Australian Drug Smuggler Arrested At Suvarnabhumi

[Artisi]

Heroin use is an evil. Heroin users know the risk but still freely make the choice to consume and create demand for the production of this drug. The pedalling of this drug is an evil and should be severly punished. I have no sympathy for users or suppliers.

However, a far more evil narcotic is Nicotine. Anyone who has become a Nicotine addict since its effects were know and published from the late 60s is an idiot.

I wouldn't think that you could ever compare nicotine and heroin in the same class of problem causing drug - this is like comparing heroin to caffeine which is the world's most widely consumed psychoactive stimulant drug substance.

This is not to say that nicotine isn't a nasty stimulant and should be banned along with a lot of other money making drugs promoted by drug and other companies with vested interests.

[Loaded]

Heroin use is an evil. Heroin users know the risk but still freely make the choice to consume and create demand for the production of this drug. The pedalling of this drug is an evil and should be severly punished. I have no sympathy for users or suppliers.

However, a far more evil narcotic is Nicotine. Anyone who has become a Nicotine addict since its effects were know and published from the late 60s is an idiot.

I wouldn't think that you could ever compare nicotine and heroin in the same class of problem causing drug - this is like comparing heroin to caffeine which is the world's most widely consumed psychoactive stimulant drug substance.

This is not to say that nicotine isn't a nasty stimulant and should be banned along with a lot of other money making drugs promoted by drug and other companies with vested interests.

You are deluded.

It is as addictive.

It kills many more people.

It costs taxpayers far more to cover health costs associated with its use.

"Tobacco addiction, the second-leading cause of death in the world, is a culprit for approximately 5 million deaths each year or 1 in 10 adult deaths. Currently, about 1.3 billion smokers live in the world; most (84%) live in developing countries.1 With the present smoking trends, tobacco will kill 10 million people each year by 2020.2 Through direct healthcare costs and loss of productivity from death and illness, tobacco will cost governments an estimated US $200 billion per year. A third of these costs will be borne by the developing countries. Many factors have led to increased global smoking rates. These include trade liberalization; direct foreign investment; global marketing; transnational tobacco advertising, promotion, and sponsorship; and international tobacco smuggling.

Nicotine meets the criteria of a highly addictive drug. Nicotine is a potent psychoactive drug that induces euphoria, serves as a reinforcer of its use, and leads to nicotine withdrawal syndrome when it is absent. As an addictive drug, nicotine has 2 very potent issues: it is a stimulant and it is also a depressant. For example, one smoker talked too lovingly about her cigarettes who are called her "best friend." They got her going in the morning, and they chilled her out during the day.

Nicotine in cigarette smoke affects mood and performance and is the source of addiction to tobacco. While cigarette manufacturers have publicly denied that nicotine is an addictive drug, recent documents disclose that they have known and used the addictive properties of nicotine since the 1950s. Unfortunately, this misinformation led to the false belief that nicotine use is a habit and not an addiction.

Nicotine stimulates the hypothalamic-pituitary axis; this, in turn, stimulates the endocrine system. Continually increasing dose levels of nicotine are necessary to maintain the stimulating effects. With regards to dependence, some experts rank nicotine ahead of alcohol, cocaine, and heroin. A teenager who smokes as few as 4 cigarettes might develop a lifelong addiction to nicotine."

Sat Sharma, MD, FRCPC, Professor and Head, Division of Pulmonary Medicine, Department of Internal Medicine, University of Manitoba; Site Director, Respiratory Medicine, St. Boniface General Hospital

Morley Lertzman, MD, FRCP©, Professor, Department of Medicine, Section of Pulmonary Medicine, St Boniface Hospital, University of Manitoba, Canada

You can google for the original

[henryalleman]

Its unbelievable that some people in this forum promote the idea that drugs must be freely available,

maybe the following links can kick some reason in them.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article757211.ece

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GPITs82wP2U

http://alcoholism.about.com/od/sa/a/blue050621.htm

A government has the duty to protect the people. So making drugs freely available is an act of hostility against their population

[Neeranam]

QUOTE (ourmaninbangers @ 2008-12-25 22:44:45)

stop this utter crap that all drugs are bad

some, like herion have nothing bad in them

they prmote like ( check it out if you do not belief

people- know your subject please!

He's actually not far off the mark here. I wonder how many people are sitting with a beer in their hand thinking how bad heroin is.

Alcohol is far more unhealthy and cases more damage to society.

As for the OP, this is Christmas, have some compassion. Legalising heroin is the only way to stop this nonsense of the death penalty for traffickers and also for heroin cut with dangerous chemicals to reach the public.

Edited December 26, 2008 by Neeranam

[Artisi]

Heroin use is an evil. Heroin users know the risk but still freely make the choice to consume and create demand for the production of this drug. The pedalling of this drug is an evil and should be severly punished. I have no sympathy for users or suppliers.

However, a far more evil narcotic is Nicotine. Anyone who has become a Nicotine addict since its effects were know and published from the late 60s is an idiot.

I wouldn't think that you could ever compare nicotine and heroin in the same class of problem causing drug - this is like comparing heroin to caffeine which is the world's most widely consumed psychoactive stimulant drug substance.

This is not to say that nicotine isn't a nasty stimulant and should be banned along with a lot of other money making drugs promoted by drug and other companies with vested interests.

You are deluded.

It is as addictive.

It kills many more people.

It costs taxpayers far more to cover health costs associated with its use.

"Tobacco addiction, the second-leading cause of death in the world, is a culprit for approximately 5 million deaths each year or 1 in 10 adult deaths. Currently, about 1.3 billion smokers live in the world; most (84%) live in developing countries.1 With the present smoking trends, tobacco will kill 10 million people each year by 2020.2 Through direct healthcare costs and loss of productivity from death and illness, tobacco will cost governments an estimated US $200 billion per year. A third of these costs will be borne by the developing countries. Many factors have led to increased global smoking rates. These include trade liberalization; direct foreign investment; global marketing; transnational tobacco advertising, promotion, and sponsorship; and international tobacco smuggling.

Nicotine meets the criteria of a highly addictive drug. Nicotine is a potent psychoactive drug that induces euphoria, serves as a reinforcer of its use, and leads to nicotine withdrawal syndrome when it is absent. As an addictive drug, nicotine has 2 very potent issues: it is a stimulant and it is also a depressant. For example, one smoker talked too lovingly about her cigarettes who are called her "best friend." They got her going in the morning, and they chilled her out during the day.

Nicotine in cigarette smoke affects mood and performance and is the source of addiction to tobacco. While cigarette manufacturers have publicly denied that nicotine is an addictive drug, recent documents disclose that they have known and used the addictive properties of nicotine since the 1950s. Unfortunately, this misinformation led to the false belief that nicotine use is a habit and not an addiction.

Nicotine stimulates the hypothalamic-pituitary axis; this, in turn, stimulates the endocrine system. Continually increasing dose levels of nicotine are necessary to maintain the stimulating effects. With regards to dependence, some experts rank nicotine ahead of alcohol, cocaine, and heroin. A teenager who smokes as few as 4 cigarettes might develop a lifelong addiction to nicotine."

Sat Sharma, MD, FRCPC, Professor and Head, Division of Pulmonary Medicine, Department of Internal Medicine, University of Manitoba; Site Director, Respiratory Medicine, St. Boniface General Hospital

Morley Lertzman, MD, FRCP©, Professor, Department of Medicine, Section of Pulmonary Medicine, St Boniface Hospital, University of Manitoba, Canada

You can google for the original

I don't have one argument against what you have sighted, in fact I am in full agreement - nicotine is nasty.

However, I was thinking more along the lines of the criminal activities associated with heroin and the moral decay of society - none of which are a by-product of tobacco smoking, although tobcco probably has a higher $$ value per year than heroin.

[Neeranam]

However, I was thinking more along the lines of the criminal activities associated with heroin and the moral decay of society - none of which are a by-product of tobacco smoking, although tobcco probably has a higher $$ value per year than heroin.

I wonder how many innocent people are going to be killed on Thailand's roads in the next week by heroin users?

[Artisi]

However, I was thinking more along the lines of the criminal activities associated with heroin and the moral decay of society - none of which are a by-product of tobacco smoking, although tobcco probably has a higher $$ value per year than heroin.

I wonder how many innocent people are going to be killed on Thailand's roads in the next week by heroin users?

Who knows, but guess this can be lumped into part of the criminal activities as it is certainly against the law - and not so long back we saw more than 2500 die in a couple of months as a direct result of drugs - don't think this was caused by tobacco.

[Loaded]

However, I was thinking more along the lines of the criminal activities associated with heroin and the moral decay of society - none of which are a by-product of tobacco smoking, although tobcco probably has a higher $$ value per year than heroin.

The vast majority of citizens of any society want to live without the fear of crime associated with illegal drug use. The punishments in the West do not act as a deterrent; rather recent changes in drug laws in many European countries seem to actively encourage drug use among many people who would normally avoid 'illegal' activities. I feel strongly that the 'sympathetic' attitude towards addicts is wrong. Addiction is often discussed as a psychological disorder but from my observations of drunks and drug addicts it is also usually associated with socially defective people. Let the majority protect themselves from this threat.

Edited December 26, 2008 by Loaded

[Neeranam]

However, I was thinking more along the lines of the criminal activities associated with heroin and the moral decay of society - none of which are a by-product of tobacco smoking, although tobcco probably has a higher $$ value per year than heroin.

I wonder how many innocent people are going to be killed on Thailand's roads in the next week by heroin users?

Who knows, but guess this can be lumped into part of the criminal activities as it is certainly against the law - and not so long back we saw more than 2500 die in a couple of months as a direct result of drugs - don't think this was caused by tobacco.

uThis post shows that you haven't a clue what you're talking about.

[neverdie]

Geeze, so many opinions & so many good points, but irregardless of whatever ANYONE thinks about what the law SHOULD BE, it is CURRENTLY illegal to do what this POOR AUSTRALIAN FOOL did & the law is set out in clear black and white (albiet thai) & now he should be hung by his goolies by the highest pole & left for the vultures to devour!

Forget about WOULD BE, SHOULD BE, COULD BE - The Thai stance on drug laws is VERY clear - 3 cheers for thailand

[ourmaninbangers]

Make a law that give every person who is in possession of any illegal drug the death penalty with a a lethal injection you can make this very humain way, doing it in a nice surrounding with good music, comfortable chair with a glass of wine

This law will make an end to a lot of suffering of drug addicts and society. because lets be frankly an drug addict have a life without any future.

hunter s thompson

the beatles

irvine welsh

william buroughs

and queen victoria

get the point you red neck nazi fascist?

and as you sit down at your computer, which of course you didnt invent perhaps you might like to read this wired

if you ruled the world i am sure we would all be very efficient worker drones but its creativity that created wealth for us westerners

I could name 1000 more name's

many top people, but they have to keep it secret, the sheep like herd of the hang 'em high hate them

oh no they cry , its all wrong, you will die, you will go to jail, you must obey the law and be sheep like us

whilst they themselves rot in their own self imposed deathly boring existance

[neverdie]

stop this utter crap that all drugs are bad

some, like herion have nothing bad in them

they prmote like ( check it out if you do not belief

people- know your subject please!

Well, you've lost any credibility you may have had as far as I'm concerned.

Heroin Effects: Short Term

Soon after injection (or inhalation), heroin crosses the blood-brain barrier. In the brain, heroin is converted to morphine and binds rapidly to opioid receptors. Abusers typically report feeling a surge of pleasurable sensation, a "rush." The intensity of the rush is a function of how much drug is taken and how rapidly the drug enters the brain and binds to the natural opioid receptors. Heroin is particularly addictive because it enters the brain so rapidly. With heroin, the rush is usually accompanied by a warm flushing of the skin, dry mouth, and a heavy feeling in the extremities, which may be accompanied by nausea, vomiting, and severe itching.

Effects:

Rush

Depressed respiration

Clouded mental functioning

Nausea and vomiting

Suppression of pain

Spontaneous abortion

After the initial effects, abusers usually will be drowsy for several hours. Mental function is clouded by heroin's effect on the central nervous system. Cardiac functions slow. Breathing is also severely slowed, sometimes to the point of death. Heroin overdose is a particular risk on the street, where the amount and purity of the drug cannot be accurately known.

Heroin Effects: Long Term

One of the most detrimental long-term effects of heroin is addiction itself. Addiction is a chronic, relapsing problem, characterized by compulsive drug seeking and use, and by neurochemical and molecular changes in the brain. Heroin also produces profound degrees of tolerance and physical dependence, which are also powerful motivating factors for compulsive use and abuse. As with abusers of any addictive drug, heroin abusers gradually spend more and more time and energy obtaining and using the drug. Once they are addicted, the heroin abusers' primary purpose in life becomes seeking and using drugs. The drugs literally change their brains.

Effects:

Addiction

Abscesses

Collapsed veins

Bacterial infections

Infection of heart lining and valves

Arthritis and other rheumatologic problems

Infectious diseases, for example, HIV/AIDS and hepatitis B and C

Physical dependence develops with higher doses of the drug. With physical dependence, the body adapts to the presence of the drug and withdrawal symptoms occur if use is reduced abruptly. Withdrawal may occur within a few hours after the last time the drug is taken. Symptoms of withdrawal include restlessness, muscle and bone pain, insomnia, diarrhea, vomiting, cold swapes with goose bumps ("cold turkey"), and leg movements.

From another site:

As with other opiates, heroin is used both as a pain-killer and a recreational drug. Frequent administration quickly leads to tolerance and dependence and has a very high potential for addiction. If sustained use of heroin for as little as three days is stopped abruptly, withdrawal symptoms can appear.

And yet another site (there are literally thousands of them):

What are its short-term effects?

The short-term effects of heroin abuse appear soon after a single dose and disappear in a few hours.After an injection of heroin, the user reports feeling a surge of euphoria ("rush") accompanied by a warm flushing of the skin, a dry mouth, and heavy extremities. Following this initial euphoria, the user goes "on the nod," an alternately wakeful and drowsy state.

Mental functioning becomes clouded due to the depression of the central nervous system. Other effects included slowed and slurred speech, slow gait, constricted pupils, droopy eyelids, impaired night vision, vomiting, constipation.

What are its long-term effects?

Long-term effects of heroin appear after repeated use for some period of time.

Chronic users may develop collapsed veins, infection of the heart lining and valves, abscesses, cellulites, and liver disease. Pulmonary complications, including various types of pneumonia, may result from the poor health condition of the abuser, as well as from heroin's depressing effects on respiration.

In addition to the effects of the drug itself, street heroin may have additives that do not really dissolve and result in clogging the blood vessels that lead to the lungs, liver, kidneys, or brain. This can cause infection or even death of small patches of cells in vital organs. With regular heroin use, tolerance develops. This means the abuser must use more heroin to achieve the same intensity or effect.

And you expect me (or anyone else) to believe:

stop this utter crap that all drugs are bad

some, like herion have nothing bad in them

people- know your subject please!

Oh yes, as to the legality of marijuana, which you offered to show us the translated Act, does the gist of it look anything like this:

The possession/purchase of Cannabis is "tolerated" in small amounts. One can purchase cannabis in special shops (called "coffee shops") if one is age eighteen and over. Sale and purchase of cannabis anywhere else is illegal. Outdoor use is forbidden as well.

Cultivation and wholesale of cannabis is likewise "tolerated" in small amounts (guidelines here are no more than five plants at home or the possession of 5 grams per adult max.).

The tolerance guidelines appear in appendix of the Opium Act.

The Opium Act states very clearly that every part of the hemp plant is banned except for the seeds – this is in accordance with many of the international treaties which the Netherlands have signed.

It is for this reason Cannabis cannot be legalised in the Netherlands. Thus, it remains illegal but it is "tolerated."

A recent court decision allowed a medical cannabis user to avoid legal prosecution for possession of a small number of cannabis plants; however, the state is appealing the decision.

From one of your countrymen on another site:

I am from the Netherlands and officially it is illegal, but tolerated. This is a constantly returning subject in the Netherland, in politics some are stongly against and some are strongly for legalisation.

From the "High Times" website (which got it from USA Today):

Cannabis is technically an illegal substance in the Netherlands, although you won't get arrested for buying or smoking it in a coffee shop.

The Dutch have adopted a policy of "gedogen," or blind eye, to its sale and use since 1976. The government distinguished between so-called "soft" cannabis drugs and "hard" drugs such as heroin or cocaine. That's when coffee houses sprang up to sell and let people smoke.

From "Stop The Drug War.org":

"For more than 30 years under the policy of "gedoogbeleid," which could best be translated as "pragmatic tolerance," the Dutch have allowed the sale of personal amounts of marijuana through the coffee house system, even though doing so is technically illegal."

Wow. Looks like almost everyone else in the world knows that marijuana is ILLEGAL in the Netherlands !

So tell me, where have I made the mistake you claimed in your previous post ?

another exmple of you a mistake

it is not illgal it is decriminamlize

shall I send you a copy of today dutch mandate

( I will translate it for it)

how many more little errors

do yuo see my point

you have made one

which makes me conclude you have made more

OURMANINBANGERS Please kind sir, before you waffle on anymore about things, can you please read Kerryd's post again & think about things for a little while. This post is dead, honestly, its all been covered already. Read & Learn....ohhh and lets teach the world to say "No to drugs"...trust me, its best policy

[ourmaninbangers]

stop this utter crap that all drugs are bad

some, like herion have nothing bad in them

they prmote like ( check it out if you do not belief

people- know your subject please!

Well, you've lost any credibility you may have had as far as I'm concerned.

Heroin Effects: Short Term

Soon after injection (or inhalation), heroin crosses the blood-brain barrier. In the brain, heroin is converted to morphine and binds rapidly to opioid receptors. Abusers typically report feeling a surge of pleasurable sensation, a "rush." The intensity of the rush is a function of how much drug is taken and how rapidly the drug enters the brain and binds to the natural opioid receptors. Heroin is particularly addictive because it enters the brain so rapidly. With heroin, the rush is usually accompanied by a warm flushing of the skin, dry mouth, and a heavy feeling in the extremities, which may be accompanied by nausea, vomiting, and severe itching.

Effects:

Rush

Depressed respiration

Clouded mental functioning

Nausea and vomiting

Suppression of pain

Spontaneous abortion

After the initial effects, abusers usually will be drowsy for several hours. Mental function is clouded by heroin's effect on the central nervous system. Cardiac functions slow. Breathing is also severely slowed, sometimes to the point of death. Heroin overdose is a particular risk on the street, where the amount and purity of the drug cannot be accurately known.

Heroin Effects: Long Term

One of the most detrimental long-term effects of heroin is addiction itself. Addiction is a chronic, relapsing problem, characterized by compulsive drug seeking and use, and by neurochemical and molecular changes in the brain. Heroin also produces profound degrees of tolerance and physical dependence, which are also powerful motivating factors for compulsive use and abuse. As with abusers of any addictive drug, heroin abusers gradually spend more and more time and energy obtaining and using the drug. Once they are addicted, the heroin abusers' primary purpose in life becomes seeking and using drugs. The drugs literally change their brains.

Effects:

Addiction

Abscesses

Collapsed veins

Bacterial infections

Infection of heart lining and valves

Arthritis and other rheumatologic problems

Infectious diseases, for example, HIV/AIDS and hepatitis B and C

Physical dependence develops with higher doses of the drug. With physical dependence, the body adapts to the presence of the drug and withdrawal symptoms occur if use is reduced abruptly. Withdrawal may occur within a few hours after the last time the drug is taken. Symptoms of withdrawal include restlessness, muscle and bone pain, insomnia, diarrhea, vomiting, cold swapes with goose bumps ("cold turkey"), and leg movements.

From another site:

As with other opiates, heroin is used both as a pain-killer and a recreational drug. Frequent administration quickly leads to tolerance and dependence and has a very high potential for addiction. If sustained use of heroin for as little as three days is stopped abruptly, withdrawal symptoms can appear.

And yet another site (there are literally thousands of them):

What are its short-term effects?

The short-term effects of heroin abuse appear soon after a single dose and disappear in a few hours.After an injection of heroin, the user reports feeling a surge of euphoria ("rush") accompanied by a warm flushing of the skin, a dry mouth, and heavy extremities. Following this initial euphoria, the user goes "on the nod," an alternately wakeful and drowsy state.

Mental functioning becomes clouded due to the depression of the central nervous system. Other effects included slowed and slurred speech, slow gait, constricted pupils, droopy eyelids, impaired night vision, vomiting, constipation.

What are its long-term effects?

Long-term effects of heroin appear after repeated use for some period of time.

Chronic users may develop collapsed veins, infection of the heart lining and valves, abscesses, cellulites, and liver disease. Pulmonary complications, including various types of pneumonia, may result from the poor health condition of the abuser, as well as from heroin's depressing effects on respiration.

In addition to the effects of the drug itself, street heroin may have additives that do not really dissolve and result in clogging the blood vessels that lead to the lungs, liver, kidneys, or brain. This can cause infection or even death of small patches of cells in vital organs. With regular heroin use, tolerance develops. This means the abuser must use more heroin to achieve the same intensity or effect.

And you expect me (or anyone else) to believe:

stop this utter crap that all drugs are bad

some, like herion have nothing bad in them

people- know your subject please!

Oh yes, as to the legality of marijuana, which you offered to show us the translated Act, does the gist of it look anything like this:

The possession/purchase of Cannabis is "tolerated" in small amounts. One can purchase cannabis in special shops (called "coffee shops") if one is age eighteen and over. Sale and purchase of cannabis anywhere else is illegal. Outdoor use is forbidden as well.

Cultivation and wholesale of cannabis is likewise "tolerated" in small amounts (guidelines here are no more than five plants at home or the possession of 5 grams per adult max.).

The tolerance guidelines appear in appendix of the Opium Act.

The Opium Act states very clearly that every part of the hemp plant is banned except for the seeds – this is in accordance with many of the international treaties which the Netherlands have signed.

It is for this reason Cannabis cannot be legalised in the Netherlands. Thus, it remains illegal but it is "tolerated."

A recent court decision allowed a medical cannabis user to avoid legal prosecution for possession of a small number of cannabis plants; however, the state is appealing the decision.

From one of your countrymen on another site:

I am from the Netherlands and officially it is illegal, but tolerated. This is a constantly returning subject in the Netherland, in politics some are stongly against and some are strongly for legalisation.

From the "High Times" website (which got it from USA Today):

Cannabis is technically an illegal substance in the Netherlands, although you won't get arrested for buying or smoking it in a coffee shop.

The Dutch have adopted a policy of "gedogen," or blind eye, to its sale and use since 1976. The government distinguished between so-called "soft" cannabis drugs and "hard" drugs such as heroin or cocaine. That's when coffee houses sprang up to sell and let people smoke.

From "Stop The Drug War.org":

"For more than 30 years under the policy of "gedoogbeleid," which could best be translated as "pragmatic tolerance," the Dutch have allowed the sale of personal amounts of marijuana through the coffee house system, even though doing so is technically illegal."

Wow. Looks like almost everyone else in the world knows that marijuana is ILLEGAL in the Netherlands !

So tell me, where have I made the mistake you claimed in your previous post ?

another exmple of you a mistake

it is not illgal it is decriminamlize

shall I send you a copy of today dutch mandate

( I will translate it for it)

how many more little errors

do yuo see my point

you have made one

which makes me conclude you have made more

you know- I am so sad that I have lost all cred with you

that will really affect my life negitively

unlike many people I know who take all those things you say are so, so bad- but, without any negitive effect ( because they do correctly) please tell me whjy this is

could it ibe...oh no.. you are wrong???

how do you answer this? you cannot,can you?

you do not like hearing the truth, you are blinkered and do not know facts, such as dutch law( some say it is legal in holland- it is not, as mention above) which has just been proven- how else may I educate you?

would like to meet someone who takes, and has taken all their life with zero medical effect because they do correctly?

my medical expert friend states, herion, when not abused, will not negitively effect you

shall we ignore him? them, there are many?

fact time

1- most drugs are no where near as dangerous as said to be, when done correctly - many, many people take all their life, albit secretly will zero negitve affect- I rest my case.

2- current policys stop that from happening- therefore all the problems associated with them.Current policys put unfrtunates in jail and make the real bad guys rich

3- you will never, have never stop people taking drugs

so, what do?

any idea?

[ourmaninbangers]

stop this utter crap that all drugs are bad

some, like herion have nothing bad in them

they prmote like ( check it out if you do not belief

people- know your subject please!

Well, you've lost any credibility you may have had as far as I'm concerned.

Heroin Effects: Short Term

Soon after injection (or inhalation), heroin crosses the blood-brain barrier. In the brain, heroin is converted to morphine and binds rapidly to opioid receptors. Abusers typically report feeling a surge of pleasurable sensation, a "rush." The intensity of the rush is a function of how much drug is taken and how rapidly the drug enters the brain and binds to the natural opioid receptors. Heroin is particularly addictive because it enters the brain so rapidly. With heroin, the rush is usually accompanied by a warm flushing of the skin, dry mouth, and a heavy feeling in the extremities, which may be accompanied by nausea, vomiting, and severe itching.

Effects:

Rush

Depressed respiration

Clouded mental functioning

Nausea and vomiting

Suppression of pain

Spontaneous abortion

After the initial effects, abusers usually will be drowsy for several hours. Mental function is clouded by heroin's effect on the central nervous system. Cardiac functions slow. Breathing is also severely slowed, sometimes to the point of death. Heroin overdose is a particular risk on the street, where the amount and purity of the drug cannot be accurately known.

Heroin Effects: Long Term

One of the most detrimental long-term effects of heroin is addiction itself. Addiction is a chronic, relapsing problem, characterized by compulsive drug seeking and use, and by neurochemical and molecular changes in the brain. Heroin also produces profound degrees of tolerance and physical dependence, which are also powerful motivating factors for compulsive use and abuse. As with abusers of any addictive drug, heroin abusers gradually spend more and more time and energy obtaining and using the drug. Once they are addicted, the heroin abusers' primary purpose in life becomes seeking and using drugs. The drugs literally change their brains.

Effects:

Addiction

Abscesses

Collapsed veins

Bacterial infections

Infection of heart lining and valves

Arthritis and other rheumatologic problems

Infectious diseases, for example, HIV/AIDS and hepatitis B and C

Physical dependence develops with higher doses of the drug. With physical dependence, the body adapts to the presence of the drug and withdrawal symptoms occur if use is reduced abruptly. Withdrawal may occur within a few hours after the last time the drug is taken. Symptoms of withdrawal include restlessness, muscle and bone pain, insomnia, diarrhea, vomiting, cold swapes with goose bumps ("cold turkey"), and leg movements.

From another site:

As with other opiates, heroin is used both as a pain-killer and a recreational drug. Frequent administration quickly leads to tolerance and dependence and has a very high potential for addiction. If sustained use of heroin for as little as three days is stopped abruptly, withdrawal symptoms can appear.

And yet another site (there are literally thousands of them):

What are its short-term effects?

The short-term effects of heroin abuse appear soon after a single dose and disappear in a few hours.After an injection of heroin, the user reports feeling a surge of euphoria ("rush") accompanied by a warm flushing of the skin, a dry mouth, and heavy extremities. Following this initial euphoria, the user goes "on the nod," an alternately wakeful and drowsy state.

Mental functioning becomes clouded due to the depression of the central nervous system. Other effects included slowed and slurred speech, slow gait, constricted pupils, droopy eyelids, impaired night vision, vomiting, constipation.

What are its long-term effects?

Long-term effects of heroin appear after repeated use for some period of time.

Chronic users may develop collapsed veins, infection of the heart lining and valves, abscesses, cellulites, and liver disease. Pulmonary complications, including various types of pneumonia, may result from the poor health condition of the abuser, as well as from heroin's depressing effects on respiration.

In addition to the effects of the drug itself, street heroin may have additives that do not really dissolve and result in clogging the blood vessels that lead to the lungs, liver, kidneys, or brain. This can cause infection or even death of small patches of cells in vital organs. With regular heroin use, tolerance develops. This means the abuser must use more heroin to achieve the same intensity or effect.

And you expect me (or anyone else) to believe:

stop this utter crap that all drugs are bad

some, like herion have nothing bad in them

people- know your subject please!

Oh yes, as to the legality of marijuana, which you offered to show us the translated Act, does the gist of it look anything like this:

The possession/purchase of Cannabis is "tolerated" in small amounts. One can purchase cannabis in special shops (called "coffee shops") if one is age eighteen and over. Sale and purchase of cannabis anywhere else is illegal. Outdoor use is forbidden as well.

Cultivation and wholesale of cannabis is likewise "tolerated" in small amounts (guidelines here are no more than five plants at home or the possession of 5 grams per adult max.).

The tolerance guidelines appear in appendix of the Opium Act.

The Opium Act states very clearly that every part of the hemp plant is banned except for the seeds – this is in accordance with many of the international treaties which the Netherlands have signed.

It is for this reason Cannabis cannot be legalised in the Netherlands. Thus, it remains illegal but it is "tolerated."

A recent court decision allowed a medical cannabis user to avoid legal prosecution for possession of a small number of cannabis plants; however, the state is appealing the decision.

From one of your countrymen on another site:

I am from the Netherlands and officially it is illegal, but tolerated. This is a constantly returning subject in the Netherland, in politics some are stongly against and some are strongly for legalisation.

From the "High Times" website (which got it from USA Today):

Cannabis is technically an illegal substance in the Netherlands, although you won't get arrested for buying or smoking it in a coffee shop.

The Dutch have adopted a policy of "gedogen," or blind eye, to its sale and use since 1976. The government distinguished between so-called "soft" cannabis drugs and "hard" drugs such as heroin or cocaine. That's when coffee houses sprang up to sell and let people smoke.

From "Stop The Drug War.org":

"For more than 30 years under the policy of "gedoogbeleid," which could best be translated as "pragmatic tolerance," the Dutch have allowed the sale of personal amounts of marijuana through the coffee house system, even though doing so is technically illegal."

Wow. Looks like almost everyone else in the world knows that marijuana is ILLEGAL in the Netherlands !

So tell me, where have I made the mistake you claimed in your previous post ?

another exmple of you a mistake

it is not illgal it is decriminamlize

shall I send you a copy of today dutch mandate

( I will translate it for it)

how many more little errors

do yuo see my point

you have made one

which makes me conclude you have made more

OURMANINBANGERS Please kind sir, before you waffle on anymore about things, can you please read Kerryd's post again & think about things for a little while. This post is dead, honestly, its all been covered already. Read & Learn....ohhh and lets teach the world to say "No to drugs"...trust me, its best policy

it will never ever happen - a nice idea- but totally unrealistic, ask maslow....it is the 5th need, surely you know this

much better to have good policys which show those who choose to do correclty, people die mostly from drug abuse NOT use, huge differnce

if good policys this may be avoided, now e just make the mafia rich

by the way, it should be miss, not sir

[ourmaninbangers]

<br />I have seen enough of the damage from heroin to know it's not worth it.<br />Much of that is caused by the high prices causing desperate people to do desperate acts.<br />But I have also seen baby's left un-attended and toddlers unfed, and had shows canceled <br />because artists either couldn't handle going on stage or OD'd backstage.. <br />Or their go[her was caught and they were more concerned with getting the name of his contact,<br /> than getting him out of jail... <br /><br />I have had to work with too many heroin junkies over the years to <br />possibly appreciate it's creative instigations. They are far and few between.<br />It's more likely already creative people, with personal demons or cyclical depressions, <br />going for a little numbness in between periods of creativity... nothing more.<br />I can go on. But won't. <br /><br />I am for 'strictly controled legalization' to get it out of the profiting hands of the dealers <br />and drug lords. <br />Yet, I still think, even with legalization, the smugglers will still do business,<br />and there will still be many, just as cigarattes are still smuggled.<br /><br />These guys still need strict lock up, <br />and it being well known to be very unpleasent. <br />It's no sadistic fantasy.<br /><br />

<br /><br /><br />

but have, as I ahve seen many, most richly enjoying their lifes by taking this....

if not, what gives you trh eright to speak

manhy/most do when done correctly

why deny themfeewill

stop this utter crap that all drugs are bad

some, like herion have nothing bad in them

they prmote like ( check it out if you do not belief

people- know your subject please!

Congratulations ourmaninbangers!!!!!!!!

Living proof of how badly damaged drug abusers become

It never ceases to amaze me the absolute CRAP that these stoners and smack heads come out with.

The sad thing is that they believe it

oh dear..

I may have a little puff once in a while, but thats about it

I do not even drink or smoke the ciggerette...which some say are far worse

lets meet and we can go and me checked- will them say sorry, or " I was wrong" lets do it ,,,, when can we meet?

so, where is your finely tuned logic now- your logic just took a nose dive

I am not for drugs am for the truth and doing things correctly and for good policys

not doing too well are you- why not look for a solution instead of all your failed name calling

so, who is talking crap now

do not make it personal people- you will/have lose

as sensible deabte is what we need

anyway, contact me when you wanna go for my check up- you have to pay of coures!

[ourmaninbangers]

I am for some sort of legalising of illicit drugs.

In most countries alcohol is legal so why should people who choose other drugs be put at a disadvantage and discriminated against because they prefer a different drug which unfortunately happens to be illegal.

Considering the amount of damage alcohol does surely a bit of pot,heroin and coke couldn't make things much worse.

The sheer amount of money involved in the illicit drugs trade is a danger to all our institutions of government.

Our governments, police forces, judiciary and banking systems are being corrupted by the vast amounts of money being made from the drug trade.

I say legalise the drugs. There are always going to be addicts that is just a fact of life but for the majority of people drugs are a leisure item to be enjoyed.

All the fear mongering about drugs is just nonsense.

The benefits of legalisation far outweigh the disadvantages.

Get rid of the crime and corruption that goes with the illegal drug trade and make addiction a health issue.

It is a win win situation.

For those who take pleasure in screaming junkie and drug addict and let them rot.....well you guys have still got your pedophiles to rage on about haven't you?

[ourmaninbangers]

I am for some sort of legalising of illicit drugs.

In most countries alcohol is legal so why should people who choose other drugs be put at a disadvantage and discriminated against because they prefer a different drug which unfortunately happens to be illegal.

Considering the amount of damage alcohol does surely a bit of pot,heroin and coke couldn't make things much worse.

The sheer amount of money involved in the illicit drugs trade is a danger to all our institutions of government.

Our governments, police forces, judiciary and banking systems are being corrupted by the vast amounts of money being made from the drug trade.

I say legalise the drugs. There are always going to be addicts that is just a fact of life but for the majority of people drugs are a leisure item to be enjoyed.

All the fear mongering about drugs is just nonsense.

The benefits of legalisation far outweigh the disadvantages.

Get rid of the crime and corruption that goes with the illegal drug trade and make addiction a health issue.

It is a win win situation.

For those who take pleasure in screaming junkie and drug addict and let them rot.....well you guys have still got your pedophiles to rage on about haven't you?

thank you sir

I have the redneck herd on my case

one guy's gonna pay for my drugs check to prove I am no druggys as he puts it I will them print out what he said and make him eat his words

people like him will run, hide, never reply when they know they have been caught out....

and yet, they try and have some credibilty

you can always dismiss those who do not back there words

[ourmaninbangers]

Its a simple thing Tolley, really why don't we just legalise everything. If you want to smoke pot, thats OK. If I want to do armed hold-ups or mug old ladies that ok, that way each of us can look after our own. Of course we can do all of this because the levels of corruption amoungst the Police, Courts and Governments are so high, do you really think corruption is that high, or are you going to let a few bad eggs completely destroy a system, imagine if we gave up on something everytime a human being got greedy

You would have to be kidding about how much damage could a few extra drugs in society cause? You say that the benifits of Legalisation of drugs far outweighs the disadvantages, perhaps you could outline a few for us?

Imagine the beauty of legalising drugs, then we could add taxes to them....good for revenue.... but in that world, I'm not going to pay taxes, why would I bother to pay taxes?

We decriminalise drugs & move it over to the health system.....its good, everything is just in little boxes we can just move the problems around, neat and tidy. Maybe when the health systems had enough of the druggies we could move their problems over to the energy systems of the world, see if they can take care of the little box for a while?

Trying to solve the worlds drug problem is no easy job, I actually doubt it can be achieved & by flicking switches and changing laws willy nilly, isnt going to solve the problems.

One thing that most people seem to forget about when they talk about legalising drugs, that the actual production, purchase and consumption of the drugs isnt the whole problem. There are all the issues about dealing with the effects of people that are affected by drugs & the long term uses of such drugs. If it is the case that the use of a particular drug increases due to it becoming legalised then the greater affect of this has to be taken into consideration. Do you really think society as a whole has to change its laws & expectations to accomodate the few people that have substance abuse as a problem?

As for the idea that people with substance abuse problems wouldnt be in jail if the substance was legalised, that is the greatest load of rubbish. Despite what some people think, people with serious drug dependacies are unable to contribute to society in a full functioning way & neither should we want them. Do you really want to work alongside someone that is high on whatever....should that person be allowed to drive, operate machinary, make decisions that affect other people, how bout the local brain surgeon 'high' while he removes a tumor? Come on, get real! A lot of seriously effected people can't think of anything other than their next hit, they don't want to do an honest job, they want the cash hard & fast, there will still be crime. You wouldnt have to go too far to hear a story about how junkies rip off their own families & that type of thing to realise that this would still go on.

Anyway, I've got to go, I'm running late to get to a 'hang em high' club meeting !

You seem to think that all people who take illicit substances are thieveing conniving no goods.

The fact is that most people who take illicit substance are pretty much like you and me just average normal people. Unfortunately their drug of choice is not alcohol but an illegal one.

The vast majority of people who take illegal drugs are not criminals per see nor are they raging dope fiends like you seem to think.

As with alcohol a certain percentage of people have substance abuse problems but for those that take illicit substance that means their problems are more likely to involve jail time and ostracism from the general society and of course a certain demonisation by posters like yourself who seem to think that one form of substance abuse is worse than another.

It isn't and it is attitudes like yours that perpetuate this great divide myth between the "junkie" and the rest of society.

Legalise drugs and remove the profit incentive for criminal gangs.

And let the health system deal with the addicts.

Yes, alright I give in, all those grubs I have dealt with for the last 20 years or so, cut em loose....that will solve everything.

Please forgive me for my indiscretions, being stabbed in the chest by a junkie on a wild crime spree seems to have tainted my opinion.

ah... poor thing,, I thought there had to be some reason why you talk like a victim

well, when you paying for my drugs check , lets have that old wound looked into...

we may get a discont and you may find it hit some nerve endings somewhere

bumingrad does a nice quick check and has macdonalds- I expect you'd like that

anyway, looking forward to thyat check and your post after that stating I am drugs free and you were wrong

and can I film you eating your words- I'll buy you big mac if I can words

[JacknDanny]

<br />I have seen enough of the damage from heroin to know it's not worth it.<br />Much of that is caused by the high prices causing desperate people to do desperate acts.<br />But I have also seen baby's left un-attended and toddlers unfed, and had shows canceled <br />because artists either couldn't handle going on stage or OD'd backstage.. <br />Or their go[her was caught and they were more concerned with getting the name of his contact,<br /> than getting him out of jail... <br /><br />I have had to work with too many heroin junkies over the years to <br />possibly appreciate it's creative instigations. They are far and few between.<br />It's more likely already creative people, with personal demons or cyclical depressions, <br />going for a little numbness in between periods of creativity... nothing more.<br />I can go on. But won't. <br /><br />I am for 'strictly controled legalization' to get it out of the profiting hands of the dealers <br />and drug lords. <br />Yet, I still think, even with legalization, the smugglers will still do business,<br />and there will still be many, just as cigarattes are still smuggled.<br /><br />These guys still need strict lock up, <br />and it being well known to be very unpleasent. <br />It's no sadistic fantasy.<br /><br />

<br /><br /><br />

but have, as I ahve seen many, most richly enjoying their lifes by taking this....

if not, what gives you trh eright to speak

manhy/most do when done correctly

why deny themfeewill

stop this utter crap that all drugs are bad

some, like herion have nothing bad in them

they prmote like ( check it out if you do not belief

people- know your subject please!

Congratulations ourmaninbangers!!!!!!!!

Living proof of how badly damaged drug abusers become

It never ceases to amaze me the absolute CRAP that these stoners and smack heads come out with.

The sad thing is that they believe it

oh dear..

I may have a little puff once in a while, but thats about it

I rest my case.

[Patsycat]

That's one BIG doobie!!!

[neverdie]

Naa thats not a big rolly, this is a big rolly!

[ourmaninbangers]

I can't believe that some people here actually support the use of drugs or want to make it legal.

Have you actually seen what it does to people? Have you spoken to people high on crack, or children in their strange cannabis world. Should those be the future of our world?

I have seen/known so many people have a great time, no harm to themselves or other...fact

drug are not nearly as bad as the goverment wants to think

fact, some drugs have zero adverse effect, unlike smoking alchol

have you freewil or are well sheep

just do as we are told by those who have our wellbeing at heart, ha,ha,ha

another fact- it will NEVER stop and we need new policys

[ourmaninbangers]

Naa thats not a big rolly, this is a big rolly!

when are we going to bumigrad for my medical check?

according to you I must be on something...

a check will show- then you will have to admit that you are wrong

then I want to ask you ( after I have made you eat your words slowly which I want to take photos of and post here) what other assumptions you have made that could be wrong?

I thought you would ignore this challenge.. your type always does

typical

and you expect people to listen to those who cannot back up what they say...

there is little hope when peple who do this have a voice

whatever happened to people of substance

[lioness]

He broke the law and will pay the price, maybe he will loose his life.

I am sorry for his family, I remember years ago when Australians, Chambers and Barlow were sentenced to death in Penang for drug smuggling, I felt deeply for the families, especially the mothers visiting their sons in Jail and knowing they were going to be hanged by the neck until dead. As a mother I know I would never recover from that.

The daughter is young and no doubt be spared the details but it will leave it's mark.

For those of you sickos who say get rid of them all and clear the gene pool, lets hope noone in your familys ever strays from the straight and narrow.

In fact there are some really sickening offensive posts here, which makes me wonder just how far into the mire this forum has sunk to.

[dingdongrb]

Interesting.......

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/28418762

[neverdie]

Interesting.......

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/28418762

Hey DDrb, where on earth do you find this stuff. Perhaps its OURMANINBANGERS that has been right all along....maybe he/she is a bee?

[MyphuketLife]

QUOTE (ourmaninbangers @ 2008-12-25 22:44:45)

stop this utter crap that all drugs are bad

some, like herion have nothing bad in them

they prmote like ( check it out if you do not belief

people- know your subject please!

He's actually not far off the mark here. I wonder how many people are sitting with a beer in their hand thinking how bad heroin is.

Alcohol is far more unhealthy and cases more damage to society.

As for the OP, this is Christmas, have some compassion. Legalising heroin is the only way to stop this nonsense of the death penalty for traffickers and also for heroin cut with dangerous chemicals to reach the public.

I can't believe people argue this.... if you want to make drugs legal or not, you can't honestly think Acohol is far more unhealthy and causes more damage to society.... It may cause more damage because its a numbers game, its legal so more people use it, but I have never seen a video of a hooker hooking and sucking for beer money.....

[JacknDanny]

when are we going to bumigrad for my medical check?

according to you I must be on something...

a check will show- then you will have to admit that you are wrong

then I want to ask you ( after I have made you eat your words slowly which I want to take photos of and post here) what other assumptions you have made that could be wrong?

I thought you would ignore this challenge.. your type always does

typical

and you expect people to listen to those who cannot back up what they say...

there is little hope when peple who do this have a voice

whatever happened to people of substance

Every time I read one of your posts, I keep getting flashbacks to Officer Crabtree out of 'Allo Allo'

[animatic]

QUOTE (ourmaninbangers @ 2008-12-25 22:44:45)

stop this utter crap that all drugs are bad

some, like herion have nothing bad in them

they prmote like ( check it out if you do not belief

people- know your subject please!

He's actually not far off the mark here. I wonder how many people are sitting with a beer in their hand thinking how bad heroin is.

Alcohol is far more unhealthy and cases more damage to society.

As for the OP, this is Christmas, have some compassion. Legalising heroin is the only way to stop this nonsense of the death penalty for traffickers and also for heroin cut with dangerous chemicals to reach the public.

I can't believe people argue this.... if you want to make drugs legal or not, you can't honestly think Acohol is far more unhealthy and causes more damage to society.... It may cause more damage because its a numbers game, its legal so more people use it, but I have never seen a video of a hooker hooking and sucking for beer money.....

No, you just don't see the video of them buying the beer with money they made sucking,

it doesn't get made into big screen films often, no pathos.

[neverdie]

when are we going to bumigrad for my medical check?

according to you I must be on something...

a check will show- then you will have to admit that you are wrong

then I want to ask you ( after I have made you eat your words slowly which I want to take photos of and post here) what other assumptions you have made that could be wrong?

I thought you would ignore this challenge.. your type always does

typical

and you expect people to listen to those who cannot back up what they say...

there is little hope when peple who do this have a voice

whatever happened to people of substance

Every time I read one of your posts, I keep getting flashbacks to Officer Crabtree out of 'Allo Allo'

Jackndanny,

Major that friend of yours!