Govt. To Launch Sufficiency Economic Project On Mar 26

[DaleBlue]

Anyone who question the government on Sufficiency Economic may be charged for LM as this is a Royal initiative.

The are good and bad in every model, may it be republism, capitalism, socialism, communist, maoist, imperialism, colonialism, total military control, etc. The danger is that when one is only allowed to praise the goods, and not allowed to discussion about the bads. That is when you will see another Myanmar in the making, or the Chinese culture revolution, or the Khmer rough, Louis 16, North Korea, Nazi, Iran revolution, etc. In each of all these examples, I can think of a long list of pro, and hide an even a longer list of cons.

Let the people decides how they want to spend their wealth, however little they have. It is very dangerous to control peoples consumption habits, or limit their choices.

[jayboy]

The danger is that 'Sufficiency' is just a cod-philosophy that tries to hoodwink the poor into believing its okay to stay poor.

I think this "danger" is overrated.

The main thrust is not to borrow beyond your means to repay and manage available resourses instead.

The one obvious alternative is the US style consumption bubble where everybody borrows to become rich. See how that played out, and it's not the end yet.

I would have thought that current economic developments have amply demonstrated the merits of the sufficiency economy philosophy.It's important to grasp this as the genuine worth of the message can be masked by the sickening hypocrisy of some its proponents who in effect say "Do as I say, not as I do."

[Journalist]

Anyone who question the government on Sufficiency Economic may be charged for LM as this is a Royal initiative.

I see your thought process, but lets not be alarmist. Nobody is going to get thrown in Klong Prem for comparing/critiquing sufficiency theory with orthodox capitalism.

[Koo82]

The cabinet has approved a budget of one billion baht for the Internal Security Operations Command (Isoc) to explain the meaning of democracy to the general public and promote careers that support the principle of sufficiency economy.

http://www.bangkokpost.com/breakingnews/13...political-views

[Koo82]

The cabinet has approved a budget of one billion baht for the Internal Security Operations Command (Isoc) to explain the meaning of democracy to the general public and promote careers that support the principle of sufficiency economy.

http://www.bangkokpost.com/breakingnews/13...political-views

Why 1 billion Baht?

To explain what? Meaning of "democracy" like why Abhisit becomes PM?

Does Democrat Party still have face to teach poor people about democracy and sufficiency economy?

[hammered]

The cabinet has approved a budget of one billion baht for the Internal Security Operations Command (Isoc) to explain the meaning of democracy to the general public and promote careers that support the principle of sufficiency economy.

http://www.bangkokpost.com/breakingnews/13...political-views

Why 1 billion Baht?

To explain what? Meaning of "democracy" like why Abhisit becomes PM?

Does Democrat Party still have face to teach poor people about democracy and sufficiency economy?

The announcemtn will be as much about disillusioning Thaksin as anything. Poltics is meny etc and lets thrwo a billion here and a billion there. Thaksin will need very deep pockets to keep playing this game which is probably why he is gambling nearly everything on radical red street action and now. If tomorrow flops - read there arent at least the 300K the PTP dude claimed there would be - he is in trouble in the great politcal game.

[wefearourdespot]

IMHO this means that the government is preparing for an economical disaster. because due the coming economical collapse millions will return to the rural areas.

The only way to bring prosperity to a country is international trade and foreign investments

Do they really still think that farming can bring wealth. This program only shows that Thailand is still a 3th world country and they are happy to be like that.

What a shame.

I think you don't understand the Sufficiency Economic....We changed approx. 2 years ago to Sufficiency Economic in our company.

My wife as manager did so, as she thought that a crisis will come.

Now our staff, who always had big dept have mostly 10-50.000 Baht on their bank accounts and there is a plan in the worst case we can downsize the company to 10 % of the turnover without laying people off.

With a farm and an income of 2000 Baht per month, but all food comes from the farm you are much better off than with 10.000 Baht in Bangkok in a rented room as low class labour instead of landowner.

Many farm owners are for both nature and society better than 4 big food producer own all the land.

That shouldn't be so difficult to understand, or? And I don't see how that damage international trade or foreign investments.

You're running a kolkhoze ?

Seriously, I'm very curious to know what is a "Sufficiency Economic" company. You're absolutely right, most of us have absolutely no idea what it means, please explain.

I think I can explain it for you.

It means "starve and shut up"

and also "if you still happen to have some baht left, make sure to use them to purchase the yellow shirt and the rubber bracelet" they come in many colours now...make sure your collection is complete.

[sriracha john]

If tomorrow flops - read there arent at least the 300K The PTP Dude claimed there would be - he [Thaksin] is in trouble in the great political game.

the same as The Red Dude?

Weng Tojirakarn

It is estimated the crowd of 200,000 to 300,000 from over 50 provinces across Thailand will participate in the rally in Bangkok, Weng Tojirakarn, one of the UDD core leaders said earlier.

Edited March 25, 2009 by sriracha john

[WinnieTheKhwai]

Incidentally sufficient is probably not a great choice of language, sustainable would grate somewhat less. You can be sustainable at any level of the economic sector but sufficient is rather an unfortunate choice of words.

Depends on what is actually meant. I think the intent is exactly to keep the poor down; not necessarily poor, but at the bottom of society.

Also if it means like h90 said to not loan money as a business then that's ludicrous: A successful, growing business ALWAYS needs to loan money, because that's what's funding the costs and cash-flow of where they're going to be in the months to come. Same for people wanting to own a house; if not for a mortgage then few people would own a home. This is common economic sense.

[Koo82]

The reds are majority of Thais. Those who love the reds will win elections.

[Jai Dee]

This topic is about the Sufficiency Economic Project for Community, kicking off on March 26th at Thammasart University, not about red or yellow politics.

Can we please stay on-topic?

[Koo82]

Economy and politics go together.

The relation is the current government lead by Abhisit doesn't prove to be suitable to practice sufficiency economy when they approved big money for Army, Newin group and a little less for those coalition parties. How much did they approve for Foreign Ministry to build images? The Foreign Minister was on PAD stage. Just fire him and they don't need to spend any satang.

They made new loan and will make more loans. Every Thai must carry that loan but they give 2,000 Baht to roughly 9 million Thais only who still have works. These people are not the poorest Thais. Free money doesn't create jobs nor products. Sufficiency doesn't mean to spend when you must borrow money.

When they spend like that, they can't teach the poor about sufficiency economy. No one will believe them so the reds must be out to protest. The longer Abhisit stays, the worse Thai economy will be.

[animatic]

If those soon to be without a job from external forces don't get help being

self sufficient more, then they will be the ones all the hungreier.

I don't see Chalerms bunch doing ANYTHING to help the poor no, not a jot,

not a SINGLE proposal to save anything in the country, well Thaksin and sod all else.

They only tear down.

What exactly are they doing to build it up.

Absolutely SHIT.

At least the curerent government is thinking and acting towards making the fall lighter for all.

Sufficency economy is for helping those in a tough way survive toughening times.

And the Gov. could care less about your criticism since it isn't joined by ANYTHING constructive.

Unless youi have a BETTER, working idea to give , beyond GET OUT,

saying get out over and over again does absolutley NOTHING.

[Steve2UK]

CABINET RESOLUTION

Bt1 billion fund for Isoc projects in rural areas

By Piyanart Srivalo

Bancha Khaengkhan

The Nation

Published on March 25, 2009

Urgent approval to counter stronger anti-govt red shirts

The Cabinet yesterday approved a fund of Bt1 billion to be set aside for the Internal Security Operations Command (Isoc) - and used on projects aimed at weakening the red-shirt movement.

The move is part of efforts to counter a stronger anti-government and anti-establishment movement linked to former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra, sources said.

The matter was given a high priority by the government and so urgent Cabinet decided not to wait for the budget for the next fiscal year, sources said.

The fund resulted from close cooperation between Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva, in his capacity as the Isoc director, and Army commander in chief General Anupong Paochinda, who is also deputy Isoc director.

Government spokesman Panitan Wattanayagorn said yesterday the fund was for projects to fight the economic crisis through the royal sufficiency economy philosophy.

Panitan said that according to Isoc, the projects would make use of the armed forces' efficiency in helping to tackle economic problems. One goal would be to promote reconciliation, instil the loyalty to the monarch and protect the institution from violations.

Projects would last for six months and target rural areas all over the country.

The fund would be for training programmes, campaigns to promote His Majesty the King's philosophy of sufficiency economy, civilian affairs operations, management, evaluation of projects, and implementation of projects in villages and communities, among others.

Sources said the projects would be similar to those implemented during the post-coup government of Surayud Chulanont. At that time, military officers were sent to villages throughout the country to "create a better understanding" about the administration.

Government House sources estimated that less than 20,000 red-shirt protesters would take part in a rally planned to start tomorrow at Sanam Luang.

The government estimates that only 30 per cent of the "red shirts" likely to join the movement, really want to see Thaksin make a political comeback and the remainder are simply opposed to the ruling Democrat Party or the anti-Thaksin People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD), sources said.

http://nationmultimedia.com/2009/03/25/pol...cs_30098776.php

[Plus]

They are borrowing money to invest in job creation and other necessary schemes.

There was an interview with Dem chief economic advisor - they are very well aware that there MUST be productive returns from their borrowing and they are evaluating and comparing every project to select the best working ones.

And yes, these loans will be carried by all Thais, via the govt. Not a novel idea, government intervention and borrowing seem to be the only options of dealing with the global crisis everywhere.

Let the people decides how they want to spend their wealth, however little they have.

Tried that, didn't work. Will definetely try again when the crisis is over, but not now. There's a fear, for example, that people would simply stash their 2k handouts instead of spending it to keep consumption (and jobs) going.

Basically, during crises there needs to be the leadership to steer people through, not leaving it to the mob dynamics or anarchism.

I know many don't like it, but it's a natural phenomenon - whenever there's crisis, freedom screws are tightened, be it economic, political, or security problems, the reaction is the same. Get used to it.

[Steve2UK]

B1bn to sway UDD supporters

By: BangkokPost.com

Published: 25/03/2009 at 10:48 AM

The cabinet has approved a budget of one billion baht for the Internal Security Operations Command (Isoc) to explain the meaning of democracy to the general public and promote careers that support the principle of sufficiency economy.

Isoc spokesman Thanathip Sawangsang said on Wednesday the project had been underway since last month.

It could help change the views of supporters of the United Front for Democracy against Dictatorship (UDD), he said, but admitted this would depend on their attitudes.

Full story continues:

http://www.bangkokpost.com/breakingnews/13...political-views

[hammered]

B1bn to sway UDD supporters

By: BangkokPost.com

Published: 25/03/2009 at 10:48 AM

The cabinet has approved a budget of one billion baht for the Internal Security Operations Command (Isoc) to explain the meaning of democracy to the general public and promote careers that support the principle of sufficiency economy.

Isoc spokesman Thanathip Sawangsang said on Wednesday the project had been underway since last month.

It could help change the views of supporters of the United Front for Democracy against Dictatorship (UDD), he said, but admitted this would depend on their attitudes.

Full story continues:

http://www.bangkokpost.com/breakingnews/13...political-views

Lets be honest in the power struggle there is a battle for hearts and minds. Newin in the Isaan is part of this and no doubt so are ISOC. Ranged against them are the PTP, Thaksin and the red shirts. The Isaan is obviously the main target as Newin is very powerul hear and has all kinds of local networks. The military have learend from last time that you cant ignore the local networks and Newin was a major thorn fo rthem that time around. Anyway if a lump of the Isaan can be pulled from PTP, it is all over electorally for Thaksin et al. That is the game.

In the North it is different and the Dems or CTP could be competetive in parts of the lower north but the upper North is locked in to Thaksin. A few times the military have even said that maybe we have to accept that they will have their base up North. However, the upper north is relatively speaking only a handful of parliamentary seats.

[sabaijai]

Short term is OK. For long term, it is going to turn Thailand into something like Myanmar where trade stop, people only need to have low income as they don't buy much, banks need not to be function as there is not much loans nor savings. However people still can survive, and live by the very basic. So much so that even fridge, resturant, electricity, running water, transportation and petrol etc are all deemed a luxury.

Myanmar is similar in size and population to Thailand.

Thailand import 80% of its energy needs.

Myanmar is only producing half as much as Thailand, but have enough to export 80% of their energy production (because they don't consume much).

Do we want to only dine at home mostly with vegatable that we grow? Do we want our children to walk a couple of miles to school? Do we want to limit our health care to the very basic? Can we live without mobile phone, and limit land line to 2 per village? Do we want to have only 4 hours of electricity per day?

IMHO Thailand have gone done too far the capitalism road.

Agree. The question is, how about short term? If I were to lose the job I have now, I'd be right back on the farm up north. The village where I have my second house has used sufficiency econony as a cushion their entire lives. When they have jobs and cash, they live differently than when they're stuck on the farm for awhile. It makes a lot of sense, and is an alternative that most people living in a fully industrialised western society don't have. I applaud the government for encouraging. I don't see anyone in gov't promoting it as the ultimate solution or ultimate future. But in the current global economic climate, well done.

[Steve2UK]

B1bn to sway UDD supporters

By: BangkokPost.com

Published: 25/03/2009 at 10:48 AM

The cabinet has approved a budget of one billion baht for the Internal Security Operations Command (Isoc) to explain the meaning of democracy to the general public and promote careers that support the principle of sufficiency economy.

Isoc spokesman Thanathip Sawangsang said on Wednesday the project had been underway since last month.

It could help change the views of supporters of the United Front for Democracy against Dictatorship (UDD), he said, but admitted this would depend on their attitudes.

Full story continues:

http://www.bangkokpost.com/breakingnews/13...political-views

Lets be honest in the power struggle there is a battle for hearts and minds. Newin in the Isaan is part of this and no doubt so are ISOC. Ranged against them are the PTP, Thaksin and the red shirts. The Isaan is obviously the main target as Newin is very powerul hear and has all kinds of local networks. The military have learend from last time that you cant ignore the local networks and Newin was a major thorn fo rthem that time around. Anyway if a lump of the Isaan can be pulled from PTP, it is all over electorally for Thaksin et al. That is the game.

In the North it is different and the Dems or CTP could be competetive in parts of the lower north but the upper North is locked in to Thaksin. A few times the military have even said that maybe we have to accept that they will have their base up North. However, the upper north is relatively speaking only a handful of parliamentary seats.

Absolutely agree.

For lovers of rich irony, what Bangkok Post and The Nation report looks like a mother lode.......

ISOC is going out to spread the word about democracy - I think comment must be superfluous.

The military is going out to spread the word about self-sufficiency to rural areas (read "rural poor", almost a tautology in itself) - after its budget was bloated from 85 billion pre-(2006) coup to 167 billion now.

The military's 2006-7 running of state agencies/boards was almost universally condemned (and occasionally admitted) as poor at best. Now we read: "according to ISOC, the projects would make use of the armed forces' efficiency in helping to tackle economic problems"...........

Needless to say, IMO the military should be nowhere near what consists largely of a PR (some would say propaganda) exercise - let alone be given charge of it and a billion baht to play with. That said, this being Thailand, it's a moot point how much of that billion will actually make it to "the front line"........

[hammered]

B1bn to sway UDD supporters

By: BangkokPost.com

Published: 25/03/2009 at 10:48 AM

The cabinet has approved a budget of one billion baht for the Internal Security Operations Command (Isoc) to explain the meaning of democracy to the general public and promote careers that support the principle of sufficiency economy.

Isoc spokesman Thanathip Sawangsang said on Wednesday the project had been underway since last month.

It could help change the views of supporters of the United Front for Democracy against Dictatorship (UDD), he said, but admitted this would depend on their attitudes.

Full story continues:

http://www.bangkokpost.com/breakingnews/13...political-views

Lets be honest in the power struggle there is a battle for hearts and minds. Newin in the Isaan is part of this and no doubt so are ISOC. Ranged against them are the PTP, Thaksin and the red shirts. The Isaan is obviously the main target as Newin is very powerul hear and has all kinds of local networks. The military have learend from last time that you cant ignore the local networks and Newin was a major thorn fo rthem that time around. Anyway if a lump of the Isaan can be pulled from PTP, it is all over electorally for Thaksin et al. That is the game.

In the North it is different and the Dems or CTP could be competetive in parts of the lower north but the upper North is locked in to Thaksin. A few times the military have even said that maybe we have to accept that they will have their base up North. However, the upper north is relatively speaking only a handful of parliamentary seats.

Absolutely agree.

For lovers of rich irony, what Bangkok Post and The Nation report looks like a mother lode.......

ISOC is going out to spread the word about democracy - I think comment must be superfluous.

The military is going out to spread the word about self-sufficiency to rural areas (read "rural poor", almost a tautology in itself) - after its budget was bloated from 85 billion pre-(2006) coup to 167 billion now.

The military's 2006-7 running of state agencies/boards was almost universally condemned (and occasionally admitted) as poor at best. Now we read: "according to ISOC, the projects would make use of the armed forces' efficiency in helping to tackle economic problems"...........

Needless to say, IMO the military should be nowhere near what consists largely of a PR (some would say propaganda) exercise - let alone be given charge of it and a billion baht to play with. That said, this being Thailand, it's a moot point how much of that billion will actually make it to "the front line"........

Truth be told it is the Newin side of the equation that will be succesful in the Isaan and not the ISOC bit unless they subcontract to him. That is what has Thaksin so rattled. Newin knows how to get people to think the right way and di it succesfully for TRT for a long time. Control of information through the right channels is amazingly succesful. Control of information through the wrong channels is a waste of money.

all imho

[Jai Dee]

PTT to apply Sufficiency Economy Principle in 84 subdistricts nationwide

Secretary General of the Chaipattana Foundation Dr.Sumeth Tantiwetchakul gave a lecture on the essences of His Majesty the King’s Sufficiency Economy Principles to the administrative board of PTT.

Dr.Sumeth recently lectured on the topic of His Majesty the King’s Sufficiency Economy Principle and what needed to be thoroughly understood to the high-ranking administrative staff of PTT and 150 other individuals from branches nationwide.

The lecture was aimed to provide more knowledge and to create a true understanding of the principles since a large proportion of the public still had a very vague understanding of it.

PTT has planned to apply and expand the principles to 84 sub-districts nationwide

Source: National News Bureau of Thailand - 26 March 2009

[samgrowth]

I better start growing some veggie. Don't want to go against the grain, or could go to jail for LM or disloyal.

[Old Man River]

The danger is that 'Sufficiency' is just a cod-philosophy that tries to hoodwink the poor into believing its okay to stay poor. Same same as mediaeval peasants were told by their Priest they'd go to heaven at the end of a lousy life.

Having said that, i'm impressed with what h90 has accomplished.

Put me down also as one of the impressed.

[RubbaJohnny]

IMHO this means that the government is preparing for an economical disaster. because due the coming economical collapse millions will return to the rural areas.

The only way to bring prosperity to a country is international trade and foreign investments

Do they really still think that farming can bring wealth. This program only shows that Thailand is still a 3th world country and they are happy to be like that.

What a shame.

Agreed tho owning just one bank or only one mobile phone co seemed enough for some

Used to wonder why Baht has not slumped yet why its outperforming euro A$ sterling etc

Yabba of course the sex skin trade,rare species,wild flowers, teak ivory and jade of Burma is off the books.In a country with abject hospitals and delapidated schools you see gold shops anf hugely expensive 4x4 pick ups in even remotest slums

Of course to devout sincere moral leaders its all Karma and will be k when we return as evaporated Milk REIN

CARNATION

Gahndi saw there would never be communist revolution in nations that really believe in it

Edited March 26, 2009 by RubbaJohnny

[Jai Dee]

PM voices faith in Sufficiency Economy Community project

Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva has expressed confidence that the Sufficiency Economy Community project will boost the nation's economy.

The Prime Minister yesterday chaired the launch of the Sufficiency Economy Community project at Thammasat University sports center, stating that the Government established the scheme to give citizens the authority to develop their own communities.

The project has a 21 billion baht budget and will provide funding to 80,000 communities across the Kingdom.

Communities in the project need only create their own programs based on the Sufficiency Economy Philosophy to apply for financial aid. The programs can be aimed at generating work, income or even at reducing production costs and improving product quality. Hopes for the project include long term sustainable occupations in the communities.

After the opening, 60 billion baht was transferred to 8,000 communities for the initial phase of the project with the Government and the Prime Minister hopeful tangible economic impacts will be seen.

Source: National News Bureau of Thailand - 27 March 2009

[Koo82]

New programming by NBT will see news reduced from 12 to seven hours, with some programmes axed and news producers losing their jobs starting April 1, PM's Office Minister Satit Wongnongtaey said Monday.

Satit, who oversees the NBT channel, said under the planned programme restructuring, the state channel would undergo up to 70 per cent change in programming that may cause some people to lose jobs. The channel will be the main producer of news and programmes but will bring in private companies to help produce some programmes including news.

- The Nation -

[Koo82]

I think they will change the logo of NBT. This is a waste of money. Let's wait and see.

I never believe in this government's sufficiency economy.

[chrislarsson]

After reading more about this "self-sufficiency economy" model, it doesn't sound like a very good idea.

Firstly, it seems to be mainly about keeping poor people in place, which means to keep them poor, and nothing about rich people splashing their money on E-Class Mercedes' and Black Label Whiskeys. Consumption that certainly make a country less self-sufficient.

Secondly, it doesn't target the problems Thailand is facing today. Thailand is far too export dependent. One of the reasons for this is that domestic demand is low, and this in turn, is because too large of the pie ends up in a few hands. If a country wants to be self-sufficient it has to start consuming its own goods. I'm not saying it should not export, but when the size of export is 2/3 of the GDP, it's simply too much, and it makes it very volatile to downturns in the world economy.

There is a reason China is doing everything it can to increase domestic demand, and the reason for this is to make China more self-sufficient.

Thirdly, the argument that growing your own food will create increased security is nonsense. If this was the case, people in countries like Burma, Laos, North Korea, and countries in Africa would be the ones best off. That is certainly not the case. Food production is secured by using technology. And this "self-sufficiency" model seems to be against investments in technology, unless you have the money in the pocket, which poor people obviously don't have.

Edited March 29, 2009 by chrislarsson

[plachon]

After reading more about this "self-sufficiency economy" model, it doesn't sound like a very good idea.

Firstly, it seems to be mainly about keeping poor people in place, which means to keep them poor, and nothing about rich people splashing their money on E-Class Mercedes' and Black Label Whiskeys. Consumption that certainly make a country less self-sufficient.

Secondly, it doesn't target the problems Thailand is facing today. Thailand is far too export dependent. One of the reasons for this is that domestic demand is low, and this in turn, is because too large of the pie ends up in a few hands. If a country wants to be self-sufficient it has to start consuming its own goods. I'm not saying it should not export, but when the size of export is 2/3 of the GDP, it's simply too much, and it makes it very volatile to downturns in the world economy.

There is a reason China is doing everything it can to increase domestic demand, and the reason for this is to make China more self-sufficient.

Thirdly, the argument that growing your own food will create increased security is nonsense. If this was the case, people in countries like Burma, Laos, North Korea, and countries in Africa would be the ones best off. That is certainly not the case. Food production is secured by using technology. And this "self-sufficiency" model seems to be against investments in technology , unless you have the money in the pocket, which poor people obviously don't have.

I think you may be confused between food security and financial security. If a rich state, like Singapore or UK, with good financial security (although right now with the banking situation even that is in doubt), does not grow any of its own food either as a nation or at an individual level, but relies on buying it, then you could say they are rather food insecure. In times of trouble or crisis, (whether natural disaster or something like the fuel blockade), then it doesn't matter how much money one has in the bank, if there is no food in your larder or in the shops, then you are going to go hungry. While the person who grows their own food, stores it sensibly for a rainy day and thinks about tomorrow is going to eat (no matter how much money they possess). That is food security, and believe it or not, most people in Laos are more food secure than in a rich country like Britain, purely because they can grow and gather their own. You may not know it, but during the fuel blockade in 2000, many supermarkets across UK were in hours of running out of food. Another day and there would have been a lot of hungry people with money in their pockets but no food to buy.

"Resilience" is a word you will be hearing a lot more about in coming years with regards to food security.

[farseer]

This new prime minister is a prat wasting so much money on this stupid sufficiency program.