Thai Political Parties Dissolved

[erobando]

Laugh all you like Erobando. But perhaps you could consider my comments in context.

And frankly, YES: the scale of demonstrations and problems in Thailand over the last six months - leading up to the airport and then the illegal siege - will make people in the boardrooms of international companies think twice about Thailand if they are considering where to build new plants in Asia. You're right to say laws on foreign ownership, etc, influence the decision. Obviously. But so do images of transportation hubs being out of action, people waving weapons around in the streets - and the Thai authorities/Govt have in the last week demonstrated utter weakness in confronting crime and maintaining essential services.

With respect I do think it is naive to think none of that influences foreign investment.

Yes, I agree if there are violent clashes over the long term. So far the police/military have limited (allowed?) the violence to isolated DAAD v PAD clashes at the protest sites.

But the last 6 months is really politics as usual in Thailand... the instability is not new.

[erobando]

lol, you really think PAD are the winners here?

They were screwed the minute they took over the airport and alienated the majority of what little support they had left.

I wouldn't so sure about either of your statements.

[Hardie]

Electoral fraud or not, Thaksin and his cronies enjoy wide popular support amongst the uneducated in Thailand, which is the majority. Such is democracy and eight years of GWBush. We didn't like it, but we didn't storm airports. Educate your people! it's pathetic!

No. Electoral fraud is NOT democracy. To make a case for electoral fraud being acceptable is just crazy! This isn't the USA if you have not noticed.

You are correct on one point though. Education is the key if there is ever going to be a fully functional democracy here, sadly it appears that we have to educate even Americans about democracy.

I hope the Demos step up now and do some of that education. Staring with "If you sell your vote it is worth nothing" and that the EC says even more clearly "If you are a political party and try and buy votes then you will be disbanded almost immediately.

The Demos also need to step up and come up with a real platform that is unifying. They need to start with debt-relief for the ill conceived Thaksinista loans. Then actually do what was supposed to have been done ages ago ... let the provinces have more self-rule instead of letting the central government appoint provincial governors. With good oversight from the central government of course!

[Hardie]

Electoral fraud or not, Thaksin and his cronies enjoy wide popular support amongst the uneducated in Thailand, which is the majority. Such is democracy and eight years of GWBush. We didn't like it, but we didn't storm airports. Educate your people! it's pathetic!

No. Electoral fraud is NOT democracy. To make a case for electoral fraud being acceptable is just crazy! This isn't the USA if you have not noticed.

You are correct on one point though. Education is the key if there is ever going to be a fully functional democracy here, sadly it appears that we have to educate even Americans about democracy.

I hope the Demos step up now and do some of that education. Staring with "If you sell your vote it is worth nothing" and that the EC says even more clearly "If you are a political party and try and buy votes then you will be disbanded almost immediately.

The Demos also need to step up and come up with a real platform that is unifying. They need to start with debt-relief for the ill conceived Thaksinista loans. Then actually do what was supposed to have been done ages ago ... let the provinces have more self-rule instead of letting the central government appoint provincial governors. With good oversight from the central government of course!

No, I'm not making a case for electoral fraud; I'm saying the Thaksinistas will likely win regardless. Democracy is a two-edged sword. You don't always get what you want. BTW the PAD was just referred to on US TV as 'anti-government terrorists.' I doubt that's the publicity they want.

Also that 1M figure for Bush-caused deaths is speculation. I don't like Bush, faxed in my vote for Obama from Tierra del Fuego, but exaggeration helps nothing and no one. The US was attacked on its own soil. Things like that don't usually go unanswered, however foolishly, except maybe in Thailand. The UK went to the Malvinas for far less. The rest is history.

[mahtin]

The rest is history.

History is being made now.

Let none of us forget it.

Edited December 2, 2008 by mahtin

[Wiresok]

Electoral fraud or not, Thaksin and his cronies enjoy wide popular support amongst the uneducated in Thailand, which is the majority. Such is democracy and eight years of GWBush. We didn't like it, but we didn't storm airports. Educate your people! it's pathetic!

No. Electoral fraud is NOT democracy. To make a case for electoral fraud being acceptable is just crazy! This isn't the USA if you have not noticed.

You are correct on one point though. Education is the key if there is ever going to be a fully functional democracy here, sadly it appears that we have to educate even Americans about democracy.

I hope the Demos step up now and do some of that education. Staring with "If you sell your vote it is worth nothing" and that the EC says even more clearly "If you are a political party and try and buy votes then you will be disbanded almost immediately.

The Demos also need to step up and come up with a real platform that is unifying. They need to start with debt-relief for the ill conceived Thaksinista loans. Then actually do what was supposed to have been done ages ago ... let the provinces have more self-rule instead of letting the central government appoint provincial governors. With good oversight from the central government of course!

No, I'm not making a case for electoral fraud; I'm saying the Thaksinistas will likely win regardless. Democracy is a two-edged sword. You don't always get what you want. BTW the PAD was just referred to on US TV as 'anti-government terrorists.' I doubt that's the publicity they want.

Also that 1M figure for Bush-caused deaths is speculation. I don't like Bush, faxed in my vote for Obama from Tierra del Fuego, but exaggeration helps nothing and no one. The US was attacked on its own soil. Things like that don't usually go unanswered, however foolishly, except maybe in Thailand. The UK went to the Malvinas for far less. The rest is history.

And the BBC world correspondant in suva referred to the "armed PAD para-militaries" holed up in the airport basement.

As mulder said in the X-files...the truth is out there...

[RenzoInOz]

I hate to spoil the PAD's celebrations, but... Somchai is gone because of a decision by the courts. That decision had nothing whatsoever to do with the PAD and its disruptive protests which were largely targeting the economy and foreigners. So while they may have got what they wanted, it had nothing, in the end, to do with their existence. They've actually achieved nothing in the last week except a lot of heartache for businesses and individuals across Thailand - and the trickle down effects such as the death of tourists on the highway, trying to escape the country....

[tartempion]

Indeed, they would NOT have occupied the airport, Somchai would still be sacked.

They would have saved this country from a lot of misery.

They lost a lot of support by their stupid action.

Congratulations to a bunch of idiots

[Lockstock]

I hate to spoil the PAD's celebrations, but... Somchai is gone because of a decision by the courts. That decision had nothing whatsoever to do with the PAD and its disruptive protests which were largely targeting the economy and foreigners. So while they may have got what they wanted, it had nothing, in the end, to do with their existence. They've actually achieved nothing in the last week except a lot of heartache for businesses and individuals across Thailand - and the trickle down effects such as the death of tourists on the highway, trying to escape the country....

Exactly ..... I guess these 'educated' city types are not a clever as they like to think they are ... or they were looking for an easy out.

[Lockstock]

Indeed, they would NOT have occupied the airport, Somchai would still be sacked.

They would have saved this country from a lot of misery.

They lost a lot of support by their stupid action.

Congratulations to a bunch of idiots

Now now....I think that you are doing idiots all over the World a disservice there.

[permanent_disorder]

Let me leave you with a photo of how the reds advocate peace.

To me it kinda looks like both sides arent that peaceful..........................

that picture is from the night before the first SoE. that night a 55 years old man was beaten to death by PAD.

PAD apologist said it was in an act of self defence and that the "peaceful" PAD camp got attacked by the team red. the 55 years old was a pro gov protestor.

to prove that the pro gov. are violent the photo above got posted again and again. always the same men in that position on that corner. there haven't been much more any other pictures of violent reds.

that picture of somchai machete is 100% staged and faked. that are just a few actors given brand new red shirts to pose with weapons to make "good" picture. perfect example how propaganda works and how pictures can lie.

just look at the time of the day the pictures have been made. do you see the sky in the background? it is dawn, but not at night time.

you see all the photographers/reporters sourround them?

ever seen those machete boys in action, in other situations?

for me it looks like a stupid stage play with poorly costumed actors.

i disbelieve those pictures. i recommend to take a closer look at them. a closer look you should take at many " news" and so on. from both sides. don't believe everything you have been told. think for yourself!

and even if those guys are real, it can not justify and excuse the murder and the violence the PAD cult warrior practised on the streets of bangkok.

start at 0:43 you can see the man on the ground, between 2 cars. got hit on the head several times.

if there are really such much different group exist under that big umbrella PAD, at least one should had spoken loud out that they condemn such practise of "self defence". but, no. never happen.

[sjaak327]

I hate to spoil the PAD's celebrations, but... Somchai is gone because of a decision by the courts. That decision had nothing whatsoever to do with the PAD and its disruptive protests which were largely targeting the economy and foreigners. So while they may have got what they wanted, it had nothing, in the end, to do with their existence. They've actually achieved nothing in the last week except a lot of heartache for businesses and individuals across Thailand - and the trickle down effects such as the death of tourists on the highway, trying to escape the country....

My sentiments exactly.

Edited December 2, 2008 by sjaak327

[robee]

Let me leave you with a photo of how the reds advocate peace.

To me it kinda looks like both sides arent that peaceful..........................

that picture is from the night before the first SoE. that night a 55 years old man was beaten to death by PAD.

PAD apologist said it was in an act of self defence and that the "peaceful" PAD camp got attacked by the team red. the 55 years old was a pro gov protestor.

to prove that the pro gov. are violent the photo above got posted again and again. always the same men in that position on that corner. there haven't been much more any other pictures of violent reds.

that picture of somchai machete is 100% staged and faked. that are just a few actors given brand new red shirts to pose with weapons to make "good" picture. perfect example how propaganda works and how pictures can lie.

just look at the time of the day the pictures have been made. do you see the sky in the background? it is dawn, but not at night time.

you see all the photographers/reporters sourround them?

ever seen those machete boys in action, in other situations?

for me it looks like a stupid stage play with poorly costumed actors.

i disbelieve those pictures. i recommend to take a closer look at them. a closer look you should take at many " news" and so on. from both sides. don't believe everything you have been told. think for yourself!

and even if those guys are real, it can not justify and excuse the murder and the violence the PAD cult warrior practised on the streets of bangkok.

start at 0:43 you can see the man on the ground, between 2 cars. got hit on the head several times.

if there are really such much different group exist under that big umbrella PAD, at least one should had spoken loud out that they condemn such practise of "self defence". but, no. never happen.

the evil men do

[KireB]

Let me leave you with a photo of how the reds advocate peace.

To me it kinda looks like both sides arent that peaceful..........................

that picture is from the night before the first SoE. that night a 55 years old man was beaten to death by PAD.

PAD apologist said it was in an act of self defence and that the "peaceful" PAD camp got attacked by the team red. the 55 years old was a pro gov protestor.

to prove that the pro gov. are violent the photo above got posted again and again. always the same men in that position on that corner. there haven't been much more any other pictures of violent reds.

that picture of somchai machete is 100% staged and faked. that are just a few actors given brand new red shirts to pose with weapons to make "good" picture. perfect example how propaganda works and how pictures can lie.

just look at the time of the day the pictures have been made. do you see the sky in the background? it is dawn, but not at night time.

you see all the photographers/reporters sourround them?

ever seen those machete boys in action, in other situations?

for me it looks like a stupid stage play with poorly costumed actors.

i disbelieve those pictures. i recommend to take a closer look at them. a closer look you should take at many " news" and so on. from both sides. don't believe everything you have been told. think for yourself!

and even if those guys are real, it can not justify and excuse the murder and the violence the PAD cult warrior practised on the streets of bangkok.

start at 0:43 you can see the man on the ground, between 2 cars. got hit on the head several times.

if there are really such much different group exist under that big umbrella PAD, at least one should had spoken loud out that they condemn such practise of "self defence". but, no. never happen.

the evil men do

Let me start of by saying that all violence should be condoned, but I hear this commentator clearly saying that pro-government supporters broke through a police line an attacked the anti governmnet supporters. The violence we have seen over the last months was horrible, but in most cases intiated by (hired?) imbecils in red shirts. Why you fail to see that is beyond me.

[RenzoInOz]

Let me start of by saying that all violence should be condoned, but I hear this commentator clearly saying that pro-government supporters broke through a police line an attacked the anti governmnet supporters. The violence we have seen over the last months was horrible, but in most cases intiated by (hired?) imbecils in red shirts. Why you fail to see that is beyond me.

Errr.. did you mean 'condemned" KireB?

(Hmmm... who was it questioning my education last night....?)

[Onyxia]

that picture is from the night before the first SoE. that night a 55 years old man was beaten to death by PAD.

PAD apologist said it was in an act of self defence and that the "peaceful" PAD camp got attacked by the team red. the 55 years old was a pro gov protestor.

to prove that the pro gov. are violent the photo above got posted again and again. always the same men in that position on that corner. there haven't been much more any other pictures of violent reds.

that picture of somchai machete is 100% staged and faked. that are just a few actors given brand new red shirts to pose with weapons to make "good" picture. perfect example how propaganda works and how pictures can lie.

just look at the time of the day the pictures have been made. do you see the sky in the background? it is dawn, but not at night time.

you see all the photographers/reporters sourround them?

ever seen those machete boys in action, in other situations?

for me it looks like a stupid stage play with poorly costumed actors.

i disbelieve those pictures. i recommend to take a closer look at them. a closer look you should take at many " news" and so on. from both sides. don't believe everything you have been told. think for yourself!

and even if those guys are real, it can not justify and excuse the murder and the violence the PAD cult warrior practised on the streets of bangkok.

start at 0:43 you can see the man on the ground, between 2 cars. got hit on the head several times.

if there are really such much different group exist under that big umbrella PAD, at least one should had spoken loud out that they condemn such practise of "self defence". but, no. never happen.

Apparently reading comprehension isnt your strong suit. No where have i have said i condone violence from either side, no where have i ever said its an excusable act, no where have i said i only believe one side. Sounds like it is you that is narrow minded when it comes to these discussions. I know you want to believe only one side of the story, take time and look at both sides of the news. Take heed of your own advice and think for yourself! Cheers

Here are some links for your reading pleasure. (I assume you can read thai, seeing as how you claim to grasp its politics better than anyone else on the forums)

http://special.bangkokbiznews.com/detail.p...sername=politic

http://www.oknation.net/blog/adisak/2008/11/09/entry-1

http://thaiinsider.info/space/content/view/12246/57/

http://www.oknation.net/blog/mhanation/2008/11/25/entry-2

Edited December 3, 2008 by Onyxia

[diehard60]

they will still have the majority in the parliament and in any future elections - at least there is a hope, that PAD will stop messing around

They will not stop here!!!!!! For sure.

[diehard60]

Let me leave you with a photo of how the reds advocate peace.

To me it kinda looks like both sides arent that peaceful..........................

that picture is from the night before the first SoE. that night a 55 years old man was beaten to death by PAD.

PAD apologist said it was in an act of self defence and that the "peaceful" PAD camp got attacked by the team red. the 55 years old was a pro gov protestor.

to prove that the pro gov. are violent the photo above got posted again and again. always the same men in that position on that corner. there haven't been much more any other pictures of violent reds.

that picture of somchai machete is 100% staged and faked. that are just a few actors given brand new red shirts to pose with weapons to make "good" picture. perfect example how propaganda works and how pictures can lie.

just look at the time of the day the pictures have been made. do you see the sky in the background? it is dawn, but not at night time.

you see all the photographers/reporters sourround them?

ever seen those machete boys in action, in other situations?

for me it looks like a stupid stage play with poorly costumed actors.

i disbelieve those pictures. i recommend to take a closer look at them. a closer look you should take at many " news" and so on. from both sides. don't believe everything you have been told. think for yourself!

and even if those guys are real, it can not justify and excuse the murder and the violence the PAD cult warrior practised on the streets of bangkok.

start at 0:43 you can see the man on the ground, between 2 cars. got hit on the head several times.

if there are really such much different group exist under that big umbrella PAD, at least one should had spoken loud out that they condemn such practise of "self defence". but, no. never happen.

the evil men do

Let me start of by saying that all violence should be condoned, but I hear this commentator clearly saying that pro-government supporters broke through a police line an attacked the anti governmnet supporters. The violence we have seen over the last months was horrible, but in most cases intiated by (hired?) imbecils in red shirts. Why you fail to see that is beyond me.

Oh! Now you are saying that the PAD was not hired? Lest we forget who started the whole thing in the beginning. Hey nit wit - it was the same person that started it 16 years ago. and who can garnades? the poor farmers of the north and northeast? Those things come from the army stupid. and who is backing the PAD - the army.

[DaleBlue]

Let there be peace in Thailand. Fighting on the street is so un-Thai.

[steffi]

Bangkok Post is reporting that Chalerm is a serious contended for PM.

Let there be peace in Thailand. Fighting on the street is so un-Thai.

[Plus]

Don't lose the big picture - PAD is against Thaksin, not PPP. Sure appointing Chalerm as a PM is an insult to the countrly but I think PAD will slip this through as long as he can't do anything to help out Thaksin.

PPP can go on and make total fools out of themselves, it's not about them, or reds - the fight is about Thaksin.

Can anyone tell for sure if Chalerm is a constituency of a party list MP? There's a big question about party list MPs now, they can't just switch to some other party that no one ever voted for.

It's an impasse of sorts - what to do with partly lists without parties.

[henryalleman]

The rest is history.

History is being made now.

Let none of us forget it.

Indeed history is made. Its the first time in Thai history that the military did not interfere in a political turmoil, and took power. This is never seen in Thai history. So little by little Thailand is on the way to a genuine democracy.And all of this due to the persistence of PAD who despite all assaults and 6 deadly and the many provocations, their supporters always keep their calm.

Also the occupation of the 2 airports was an example of discipline, no looting, no destruct ions.

You can disagree with their goals and tactics, but you can't deny the above.

Congratulations PAD for this achievements.

[henryalleman]

Let me leave you with a photo of how the reds advocate peace.

To me it kinda looks like both sides arent that peaceful..........................

that picture is from the night before the first SoE. that night a 55 years old man was beaten to death by PAD.

PAD apologist said it was in an act of self defence and that the "peaceful" PAD camp got attacked by the team red. the 55 years old was a pro gov protestor.

to prove that the pro gov. are violent the photo above got posted again and again. always the same men in that position on that corner. there haven't been much more any other pictures of violent reds.

that picture of somchai machete is 100% staged and faked. that are just a few actors given brand new red shirts to pose with weapons to make "good" picture. perfect example how propaganda works and how pictures can lie.

just look at the time of the day the pictures have been made. do you see the sky in the background? it is dawn, but not at night time.

you see all the photographers/reporters sourround them?

ever seen those machete boys in action, in other situations?

for me it looks like a stupid stage play with poorly costumed actors.

i disbelieve those pictures. i recommend to take a closer look at them. a closer look you should take at many " news" and so on. from both sides. don't believe everything you have been told. think for yourself!

and even if those guys are real, it can not justify and excuse the murder and the violence the PAD cult warrior practised on the streets of bangkok.

start at 0:43 you can see the man on the ground, between 2 cars. got hit on the head several times.

if there are really such much different group exist under that big umbrella PAD, at least one should had spoken loud out that they condemn such practise of "self defence". but, no. never happen.

the evil men do

Let me start of by saying that all violence should be condoned, but I hear this commentator clearly saying that pro-government supporters broke through a police line an attacked the anti governmnet supporters. The violence we have seen over the last months was horrible, but in most cases intiated by (hired?) imbecils in red shirts. Why you fail to see that is beyond me.

hate is blindfolded them

[Svetlana]

May I ask what "genuine democracy" means for you? Do you really think that there is even one country around the world we could call "a country of genuine democracy"? It sounds very good but it cannot be true, let's just be honest...

I would be very glad for Thailand, for Thais if they were on the way of democracy. But where can you see that? It's just another struggle for power and money. It's a game and somebody rules it very nicely - the majority of yellows and reds don't even realise that...

[robee]

The rest is history.

History is being made now.

Let none of us forget it.

Indeed history is made. Its the first time in Thai history that the military did not interfere in a political turmoil, and took power. This is never seen in Thai history. So little by little Thailand is on the way to a genuine democracy.And all of this due to the persistence of PAD who despite all assaults and 6 deadly and the many provocations, their supporters always keep their calm.

Also the occupation of the 2 airports was an example of discipline, no looting, no destruct ions.

You can disagree with their goals and tactics, but you can't deny the above.

Congratulations PAD for this achievements.

no sure about everything you mentioned but am glad that the military did not take over and then install someone as most often happens.

and agree that i have sen no evidence of looting at airport or destruction of property.

let me think about and comment on the the democracy comment after a bit

[VegasVic]

I think for 2009 the TAT slogan may have to change from "Amazing Thailand" to "The year of living dangerously" !

[robee]

I think for 2009 the TAT slogan may have to change from "Amazing Thailand" to "The year of living dangerously" !

or travel to Thailand the 7th deadly place in the world to visit...

[Kerryd]

When you call for actual violence .. then your opinion CAN hurt people. (That may be why there is a rule against it on ThaiVisa.com)

Did PAD leaders promote peace when they said they are "ready to die"?

Or did PAD guards promote peace when they shot with handguns on Viphavadee Road?

Hahaha, give them enough rope and they are sure to hang themselves !

You (rainman) advocate violence against the PAD, because (some) PAD advocate violence (but oddly you ignore the "red" violence, maybe because the "reds" haven't "inconvenienced" you like the yellows have ?)

So, by advocating the same thing that (some) PAD were advocating (inciting violence) puts you on the same level as them.

Of course, that same level is one in which you called them scum and terrorists.

Wow. I never realised that you and the PAD had so much in common !

[digitele]

May I ask what "genuine democracy" means for you? Do you really think that there is even one country around the world we could call "a country of genuine democracy"? It sounds very good but it cannot be true, let's just be honest...

I would be very glad for Thailand, for Thais if they were on the way of democracy. But where can you see that? It's just another struggle for power and money. It's a game and somebody rules it very nicely - the majority of yellows and reds don't even realise that...

The majority of the old farangs on TV don't realise it either.

It is what it is. Stay tuned for more disfunction. Sanuk, sanuk.

[Jai Dee]

A switch of coalition alliance to Democrats difficult: Kudep

MP Kudep Saikrajang on Wednesday ruled out the possibility for the Democrats to form the next coaliton government on the ground that six coalition parties remain firm on their alliance.

"It is more realistic if the Democrats want to join the six-party alliance - this is very possible and the coalition is open for negotiations," he said.

Kudep was reacting to a call from the business associations for the coalition switch in order to overcome the political turmoil.

Even if the Democrat Party leads the next coalition, it will not have sufficient votes to ensure stability, he said.

Source: The Nation - 03 December 2008