"i Was Fleeced In Thailand" Stories Piling Up

[CFIT]

...is pertinent to General Topics.

http://www.smh.com.au/travel/travel-news/3...90522-bhp8.html

<h2 class="cN-headingPage prepend-5 span-11 last">$3000 the price of Thai justice</h2> Photo: courtesy Channel 10

Chalpat Sonti

May 22, 2009 - 12:49PM Natalie Appleby and her fiance know all too well the problems Annice Smoel faced - the Perth couple went through a similar ordeal last month.

While Mrs Smoel, a mother of four, is safely back in Melbourne after spending four nights in a Thai jail on charges of stealing a $50 bar mat, Ms Appleby still shivers at how her fiance suffered a similar - and much more expensive - fate.

Like Mrs Smoel, Ms Appleby's fiance - who only wanted to be identified by his first name, Michael - went for a drink in the popular Aussie Bar in Phuket.

He had surprised Ms Appleby, who travelled to Thailand last month to act as bridesmaid at a friend's wedding, by travelling to Phuket.

On his first night in Phuket, and the night before the wedding, Michael went with a group of people to the Aussie Bar.

"He doesn't remember finishing his second drink. The next morning he had no recollection of the night but found he had woken up in a Phuket jail," Ms Appleby told WAtoday.com.au.

Michael managed to find an English-speaking detective in the jail and made a phone call to his worried fiance.

Her father went to see Michael, and things began to get worse.

"First of all they tried to charge him with stealing, but a Thai lady there said the shop he was accused of stealing from was actually closed," Ms Appleby said.

"They then said they had made a mistake and charged him with damaging the roof of a house. There weren't any houses there, but they said it would cost $5000 for the charges to go away. They said if we talked to the Australian Consulate, (Michael) would be taken to the Bangkok Hilton (the notorious Thai jail, Bangkwang prison)."

After negotiating with a detective - "he wanted the money in an envelope" - the family paid $3000 to have the charges dropped. Ms Smoel pleaded guilty to her charges - in order to leave Thailand - was fined $38 and placed on a good behaviour bond.

"(The detective) told us everything would be sweet and to enjoy the rest of our holiday," Ms Appleby said.

"We could've done like (Mrs Smoel) and fought the charges but he would've been there for quite a few more days. Michael was obviously petrified. There were big, big grey patches in what they were charging him with."

Michael left Thailand for Perth almost immediately. Ms Appleby suspected his drink had been spiked, and said the incidents were a warning for Australians visiting the tourist mecca.

"People need to know to watch out. You need to be with friends and they need to be watching out for each other," she said.

"You have to be careful of having a big night. It's a shame. I don't want to say don't go there, because it can be good, but maybe the bad publicity will make them clean up their act. People there say this sort of thing is happening all the time and Thai prostitutes will drop drugs into Westerners drinks."

[Moonrakers]

I have faced a similar problem in a certain pub in Bangkok.

I enter the pub, but oddly enough for the life of me I just can't remember leaving. What's even more worrying is that I wake up the next day (afternoon) to find that I have around 2,000 baht less in my wallet than when I first entered the pub.

Bizarre, it seems to be a weekly occurence as well.

[bkkjames]

I have faced a similar problem in a certain pub in Bangkok.

I enter the pub, but oddly enough for the life of me I just can't remember leaving. What's even more worrying is that I wake up the next day (afternoon) to find that I have around 2,000 baht less in my wallet than when I first entered the pub.

Bizarre, it seems to be a weekly occurence as well.

One would think that after this happened to you the first time MR that you would avoid the place?

[CFIT]

Moonrakers is applying what is called facetiousness- annoying sarcasm that signals opposition to, and attempts to mask the writers inability to contradict the gist of the topic, which is tourists are getting fleeced, drugged robbed (and murdered, too it seems ) right and left in Thailand .

Because he binge drinks once a week or so, to the point of black out ( a clear alcoholic ) he then assumes anyone with a bar tale of woe does so also , ignoring the victim's statement that after the first drink, memory was lost.

Edited May 22, 2009 by CFIT

[Moonrakers]

Moonrakers is applying what is called facetiousness- annoying sarcasm that signals opposition to, and attempts to mask the writers inability to contradict the gist of the topic, which is tourists are getting fleeced, drugged robbed (and murdered, too it seems ) right and left in Thailand .

Because he binge drinks once a week or so, to the point of black out ( a clear alcoholic ) he then assumes anyone with a bar tale of woe does so also , ignoring the victim's statement that after the first drink, memory was lost.

Maybe.

Or maybe I just have a sense of humour........

[bkkjames]

Moonrakers is applying what is called facetiousness- annoying sarcasm that signals opposition to, and attempts to mask the writers inability to contradict the gist of the topic, which is tourists are getting fleeced, drugged robbed (and murdered, too it seems ) right and left in Thailand .

Because he binge drinks once a week or so, to the point of black out ( a clear alcoholic ) he then assumes anyone with a bar tale of woe does so also , ignoring the victim's statement that after the first drink, memory was lost.

Maybe.

Or maybe I just have a sense of humour........

Funny (or not), I like to drink to excess once a week but abstain the remaining six days. Am I an alcoholic too?

[JohnGotti]

I find it very hard to believe that a farang bar owner could be dishonest or corrupt. These guys are the cream of the expat crop.

[Moonrakers]

Moonrakers is applying what is called facetiousness- annoying sarcasm that signals opposition to, and attempts to mask the writers inability to contradict the gist of the topic, which is tourists are getting fleeced, drugged robbed (and murdered, too it seems ) right and left in Thailand .

Because he binge drinks once a week or so, to the point of black out ( a clear alcoholic ) he then assumes anyone with a bar tale of woe does so also , ignoring the victim's statement that after the first drink, memory was lost.

Maybe.

Or maybe I just have a sense of humour........

Funny (or not), I like to drink to excess once a week but abstain the remaining six days. Am I an alcoholic too?

clearly so James, it would appear that only alcoholics get drunk.

[bkkjames]

Moonrakers is applying what is called facetiousness- annoying sarcasm that signals opposition to, and attempts to mask the writers inability to contradict the gist of the topic, which is tourists are getting fleeced, drugged robbed (and murdered, too it seems ) right and left in Thailand .

Because he binge drinks once a week or so, to the point of black out ( a clear alcoholic ) he then assumes anyone with a bar tale of woe does so also , ignoring the victim's statement that after the first drink, memory was lost.

Maybe.

Or maybe I just have a sense of humour........

Funny (or not), I like to drink to excess once a week but abstain the remaining six days. Am I an alcoholic too?

clearly so James, it would appear that only alcoholics get drunk.

Good point, never considered that.

As for the original article and title of this thread, perhaps it's time to change the title to Fleeced by a Farang Bar Owner - wouldn't want our locasl hosts getting a bad rap for something not involving them.

[dave111223]

So what happened to the rest of his "group"?

What's to say he didn't actually get pissed out of his tree, mashed someones roof up?

Then tell the misses a convenient story of only remembering having 2 drinks, and then being stitched up...

Edited May 22, 2009 by dave111223

[robblok]

I find it very hard to believe that a farang bar owner could be dishonest or corrupt. These guys are the cream of the expat crop.

Just like wiseguy wannabe's

[CWMcMurray]

I think one of the real reasons that the case was cleared up so quickly is that all the Thai officials involced know that there are countless similar stories out there.

Ever day that this case remained opened more and more and more and more of these cases would have contiunued to come to light.

Investigative journalism may not exist in Thailand, but it is alive and well in many other countries. I am sure that many jouranlists were searching for more of these stories so that they could be the first to secure interviews with other "victims" of Thai corruption.

[mrtoad]

Moonrakers is applying what is called facetiousness- annoying sarcasm that signals opposition to, and attempts to mask the writers inability to contradict the gist of the topic, which is tourists are getting fleeced, drugged robbed (and murdered, too it seems ) right and left in Thailand .

Because he binge drinks once a week or so, to the point of black out ( a clear alcoholic ) he then assumes anyone with a bar tale of woe does so also , ignoring the victim's statement that after the first drink, memory was lost.

Are you a doctor?

[CFIT]

I believe this story is pertinent also and posted in Gen topic but as closed as it is on Phuket forum thread

It was on Page 2 of May 15- 28 Phuket Post with no credit given to source , which is ...

http://www.smh.com.au/travel/travel-news/r...90519-be71.html

Geoff Strong

May 20, 2009 It seemed like a good idea to return to paradise. That was the memory a Melbourne-based American couple had of the Thai holiday island Phuket where they used to live.

When they did return for a short holiday early last month, it became a holiday in hel_l.

After a night in prison plus $60,000 in mysterious payments through a Kafkaesque legal system, it was a very expensive hel_l too...."

At risk of mod censure will not post the rest as it is duplicate but essentially they lived in Phuket over 2 years ago, rented a house that then burned down , due to electrical short according to fire report. They left to live in Australia and returned in April on a holiday only to find themselves charged with responsibility with the fire, cause of which has now changed to, "..cigarette."

Edited May 22, 2009 by CFIT

[davejonesbkk]

I have faced a similar problem in a certain pub in Bangkok.

I enter the pub, but oddly enough for the life of me I just can't remember leaving. What's even more worrying is that I wake up the next day (afternoon) to find that I have around 2,000 baht less in my wallet than when I first entered the pub.

Bizarre, it seems to be a weekly occurence as well.

Yeah me too, but it never seems to be the first pub for me, its usually whatever bar Im in after say 2-3 hours of being out, Im guessing that's how long it takes for the spiked drink to kick in...

[CFIT]

http://landoftrials.wordpress.com/

From the blog of the fire fleeced couple..

"...During this meeting we also found out that our first lawyer had been trying to rob us. His first falsehood was that he had been sent by the embassy. Though the US Embassy told us that they do not send lawyers; they only send a list. The second lie that he told us was that we would only get our 200,000 Baht in bail back if we fought the case in court and won. When we told the police that they laughed in our faces. The only thing the police needed for us to be bailed was a signature from a lawyer. But who contacted the lawyer in the first place? The police. We went to the lawyer’s office and demanded our money back. At first he tried to intimidate us, yelling and throwing things around the office but my partner held firm and he eventually gave us back our money though this cancelled his bail for us. This means we were to go back to jail unless we had a Thai person to sign for us.

Our translator volunteered, entrusting us with her livelihood. If anything had happened – if we had tried to skip the country, even if we had gotten in an accident – she would have been held responsible.

At this point we found a new lawyer to help us get through this mess, and these were our options:

A) In all seriousness, have the landlord killed

Flee the country – impossible because of the effect it would have had on our translator..."

[orchis]

The strange thing is that these apparently well-off people sollicit "donations" on their web site.

[Moonrakers]

http://landoftrials.wordpress.com/

From the blog of the fire fleeced couple..

<snip>The only thing the police needed for us to be bailed was a signature from a lawyer. <snip>

I am no legal expert, but surely the decision of bail does not rest with a lawyer.

[thecatman]

I think one of the real reasons that the case was cleared up so quickly is that all the Thai officials involved know that there are countless similar stories out there.

Arrrr......and there was me foolishly thinking one of the real reasons that this case was cleared up so quickly is because they coughed up $3000.

Edited May 22, 2009 by thecatman

[farseer]

I find it very hard to believe that a farang bar owner could be dishonest or corrupt. These guys are the cream of the expat crop.

It seems that you don't leave your room, some farang bar owners are positively evil, some resort to violence in order to extort money, while some jack up the bill a few hundred % and some try to scam by saying that you stole something or broke something.

Cream? More like crap!

[noahvail]

Moonrakers is applying what is called facetiousness- annoying sarcasm that signals opposition to, and attempts to mask the writers inability to contradict the gist of the topic, which is tourists are getting fleeced, drugged robbed (and murdered, too it seems ) right and left in Thailand .

Because he binge drinks once a week or so, to the point of black out ( a clear alcoholic ) he then assumes anyone with a bar tale of woe does so also , ignoring the victim's statement that after the first drink, memory was lost.

Are you a doctor?

There are five kinds of alcoholism. One entails binge drinking on a regular or semi-regular routine, with blackouts being the biggest red flag. There are also alcoholics whose tolerance to alcohol has dropped so low that one drink puts them into black - these are late-stage alcoholics. I'm not trying to paint a picture of anyone here as an alcoholic - you simply can't do that on a forum. But there are a couple of signs to look for, and they have been noted here.

And no, I'm not a doctor. But I am, strike that - was, now retired, a registered alcohol and substance abuse counsellor back in the States.

Is there a "Quit-drinking-now-before-you-go-off-the-deep-end" forum on TV. Gawd, I hope not!!!

[bkkjames]

Moonrakers is applying what is called facetiousness- annoying sarcasm that signals opposition to, and attempts to mask the writers inability to contradict the gist of the topic, which is tourists are getting fleeced, drugged robbed (and murdered, too it seems ) right and left in Thailand .

Because he binge drinks once a week or so, to the point of black out ( a clear alcoholic ) he then assumes anyone with a bar tale of woe does so also , ignoring the victim's statement that after the first drink, memory was lost.

Are you a doctor?

There are five kinds of alcoholism. One entails binge drinking on a regular or semi-regular routine, with blackouts being the biggest red flag. There are also alcoholics whose tolerance to alcohol has dropped so low that one drink puts them into black - these are late-stage alcoholics. I'm not trying to paint a picture of anyone here as an alcoholic - you simply can't do that on a forum. But there are a couple of signs to look for, and they have been noted here.

And no, I'm not a doctor. But I am, strike that - was, now retired, a registered alcohol and substance abuse counsellor back in the States.

Is there a "Quit-drinking-now-before-you-go-off-the-deep-end" forum on TV. Gawd, I hope not!!!

Let's see,, you almost had me with the first point - except for the blackouts. SAFE

For the second one, I wish that was the case with the prices and taxes going up up up. SAFE

So, in conclusion, if I said, "I drink therefore I am - not a drunk" would basically mean in laymen's terms "I would rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal labotomy".

BTW, there is a "I drink to much thread on TV" check the health forum - it's the blurry one.

[ajarnmark]

Moonrakers is applying what is called facetiousness- annoying sarcasm that signals opposition to, and attempts to mask the writers inability to contradict the gist of the topic, which is tourists are getting fleeced, drugged robbed (and murdered, too it seems ) right and left in Thailand .

Because he binge drinks once a week or so, to the point of black out ( a clear alcoholic ) he then assumes anyone with a bar tale of woe does so also , ignoring the victim's statement that after the first drink, memory was lost.

[BigSnake]

Guess all be careful where you go drinking these days, maybe find yourself behind bars for a bar scam, from the sound of some of these stories someone out there could very well be running such a scam, HMMMMMMMM! I wonder?

[mrtoad]

Moonrakers is applying what is called facetiousness- annoying sarcasm that signals opposition to, and attempts to mask the writers inability to contradict the gist of the topic, which is tourists are getting fleeced, drugged robbed (and murdered, too it seems ) right and left in Thailand .

Because he binge drinks once a week or so, to the point of black out ( a clear alcoholic ) he then assumes anyone with a bar tale of woe does so also , ignoring the victim's statement that after the first drink, memory was lost.

Are you a doctor?

There are five kinds of alcoholism. One entails binge drinking on a regular or semi-regular routine, with blackouts being the biggest red flag. There are also alcoholics whose tolerance to alcohol has dropped so low that one drink puts them into black - these are late-stage alcoholics. I'm not trying to paint a picture of anyone here as an alcoholic - you simply can't do that on a forum. But there are a couple of signs to look for, and they have been noted here.

And no, I'm not a doctor. But I am, strike that - was, now retired, a registered alcohol and substance abuse counsellor back in the States.

Is there a "Quit-drinking-now-before-you-go-off-the-deep-end" forum on TV. Gawd, I hope not!!!

Considering your experience then you should know full well that diagnosis can't be made on the basis of a tounge in cheek statement on the internet about drinking habits.

[GuestHouse]

Regardless of whether people posting on this thread are, or are not, alcoholics, these incidents grab international headlines and discourage people from taking holidays in Thailand.

The end result is that Thailand's tourist industry suffers and at the end of the day that means people loosing jobs, incomes lost and hardship for people working in the tourist industry.

A few wealthy Thais loose money, maids, drivers, tour guides, food sellers, waiting staff - people who need the work loose out.

You've got to have a sick sense of humor to find that funny.

[sunray69]

...is pertinent to General Topics.

http://www.smh.com.au/travel/travel-news/3...90522-bhp8.html

<h2 class="cN-headingPage prepend-5 span-11 last">$3000 the price of Thai justice</h2> Photo: courtesy Channel 10

Chalpat Sonti

May 22, 2009 - 12:49PM Natalie Appleby and her fiance know all too well the problems Annice Smoel faced - the Perth couple went through a similar ordeal last month.

While Mrs Smoel, a mother of four, is safely back in Melbourne after spending four nights in a Thai jail on charges of stealing a $50 bar mat, Ms Appleby still shivers at how her fiance suffered a similar - and much more expensive - fate.

Like Mrs Smoel, Ms Appleby's fiance - who only wanted to be identified by his first name, Michael - went for a drink in the popular Aussie Bar in Phuket.

He had surprised Ms Appleby, who travelled to Thailand last month to act as bridesmaid at a friend's wedding, by travelling to Phuket.

On his first night in Phuket, and the night before the wedding, Michael went with a group of people to the Aussie Bar.

"He doesn't remember finishing his second drink. The next morning he had no recollection of the night but found he had woken up in a Phuket jail," Ms Appleby told WAtoday.com.au.

Michael managed to find an English-speaking detective in the jail and made a phone call to his worried fiance.

Her father went to see Michael, and things began to get worse.

"First of all they tried to charge him with stealing, but a Thai lady there said the shop he was accused of stealing from was actually closed," Ms Appleby said.

"They then said they had made a mistake and charged him with damaging the roof of a house. There weren't any houses there, but they said it would cost $5000 for the charges to go away. They said if we talked to the Australian Consulate, (Michael) would be taken to the Bangkok Hilton (the notorious Thai jail, Bangkwang prison)."

After negotiating with a detective - "he wanted the money in an envelope" - the family paid $3000 to have the charges dropped. Ms Smoel pleaded guilty to her charges - in order to leave Thailand - was fined $38 and placed on a good behaviour bond.

"(The detective) told us everything would be sweet and to enjoy the rest of our holiday," Ms Appleby said.

"We could've done like (Mrs Smoel) and fought the charges but he would've been there for quite a few more days. Michael was obviously petrified. There were big, big grey patches in what they were charging him with."

Michael left Thailand for Perth almost immediately. Ms Appleby suspected his drink had been spiked, and said the incidents were a warning for Australians visiting the tourist mecca.

"People need to know to watch out. You need to be with friends and they need to be watching out for each other," she said.

"You have to be careful of having a big night. It's a shame. I don't want to say don't go there, because it can be good, but maybe the bad publicity will make them clean up their act. People there say this sort of thing is happening all the time and Thai prostitutes will drop drugs into Westerners drinks."

I totally agree and feel so sad for that... Westerners are not welcome in this country... The last years I thought Thailand was emerging and became an interesting place to go for holiday but unfortunately Thailand shows its true nature.. This country is just (and I feel so sorry) the whore of the world and it will remain that way...

[LooseCannon]

Regardless of whether people posting on this thread are, or are not, alcoholics, these incidents grab international headlines and discourage people from taking holidays in Thailand.

The end result is that Thailand's tourist industry suffers and at the end of the day that means people loosing jobs, incomes lost and hardship for people working in the tourist industry.

A few wealthy Thais loose money, maids, drivers, tour guides, food sellers, waiting staff - people who need the work loose out.

You've got to have a sick sense of humor to find that funny.

There are quite a number of posters taking great delight in what is happening to Thailand's image in the world's media. It's something I am having trouble understanding because presumably these people live/visit Thailand/ have a Thai wife/girlfriend but seem to harbour some deep seated resentment/hatred towards the country.

This was posted on one of the other threads discussing these incidents......

The Gazette is saying this was mis reported and there were no undercover police. Of course they are covering for their advertisers who are in a panic that the truth about Thailand is making HEADLINE news around the world !!

Oh it's so DELICIOUS !!

(the caps aren't mine)

What would motivate a person to post this sort of comment?

[TheLaughingMan]

Hmm well it could be that the more the corruption and scamming and murders and false charges and bad reporting gets brought to light that maybe something will be done about it one day. Not likely but perhaps that is what some people are thinking, that the more it is in our face then the government will have to do something since it is not being swept under the carpet so easily, especially with new events happening daily in the news.

[mommysboy]

I have faced a similar problem in a certain pub in Bangkok.

I enter the pub, but oddly enough for the life of me I just can't remember leaving. What's even more worrying is that I wake up the next day (afternoon) to find that I have around 2,000 baht less in my wallet than when I first entered the pub.

Bizarre, it seems to be a weekly occurence as well.

Just 2000bt MR, barely enough to cover the alcohol cost let alone the after hours service that no doubt depleted your wealth still further!