Missing Good Chinese-american Food In Bangkok

[new27mail]

If, like me, you are a fan of Westernized Chinese food (eg. Kung Pao Chicken, Broccoli Beef, Sweet & Sour) please take the poll/survey and share your answers to the following questions of mine:

1) Where in Bangkok might I be able to find such Americanized-Chinese food? Any clean and convenient places?

2) Do you prefer truly authentic Chinese food -OR- the the modified tastes that you'd find in Chinese restaurants in the US and Europe?

3) Would Chinese food be better as fast food/takeout -OR- sit down and dine-in restaurant

4) Would you travel across town for the sole purpose of eating such food in a clean and comfortable Chinese restaurant similar to "Panda Express"?

5) If so, would you dine alone or with friends, colleagues, family? Do you have any local Thai friends who might appreciate such food?

Thanks for your help!

[Jingthing]

You can get stir fried or sizzling iron pan black pepper dishes in many, many THAI restaurants. One dish I really miss that you didn't mention are BLACK BEAN SAUCE dishes. You also forget egg foo young and shrimp in lobster sauce.

Edited June 2, 2009 by Jingthing

[jerrylee]

If, like me, you are a fan of Westernized Chinese food (eg. Kung Pao Chicken, Broccoli Beef, Sweet & Sour) please take the poll/survey and share your answers to the following questions of mine:

1) Where in Bangkok might I be able to find such Americanized-Chinese food? Any clean and convenient places?

2) Do you prefer truly authentic Chinese food -OR- the the modified tastes that you'd find in Chinese restaurants in the US and Europe?

3) Would Chinese food be better as fast food/takeout -OR- sit down and dine-in restaurant

4) Would you travel across town for the sole purpose of eating such food in a clean and comfortable Chinese restaurant similar to "Panda Express"?

5) If so, would you dine alone or with friends, colleagues, family? Do you have any local Thai friends who might appreciate such food?

Thanks for your help!

The Americanized chinese food that I've seen in the states were flourescent in colour, and they had things like pot-stickers, well gyoza and guizi are eaten everyday, but few will sell under pot-stickers, so answer is that you probably wont find the same americanized versions elsewhere.

Chinese food in say Vancouver uses better standard beef, salmon etc. food in Hong Kong or China uses authentic/original soy-sauces, vinegars, the flavouring ingredients are different, hongkong now is into a lot more nouveou/fusion kind of dishes. Chinese food in Bangkok will never be same as in china, e.g. ducks in china are forced fed and raised in cold climates, real Peking ducks are dried by the gobi desert wind.

Theres great chinese food for breakfast soy bean milk (sweet or savoury), fried bread (phad tong guo) congees of various condiment, steamed rice sheets rolled up, and of course pots of hot tea.

Lunches - bbq pork/duck/suckling pig over rice, wonton noodles, these can even be takeaway boxes or fast-food sit downs, the famous "yung kee" roast duck restaurant in Hongkong sellout 1,000 lunch boxes each day. It's good that one can buy takeaways at good restaurants.

Chinese foods that calls for high temperature cooking/steaming are often better at the streets, while foods that calls for special ingredients or preparations are better in restaurants, chinese restaurants dont get to survive if they're not good at something?

Sathorn Area - Ivory Palace - The Bangkok Club, very good dim-sum

Sukhumvit Area - Inside Soi to Ambassador Hotel - ex hongkong chef of Ambassador - good noodles,

Sui Sin - The Landmark Hotel - well known for sunday dim-sum lunches

Soi Thonglor - Mandarin - small restaurant. Best roast duck in the mango, weekend evenings always full of "celebrities".

Every year in Bangkok, they fly in some chinese cook to do a tour of all the chinese restaurants at the hotels, unfortunately, they only advertise about these in the thai language newspapers.

outside of Bangkok, I've found good chinese cooking in Lampang, and up in Mae Salong, Chiangrai.

Chinese dinners are more enjoyable with a large group of friends, then you get to order more dishes to try, the thai-chinese descendants of Hainan or Shantau dont have knowledge of the finner city cuisines.

[jerrylee]

You can get stir fried or sizzling iron pan black pepper dishes in many, many THAI restaurants. One dish I really miss that you didn't mention are BLACK BEAN SAUCE dishes. You also forget egg foo young and shrimp in lobster sauce.

The peppers here are good, but the local black beans are not fermented long enough, so therefore hard and less tasty.

[Jingthing]

No problem. Just buy bottles of fermented black beans from ... CHINA. That's what they use in the US. BTW, generally the Thai restaurants cooking black pepper sauce dishes also use prepared black pepper sauce but I think that is usually made in Thailand. Before Thailand had chilies (which are from the Americas) the hot thing they did have was black pepper, so cooking with black pepper is a kind of ancient Thai cooking.

The Americanized chinese food that I've seen in the states were flourescent in colour, and they had things like pot-stickers, well gyoza and guizi are eaten everyday, but few will sell under pot-stickers, so answer is that you probably wont find the same americanized versions elsewhere.

Yeah, pot stickers are massively popular. Authentic Chinese food is also available in the US in most big cities and San Francisco authentic Chinese cooking is comparable even to Hong Kong according to the Hong Kong people I knew there said as long as you go to the right places. Personally I love many styles of Chinese cooking. My least favorite unfortunately is Thai Chinese, my most favorite is Sechuan, but the real stuff that is very hard to find, not the dumbed down versions.

BTW, does anyone know a Bangkok Chinese restaurant with a good assortment of CLAY POT dishes? Those were always my favorite at authentic US Chinese restaurants although you generally won't find them on the menus of Americanized places (except when they have two menus, ha ha). Also looking for Hakka style SALT BAKED CHICKEN served with ginger oil sauce.

Edited June 2, 2009 by Jingthing

[mhan77]

Best chinese food in Bangkok is located two blocks from BTS Chong nonsi. I would recommend this place to anyone visiting or residing in Bangkok.

[Jimjim]

How about a name, mhan77? What's the restaurant?

[TGIR]

New27Mail -

In answer to your survey, I vote for all the above. Here in Cha Am/Hua Hin it is really the only cuisine we can't find, and the wife and I (she's Thai) agree we would do just about anything for a good Chinese/American meal.

If I had the money I would import this cuisine into Thailand as I believe it would be extremely popular. "Thai" restaurants in Northern California where I'm from would often serve these dishes along side Thai dishes to cater to American's learned tastes of Asian foods.

[hansnl]

New27Mail -

In answer to your survey, I vote for all the above. Here in Cha Am/Hua Hin it is really the only cuisine we can't find, and the wife and I (she's Thai) agree we would do just about anything for a good Chinese/American meal.

If I had the money I would import this cuisine into Thailand as I believe it would be extremely popular. "Thai" restaurants in Northern California where I'm from would often serve these dishes along side Thai dishes to cater to American's learned tastes of Asian foods.

Chinese food?

Brrrrrrr.

American Chinese food?

2xBrrrrrrr.

Chinese?

3xBrrrrrr

[bonobo]

My favorites are Szechuan and dimsum.

You can find very authentic Chinese food in the US.  But you can also find extremely westernized Chinese buffets for $6.95 which have very little in common with anything found in China.

I have to admit, though, and maybe I will now have to cancel my subscription to Bon Appetite and lose any illusions of being a gourmet, that I personally like many of the higher-end westernized Chinese restaurants.  P.F. Changs is hardly authentic Chinese food, but I like the taste.  And even with more traditional Chinese restaurants, I tend to like the Chinese food I get in the US over that I get in China, Hong Kong excepted. I also like Indian food cooked in the US better than in India, but I really don't like too many Thai restaurants in the US or Europe.

Shangarila off Soi Thaniya is my favorite Bangkok Chinese restaurant, but I would love to find decent Szechuan, Hunan, or Chinese-Muslim food here.

[new27mail]

First of all, thanks to everyone who took the survey and contributed their opinions above.

I have been living in Bangkok for a while now, and I do miss the occasional Chinese take-out that I used to enjoy back in the States. Yes, I know Chinese-American food can have a radioactive glow and mostly consists of MSG, but to me it tastes dam_n good. Admitting such among a group of seasoned Asia-lovers could be a kiss of death, given that you all have likely sampled the more authentic varieties of Chinese cuisine. Don't get me wrong, the real deal in China/HK/Taiwan/etc is also tasty. But sometimes I'm not up for more exotic Chinese dishes (that I often find in Bangkok) with assorted internal organs and fancy sea creatures. Other times I am.

Here in Thailand I have visited some Thai restaurants that served dishes that resemble Chinese food in America, but not quite. Given the resemblance, I wonder whether native Thais would enjoy Chinese-American food. I don't think there is anything objectionable in the typical ingredients, except for beef, which many here do not consume. It can be sanitary, convenient, and affordable if done right.

If there were a restaurant that served such food, do you think the customer pool will be expats only, or might locals partake?

[Jingthing]

Expats only. There is a place in Pattaya doing UK style Chinese food which is apparently similar to US style, but they do it poorly (based on my own taste and numerous comments of others who are from the UK) and I have no idea how they stay in business. My honest opinion is that this is a poor business idea. I think investing in a world class Sechuan chef and bringing REAL Sechuan food (or Hunan second choice) to Thailand would be exciting for both Thais and foodie expats.

Why would Thais want to go to a US style Chinese place? Would Americans in the US want to go to a Mexican style Chinese place (yes that is an actual style) unless they were Mexican and grew up with that stuff?

As an expat I would go to such a place, sometimes, if it was done very well and priced well.

The reason I think real Hunan and Sechuan would have a chance to hit with Thais is because they are spicy, and once tried (especially the hot and numbing Sechuan peppers) it has a high addiction rate. One kind of food I would love to see here, Chinese Muslim cuisine, with handmade wheat noodles and fantastic breads, and lots of lamb wouldn't have a prayer here with either expats or Thais. Too weird, too unknown, too ethnic, and too much lamb. So good food and good business doesn't always mix.

If you want to know what I mean by authentic gourmet Sechuan food go to this site, and select the TASTY CHINA restaurant.

http://www.blissfulglutton.com/

Edited June 4, 2009 by Jingthing

[JR Texas]

Expats only. There is a place in Pattaya doing UK style Chinese food which is apparently similar to US style, but they do it poorly (based on my own taste and numerous comments of others who are from the UK) and I have no idea how they stay in business. My honest opinion is that this is a poor business idea. I think investing in a world class Sechuan chef and bringing REAL Sechuan food (or Hunan second choice) to Thailand would be exciting for both Thais and foodie expats.

Why would Thais want to go to a US style Chinese place? Would Americans in the US want to go to a Mexican style Chinese place (yes that is an actual style) unless they were Mexican and grew up with that stuff?

As an expat I would go to such a place, sometimes, if it was done very well and priced well.

The reason I think real Hunan and Sechuan would have a chance to hit with Thais is because they are spicy, and once tried (especially the hot and numbing Sechuan peppers) it has a high addiction rate. One kind of food I would love to see here, Chinese Muslim cuisine, with handmade wheat noodles and fantastic breads, and lots of lamb wouldn't have a prayer here with either expats or Thais. Too weird, too unknown, too ethnic, and too much lamb. So good food and good business doesn't always mix.

If you want to know what I mean by authentic gourmet Sechuan food go to this site, and select the TASTY CHINA restaurant.

http://www.blissfulglutton.com/

I have been looking for American-style Chinese food in Thailand/Bangkok for 23 years and still have not found anything resembling it. You certainly will not find it in Chinatown.

I did live in China for about two years.......loved some of the food........but it was very different from American-style Chinese food. I like the American-style Chinese food better than the real thing.

Maybe some person will open an American-style Chinese food restaurant and make a fortune.....I miss the Chinese buffets in the USA.

[barrybike]

yes op im from ireland and i would love to get the same tasting chinese meal over there as what im used to ....fried beef and black bean sauce green peppers ,sweet n sour chicken balls or cantonease style mmmmmmmmmm ..would be a goood business oppertunity for a thai or chinese chef who has worked in another countryand start up something similar in tbangkok or else where ..im sure it would do well......would you believe nearly all the chinese restaurants owned that i know of in surrounding towns are owned by malaysians (grand parents originally from china)...hope op that we get the names of some good places to go to from your post because i would really enjoy going to some where like this......

Edited June 6, 2009 by barrybike

[sabaijai]

This style of Chinese cooking, or at least something very similar, is already available in Bangkok.

http://www.chefsxp.com/home.php?manufacturers_id=274

My office ordered practically the whole menu once, and the appearance and flavours reminded me of Chinese takeaway in the USA. The place is run by Indian-Thais and they bill the food as British-Chinese.

[Ossies]

Has anyone been to this place 'Shanghai Xiao Long'? I think it is a chain restaurant and we went there for luch at The Mall Bangkapi a few days ago.

Not sure what American style Chinese is like but assume much the same we are used to in UK. Only tried a couple of dishes and thought it was good value for money. We had a vegetable dish and some sort of spicy fried chicken. My gf said they had adapted the menu to make it a bit more spicy than your usual Chinese fayre (apart from the obvious regional variations) which I assume is essential to attract the local Thais.

Would be interested for comments from anyone elses who knows this place as I certainly intend to head back to try more from the menu. It is a value for money casual dining concept so don't expect too much.

[ozzydom]

If you happen to find yourself in Chiang Mai ,try the dim-sum at the Princess Royal Hotel near the night bazaar, really enjoyable.

The chinese restaurant in the Landmark is very good "westernised chinese fare".

[TheWalkingMan]

Great topic and you guys just made me hungry and nostalgic for The Hunan Place in San Francisco... Dang I want some of that Hunan Spicy Chicken

[JR Texas]

This style of Chinese cooking, or at least something very similar, is already available in Bangkok.

http://www.chefsxp.com/home.php?manufacturers_id=274

My office ordered practically the whole menu once, and the appearance and flavours reminded me of Chinese takeaway in the USA. The place is run by Indian-Thais and they bill the food as British-Chinese.

I followed that link and the food did not remind me of anything at an American-Chinese food place.

Maybe somebody can post some pics of the real thing: Kung Pao Chicken, Hunan Chicken, Moo Goo Gai Pan, Lemon Chicken, Beef and Scallops Hunan Style, Egg Foo Young, Pork w/ Black Bean Sauce, Sweet and Sour Pork/Shrimp, etc.

Most of the common American-Chinese places do not serve Dim Sum.......they are usually dishes with meat and vegetables combined in wonderful sauces.

A lot of the food is "Hunan style" because the people from that province were some of the first to come to the USA (West Coast). Hunan food is famous for its sauces.......spices.

For history buffs, the way I understand it, the migrants tried to get Americans to eat authentic Chinese food but it did not work, so they changed the food to fit American taste.

[Jingthing]

JR, I believe you have some facts wrong:

-- the vast majority of early Chinese migration to the USA was from the provinces of Guangdong (Cantonese speaking) and nearby Fujian, most certainly not Hunan (which is far away from the coast).

-- yes the food was altered for American tastes and also availability of ingredients. Some dishes such as chop suey are considered to be made in America (and best kept there under a rock in my opinion)

-- Americans are stereotyped by Chinese to favor heavily SAUCED dishes and also dishes with lots of SUGAR

-- standard American Chinese dishes have almost no relation to authentic Hunan cuisine, the only currently popular American Chinese dish I can think of that is Hunan-esqe is Chinese chicken salad with spicy garlic peanut butter sauce

-- some dishes which many people think are strictly American Chinese creations such as egg foo young actually have their roots in actual Chinese dishes (BTW, I love a good egg foo young but they are usually big greasy messes ...)

--

Most of the common American-Chinese places do not serve Dim Sum

Not exactly true! They always serve EGG ROLLS. Egg rolls are dim sum!

American Chinese food IS Chinese food, just another variation. There are so many people in America eating this version of Chinese food that it has legitimacy as a unique separate style.

Edited June 7, 2009 by Jingthing

[Jingthing]

Here is a menu of a NYC Chinese menu that pretty much includes all of the classically popular American Chinese dishes (plus some more it being New York City). Reading it reminded me that nobody mentioned MU SHU dishes ...

http://www2.seamlessweb.com/AtHome/China-P...ork-City.3488.r

[JR Texas]

Here is a menu of a NYC Chinese menu that pretty much includes all of the classically popular American Chinese dishes (plus some more it being New York City). Reading it reminded me that nobody mentioned MU SHU dishes ...

http://www2.seamlessweb.com/AtHome/China-P...ork-City.3488.r

Thanks for posting that menu.........I definitely want to eat there and wish "there was here."

You are right......it was old Canton province.....now called Guangdong.....it was the province closest to Hong Kong. That is where the original migrants came from.......and that is the food we love........so-called "Cantonese food."

I would love to see an American-style Cantonese-Hunan-Szechuan food restaurant in Thailand.

[JR Texas]

Here is a menu of a NYC Chinese menu that pretty much includes all of the classically popular American Chinese dishes (plus some more it being New York City). Reading it reminded me that nobody mentioned MU SHU dishes ...

http://www2.seamlessweb.com/AtHome/China-P...ork-City.3488.r

Here is a pic of Cantonese-style Kung Pao Chicken.......what surprises me about it is that it looks like the Kung Pao Chicken I ate in China (in Guangdong Province) and in America.

Jingthing is right......it is the Cantonese style food that most of us like.......along with the Hunan and Szechuan food.

I would love to eat at a good Cantonese-style restaurant in Thailand w/ an American-Chinese influence.

[akarmaka]

i really miss panda express. especially the chow mein, one of a kind. where can i get that here?

[JR Texas]

i really miss panda express. especially the chow mein, one of a kind. where can i get that here?

Panda Express...............where? what country?

[akarmaka]

i really miss panda express. especially the chow mein, one of a kind. where can i get that here?

Panda Express...............where? what country?

haven't you heard of panda express in the states?

[JR Texas]

i really miss panda express. especially the chow mein, one of a kind. where can i get that here?

Panda Express...............where? what country?

haven't you heard of panda express in the states?

Sorry for the question above........just Googled it.........fast food Chinese in USA.........looks good to me.......I would eat there if it came to Thailand.

[akarmaka]

i really miss panda express. especially the chow mein, one of a kind. where can i get that here?

Panda Express...............where? what country?

haven't you heard of panda express in the states?

Sorry for the question above........just Googled it.........fast food Chinese in USA.........looks good to me.......I would eat there if it came to Thailand.

doubt it will. taco bell is bigger than that and even that is not here.

[Jingthing]

Kung Pao chicken is originally a Sechuan dish. It would be interesting to know when it entered onto popular Chinese American menus. I am pretty certain that when I was a boy this dish was not found on typical Chinese American menus, so I am guessing it became popular around the 1970's.

Edited June 8, 2009 by Jingthing

[bonobo]

Kung Pao chicken is originally a Sechuan dish. It would be interesting to know when it entered onto popular Chinese American menus. I am pretty certain that when I was a boy this dish was not found on typical Chinese American menus, so I am guessing it became popular around the 1970's.

I think Kung Pao chicken became popular in the US only after the rise in Szechuan restaurants.  It was never widely available in the Chinese restaurants in the 60's and even into the 70's.  But after the rise in Szechaun and Hunan restaurants (I read that there are now more Szechuan restuarants in the US than Cantonese), other tastes became more accepted, and then with the rise in buffets, they needed Chinese food which was acceptable to sit in warming trays.  Now, just about every cheap Chinese buffet offers kung pao chicken as one of their staples.

For people who assume all Chinese food is so healthy for you, kung pao chicken is one of the worst restaurant foods for a person to eat, right after pasta alfredo.