New Babies

[tutsiwarrior]

When a new baby is born what sort of activities usually accompany the event in a rural, tight-knit, extended family. Do the monks from the wat get involved like they do for a house blessing, etc?...a big party perhaps to formally introduce the new arrival? In the west we usually retreat into our nuclear family nest when the new baby comes with nervous parents isolating themselves from other than immediate family and warily sizing up anyone who would seek to handle the precious bundle.

What normally happens in rural Thailand when a large extended family is involved?

[coventry]

When a new baby is born what sort of activities usually accompany the event in a rural, tight-knit, extended family. Do the monks from the wat get involved like they do for a house blessing, etc?...a big party perhaps to formally introduce the new arrival? In the west we usually retreat into our nuclear family nest when the new baby comes with nervous parents isolating themselves from other than immediate family and warily sizing up anyone who would seek to handle the precious bundle.

What normally happens in rural Thailand when a large extended family is involved?

What happens is entirely up to you. I have a 17 month old daughter and twin boy and girl aged 3 weeks. Nothing happens to them that I don't want to happen. Just do your own thing and don't go down the Thai road with all their crap of shaving the babies heads etc. Good luck and you decide.

One tradition that pisses me off here in rural Thailand is that if you have a son they automatically have to have a look and a tug at the penis. They can't help themselves.

Edited May 1, 2009 by coventry

[tutsiwarrior]

it's not my offspring that's involved but belongs to someone in my household and my wife (as the head of household) has been making noises about festivities. I'm away at work in the Middle East but have been expecting the birth. When I call my wife there now appears to be more than the usual number of family associates present with a festive atmosphere...not that I mind; the ones that I know are good folks.

It's a little boy, btw...

[sbk]

Congrats Tutsi (I guess) does that make you a great-uncle or something now?

I know you aren't super thrilled about this whole thing but best to just grin and bear it. Can't go back now.

I can't say that anyone I know has ever done anything special for a birth, but it might be different up in Suphan. Could just be the usual "gathering round of the entire extended family" that occurs at any big family event.

[tutsiwarrior]

Congrats Tutsi (I guess) does that make you a great-uncle or something now?

I know you aren't super thrilled about this whole thing but best to just grin and bear it. Can't go back now.

I can't say that anyone I know has ever done anything special for a birth, but it might be different up in Suphan. Could just be the usual "gathering round of the entire extended family" that occurs at any big family event.

grand-'uncle', indeed

what bothers me is that my MiL (now a great grandmother) has not yet come to see the baby. The last time at home I found that she had had another tiff with the wife and had moved back to the old house-on-stilts previous family abode back in the village. I guess this means that she's not ever coming to our house again...a big drag as I hate to see these dumb spats disrupt family harmony (and nobody else in the family can massage me like she can...maybe the strength it takes to give a good massage is proportional to the amount of physical labor one has endured). Toobad I'm not at home as I coulda used the occasion to engineer some sort of reconciliation...

[bina]

tutsi, we should keep that last post as evidence for all those complainers/whingers about their MIL's and extendeds.... i too have learned that extended family for all its craziest has many many benefits. including this present moment as i go to thailand, my ex MIL has lent me her camera, and will take up the slack in spoiling my teenager still at home (under dad's authority, but hey, has a slew of extendeds' to spoil her while im gone), but no massage unfortunately...

u are practically the only one lamenting about the MIL actually going back to where she came from........ and the only one to see it as disrupting family harmony. GOOD FOR YOU )

btw, in jewish familiess aprt from the circumcision rites for a little boy (at 8 days old), for girls there is also a sort of little (or big) thing at two weeks, but without the snip of course. usually this is the first time the baby comes out to the public, along with the mother.... it allows all the relatives and friends to give gifts, see the child and the mother and thereby cutting back on too many impromptu visits.

bina

israel

[tutsiwarrior]

aw shucks, bina...I was just wantin' to smooth things over at home when the emotions get out of hand plus the MiL always likes to stay up and drink vodka with me and it helps me to practice speaking thai...the others ain't got the patience...

circumcision being a religious ritual are there any buddhist ones when there is a new arrival...anyone?

[Nibor1945]

Hi Tutsiwarrior.

Like everything in Thailand there are regional variations, I can only go by my personal experience with my two children in the Saraburi area (Farang male married to Thai national, our children are Thai nationals). After they were born most of the extended family visited to see the new arrival, however the the baby was not taken on any journeys other than to the clinic for the first month. After the first month was up then the baby was considered old enough to travel, and the first journey was to see the maternal grandparents (Tar and Yai).

Most of the extended family had gathered for the occasion, Tar and then Yai blessed the baby and tied the usual white cord around the wrist. A lock of hair was cut off (I was not very impressed with the usual head shaving), and this along with some other "ingredients" were wrapped in a banana leaf and given to my wife and I. After that there was an informal party, as my wife has seven brothers and sisters there were a considerable amount of people there.

On our return home, the banana leaf bundle was placed under the village/estate "spirit tree" which is the oldest tree in the village (usually decorated with multi coloured ribbons of material). From what I can gather in Thai animist beliefs, ancient trees develop a soul and become a focal point for the spirits of the village, and this is to notify them that someone new has joined the community!

I try to keep an open mind to most things Thai, after all I'm a guest here and providing it poses no risk to to my family I go along with most things here. I cannot recall any specific Buddhist ceremony for the children.

I go along with your sentiments about MIL, a good "Yai" is worth her weight in gold (providing she doesn't actually cost that much)!

[tutsiwarrior]

Nibor...thanks for your informative post especially the bit about the spirit tree...brings to mind the pervasive influence of traditional beliefs in rural communities and how they remain despite the introduction of religion (my own observations in indigenous communities in Latin America and roman catholicism come to mind...).

so...it don't look like there are any buddhist rituals to be observed when there is a new baby...but plenty of reason to have a party; like I said the background noises during my recent phone calls home indicate that there is plenty of 'sanook' around...

[Richb2004v2]

When a new baby is born what sort of activities usually accompany the event in a rural, tight-knit, extended family. Do the monks from the wat get involved like they do for a house blessing, etc?...a big party perhaps to formally introduce the new arrival? In the west we usually retreat into our nuclear family nest when the new baby comes with nervous parents isolating themselves from other than immediate family and warily sizing up anyone who would seek to handle the precious bundle.

What normally happens in rural Thailand when a large extended family is involved?

What happens is entirely up to you. I have a 17 month old daughter and twin boy and girl aged 3 weeks. Nothing happens to them that I don't want to happen. Just do your own thing and don't go down the Thai road with all their crap of shaving the babies heads etc. Good luck and you decide.

One tradition that pisses me off here in rural Thailand is that if you have a son they automatically have to have a look and a tug at the penis. They can't help themselves.

I'm glad I read that. I remember when I first came here over ten years ago see this happen a few times to male toddlers and babys. Recently we had twins and I mentioned that I didn't want this happening to my son. My wife looked blank at me and didn't know what I was talking about. Anyway, so far it hasn't happened.

[slaninaj]

When a new baby is born what sort of activities usually accompany the event in a rural, tight-knit, extended family. Do the monks from the wat get involved like they do for a house blessing, etc?...a big party perhaps to formally introduce the new arrival? In the west we usually retreat into our nuclear family nest when the new baby comes with nervous parents isolating themselves from other than immediate family and warily sizing up anyone who would seek to handle the precious bundle.

What normally happens in rural Thailand when a large extended family is involved?

we had a big party for him about 3 months after her was borned. I think it should be done at 1 months. But I would not have been around for it, so they wait till my sister and I came back to Thailand. We have all then monk come over to bless him I think 10 and about 15 kids that where doing summer camp at the temple.

[dave_boo]

First thing I thought of when reading this thread is why doesn't the love snake tug work for Thais?

And yeah, they shaved my daughters head (!) while I was out of the country. Luckily my family has fast growing hair...and it is just hair.

I'm probably going to get some bad press for this, but going back to sons, what's with not wanting to circumcise it? Before we knew it was going to be a girl, I was gathering all the information we'd need for the Berit Milah and the wife was horrified....not quite sure why.

[bojo]

I came home one day and my daughter's head had been shaved. Not impressed, nor with the reasoning as to it making the hair stronger. What a load of old codswallop. I notice Nibor mentioned it briefly above. What's the real reason for it, anybody care to enlighten me?

Regards Bojo

[slaninaj]

Nan did not shave Chase head, They only cut a little bit from the back of his head. The fire hair cut is common khwan ceremony in some parts of Thailand.

I am surprised you did not know about it and was no there for it. My wife is very traditional in her beliefs, I remember she did a ceremony when chase came home. She made meal with 2 pigs faces for her ancestors. so they would watch over chase.we plan to raise our kids as Buddhist and with the tradition's of Thailand and tradition's of America.

There is a lot of information on the net. look up "fire-hair cut Thailand".

We talk about circumcise for our son, it something we forgot at the hospital.

[Boo]

In many countries circumcison isn't normal practice, in the UK for example it isn't & neither is it in Thailand. TBH my own opinion has always been, why remove something that is their for a reason. It isn't a birth defect or abnormality that needs correcting or a religous issue so unless it causes medical issues or pain then leave it be.

[slaninaj]

In many countries circumcison isn't normal practice, in the UK for example it isn't & neither is it in Thailand. TBH my own opinion has always been, why remove something that is their for a reason. It isn't a birth defect or abnormality that needs correcting or a religous issue so unless it causes medical issues or pain then leave it be.

will I can not find any reason he needs circumcision and I can tell you it is extreme painful. I had a doctor do it when I was old without giving him the ok when I was having a operation.

[jamescollister]

I came home one day and my daughter's head had been shaved. Not impressed, nor with the reasoning as to it making the hair stronger. What a load of old codswallop. I notice Nibor mentioned it briefly above. What's the real reason for it, anybody care to enlighten me?

Regards Bojo

the head shaving I gather is to make the baby unattractive to Bee bop, a nasty looking female goblin type creature that steals babies. I didn't have my daughters head shaved, but we did introduce her to the village spirits after they complained to one of the village elders that she had not be introduce to them. I'm happy to go along with the little rituals as long as it is harmless. Keeps everyone happy. Jim

[slaninaj]

I came home one day and my daughter's head had been shaved. Not impressed, nor with the reasoning as to it making the hair stronger. What a load of old codswallop. I notice Nibor mentioned it briefly above. What's the real reason for it, anybody care to enlighten me?

Regards Bojo

the head shaving I gather is to make the baby unattractive to Bee bop, a nasty looking female goblin type creature that steals babies. I didn't have my daughters head shaved, but we did introduce her to the village spirits after they complained to one of the village elders that she had not be introduce to them. I'm happy to go along with the little rituals as long as it is harmless. Keeps everyone happy. Jim

Yes it does make them look unattractive and Nan did not want chase to look unattractive hahha. but she was just at one that did shave the daughters head. I think it has to do with the grandmother. Nan grandmother died 3 days after we got married, that sucked...

Well at 20 Chase will get his hair shaved when he becomes a monk haha. I almost had my hair shave when her grandmother die. but my wife did not want me to become a monk for the days right after we just got married....