Udon Ride List Darn Thing's Outgrown Me Agian

[ray23]

We started out on this journey a long time ago with guys riding 200's Ect. Today many riding 1000 CC's and bigger.

In the beginning it was very apparent that riders were very different. John in Khon Kean stepped in for the sport bikes. At the time I thought that would do the trick fast guys and slow guys.

I was dead wrong. I believe there are really three types of riders Fast, Medium and slow.

Well I'm slow. I really don't see a need to create a third grouping.

Riding is a very individual aspect of life. I have limits, I will not ride past my abilty nor the ability of my equipement and I will ride to the prevailing road conditions.

I truly beleive the ride list is a benefit to the community and I fully intend to continue with it. I enjoy the social aspect and have met some great people through this. I will post rides for anyone that cares to give me the information.

I will in addition post my own rides and lead them. Man will I miss Dil leading that is a terrible thing to do but I can do it. So if I post a ride it will be slow and I will lead, count on getting lost I do that. Also count on frequent breaks. Something I need to do for my back.

I will post them show up if that kind of riding fits for you, if not you probably won't be very happy with the ride. I believe riding as a group means riding together and that means riding to weakest rider not the best.

That can be very frustrating for experienced riders.

But me I'm retired not in hurry to go anywhere and I enjoy really seeing the area that I go through.

Since I have made many friends here I have no desire to upset anyone and sometimes just saying what's on your mind is the best approach. So I don't mean to offend anyone and hope to maintain the friendships I have made. But I have to ride as I can.

So I will be doing it my way, if it fits anyone is welcome. If it doesn't hopefully the other guys will continue to get the infromation out on the rides they take and everyone should have a group they can be comfortable with on a ride.

Socially such as the Eagle Riders meeting I see no reason why we all can't share that aspect.

So in the future if I post a ride I will identify it as a slow ride. If you don't see that, then it more then likely it will be a mid group ride not quiet as fast as sport bikes, but not slow.

[GizmoBKK]

Interesting reading, ray23.

First thing that comes to my mind: cannot help it, but think that "fast" and "slow" are not the only criteria to distinguish riders. What about "high risk" and "low risk"?

Second thing: the slow ride concept fits nicely to "Sport Riding Techniques" by Nick Ienatsch which I recently added to my bookshelf. The author is a professional rider who recommends to keep the speeding for the race track, and instead promotes finding joy on the road by bringing your riding skills to perfection. - And let's be honest, speeding alone is no skill; every idiot can open the throttle. But this perfect cornering or getting the bike to maximum deceleration under control are different stories...

So, enjoy the slow ride.

[Travelmate]

what do you mean by slow? And what is fast?

I followed a 250 Ninjette on my fire spitting Ninja ZX10R all the way to CM. And would classify that ride as neither slow or fast. Just enjoyable.

[ray23]

It's really something hard to define. Sometimes I ride at 120 sometimes it's 80, 400CC bikes can't do much more if it's not a sports bike. Depends on the roads I'm on. to me that is a slow rider

Everyone enjoys rides in different ways, we have guys on the sports bikes, will hit 180. Why that group has it's own leader. I think these guys are best described in the previous post

The medium group I would say 110 to 140 crusing hittting 160 sometimes.

That doesn't fit me.

Even if my bike would do it and I ahev a few that would, I don't conider myself capable enough to handle that it is endangering my pasenger and myself.

The group rides are a social event to me. I also do solo rides.

The list has been split once aready, still 40 riders on the Udon list. Some are great riders some medicore such as myself. Some need more ride time.

I think it all going to work out just fine. The guys who don't want to run hard will be riding with the looky Lu guys like me. If thier abilties get better then they can go up to the next level.

Whats happening now is guys are overiding thier abitles trying to stay up and that is dangerous.

I beleive this normal when yuo put things like this together. If I stopped right now I have accomplished what I set out to do, Got the riders in the area together. That was the goal. What they do with it after that is really an individual thing.

Just growing pains.

Lots of advantages in it, a lot of the rides that I ahve been on in the past six years, your only goign to find them with local knowledge. So guys share ideas, what shops to use all done word of mouth,

I really recomment this is if you don't have something like it in you area. I'm not a club kind of guy, but I do enjoy the social aspect of group riding.

I think the differences in riding styles just goes with the territory. I have no comment about how another person rides, But I do intend to saty within my limitations. If tha fits for other then they are welcome. If not there are really three different levels posting rides at this point so pretty good selection.

I put it on the forum as I do post rides on here as well. Better to be upfront about what your going to be doing then getting people upset, after the fact.

[AnthonyR1]

maybe it's just me and the ppl i have ridden with but generally anything above 160 for an extended period is hard work. sure, with a bigger bike i have opportunity to open it up periodically but generally we cruise around 140 to 160...and a lot of the time even less than that. thailand highways are full of small towns, lights, u-turn lanes, traffic and not to mention having to stop for fuel every 200 or so km. i find you have to choose your time carefully to blast up to 200 or more.

few years back i joined a ride to CM, travelmate was on that ride as well....on the way back we caned the bikes and it was a HARD ride. hehehe maybe i'm getting old but i find a mixture of riding styles and bike size is a good thing as it keeps the pack in check. anyone who wants to ride up ahead is fine with me, eventually they get caught up.

arrive alive is a good theme for long trips.

PS. i was doing 225 on my ninja south of hua hin 3 years ago when a massive buffalo decided to cross the road....i kept my line but that oversize hamburger was within 2 meters of me when i went passed it woke me up a bit

[GizmoBKK]

[...]

I followed a 250 Ninjette on my fire spitting Ninja ZX10R all the way to CM. And would classify that ride as neither slow or fast. Just enjoyable.

Though I haven't met you guys in person (yet!), I have an idea who that was on the Ninjette

It's really something hard to define. Sometimes I ride at 120 sometimes it's 80, 400CC bikes can't do much more if it's not a sports bike. Depends on the roads I'm on. to me that is a slow rider

[...]

Still, I have a slightly different view here: 80 to 120 (no matter whether km/h or mph...) can be way TOO fast depending on the circumstances. (How many people can REALLY do an emergency braking at 120 km/h?)

[...] If thier abilties get better then they can go up to the next level.

[...]

If this is supposed to mean "fast = skilled", I cannot agree: a skilled driver will adjust his (her) speed according to the environment.

Reminds me of this pilots' saying: "There are many bold pilots. And there are many old pilots. But there are only few old bold pilots."

Safe riding guys (and girls)

[ray23]

Well here in Issan on the country roads 80 is it for me. To many dogs, cattle waterbuffalo and the occasional elephant.

People coming out of side roads that have never looked for oncoming traffic.

There are roads here that 80 is to fast, just to many huge pot holes to dodge.

Thier are curves on the Mae Hong on loop that would be a real challenge to go through at 80.

We have guys that can run 200 as safe as anyone else, I'm not one of them

[AnthonyR1]

and the occasional elephant.

ouch! that would suck....not to mention the ridicule for life you would get from your friends. "you hit a what"?

ray, you're right though, the obstacles are endless.

[Travelmate]

It's all down to having the right pace at the place of ride. Slow in traffic, speed up on highways, twisties take it easy and so forth. But the real danger is having a beginner in wrong group trying to stay with the faster riders when they speed up for a little bit dance on the tarmac.

The other is I hate taking the lead as I always feel I am riding too slow for the group and tend to add speed as we go along.

Like the CM trip couple of years back. We were lucky on the way back. Speeds were supersonic.

[ray23]

I know the feeling leading is not fun. I'm going to post it as a slow ride hope they believe me

[AnthonyR1]

The other is I hate taking the lead as I always feel I am riding too slow for the group and tend to add speed as we go along.

ya leading sucks. too fast and you're a maniac. too slow and you're a wimp. :-) i prefer to hang back or or in the middle of the pack and do my blasts as i see fit. dam_n, feel like riding now!

[ray23]

Well it will be good to get out with a few of the guys, who like to take things easy. It will all work out.

[LivinLOS]

Some really interesting comments..

I am really variable.. On a open road straight and with sightlines I will push 180.. But I was very concious when we met up and the lads were all on thier new 250's and I was on an old 400, with big saddle and tank bag, that my handling was much more lose than thiers and I readily admit that a couple were higher skill level (and machines) or just more comfortable then me.. the pressure to be fast is a bad feeling when I want to ride relaxed.. Also the morning having a couple of near misses in the group made me quite nervous about what was going on behind me, something I am not used to.. As such I do find riding alone probably more fun but then you want some mates when you stop. I also ride totally differently with my GF on the back, then its cruise with some minor playtime, I wont take risks then.

Second thing: the slow ride concept fits nicely to "Sport Riding Techniques" by Nick Ienatsch which I recently added to my bookshelf. The author is a professional rider who recommends to keep the speeding for the race track, and instead promotes finding joy on the road by bringing your riding skills to perfection. - And let's be honest, speeding alone is no skill; every idiot can open the throttle. But this perfect cornering or getting the bike to maximum deceleration under control are different stories...

This is really interesting (and will add the book to my next order) as I was going to post something similar after my time in CM.. I think its quite hard to progress as a rider, beyond a fairly basic proficiency without good roads to do so on. If all you have are straight boring inter province roads, and roads that are covered in sand, and things you need to keep reserve grip for, then learning to push safely is nearly impossible. Sure a well rounded rider will have skill for all terrain, urban, highway, fast road, track, even off road etc but realistically you dont build those skills without the practice and you cant practice without the terrain.

I really found myself up in CM, staying well within my boundaries of grip (had GF on back) and choosing to not make her all nervous and REALLY concentrated on being as smooth as I could.. Smooth in the gear selection, smooth in throttle inputs, smooth in corner lines.. Not fast and attack but sort of clean.. It was amazing how much satisfaction I could get from simply getting everything 'right' even tho I was no where near the limits.. Just getting the precise approach, breaking, downchange, meeting the throttle blip to the gear speed, correct line and adding throttle input 'just so' on the line out.. In just a few days of those windy mountain roads my riding had come on leaps and bounds and that was even on a bit of a clunker rental bike, not my own which was more suited to the twisties. I was going to post about how you kind of need good roads to progress and how surprised I was to find myself really enjoying that 'zen' of smooth so much, in fact at my skill level its harder than it sounds to be 'perfect' often, speed riding and hard inputs tends to mask that kind of corrections you apply to your mistakes. Of course being smooth in turn also makes you much more confident and fast, but as a byproduct. I made a promise to myself to keep that as my goal, to be a smooth clean rider first and foremost and let any speed come from that starting place, not force it out.

Bikes are a very personal thing, but one thing that CM trip showed me was just by getting a complex or reducing curve just right, or double apexing without any line adjustment, even at lower speeds left me grinning with satisfaction. Of course this is also why I am itching to get back up there.

[ray23]

You know yuo couldn't be more accurate riding is a very personal thing and what makes one person feel good. May bore the heck out of some and put others on a constant edge.

I have came to the conclusion that when 15 or 20 people are involved finding a balance is next to impossible. The only answer for that is prearranged meeting spots.

I'm sure the ride we will have Friday will be a lot smaller group. Thats OK anyone can post rides on the ride list. After two years I'm fairly confident I know who rides as I do and those who wish to move long faster then I'm comfortable with.

I'm more then happy to keep posting rides for the guys. Gives me something to do and I enjoy seeing people come to gather and share a wonderful hobby. At whatever level they can.

I'll sit up rides for the slower guys and lead even if I hate it. Sure a lot more fun to let someone else do thinking and just kick back. Oh well

The fact that it has outgrown me twice means it's a worthwhile concept.

[ray23]

Speaking of dogs.

This is a heck of way to prove a point

We did everything possible to do a safe ride and even with that things can go wrong. We even did a safty briefing in the end I was very thankful for that cause no one ran over my wife or I.

The Culprit amazing that the owners cared for their dog so much that they bought it sweater to protect it from the cold. But, not enough to keep it off a busy highway

I had always been told if your going to hit a dog hit him straight on, I remember thinking that as I saw there way no way I was going to avoid it. So I was doing all that I could to do just that. One of those times no where to go for me or the dog. Oncoming traffic coming now that would have hurt. Dog got scared and ran for the edge of the road at the last possible second.

Lots of things happening real fast, Question did I lock up my rear brake trying to slow, don't know I know there were skids. I also know I just had the brakes redone and they were much more sensitive then I was used to So maybe I really don't know.

The skids were side way brush skid, so I just don't know. Hitting them straight good as anyhting I can think of now that I have experienced it. I do know this, when my front tire hit the dog it went the same direction the dog was running. Not good folks get um to stand still :wink:

The rear end felt the same way. Did that put me into a skid can't say, might have hit the breaks to hard. Believe me things are happening very very quickly.

Mind you we were doing around 70 Klms before the accident. We had already been confronted with dogs on the edge of the road . Horn kept them out of the road.

[

The worse injury was a severly sprained ankle, note the front crash bar going into the foot board. My guess that is where it came from. Since it was my right ankle. Believe me since I have to rebuild anyway. I will have custom crash bars made hopefully that won't happen again. But that is no light bike by the time we actually went down still had to be doing 40 Klms. That is a lot of wieght and energy.

IMG]http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u52/rayfisher23/Ride%207-27/Accident%201-16/100_2578.jpg[/img]

An Amazing thing bike hit on the right side the left handle bar snapped at the T. After market bars put on the bike for looks not by me more for looks then anything else. So this time a good set of strong bars. Rear crash bars and sissy bar can't say enough about them. Wife had few minor scratch marks on her upper thigh. Guys tell me she stayed with the bike and rode it out. I know I did but I wa a bit busy at the time. That equipment protected her no doubt about it Also the bars and bag absorb a lot of energy on impact.

Well I was going to post some more photos but photo buket is not coperating today. So I'm just goign to finish the story. I will say that the villager were very worried about me trying to get to the hospital, heck we were ony 20 Klms out of Udon. Not that serious.

We actually ended up with a mechanic coming from Udon and picking the bike up. He delieverd us right to our front door. Question will it be ready fro the Udon Bike week. I really doubt it.

Can't say enough about the guys on the ride list, stepped right in got things organized very quickly and made the sure the wife and I were OK. They stayed and helped load the monster in the truck not something I could have done. Finally convienced them that I was alright to go ahead and finish the ride and enjoy the day. One of those days one the guys had Mechanicle problems same mechanic came out from Udon and picked up his bike as well.

Turned out the new road I wanted to ride was pretty much a goat path, hey at least I know and I can scratch that one off the list.

One guy was talking to me about not going because his wife told him before he left to be careful that she had a dream and there was going to be an accident, I told well heck thats done I just did it might as well go. I missed seeing Lickey, oh well next time. He called to check on me as John from Udon has done several times as well. Nice to have good friends.

I went home elevated the ankle put ice on it.

It seemed to be good idea the next day and get an xray, rather painful. Well not broken that was good news. They applied a partial splint gave me some crutches. First time I have ever used them. I have a gained a lot of respect for people who do, real quick.

My attitude about safety has not changed one bit. No matter what you do you ride long enough your going to go down, comes with the territory. That is a given what is not a given is how badly are you going to be hurt.

We did this at 70klms, what would the results have been at 140klms. My guess a lot more severe injures. So I will still be riding my way.

Wouldn't it be nice if the bike and I were fixed at the same time somehow I doubt that.

Well Photobucket fianlly gave in. You got the story that goes with them.

Last by but not least I was really proud of my wife through this a real trooper. Laughed at me a lot but never complained.

[Lickey]

Hi Ray,

Glad that you & Mrs are ok, When the bikes arived and parked opposite the salon, i was looking for you & mrs, Then Khurram came over and explained what had happened with you and the dog and that you told them to carry on to Namsom ect.First, we all had tea or coffee then walked down to the food market, had different dishes ect, i think they all enjoyed it, all empty bowls!!

So then we got under way, gas station first, and eventually the road? to Suhana Khuha, [however it is spelt?] 5k concrete, 3 k potholed tarmac, 4k just red earth, [god knows what its like when it rains] then 1 place they were dragging up the tarmac with like a 6 wheeled scraper, so the tarmac was just loose cobble stones, there was an untouched part about 1/2 mtr wide with overhanging trees we got along at about 15kph,After 3 turnarounds Khuurram asked us to lead the group, my mrs knows the area, the signposts are small or non exsistant here, this went on for 50ks, eventually Suhana Khuha,then we got going, good roads, but sticking to the slow riders max of 80kph,very good hill roads, eying up the next bend, snicking down the gears, and gunning my XJR1200 out of the bend on the can is a very satisfying sound, mrs loves it too, [im 56, mrs 46] Then one of the bikes stopped, i think it was a broken cam chain, keep me posted on my diagnosis please Ray, when recovery arrangements were made, we had to get back to Namsom for closing time at the Salon,

You can definitely srcatch that Namsom-Kuhna Suwha road of your list Ray, or send it to the Dakar Rally people, the riders who came here friday, a really great bunch of blokes, look forward to seeing them and yourself again, Cheers, Lickey & Pan..

[MJo]

Mind you we were doing around 70 Klms before the accident. We had already been confronted with dogs on the edge of the road . Horn kept them out of the road.

Lucky you and your wife are ok, i've ran over a dog myself doing 125 kph and know from experience there is not much you can do regardless of your speed. Things happen fast but as you mentined you have some time to react i.e. try to slow down but not that much control if it's gonna throw your bike sideways.

Happened to me few years back between Udon and KK. I got lucky as i missed it with my front tire by couple of inches and took it to my left foot / foot peg. This propably saved my life as i managed to keep the bike on the road and rubber side down. I'm sure that if i would take it under my front tire i definedly would have crashed the bike with trees in the road side and in the middle so almost certain death or major injuries. Also i reckon it helped me to keep balance as i was not hard on brakes at the time of the impact. My natural reaction was to brake but it happened so fast that i only managed to pull the clutch before impact.

It was hard impact and threw my leg back out of the peg and i totally lost any feeling from my leg which started to returned slowly only after 10 mins. No fractures thanks to good boots.

And man the beer was good after the ride that day

Good luck to all and keep an eye on the little buggers while riding.

[ray23]

Probably would hae n been allright had not braked. Live and learn

[CroBiker]

I have came to the conclusion that when 15 or 20 people are involved finding a balance is next to impossible. The only answer for that is prearranged meeting spots.

Ray, I see this pattern only among some "got to prove myself" farangs here in Thailand. I spent 8 years riding with Malaysians and Singaporeans, they would never leave rider behind just because he is slower then others. And they drive much better and more powerfull bikes then folks in Thailand. Prior to trip we would agree on average cruising speed and most experienced riders would take 1 position each: at the front and end of the pack to make sure all goes smooth. Telling slow rider "we will meet you later at this or that spot" is real bullshit and has nothing to do with group ride.

Edited January 17, 2009 by CroBiker

[ray23]

agreed the ride we took was for the slow riders. I went down was no abandoned we stuck together. Exactly what I would have and have done. I had to push them to finish the ride. I was OK everything that could be done was done.

When the bike is done I'll set up another ride. Next time I hit a dog I will stay off the brakes.

Through that area the other guys would have been riding 130m we were doing under 70 when I hit the dog. There is just to much going on out on those country roads for high speeds.

130 I doubt we would have walked away from that.

Not for me to tell anyone how to ride except myself. People that want to are more then welcome to join me. Or anyone else. we are no a club so anyone can post rides.

Me I enjoy the social contact which mean staying together.

When we started out it wasn't like this, just changed over time.

I was really surprised when eight riders showed up for this ride. I was expecting one other guy.

I had a guy riding sweep so he was the only one I had to keep track of.

Really progressing as a good ride then OOPPPS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Man I hate riding lead but at the moment that is the only option. Things will come together a long as the guys keep communicating a few of them are angry at me fo the moment. So I'm not hearing much from them they will get over it.

Sometime people don't like to hear what you got to say. Right now the weather is great and everyone wants to be out here. When the heat and rain hits it gets down to hard core guys. But. my speeds are saying where they are. I'll hear from the other guys then.

You know it takes time to get used to riding here I'm more then happy to go out with new guys and help them get in ride time at their level so they can improve.

It's funny to watch the guys progress, they get frustrated at times with the slower riders. They forget how they were at first. I have not forgotten myself in those days. What scares me most is guys trying to keep up when their skills are not up to it. Me i ride to weakest link on a group ride. The other guys philosphy, they got to keep up. Like I said right now they got lots of riders out there.

40 plus years of riding and a pooch put me down. People going to down if they ride for log enough just a part of the hobby. Question are you going to walk away. Do things right and more then likely you are to do that. Like I said I'm not here to tell people how to ride. But in all honesty i ee peeds out ther that are more appropriate to race tracks then public roads.

I think the guys down in Pattaya actually have place to do that, nothing in this area.

I will keep plugging along and guys will sort themselves out. No fast riders showed up for my ride. It will work out in the end.

[CroBiker]

Accidents involving animals, tell me about it....

This was written by experienced rider:

Most of us don’t put much thought what to do when they appear on the road. Some will think the following comments are coldhearted. They are meant to save you from harm. Most riders, when trying to avoid that cute little squirrel, cat or dog on the road overreact and crash their bike or car. To avoid this, aim at the rear hindquarters of the animal. Most of the time the animal will go to direction the head is aiming. If it is a small animal it is better to hit it than over correcting and crashing to avoid it. A 500-pound bike with 200 pounds of human will win over a 5 to 20 pound animal. Do not watch where the animal is going, as that will cause you to steer into the animal, watch where the animal was. Prepare as if you will hit the small animal for the small bump. Do not break hard during the impact as that will cause you to loose control. It is better to roll over the road hazard (small animal) than to slide over it. Larger animals tend to travel in herds and you will get to see the first one but will hit the second. Watch the shoulder areas especially in farm areas for loose farm or game animals. Slow down for the animal you don’t see in the ditch beside the road. For large animals aim behind the rear hindquarters but keep breaking incase there is a second animal. Being mentally prepared for the accident will help you avoid most accidents without damage. It will help you recognize the accident before it happens. Work through your escape paths and scenarios as you drive. You will live longer and not spend time recovering from injuries.

[LivinLOS]

I poleaxed a dog once on a CB400.. He came out, then kinda saw me and froze for a sec, I max braked but a second before impact let off all braking and tensed to try to keep the bars from going anywhere.. Lucking for the dog he leapt at the last moment so instead of T boning him, probably snapping his spine and all manner of nastyness, I think I must have hit his rear thigh.. He didnt go under the wheel rather bounced (yelping) in a mega flying spin.. As I skidded to a halt trying to recover from the brown trouser moment he was up and running away so have to assume wasnt broken (or not too badly)..

Its only when something all bursts into emergency mode that you realise how fast it all happens. I probably wasnt going that fast either as it was still in a semi built up area..

When I was a kid with 50cc bikes I had a full face wreck of a helmet without a visor, a pigeon startled out of the hedgerow and exploded on me in a cloud of feathers.. That put the fear on me too !!

[ray23]

In this case ther was no escape path oncoming traffic one side dog going the other way. If I had not gotten hard on the brakes doubt I would have went down. Normally you can get around them. No car coming it would have been easy. somtimes you got no place to go. I would say that is good advice.

[ray23]

HAVE BAG WILL TRAVEL

Some things can't wait forever so off to the mechanic, not bad under 25K baht Includes a completly new paint job and air brush work added the IROT Logo. Committed to having it done by Udon Bike Week, not betting on that one.

Modified the front crash bars, to include an additional brace back to the frame so maybe next time it won't try to break my leg. Cause as sure as I am sitting at this computer there will be another one. Goes with the territory :wink:

[klx250]

what is up with these dogs lately?

riding in the hills on friday I was entering a left hand corner about 30 kmh on dirt/gravel.........a dog came out of nowhere from the right rear and started the running/growling routine......I turned and looked to the right which threw the weight of the bike off and the front slid out.......it happened in a flash and I was down hard.......the result was a big gash on my forearm that needed stitches + bad gravel rash.

going back with a knife in 2 weeks to look for the dog, it's going to have more than a gash when I finished carving it up.

Edited January 19, 2009 by klx250

[ray23]

Don't know about gravel roads but asphalt is warm and it's been very cold lately

[barrybike]

hope your better soon ray ,,,you ll be back out on your bike in no time,take it easy for a bit.......cheers

[ray23]

With any luck we will be ready at the same time.

[Thumchok]

With any luck we will be ready at the same time.

All the best for a speedy recovery Ray .

Good to see your keen to get back onto it .

[ray23]

We are definetly a bunch of strange nut buckets. Can't walk good yet, but I want to ride so bad I can taste it