regarding the demo,s and while the views where varied and sensible, the exception was the Moo Ban Puyai.

Apart from him it was agreed that the red shirts violent offerings where not good at all.

All agreed it was not good for Thailand to cause the protest at the airports, but thought their was no other way now, as the government had created the last stand situation instead of negotiating an agreement long ago and dropping the constitutional objectives they desperately want to enforce.

Again all said Thaksin should now keep quiet and stop inciting the red shirts to do their dirty work on his behalf, especially the violence, bombing ect that was / is causing harm to it,s citizens.

The Moo Ban Puyai finished leaving the table and his food and moving away from the group in a state of real anger.

He also said before he got wound up, that the local government had instructed ALL Moo Ban Puyia that they had to advise / announce that everyone should wear a yellow T shirt tomorrow and he said he hates the yellow T shirts and wants to wear a red one ( but cannot as he has been told otherwise. )

He and his chosen few have, as i previously posted somewhere in the last 4 months been given 2 x 400,000 baht contributions to supposedly create benefits for the whole community.

The first one has gone with no such benefits to the Moo Ban and has been greedily consumed by the chosen few, and disappeared completely with nothing to show anywhere ???????

The second one is in the process of adding an extension to one of the more favoured ones of the group to provide a shop for future OTOP benefits for the community.

This will be her 3rd such improvement to her property which includes raising the house above the flood levels that happen every year.

As with all previous contributions this will be, in practice, a way of rewarding the Thaksin advisors and doers for services rendered after the sum is taken out for the extension.

This is fact and not bullshit, in the real world of the North East Thailand where the genuine poor and weaker members are continually abused and forgotten, apart from election times of course.

May the objectives of those who oppose these unethical, self rewarding practices be soon achieved and that they may safely come out of what could take place anytime in the next day or two, victorious in their endeavours to stop the years of Puyai / Government abuse and pillaging that has taken place since Thaksin promised the Thai loves Thai concept prior to the TRT being initially elected.

I / We, where all sucked in with the bullshit he promised ALL Thai voters prior to being elected, he also bought off his famous / infamous, honest / dishonest mistake WAF joke that was.

Now all the criminal fugitive wants to do is destroy the country and the citizens who placed their faith in his numerous broken pledges and promises.

WAF evil self serving piece of garbage he has shown himself and his party / parties to be !!!!!!!!!!!!

marshbags

P.S. this MooBan is like most others in this area, dominated and run by Thaksins self serving scum !!!!!!!!!

Was anyway ???????????

Edited November 30, 2008 by marshbags

[hammered]

woman with her foot blown off on Oct 7th

How could someone lost her foot when the police used tear gas? What did they do that the police had to use tear gas? Answer please.

I've heard no talks about that woman since then. Where is she now?

Is this poster for real?

Koo82: Please, read some news once in a while, watch some news programs, something...that isn't just more of the Thaksin Kool Aid...if you did, you might have known about the teargas grenades of military grade that blow peoples limbs off and killed one unarmed young woman during the 7 Oct clash.

Tv showed that the Police brought the tear gas they used on 7 Oct to test after being blamed. Not strong enough to tear a sheet of paper.

So, you broke into my house. If I fight with you, I'm wrong.

Independent forensic tests showed Angkhana was killed when hit by an explosive tear gas canister. That seems to be widely accepted as the result of death atcually.

[PeaceBlondie]

But PAD has been almost perfectly nonviolent.

A pretty weak argument. There was an insidious change in PAD's demeanor when they started carrying golf clubs, metal rods, clubs, etc. months ago. Serious lethal weapons (guns, ammunition, knives, etc.) have been found on their "peaceful guards" for at least a month now. The final straw for me was watching armed PAD gunmen, gunning down people in the streets last week near Don Muang Airport. Then the "fight to the death" rhetoric from their rabid leaders. Then, the temporary abduction of a police officer, and the ugly scene described above.

In my book, they've lost all credibility in the "Peaceful" category.

Your "has been almost perfectly" description is currently in tatters, and has been for several months now.

Nevertheless, I back "necessary force" using common western methods of riot control (which we have yet to see here); non-lethal but persuasive. It appears the Thai police and military have an "all or near'nothing" approach to this problem.

Vexing indeed.

Toptuan, my fellow teacher of English, I agree. I used the present perfect and qualifiers, but should have emphasized that it has passed. PAD has changed. I should have said, it had been - almost perfectly nonviolent - in the more distant past, not the present. The wikipeda article on Sondhi using civil disobedience in Thailand needs to be updated.

[Koo82]

Wake up! EVERY party bought votes. They couldn't win after buying votes so now they support the PAD to pull the PPP.

Sondhi is having 200 years in jail waiting. He has nothing to lose so he just fights like a rat.

Apart from the fact that he isn't sentenced to any jail time so far, unlike Thaksin that is?

Khun Thaksin must go to jail because he signed the paper as a husband to let his wife buy land. This damaged Thailand immensely.

Sondhi can't go to jail. Unfair for him because he only leads PAD to protest at the 2 airports and Ex-Government House causing only a few hundred million Baht loss. Nothing big. Nothing serious.

[bulmercke]

Homer needs to come here and rung the show.

Just some quick thoughts.

Maybe we have a power vacuum causing this or at least adding to the trouble.

While most of the generals, but not all would back the red, the vast majority of the foot solders back the red.

The police too are split.

This is not a joke and the disagreements are real and profound.

Joking about this would make you feel bad if you woke up to Find a thousand dead in a fight in the future.

If Thailand rejects democracy it will for sure be hit with huge trade tariffs from nations.

The economy is imploding.

I hope for the best but fear from the worst.

Well put!

There IS a complete power vacuum. Somchai has done nothing preferring to "relax" (according to my wife's translation of an interview she watched online this morning) in Chiang Mai while Yellow Rabble from People Against Democracy are destroying property, kidnapping, attacking police and trespassing (and openly lying by saying we're doing everything 'only peacefully' as a previous post stated)... Somchai says he has done nothing wrong. What he didn't explain is that it is hard to do something wrong if you don't do anything in the first place. Trouble is, if he quits, as he rightly should, it looks like these disloyal, self-serving 'treasonistas' at the airport have won.

Somchai and his mob are utterly spineless, weak and pathetic. This is a time when strong leadership is required. Somchai's style is to go into hiding miles away, covering under a blanket....

Ouch!

Spot-on RenzoInOz.

[fauxie]

Please read post 814 and tell us what you think

I think everyone has seen that video by now. What more can be spoken about it that hasn't been said already countless times long, long ago?

[groovyc]

Is this poster for real?

Koo82: Please, read some news once in a while, watch some news programs, something...that isn't just more of the Thaksin Kool Aid...if you did, you might have known about the teargas grenades of military grade that blow peoples limbs off and killed one unarmed young woman during the 7 Oct clash.

Tv showed that the Police brought the tear gas they used on 7 Oct to test after being blamed. Not strong enough to tear a sheet of paper.

So, you broke into my house. If I fight with you, I'm wrong.

some of them have obviously got some extra limbs doing what they're doing. let's hope gas grenades get the right limbs. whoever are still there are bringing it on to themselves.

[Plus]

Last week's clash with yellow-arm-banded PAD people calculatedly pointing and shooting weapons directly into the melee in the street

Yes, it was a melee, the reds tried to ambush PAD trucks loaded with their guards and got comeuppance.

In Chiang Mai, on the other hand, reds blockaded defenseless PAD radio station, stopped the father of PAD leader, dragged him out of his car, severely beat and finally shot him dead. Police were watching.

On the same day reds blockaded Chiang Mai ariport and checked all the vehicles, when a yellow shirted man was spotted in the van they drqagged him out and beat him senseless. It was a just driver transporting a court judge.

Yesterday at Bangkok airport PAD caught undercover police woman, PAD guards SAVED her from being beaten and escorted her to a taxi.

"UDD rallies have been models of restraint." - <deleted>?

YH, your ideological stand has completely blinded you, just like it did with our late Colonel. Have you conveniently forgotten one VERY memorable Udon rally? Have you chosen to consciously ERASE that from your memory.

[Nampeung]

God knows who is on who's side here any more but as to the sitch regarding Angkhana et al, I saw the video footage and the police threw grenades as well as tear gas

[Koo82]

Its so sad to of watched Thailand self destructing over the last few months and now it is becoming a laughing stock. We all know how wonderful the Thai police are, but their current display of incompetency really does go beyond belief.

I personally believe the damage that has been caused by these 'Terrorists'/'Insurgents' ( I use these words because thats what they would be called in any another country ) will have a long lasting effect on Thailand's economy and tourism.

I was on the understanding that the current government was elected democratically, maybe the stories of them being a puppet government for Thaksin to control from outside are true, but at least if we look back at the time when Thaksin was in power Thailand seemed to be a much more stable place, and more inviting for both business and tourist even if he wasnt the straightest PM in power, lets face it who wants to go there now?

Do the Thai people really want a Democracy, or even understand what it is?

They support the big people who has the power. Anupong is under PM in theory but in reality he is most powerful. When he said he won't do a shet, some people will follow him.

[grandpops]

Yeah Yeah Yeah plus.

Good thing the sheep are now penned in at the Airport.

Red shirts in town and the Government can now organise its meeting seriously and no idiot PAD can disrupt it no as they are surrounded by police in three separate locations.

Court house will be different as if the Gov not have time to change constitution, the UDD with blokade the court in the same fasion so they cannot disolve UDD... Police and army cannont stop UDD now or its a coup in name and Thailand is totally shafted by the foreign community.

PAD lost the propaganda battle as Prime Minister (ELECTED THAT IS) Little Lord Faunterleroy is looking the picture of innocence and the PAD are looking like a Right Wing Death sqaud from the South americas of the 60's and 70's. Maybe not on Thai Visa and possibly Burma, but certainly to most of the rest of the world. Fancy Burma moving up in the rankings as Thailand moves down.

Two years of poverty and hardship in Bangkok and they will be paying Thaksin to allow them to vote for him.

Anarchy for sure for sure.

[younghusband]

Incidentally you should learn some history.Gandhi's followers were never slaughtered in the independence struggle.That's because the colonial masters were the British who despite their hypocrisy and racialism were capable of being shamed, possessors of a basic decency.

You should take off your union jack glasses mate. In 1919 ,General Reginald Dyer ordered a platoon of soldiers of the Baluch Regiment to open fire on the unarmed crowd, killing some 380 and wounding 1,500. There were plenty of other instances of sometimes murderous British repression during the struggle for independence too.

There's also this policy as formulated by Churchill that you should also take into consideration"

In 1940, Winston Churchill hoped that Hindu-Muslim antagonism would remain “a bulwark of British rule in India.” Certainly Churchill, who did not want his views on India to be “disturbed by any bloody Indians” . Not much jolly old British decency there I think.

But nevertheless, Gandhi for all his human frailties, is a fine role model for those wishing to resist oppression. Although it must be said that the PAD are anything but standing for civil rights.

Actually it's you that should learn some history.Dyer's actions at Amritsar were appalling, the worst incident of its kind in the British Raj in the twentieth century but in historical context the numbers killed were tiny.Dyer's career was ruined and there was a full investigation.It was an important seed in the campaign for independence.However it was in 1919 and nothing to do with Gandhi who had only just returned from India.Churchill's views on India was rather eccentric 'half naked fakir'etc but of no relevance to the formulation of policy.

Edited November 30, 2008 by younghusband