My Catfish Farm Operation

[Openmind111]

I take it positive, I can sit beside, watch and learn without being directly affected, I still believe there can be money made by farming in Thailand as many farmers tell so, who post here, we just have to do it right and sometimes with a bit persistance, when it doesn't work out straight away as we imagined.

I have a few plans but more for that when I have a bit more time to write...

[cdmtdm]

rb ..... you mention 3 to 4 inch fingerlings , when i buy my Tilapia they are supposed to be 4 cm fingerlings , however i reckon 60 percent are 2 cm and less than 1 gram .... i cannot find a supplier selling larger fingerlings , i think 6 inch and 5 grams or so would be perfect ...any thoughts on that ?

[RedBullHorn]

Cdmtdm, up here in the north fingerlings for Pla Duk are sold by the inches and fingerlings of Pla Nin are sold by coin size...

Sizes are measured according to 1 Thb, 5 Thb and 10 Thb coin sizes.

The cage farm by the Mekong River are raise by some farmer using advance stage juvenile measuring 2-3 fingers size (look at your digit and middle fingers sticking together). These farmers only need to raise them for 4 month plus to harvest.

[RedBullHorn]

Building a Sala that double as a bridge...

Finishing up in the cool morning fog...

My neighbour's prepared plot for next crop...

[weedywhaoo]

RBH, I have with great interest followed your fishfarming operation. It is very pleasing to see a farang succeding in the farming business here. I have now decided to enter the cat fish farming business, so hopefully we can change some advice and ideas along the line. I have scouted for land for six months and finally got a piece of land in Saraburi, 12 rai. I had a meeting with Betagro about being a contract farmer and it sounded good in the beginning. At first they were hesitant to have a meeting with a farang but they finally let me join together with my wife and a thai friend. After reading the contract and some quick calculations, it became clear that the profit would be very low, about 50 stang/fish/cycle. This was due to high food cost and low guaranteed price.

So in my mind the way to go is private. That way a better profit is made. I have looked at your numbers and they correlate very well with my calculations.

I will be posting here as the project progresses. Thank you for all the information you have shared. I will share all my experiences that comes up.

Happy fishing

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[RedBullHorn]

Thank you for taking an interest and following my topic...

Yes contract farming is low profit because of credit terms...Going independent is enriching if you have contacts.

Always start small for beginners...

Bear in mind different region have different farmgate prices, same apply to feed prices. The further you are located the more expensive is the price of feed due to transportation cost from the factory/plant (plus middleman's share = feed stockie) and the higher farmgate prices expected to balance the cost.

[weedywhaoo]

I have two thai friends in Saraburi that has been doing this for five years now. When they started, they lost money the first year due to lack of knowledge and experience. Nowdays they have learnt many lessons and are doing fine. It is like a coorporative there with 4 guys and about 20 ponds about 1000 sqm each in size. Gate price there is 45 baht at the moment. The good thing is that the buyer comes with his own crew to do the harvest, so no extra staff is needed for harvesting. I would be happy to make what they are making but think its possible to improve the numbers in a year or two after some learning period. I plan to dig 12 ponds but start with 4, then 4 more after a month or two and then the last 4 some time later to keep liquidity at a reasonable level. It still requires a lot of money to get started and pay for food until harvest time. Lets hope for the best and have plans for the worst.

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[David48]

It is very pleasing to see a farang succeding in the farming business here.

RBH ... 'A Farang' ... is that an Upgrade or a downgrade to your ethnicity ...

.

[RedBullHorn]

It is very pleasing to see a farang succeding in the farming business here.

RBH ... 'A Farang' ... is that an Upgrade or a downgrade to your ethnicity ...

.

I'm sort of like an albino farang...

[RedBullHorn]

I have two thai friends in Saraburi that has been doing this for five years now. When they started, they lost money the first year due to lack of knowledge and experience. Nowdays they have learnt many lessons and are doing fine. It is like a coorporative there with 4 guys and about 20 ponds about 1000 sqm each in size. Gate price there is 45 baht at the moment. The good thing is that the buyer comes with his own crew to do the harvest, so no extra staff is needed for harvesting. I would be happy to make what they are making but think its possible to improve the numbers in a year or two after some learning period. I plan to dig 12 ponds but start with 4, then 4 more after a month or two and then the last 4 some time later to keep liquidity at a reasonable level. It still requires a lot of money to get started and pay for food until harvest time. Lets hope for the best and have plans for the worst. Sent from my GT-I9300 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Don't rush...slow down slow down. You need to study the seasonal volatility first. Hot season sales is definitely a fast moving one but comes raining season market will slow down, coupled with start of buddish lent, school holidays , vegetarian festive and natural catch of river fishes flooding the wet market. You queue number for a date to harvest may be longer than usual as everybody is waiting for queue. Such is the case where by your fishes are all ready for harvest and while you wait in line, your fishes need to eat...so more feed is given...and you will be agitated and worry that your fishes will be too big for the wholsalers which will make things more difficult as market have slow down making selling the bigger sizes a little difficult and slow pace...

Cold season market movement is average...

Wholesalers are middleman, they wouldn't bother about your concerns... When you are stuck in the queue with 4 big ponds waiting to harvest... and if you time it wrong, you will miss you restocking date for the cold season fingerlings quota as the last batch of fingerlings is December. After that date, the brood stocks will discharge all their eggs.

You already have the fund to invest, the ponds are filled...Take things a step at the time.

[RedBullHorn]

...The good thing is that the buyer comes with his own crew to do the harvest, so no extra staff is needed for harvesting.

The seining crew are not free, you have to bear the cost at between ฿200-฿250 per person per day. You will need 4-5 person team to seine net your pond. The good part is you don't need to go searching for workers but you still need a team from your own village to do your final pond clearing.

[RedBullHorn]

The new Sala cum bridge.

The red colouration are plankton...I read somewhere that red colour is an indication that the plankton died. No ? ......

[David48]

RBH ... you are doing some great work now.

Really liking the The new Sala cum bridge.

How long do you expect it to last?

I have been told that the bamboo weevil/bug is a problem in Thailand.

I reckon the The new Sala cum bridge looks great ...

[RedBullHorn]

David, it will last for a year or two. Replacing the bamboo path and roof panels, hopefully the storms don't blow the roof off first...

[weedywhaoo]

RBH,

I am so grateful to receive the advice from you. I did not know that different seasons brings different prices and problems about getting the buyer

to come to you. I met fish an American fish farmer in Korat and he did cycles that were about 3,5 months, so he could almost do 3 cykles in a year but

more to the truth was 13-14 months time for 3 cycles. The people in Saraburi do longer cycles, about 5 months, so they will only do 2 cycles per year.

I don't know why their cycles are longer, maybe due to overstocking? They also don't have any aeration in the ponds. They stock a 1000 sqm pond with

50 000 fingerlings but the American in Korat also stocked 50 000 in the same size ponds. Regarding buying fingerlings, is there a difference in supply depending on

what month of the year? If doing only 2 cycles, what would be the ideal harvest months in your opinion?

You are right about the fish crew, it will be on my cost but the huyer supply the workers and the equipment. The agreement in Saraburi is that the fishes left in the mud are given to local workers and they clean the pond for you. Your sala is looking great.

[RedBullHorn]

RBH,

I am so grateful to receive the advice from you. I did not know that different seasons brings different prices and problems about getting the buyer

to come to you. I met fish an American fish farmer in Korat and he did cycles that were about 3,5 months, so he could almost do 3 cykles in a year but

more to the truth was 13-14 months time for 3 cycles. The people in Saraburi do longer cycles, about 5 months, so they will only do 2 cycles per year.

I don't know why their cycles are longer, maybe due to overstocking? They also don't have any aeration in the ponds. They stock a 1000 sqm pond with

50 000 fingerlings but the American in Korat also stocked 50 000 in the same size ponds. Regarding buying fingerlings, is there a difference in supply depending on

what month of the year? If doing only 2 cycles, what would be the ideal harvest months in your opinion?

You are right about the fish crew, it will be on my cost but the huyer supply the workers and the equipment. The agreement in Saraburi is that the fishes left in the mud are given to local workers and they clean the pond for you. Your sala is looking great.

Firstly i would like to stress this. "You do not give the final pond clearing fishes to the locals !" big mistake...because a small pond of half rai will have about 200kg of left over in the mud, if it is ฿45/kg at your place...do the maths.

You can apply my method...pay them ฿300 per team member, feed them "very well", lunch khao ka moo or chicken rice (they love it !), after the job is done give them Moo Ka ta buffet (Thai steamboat, you source you ingredient from Makro's "ready-to-go and marinated" packs plus pig liver, White Squids and Prawns...easy as hell~) and free flow of Lao Khao and beer (How much can you drink~ ). A crew of ten members plus food and drinks will cost you a max of ฿6-7'000.- Your final pond clearing is 600-800kg......Normally I threw in a bonus of 2kg of fishes for each member too...

You need them... buy their hearts by being generous and let it be known to them "Business is business !"

With my method, i retain my crew for 7 years till now...(used to be ฿200 per person back then)

Feed them well and treat them super nice...they will be back for more because of your generosity

The above overall cost for my crew is based on clearing job for the day...all done within the day. A must ! You need to calculate you left over and engage numbers of crew members accordingly.

Secondly...You do not need aeration for Clarias catfishes...just change 50% of the water when water foul up.

.

[RedBullHorn]

I will stop here on advise... you will have to face the music on your own from now on...

That's How You Learn ! (Pay to learn. )

There's a LOT more you do not know...It's not as easy as it looks...

Do more research...a lot of it~

[RedBullHorn]

BUT ! If you insist on learning more....... I will collect a fee for the WHOLE PACKAGE~

I'm Chinese... Business is business~

[DerkMR]

The red colouration are plankton...I read somewhere that red colour is an indication that the plankton died. No ? ......

Not necessarily dead.

There are a lot of red coloured plancton as Daphnia and Moina.

Just go to an aquarium shop and buy a fine net (finer than the mosquito gaze) and you can get samples.

If you have a good food source for plancton like molasses you can also make money out of selling live plancton to aquarium shops - a quantity of walnut sized dry masse plancton retails for THB 20.-

Bye,

Derk

[weedywhaoo]

RBH,

I would like to introduce myself briefly.I have lived and worked constantly in Thailand for 14 years now. During all these years I have helped hundreds of farangs here with everything from visa problems, police problems to translation service. I speak Thai fluently and love Thai people and the culture here. I do have long experience of how to do business in Thailand and also not how to do it. This has many times been learned the hard way, by paying for your misstakes.

However I am a newbie to the Thaivisa forum and also the catfish business. I am doing resarch from the internet almost dayly and have collected probably over 1000 pages of research reports, manuals etc. So a little bit of knowledge is established. The bad part is that the little I have learned is basically theories.

The absolute best way to gain knowledge, is to listen to people that has hands on experience. That help is priceless. It is therefore I am so grateful to hear your advice on fishfarming. It should also be a two way street, where information is getting back and forth in order to get gains for all involved parties. Thats what I thought was the purpose of this forum.

The way you write here, I can see that you know very much of fishbusiness as well as how Thai soceity works. It is not easy to come to this stage in Thailand. I am seriously interested in learning more from you and if we can agree on a reasonable amount, I would like to engage you to learn me the ABC of catfish farming.

[ray23]

RBH I do believre I have messed up again. I wanted to cement the botom of the small pond. I even climbed down in ti and marked the level. Well you guessed it the did the sides as well. So just how bad is this going to be for Catfish?

I can always knock out the side walls if I have to. I wanted the bottom cement cause to catch the fish after pumping it out people would be a waist deep in mud

Netting was useless as they simply buried themselves in the mud

[RedBullHorn]

The red colouration are plankton...I read somewhere that red colour is an indication that the plankton died. No ? ......

Not necessarily dead.

There are a lot of red coloured plancton as Daphnia and Moina.

Just go to an aquarium shop and buy a fine net (finer than the mosquito gaze) and you can get samples.

If you have a good food source for plancton like molasses you can also make money out of selling live plancton to aquarium shops - a quantity of walnut sized dry masse plancton retails for THB 20.-

Bye,

Derk

Thanks for the infor DerkMR, you are a star.

Plancton~ That's Spanish Derk... You are a shadow talent, keeping a low profile.

I enjoy your posts and i can spot talent in them.

Please post more often...

[RedBullHorn]

RBH I do believre I have messed up again. I wanted to cement the botom of the small pond. I even climbed down in ti and marked the level. Well you guessed it the did the sides as well. So just how bad is this going to be for Catfish?

I can always knock out the side walls if I have to. I wanted the bottom cement cause to catch the fish after pumping it out people would be a waist deep in mud

Netting was useless as they simply buried themselves in the mud

I told ya~~~

Dredging is the only way, you need to clean the pond bed but what you have done is just burying fossil fuel (you will be rich after a million years. ) and overtime the methane and ammonia will cause more damage than good and also greatly affect the fishes ADG.

[RedBullHorn]

RBH,

I would like to introduce myself briefly.I have lived and worked constantly in Thailand for 14 years now. During all these years I have helped hundreds of farangs here with everything from visa problems, police problems to translation service. I speak Thai fluently and love Thai people and the culture here. I do have long experience of how to do business in Thailand and also not how to do it. This has many times been learned the hard way, by paying for your misstakes.

However I am a newbie to the Thaivisa forum and also the catfish business. I am doing resarch from the internet almost dayly and have collected probably over 1000 pages of research reports, manuals etc. So a little bit of knowledge is established. The bad part is that the little I have learned is basically theories.

The absolute best way to gain knowledge, is to listen to people that has hands on experience. That help is priceless. It is therefore I am so grateful to hear your advice on fishfarming. It should also be a two way street, where information is getting back and forth in order to get gains for all involved parties. Thats what I thought was the purpose of this forum.

The way you write here, I can see that you know very much of fishbusiness as well as how Thai soceity works. It is not easy to come to this stage in Thailand. I am seriously interested in learning more from you and if we can agree on a reasonable amount, I would like to engage you to learn me the ABC of catfish farming.

Guys ! I believe i just hit the jackpot ! A customer...finally ! ...A lawyer i think~

My fee is... A SIX PACKER GUINNESS STOUT ! CANS will do just fine. I don't know where you could find it in Bangkok or in Chiang Mai maybe...

Once you have that... I will PM you a meeting location in Chiang Rai.

You will travel if you are dead serious to make it happen.

Cheers

P.S: I'm down to my last 3 cans...Dutyfree...

[weedywhaoo]

I will find the guiness for you, even if I have to go to Ireland. Believe me that I will bring more than a six pack. I really would like to visit you.

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[RedBullHorn]

You are most welcome to visit my small farm...Just bring the Guinness...

[weedywhaoo]

Thank you RBH,

I will quit my job on Feb 7. By then I will have the Guiness and would very much like to visit your farm some days after that, when it is convenient for you.

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[DerkMR]

Thanks for the infor DerkMR, you are a star.

Plancton~ That's Spanish Derk... You are a shadow talent, keeping a low profile.

I enjoy your posts and i can spot talent in them.

Please post more often...

Well, as I moved off my small farm in July last year I only do a little "pet farming" now with my pla kat, so seldom I have experiences in the area and I practice little own farming now.

A star? No but biologist in a former life.

Bye,

Derk

[RedBullHorn]

DerkMR, that's a very cool setup...

[RedBullHorn]

Thanks for the infor DerkMR, you are a star.

Plancton~ That's Spanish Derk... You are a shadow talent, keeping a low profile.

I enjoy your posts and i can spot talent in them.

Please post more often...

Well, as I moved off my small farm in July last year I only do a little "pet farming" now with my pla kat, so seldom I have experiences in the area and I practice little own farming now.

20131129_114523-2_a.jpg

A star? No but biologist in a former life.

Bye,

Derk

DerkMR, as a scientist and as an observer, what is your outlook and opinion of the aquaculture that is ongoing in present Thailand and concern in regards to small operations of the rest of Thailand like mine and Ozzydom...and what's your opinion in regards to AEC impacts coming into effect in the late 2015 in terms of free trade... in business point of view.